Did you not think that that quote came from somewhere else. Like maybe a book about politics in 1945?
And you seem to have "forgotten" that what isn't disputed is that YOU got you stuff from that website and what you cut and pasted was quickly trashed by the people making comments on that site.
Have a view for sure but at least let it be your own view not something you've copied off the internet.
Going to accept that you were wrong about elections during the war as well? No, though not.
No point carry on this non-debate so bye bye.
Don't let it go Henry. You had him on the ropes.
I don't see how him lying, hurling childish abuse and then running away counts as having me on the ropes. But then I view the world with logic and facts, not through the myopic lens of Labour's apologists who contort themselves to convince themselves that the Tories are the root of every single problem in the world.
Did you not think that that quote came from somewhere else. Like maybe a book about politics in 1945?
And you seem to have "forgotten" that what isn't disputed is that YOU got you stuff from that website and what you cut and pasted was quickly trashed by the people making comments on that site.
Have a view for sure but at least let it be your own view not something you've copied off the internet.
Going to accept that you were wrong about elections during the war as well? No, though not.
No point carry on this non-debate so bye bye. </
Impressive speeches from Major and Milliband today.</p>
I can't agree that Milliband was impressive. Rich people on zero tax? Goes down well with the ignorant if thats what they want to believe, but where's the evidence of this and if there was any why would HMRC tolerate it? I can assure you they wouldn't.
Why did Labour want a 50p top rate if the rich aren't paying tax? And before he shouts "avoidance" let's be clear that the Govt has clamped down on avoidance by individuals with legislation that tramples over certain fundamental rights dating back to Magna Carta and requires people to pay tax that HMRC thinks is due whether it actually is due or not. HMRC has never had more power. That's the Coalition by the way, not Labour who never tackled tax avoidance as aggressively as this lot!
Making up something populist and saying "I will put a stop to that" is not impressive.
Right, let me throw this one into the mix. Just been chatting with my Bulgarian buddy in Sofia, now a successful businessman, 27 years after we first met when I was on holiday there and we did a black market "forex deal". I mentioned the British disquiet about the "tide" of Romanians and Bulgarians and asked him what they say about it over there.
he said that in the Spring the Bulgarian government released their figures on the situation. They put the total number of Bulgarians in the UK at 40,000. However, of them, 30,000 are students, and as my buddy pointed out, because many of his friends have sent their kids there, the parent are paying 9k a year student fees and also funding their living costs.. Most of the remaining 10k are working.
Now of course, the Bulgarian government figures may not be 100% reliable. But can anyone here quote different figures which re obviously more reliable? And the figure for students will be reliable. It suggests that the vast majority of Bulgarians in the UK are the sons and (usually beautiful) daughters of middle class Bulgarians. And far from taking benefits, they are pumping money into the UK economy.
From ONS. • Net long-term migration to the UK was estimated to be 243,000 in the year ending March 2014, a statistically significant increase from 175,000 in the previous 12 months.
• While net migration has increased since the most recent low of 154,000 in the year ending September 2012, it remains below the peak of 320,000 in the year ending June 2005.
• 560,000 people immigrated to the UK in the year ending March 2014, a statistically significant increase from 492,000 in the previous 12 months. Two-thirds of the increase is accounted for by immigration of EU citizens (up 44,000 to 214,000).
• An estimated 316,000 people emigrated from the UK in the year ending March 2014. Long-term emigration has been relatively stable since 2010.
• 28,000 EU2 (Romanian and Bulgarian) citizens immigrated to the UK in the year ending March 2014, a statistically significant increase from 12,000 in the previous 12 months.
• There was a statistically significant increase in immigration for work (up 38,000 to 228,000), driven by increases for EU15 and EU2 citizens. Estimated employment of EU citizens was 17% higher in April to June 2014 compared to the same quarter in 2013.
• Immigration for study remained stable (177,000) in the year ending March 2014. Study visas granted in year ending June 2014 rose 7% reflecting higher levels of university sponsored applications (applications for other education sectors fell).
• 265,000 non-EU citizens immigrated to the UK in the year ending March 2014. This ends a steady decline since the recent peak of 334,000 in 2011.
• Work and study visas granted rose 10% (+14,799) and 7% (+13,885) respectively in the year ending June 2014 compared to the previous year, following a decline since 2011. The increase in work visas was largely accounted for by skilled work (+11,744).
• There were 23,479 asylum applications (main applicants) in the year ending June 2014, similar to the previous 12 months (23,523), but low relative to the 2002 peak (84,132).
Right, let me throw this one into the mix. Just been chatting with my Bulgarian buddy in Sofia, now a successful businessman, 27 years after we first met when I was on holiday there and we did a black market "forex deal". I mentioned the British disquiet about the "tide" of Romanians and Bulgarians and asked him what they say about it over there.
he said that in the Spring the Bulgarian government released their figures on the situation. They put the total number of Bulgarians in the UK at 40,000. However, of them, 30,000 are students, and as my buddy pointed out, because many of his friends have sent their kids there, the parent are paying 9k a year student fees and also funding their living costs.. Most of the remaining 10k are working.
Now of course, the Bulgarian government figures may not be 100% reliable. But can anyone here quote different figures which re obviously more reliable? And the figure for students will be reliable. It suggests that the vast majority of Bulgarians in the UK are the sons and (usually beautiful) daughters of middle class Bulgarians. And far from taking benefits, they are pumping money into the UK economy.
I lived and worked in Sofia between 2004-06 and before that was in Budapest. Working on EU accession projects! Great times and great people trying hard to get their countries back into shape. It seems to me that the people highlighted as the scroungers and benefit tourists in the tabloids are mainly from the Roma populations of the former Eastern bloc. The Roma issue is, of course, a nightmare and best not go there!
28,000 EU2 (Romanian and Bulgarian) citizens immigrated to the UK in the year ending March 2014, a statistically significant increase from 12,000 in the previous 12 months.
Quite, and a lot of them may well be the students logged by the Bulgarian government. The Bulgarians would also appreciate it if the UK government would split out the figures for the two countries.
Tbf I've not knowingly met a Bulgarian in the UK & certainly aren't aware that they are camping out at Park Lane like some Romanians are/were.
My buddy is well off enough to camp out in a Park Lane hotel, but also sensible enough not to do so. He sensibly sent his daughter to uni in Maastricht, where the fees are 20% of what they are in the UK.
Tbf I've not knowingly met a Bulgarian in the UK & certainly aren't aware that they are camping out at Park Lane like some Romanians are/were.
My buddy is well off enough to camp out in a Park Lane hotel, but also sensible enough not to do so. He sensibly sent his daughter to uni in Maastricht, where the fees are 20% of what they are in the UK.
Did you not think that that quote came from somewhere else. Like maybe a book about politics in 1945?
And you seem to have "forgotten" that what isn't disputed is that YOU got you stuff from that website and what you cut and pasted was quickly trashed by the people making comments on that site.
Have a view for sure but at least let it be your own view not something you've copied off the internet.
Going to accept that you were wrong about elections during the war as well? No, though not.
No point carry on this non-debate so bye bye. </
Impressive speeches from Major and Milliband today.</p>
I can't agree that Milliband was impressive. Rich people on zero tax? Goes down well with the ignorant if thats what they want to believe, but where's the evidence of this and if there was any why would HMRC tolerate it? I can assure you they wouldn't.
Why did Labour want a 50p top rate if the rich aren't paying tax? And before he shouts "avoidance" let's be clear that the Govt has clamped down on avoidance by individuals with legislation that tramples over certain fundamental rights dating back to Magna Carta and requires people to pay tax that HMRC thinks is due whether it actually is due or not. HMRC has never had more power. That's the Coalition by the way, not Labour who never tackled tax avoidance as aggressively as this lot!
Making up something populist and saying "I will put a stop to that" is not impressive.
He is, though, the leader of a party needing a drive, some impetus, and I think, having listened to most of it, he gave his party something to get behind.
Simplistic bullshit, nicely packaged to appeal to people who don't themselves work in business. Just what I would expect from Daniel Hannan.
Hannan is a total turd. Hasn't even got the bollox to jump ship and join the Kippers where he belongs. Never forgive him for slagging off the NHS on Fox News. Opps beginning to sound like GH here!
Simplistic bullshit, nicely packaged to appeal to people who don't themselves work in business. Just what I would expect from Daniel Hannan.
Hannan is a total turd. Hasn't even got the bollox to jump ship and join the Kippers where he belongs. Never forgive him for slagging off the NHS on Fox News. Opps beginning to sound like GH here!
An anti Euro Tory - no wonder you think he,s a turd. Sitting as a Euro MP as we'll must have you steaming :-).
Simplistic bullshit, nicely packaged to appeal to people who don't themselves work in business. Just what I would expect from Daniel Hannan.
Hannan is a total turd. Hasn't even got the bollox to jump ship and join the Kippers where he belongs. Never forgive him for slagging off the NHS on Fox News. Opps beginning to sound like GH here!
An anti Euro Tory - no wonder you think he,s a turd. Sitting as a Euro MP as we'll must have you steaming :-).
Isn't' he Peruvian anyway?
Lol. Even worse, coming over here nicking one of our MEP jobs. The total bstd!
A good, factual, if rather succinct overview of the creation of the NHS. Rather telling that the circle jerk of Labour's apologists on this board have failed to respond to it, since they prefer their own fictional account of how the NHS was formed.
A good, factual, if rather succinct overview of the creation of the NHS. Rather telling that the circle jerk of Labour's apologists on this board have failed to respond to it, since they prefer their own fictional account of how the NHS was formed.
I had hoped you'd seen it, and agree re the lack of response. That said, it was put out there as a means to, hopefully, put that one to bed and not for me to engage in any arguments for or against its content.
This is a great debate. Keep it up. It gives the likes of myself the chance to research things that I may never have otherwise bothered to.
A good, factual, if rather succinct overview of the creation of the NHS. Rather telling that the circle jerk of Labour's apologists on this board have failed to respond to it, since they prefer their own fictional account of how the NHS was formed.
I had hoped you'd seen it, and agree re the lack of response. That said, it was put out there as a means to, hopefully, put that one to bed and not for me to engage in any arguments for or against its content.
This is a great debate. Keep it up. It gives the likes of myself the chance to research things that I may never have otherwise bothered to.
Sadly, when it comes to Labour's apologists on this board, facts and history are meaningless since they've all signed up to 'The History of the UK according to Polly Toynbee, Owen Jones & Kevin Maguire'.
A good, factual, if rather succinct overview of the creation of the NHS. Rather telling that the circle jerk of Labour's apologists on this board have failed to respond to it, since they prefer their own fictional account of how the NHS was formed.
I had hoped you'd seen it, and agree re the lack of response. That said, it was put out there as a means to, hopefully, put that one to bed and not for me to engage in any arguments for or against its content.
This is a great debate. Keep it up. It gives the likes of myself the chance to research things that I may never have otherwise bothered to.
Interesting link BBW ...filled some blanks in my knowledge of the NHS
A good, factual, if rather succinct overview of the creation of the NHS. Rather telling that the circle jerk of Labour's apologists on this board have failed to respond to it, since they prefer their own fictional account of how the NHS was formed.
I had hoped you'd seen it, and agree re the lack of response. That said, it was put out there as a means to, hopefully, put that one to bed and not for me to engage in any arguments for or against its content.
This is a great debate. Keep it up. It gives the likes of myself the chance to research things that I may never have otherwise bothered to.
Sadly, when it comes to Labour's apologists on this board, facts and history are meaningless since they've all signed up to 'The History of the UK according to Polly Toynbee, Owen Jones & Kevin Maguire'.
Comments
Oh get over yourself. Pomposity at its best.
he said that in the Spring the Bulgarian government released their figures on the situation. They put the total number of Bulgarians in the UK at 40,000. However, of them, 30,000 are students, and as my buddy pointed out, because many of his friends have sent their kids there, the parent are paying 9k a year student fees and also funding their living costs.. Most of the remaining 10k are working.
Now of course, the Bulgarian government figures may not be 100% reliable. But can anyone here quote different figures which re obviously more reliable? And the figure for students will be reliable. It suggests that the vast majority of Bulgarians in the UK are the sons and (usually beautiful) daughters of middle class Bulgarians. And far from taking benefits, they are pumping money into the UK economy.
•
Net long-term migration to the UK was estimated to be 243,000 in the year ending March 2014, a statistically significant increase from 175,000 in the previous 12 months.
•
While net migration has increased since the most recent low of 154,000 in the year ending September 2012, it remains below the peak of 320,000 in the year ending June 2005.
•
560,000 people immigrated to the UK in the year ending March 2014, a statistically significant increase from 492,000 in the previous 12 months. Two-thirds of the increase is accounted for by immigration of EU citizens (up 44,000 to 214,000).
•
An estimated 316,000 people emigrated from the UK in the year ending March 2014. Long-term emigration has been relatively stable since 2010.
•
28,000 EU2 (Romanian and Bulgarian) citizens immigrated to the UK in the year ending March 2014, a statistically significant increase from 12,000 in the previous 12 months.
•
There was a statistically significant increase in immigration for work (up 38,000 to 228,000), driven by increases for EU15 and EU2 citizens. Estimated employment of EU citizens was 17% higher in April to June 2014 compared to the same quarter in 2013.
•
Immigration for study remained stable (177,000) in the year ending March 2014. Study visas granted in year ending June 2014 rose 7% reflecting higher levels of university sponsored applications (applications for other education sectors fell).
•
265,000 non-EU citizens immigrated to the UK in the year ending March 2014. This ends a steady decline since the recent peak of 334,000 in 2011.
•
Work and study visas granted rose 10% (+14,799) and 7% (+13,885) respectively in the year ending June 2014 compared to the previous year, following a decline since 2011. The increase in work visas was largely accounted for by skilled work (+11,744).
•
There were 23,479 asylum applications (main applicants) in the year ending June 2014, similar to the previous 12 months (23,523), but low relative to the 2002 peak (84,132).
Latest data due out in a fortnight.
Quite, and a lot of them may well be the students logged by the Bulgarian government. The Bulgarians would also appreciate it if the UK government would split out the figures for the two countries.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&persist_app=1&v=TTv7UoK8oJY
http://www.nhshistory.net/shorthistory.htm
Isn't' he Peruvian anyway?
This is a great debate. Keep it up. It gives the likes of myself the chance to research things that I may never have otherwise bothered to.