Thought we could've changed to 3-5-2 soon after going two down, just to try something different, give Bolton something to think about. Feels like we're prepared to just keep doing what we're doing sometimes.
Got lols on the post match thread for my appraisal of Appleton yesterday, but maintain after a long old sleep that yesterday’s result was pretty much down to him. Bolton’s formation overran us and we played into their strengths, while being at home. As others have said May (no matter how much we love the guy) versus a 3 including Santos! You don’t need a UEFA pro licence to know that trying this let alone sticking with it for so long in the game was fcuking stupid.
Yesterday was crying out for a lump at top, probably Tedic to ruffle Santos’ feathers.
We made it way too easy for them and the score line flattered us, we were second best all over the pitch. Don’t read too much into the possession stats nowadays when it contains passing across your back line one way and then going back the other 20+ times in a game.
So frustrated we have not been able to capitalise on what was an encouraging run.
Finally, Appleton cannot rate our crop of loan players other than perhaps Pan and Watson. C Campbell, Abankwah and Tedic are all allegedly higher level players and yet we are not seeing it or getting a tune out of them.
I wasn't sold from the beginning and mainly put it down to the squad and my stance hasn't really changed. Most of our results have come from having Aneke available and now he's injured we lose back to back. Feel like Chuks gave a few of our managers better results than they probably could have achieved without him.
Got to say I don't like him mentioning xG, it's a nonsense stat unless it's significantly high or higher than the other team. Also not a fan of him saying Bolton is a product of 4 years implying he may need that much time here to get out of this league? They were inherited as a League 2 side for a start.
Anyway nothing has really changed, until we gey better players nothing will. A better manager would probably scrape play offs with this squad at best, that's the squads limit.
Playing a big man up front would’ve played right into Santos and co’s hands. We’ve tried it with Stockley and others in recent years, with very little success.
Aneke, if fit, might have been worth a go but Leaburn and Tedic have done nothing in their previous couple of starts to suggest they would’ve fared any better than Charlton strikers of past seasons.
And playing just May up front didn't play right into Santos and co's hands?
Interesting that when Leaburn did eventually come on , he and May actually started giving the Bolton defence some problems.
W5 D3 L2 GF20 GA14 - 1.8 points per game - 2.0 goals scored per game, 1.4 goals conceded per game - 50% win ratio
Apologies this was incorrect. I miscounted one of the draws as a win.
W4 D4 L2 GF20 GA14 - 1.6 points per game - 40% win ratio
Wins vs Wycombe, Exeter, Reading and Wigan Draws vs Stevenage, Shrewsbury, Blackpool and Portsmouth Losses vs Lincoln and Bolton
That's still pretty respectable given the string of results before he came in. As I said on the post match thread you can certainly question some of his tactical choices but there's no denying that he's got the players up for a fight and putting actual effort in.
The cup game being such a damp squib is obviously an outlier there but that was 11 players pretty much chucked in to make do and mend - we've been much more impressive in the league.
Got it spot on with his changes yesterday. I was one of those groans when he moved May out to the right to get an extra midfielder on, but it worked perfectly. We gained a bit more control in the middle and May was more involved from the right than he had been all game. Think we will see that set up more often in trickier away games
May works so hard he can play in different forward positions and his instinct gets him in goal scoring positions. I am liking Appleton more and more. We really do need to back the manager and give him the time he needs. I get the feeling he knows the direction of travel required.
Got it spot on with his changes yesterday. I was one of those groans when he moved May out to the right to get an extra midfielder on, but it worked perfectly. We gained a bit more control in the middle and May was more involved from the right than he had been all game. Think we will see that set up more often in trickier away games
Spot on mate but it also makes the option easier when you have a player out wide on the right that plays the ball off and then somehow pops up in the middle of the box just a few seconds later. Fitness and mindset is just ridiculous
What’s the Appleton consensus now, do we think he’s doing a good job.
I keep thinking of the memes that often got posted before he became our manager, mostly from a derogatory perspective, have we grown to like him?
I think he comes across well in interviews but that in itself is no measure of the man, they’re all well versed with the media and know what to say.
As others have said, he does appear to have instilled some bottle and fight into the players.
I think he is. Obviously he was helped with player availability but there’s definitely been an improvement which has stuck around while Aneke and Camara have been out. Think he’s still finding the right balance in the team but everyone seems more confident and comfortable which can’t be a bad thing
I find it impossible to feel anything other than apathy with Charlton managers at this stage. They're there for a bit, they'll go, we just have to hope they achieve something useful in their brief time.
Aside from liking though, one thing that I do appreciate is that he seems to have been able to make our players play, if not brilliantly, at least well enough that they look like L1 level. That shouldn't be a high bar but it weirdly is for us. We've signed so many players who have come in, looked bad and then got worse. We sign players who aren't match fit, wait for them to improve and then they never do. Under Appleton so far though people have at least looked serviceable; Tennai looks like he's starting to get somewhere now he's played a bit, Jones looks settled, AMB seems calmer. It's early days but we've seen more out of McGrandles than we ever have before. The very least we should hope for is our players being at least L1 level and then pray they perform better so it's sort of progress.
On the other hand he does weird stuff. He loves repurposing a player - rush left back, Tyreece Campbell anywhere except on the wing, strikers all over the shop. I know a lot is dictated by our limited squad size but it feels like a thing he'd do anyway. I also am slightly concerned by his overall man management. We've heard that he freezes players out if he doesn't like them, and I can't help but feel bad for Chem Campbell. He was one of our better players under Holden and it must be frustrating for him watching May play at 10 and Tedic on the wing while he struggles to get into the squad ahead of Kirk considering he was providing goals and assists from those spots only weeks before. That can work if you don't do it too much but if we start to dip I can see him losing control of the dressing room quickly.
We also really struggle to play more than one good half which is annoying. You're not going to get a lot of 90 minute clinics at this level but it would be nice to consistently do the thing we're meant to do for most of a game rather than just after the players have been recently threatened by hench Voldemort. He's done ok, at this point we need to see what a good January would look like for him. I don't hold out a lot of hope for Tedic, Chem's, Camara's and Abankwah's loans so we might see some or all of them go back and new loans in. We need a better centre back, a second left back and ideally another striker option. Those can all be loans but I think a really big plus for us would be buying a central midfielder who can run a game. We actually did makes steps in that direction with Terry Taylor but through injury that's been a washout so planning for the inevitable Dobson-less future right now wouldn't hurt; a midfield two of someone hard-working but creative and Taylor next season would be helpful.
Good post, but I wouldn't necessarily bank on 'the inevitable Dobson-less future' - is it so obvious he's going to the Championship (and not with us)? He's very settled here, and he has small flaws in his game that might be accentuated at that level - it's possible he could do well at the level but he wouldn't be a massively obvious signing for a Championship club looking to strengthen.
I'd also argue that a lot of Appleton's repurposings have made sense in the circumstances
I don't have much opinion on Appleton the person (as opposed to club legends like Bowyer or Jackson, or Adkins and Holden who deliberately attempted to connect with fans "personally") but I see it as a feature not a flaw.
He's obviously been around the metaphorical block more than once and probably won't be here forever one way or the other - but again I do think really see that as a bad thing if it means that he gets the players into a semblance of order and organisation and then moves on (or is moved on) so that a proper long term solution can be put in place.
He's doing exactly what we need him to do and probably as well as anyone could do it with the squad he's got. I don't see him ever writing his name in the history books as a hero like Curbishley or Powell - but I don't see him ever being a Fraeye or a Dowie either.
If I based all my opinions of individuals on overused .jpgs and crass inane attempts at humour... Hold on!
Pleasantly surprised by Mickey Apples, he was dealt a hand that contained, journeyman wasters, raw youngsters, sicknotes, and a sparse sprinkling of solid professionals. Glad we are finally scoring but boy is our defence predictably shit still. Your mission MA if you should choose to take it...
Good post, but I wouldn't necessarily bank on 'the inevitable Dobson-less future' - is it so obvious he's going to the Championship (and not with us)? He's very settled here, and he has small flaws in his game that might be accentuated at that level - it's possible he could do well at the level but he wouldn't be a massively obvious signing for a Championship club looking to strengthen.
I'd also argue that a lot of Appleton's repurposings have made sense in the circumstances
I don't think he'll necessarily get a Championship club, though equally I would expect one of the shithouse teams who survive (could be Rotherham, QPR, Birmingham, Stoke etc) might see a lot of value in a free midfielder who can plug gaps. Even if he doesn't get a Championship gig though are we going to pay him enough to stay? One of them teams that come down or a nearby team might just decide he's worth the wage on a free and offer more than our owners are willing to. It's less that I think he's destined for greater things and more that he's got 6 months left on his deal and will want a payrise. I guess we'll see, but it does feel like if our captain wanted to stay he'd have signed something by now. If he does stay I expect it'll be because we go up (nope) or because nothing else comes up at the level he was hoping for, which isn't hugely inspiring for us or him.
I don't have a big issue with the repurposing given our squad size but I worry that it's going to be a thing with him. We'll probably never have a big enough squad to find out if it's needs must or if he's just mad though
Lee Bowyer was the ultimate tinker man. Sometimes he had no choice but to have an A-Z of different formations or players being tried in weird positions was different.
Gunter playing RB,LB, or CB didn't work under Adkins/Jackson, again they were short of players in certain positions and desperation kicked in.
It was great to see Charlton have RB, CB'S and a left footed LB against Pompey. It shouldn't be too much to ask but even for Michael Appleton because of injuries or younger players not ready to play every game, the line up and formations needs to be flexible.
I/we wanted May and Leaburn in a two up front but bizarrely Alfie can play as a 10 with Miles at 9 and still spend plenty of time in front of Leaburn. Mainly because of May athleticism he can be deeper when we are out of possession but still a fox in the box when we attack.
Appleton has started fine with the usual set backs with injuries to Terry Taylor and Camará. Tough gig for Apples at Cafc but I really hope it bears fruit as we have suffered for far too long in a football sense (not real life suffering).
Good post, but I wouldn't necessarily bank on 'the inevitable Dobson-less future' - is it so obvious he's going to the Championship (and not with us)? He's very settled here, and he has small flaws in his game that might be accentuated at that level - it's possible he could do well at the level but he wouldn't be a massively obvious signing for a Championship club looking to strengthen.
I'd also argue that a lot of Appleton's repurposings have made sense in the circumstances
I don't think he'll necessarily get a Championship club, though equally I would expect one of the shithouse teams who survive (could be Rotherham, QPR, Birmingham, Stoke etc) might see a lot of value in a free midfielder who can plug gaps. Even if he doesn't get a Championship gig though are we going to pay him enough to stay? One of them teams that come down or a nearby team might just decide he's worth the wage on a free and offer more than our owners are willing to. It's less that I think he's destined for greater things and more that he's got 6 months left on his deal and will want a payrise. I guess we'll see, but it does feel like if our captain wanted to stay he'd have signed something by now. If he does stay I expect it'll be because we go up (nope) or because nothing else comes up at the level he was hoping for, which isn't hugely inspiring for us or him.
I don't have a big issue with the repurposing given our squad size but I worry that it's going to be a thing with him. We'll probably never have a big enough squad to find out if it's needs must or if he's just mad though
Or perhaps he knows the longer he leaves it, the more leverage he'll have?
While this shows our form has been good, this stat also means that, despite that good form, we have not got any closer to the top 6.
If we are 11th now and were 20th on September 1st then surely we are closer to the top 6 now than we were. Obviously the top six aren't all going to drop points to allow as to catch up in just a few weeks. 6 points behind Barnsley in 6th is a big improvement on our shaky start to the season.
We are still someway off playing wise with the inability to play the full 100 minutes with out losing our shape or making an error at the back but some light at the end of the tunnel.
Good post, but I wouldn't necessarily bank on 'the inevitable Dobson-less future' - is it so obvious he's going to the Championship (and not with us)? He's very settled here, and he has small flaws in his game that might be accentuated at that level - it's possible he could do well at the level but he wouldn't be a massively obvious signing for a Championship club looking to strengthen.
I'd also argue that a lot of Appleton's repurposings have made sense in the circumstances
I don't think he'll necessarily get a Championship club, though equally I would expect one of the shithouse teams who survive (could be Rotherham, QPR, Birmingham, Stoke etc) might see a lot of value in a free midfielder who can plug gaps. Even if he doesn't get a Championship gig though are we going to pay him enough to stay? One of them teams that come down or a nearby team might just decide he's worth the wage on a free and offer more than our owners are willing to. It's less that I think he's destined for greater things and more that he's got 6 months left on his deal and will want a payrise. I guess we'll see, but it does feel like if our captain wanted to stay he'd have signed something by now. If he does stay I expect it'll be because we go up (nope) or because nothing else comes up at the level he was hoping for, which isn't hugely inspiring for us or him.
I don't have a big issue with the repurposing given our squad size but I worry that it's going to be a thing with him. We'll probably never have a big enough squad to find out if it's needs must or if he's just mad though
Or perhaps he knows the longer he leaves it, the more leverage he'll have?
I think it suits him not to sign yet. If we do manage to go up he'll be asking for a promoted player's wage. If we don't go up he can bail. It doesn't give him much leverage to leave it if he plans on staying regardless though. If we don't get anywhere this season we aren't going to offer him much of a payrise and the owners will be able to point out that Dobson was as much a part of the squad that didn't go up as anyone else if they don't want to spend the money. I reckon they'd look at the way we play, see Fraser, Taylor, McGrandles, Anderson, May and Campbell as permanent players under contract who can fill those three midfield roles between them without us even bringing anyone else in and ask why they'd bother matching what he can get elsewhere. That's based on what we've seen of their investment so far, they may change their ways.
Comments
We made it way too easy for them and the score line flattered us, we were second best all over the pitch. Don’t read too much into the possession stats nowadays when it contains passing across your back line one way and then going back the other 20+ times in a game.
So frustrated we have not been able to capitalise on what was an encouraging run.
Got to say I don't like him mentioning xG, it's a nonsense stat unless it's significantly high or higher than the other team. Also not a fan of him saying Bolton is a product of 4 years implying he may need that much time here to get out of this league? They were inherited as a League 2 side for a start.
Anyway nothing has really changed, until we gey better players nothing will. A better manager would probably scrape play offs with this squad at best, that's the squads limit.
Interesting that when Leaburn did eventually come on , he and May actually started giving the Bolton defence some problems.
If only we had tried that earlier.
W5 D3 L2 GF20 GA14
- 1.8 points per game
- 2.0 goals scored per game, 1.4 goals conceded per game
- 50% win ratio
W4 D4 L2 GF20 GA14
- 1.6 points per game
- 40% win ratio
Wins vs Wycombe, Exeter, Reading and Wigan
Draws vs Stevenage, Shrewsbury, Blackpool and Portsmouth
Losses vs Lincoln and Bolton
The cup game being such a damp squib is obviously an outlier there but that was 11 players pretty much chucked in to make do and mend - we've been much more impressive in the league.
Of course the squad is paper thin and we need some quality recruitment if we are to keep chugging along towards a play off spot.
The jury is still out on the owners however - If their entire plan is based upon selling players and youth then no manager will make us succeed
”X club want £1m for player X, it’s ridiculous” (we then discuss how many multi milllions Leaburn is worth)
What’s the Appleton consensus now, do we think he’s doing a good job.
I keep thinking of the memes that often got posted before he became our manager, mostly from a derogatory perspective, have we grown to like him?
I think he comes across well in interviews but that in itself is no measure of the man, they’re all well versed with the media and know what to say.
As others have said, he does appear to have instilled some bottle and fight into the players.
I'd also argue that a lot of Appleton's repurposings have made sense in the circumstances
He's obviously been around the metaphorical block more than once and probably won't be here forever one way or the other - but again I do think really see that as a bad thing if it means that he gets the players into a semblance of order and organisation and then moves on (or is moved on) so that a proper long term solution can be put in place.
He's doing exactly what we need him to do and probably as well as anyone could do it with the squad he's got. I don't see him ever writing his name in the history books as a hero like Curbishley or Powell - but I don't see him ever being a Fraeye or a Dowie either.
Pleasantly surprised by Mickey Apples, he was dealt a hand that contained, journeyman wasters, raw youngsters, sicknotes, and a sparse sprinkling of solid professionals. Glad we are finally scoring but boy is our defence predictably shit still. Your mission MA if you should choose to take it...
Sometimes he had no choice but to have an A-Z of different formations or players being tried in weird positions was different.
Gunter playing RB,LB, or CB didn't work under Adkins/Jackson, again they were short of players in certain positions and desperation kicked in.
It was great to see Charlton have RB, CB'S and a left footed LB against Pompey.
It shouldn't be too much to ask but even for Michael Appleton because of injuries or younger players not ready to play every game, the line up and formations needs to be flexible.
I/we wanted May and Leaburn in a two up front but bizarrely Alfie can play as a 10 with Miles at 9 and still spend plenty of time in front of Leaburn. Mainly because of May athleticism he can be deeper when we are out of possession but still a fox in the box when we attack.
Appleton has started fine with the usual set backs with injuries to Terry Taylor and Camará.
Tough gig for Apples at Cafc but I really hope it bears fruit as we have suffered for far too long in a football sense (not real life suffering).
For me he is doing what we could reasonably have hoped for, other than beating Cray Valley.
If we are 11th now and were 20th on September 1st then surely we are closer to the top 6 now than we were. Obviously the top six aren't all going to drop points to allow as to catch up in just a few weeks.
6 points behind Barnsley in 6th is a big improvement on our shaky start to the season.