Valley Gold

Henry Irving · January 2016

Miserableoldgit said:
Sod it, cancelling now.
If, after 17 days I can't get a simple answer to a simple question, why bother.

One less member for the scheme, money lost and all for the lack of a simple yes or no.

Miserableoldgit · January 2016

rikofold said:

Henry Irving said:

rikofold said:

Henry Irving said:

stonemuse said:
To be fair Rik, it's a fair question.

The statement says:

However, the supporters’ representatives felt that they could not overlook the concerns raised, and indicated that they would not consider any further major donations to the football club until later on in the year.

That could mean payment will be made in June .... which, as you know, many of us do not want.
It is a fair question and the longer Rich avoids it the more it seems that the answer is not one that you or I would like.

That could be easily and quickly disproved by @rikofold giving a direct answer.

We know he opposed the idea of withholding a payment in June and argued against it.
I'm not avoiding the question, but the committee agreed a statement and it's not for me to make my own variation.

What I will say is what Sharron has already said to you Henry - that it's reasonable to assume we're talking about the second half of the year. Make of that what you will, but as I say most people seem to have understood what the statement is saying.

I'm not the enemy, try not to forget that everyone, but I am constrained by my role.
But Sharon isn't a committee member, you are and I don't want to assume incorrectly.

Answer the question.
You have no right to demand something of me you know very well I'm not free to say. The Committee agreed a statement, make of it what you will. I've said all I'm going to say on it, and if you really haven't worked it out by now then you've gone down in my estimation Mr Irving.

But you know exactly what the situation is and are just making the usual mischief.

Fine Rik, you and Henry might have issues. I don't really care.

Now, please answer my question.

stonemuse · January 2016

Miserableoldgit said:

rikofold said:

Henry Irving said:

rikofold said:

Henry Irving said:

stonemuse said:
To be fair Rik, it's a fair question.

The statement says:

However, the supporters’ representatives felt that they could not overlook the concerns raised, and indicated that they would not consider any further major donations to the football club until later on in the year.

That could mean payment will be made in June .... which, as you know, many of us do not want.
It is a fair question and the longer Rich avoids it the more it seems that the answer is not one that you or I would like.

That could be easily and quickly disproved by @rikofold giving a direct answer.

We know he opposed the idea of withholding a payment in June and argued against it.
I'm not avoiding the question, but the committee agreed a statement and it's not for me to make my own variation.

What I will say is what Sharron has already said to you Henry - that it's reasonable to assume we're talking about the second half of the year. Make of that what you will, but as I say most people seem to have understood what the statement is saying.

I'm not the enemy, try not to forget that everyone, but I am constrained by my role.
But Sharon isn't a committee member, you are and I don't want to assume incorrectly.

Answer the question.
You have no right to demand something of me you know very well I'm not free to say. The Committee agreed a statement, make of it what you will. I've said all I'm going to say on it, and if you really haven't worked it out by now then you've gone down in my estimation Mr Irving.

But you know exactly what the situation is and are just making the usual mischief.
Fine Rik, you and Henry might have issues. I don't really care.

Now, please answer my question.

And mine, please

To_Be_Franck · January 2016

All these people leaving and still not a sniff of a daily / weekly prize.
@rikofold , rather than answering all these tricky questions from everyone else, could you tell me whether my number is still in the hat please?!

Miserableoldgit · January 2016

Okay.
Cancelled.

I suggest every Valley Gold member cancels their subscriptions unless "we" get a straight answer to a straight question.

Is RD and his company receiving any money from Valley Gold members now or June, or, is "our" money being held indefinitely ?

Henry Irving · January 2016

rikofold said:

Henry Irving said:

rikofold said:

Henry Irving said:

stonemuse said:
To be fair Rik, it's a fair question.

The statement says:

However, the supporters’ representatives felt that they could not overlook the concerns raised, and indicated that they would not consider any further major donations to the football club until later on in the year.

That could mean payment will be made in June .... which, as you know, many of us do not want.
It is a fair question and the longer Rich avoids it the more it seems that the answer is not one that you or I would like.

That could be easily and quickly disproved by @rikofold giving a direct answer.

We know he opposed the idea of withholding a payment in June and argued against it.
I'm not avoiding the question, but the committee agreed a statement and it's not for me to make my own variation.

What I will say is what Sharron has already said to you Henry - that it's reasonable to assume we're talking about the second half of the year. Make of that what you will, but as I say most people seem to have understood what the statement is saying.

I'm not the enemy, try not to forget that everyone, but I am constrained by my role.
But Sharon isn't a committee member, you are and I don't want to assume incorrectly.

Answer the question.
You have no right to demand something of me you know very well I'm not free to say. The Committee agreed a statement, make of it what you will. I've said all I'm going to say on it, and if you really haven't worked it out by now then you've gone down in my estimation Mr Irving.

But you know exactly what the situation is and are just making the usual mischief.

I'm one of a number of Valley Gold members asking you, as a Valley Gold committee member, to clarify the ambiguous statement you and the other committee members made.

Already on this thread two members have decided to leave Valley Gold, something which I did not want to happen, because you will not give a straight answer to a straight question.

You actively opposed blocking payments at all and specifically in June on other threads. You are now refusing to clarify what the statement means and have endorsed Missed it's post that says that there is only a "threat" of with holding payment.

So I have to assume, until you state otherwise, that VG WILL make a payment to the football club in June as that is "later in the year".

rikofold · January 2016

All, for the last time please respect that I am not free to comment here beyond the statement issued. I am bound by my responsibilities to the management committee.

Henry, you've already been told earlier this week that you're safe to consider the statement implies H2 2016. If you want to assume June is in H2 then - seriously - there's no-one that can help you.

Everyone, you're allowed to read what I've said Henry's been told. And if you too want to think June is H2 then no-one can help you either.

That's it from me now on this thread.

EDIT: https://chicagoaddick.wordpress.com/2016/01/12/valley-gold-withdraws-funding/

cafcfan · January 2016

Perhaps I'm being a bit dumb here but how can anyone answer "yes or no" to a question about something that is not scheduled to happen for another 150 days or so?
Anything might happen in that intervening period. Roland might sell the club or die; North Korea might nuke us; KM might become a competent CEO (okay scrap that last one).
So in the circumstances, neither a yes or a no answer is appropriate, surely?
The phrase "not consider any further major donations to the football club until later on in the year". seems clear to me. With the key words being not consider.
So, taking a further decision in the light of whatever future events take place down the line seems the correct concept to me.

Missed It · January 2016

Well, I can understand why rikofold gets to tearing his hair out over this!

I think everybody needs to put their sense of 'internet entitlement' away for a second and take a deep breath.

The official statement was issued on behalf of the legally constituted body that is Valley Gold. Even if he wants to, he cannot state on a public forum any action or intention outside of the statement issued.

We can all cancel, which will probably kill the scheme. Or we can all note that the threat has been made, bearing in mind that if carried out it would probably kill the scheme too.

I'd rather have Valley Gold in existence than not but if we kill it now the economics of the third division, where we are likely to end up, may mean it is never resurrected.

Norman_Smith · January 2016

I like HI would like a clear answer if you are unable to give one I suggest you call a emergency GM so current members can vote on the payment before June.

Weegie Addick · January 2016

Oh Henry Irving does love a wind-up.

Shame the "all fans united" lasted as long as Wim de Corte's reign...

RDG · January 2016

Just catching up on this. It's clear the membership needs to be fully consulted on withholding payment to the club. If I discover any more money is moving from VG into the coffers of the RD regime, then I'm afraid I'll have to cancel. No point in boycotting games if my cash is still going into his pockets via this route.

Never won a penny, either. Bloody scandal that too!

RalphMilnesgut · January 2016

I have been a Valley Gold member since the beginning. I don't like the statement as it is not clear. That said it was agreed by committee and I do not blame Rik for not breaking ranks.

I think I'm staying in until the next payment and then make my mind up if it is supporting a millionaires plaything/experiment.

stonemuse · January 2016

Weegie Addick said:
Oh Henry Irving does love a wind-up.

Shame the "all fans united" lasted as long as Wim de Corte's reign...

Why are you blaming Henry for a windup?

I can assure you that both MOG and I are not on a windup. We both wanted a simple answer.

We are not the ones causing the split.

carly burn · January 2016

carly burn said:
When you ask Rikofold a question he gets all up tight and says "I've answered this" and you have to traipse through various comments on any particular thread? Normally concluding he didn't!

I sometimes think he went the Belgian school of communication.

He also says 'I'm out' a lot

and comes back umpteen times!

;-)

carly burn · January 2016

Weegie Addick said:
Oh Henry Irving does love a wind-up.

Shame the "all fans united" lasted as long as Wim de Corte's reign...

I think he's asking a perfectly pertinent question.

Weegie Addick · January 2016

carly burn said:

Weegie Addick said:
Oh Henry Irving does love a wind-up.

Shame the "all fans united" lasted as long as Wim de Corte's reign...
I think he's asking a perfectly pertinent question.

@rikofold has explained clearly why his tongue is tied and referred those asking to Sharron's comment re 2nd half of the year, which Henry was well aware of, but chose to ignore.

carly burn · January 2016

Henry Irving said:

rikofold said:

Henry Irving said:
So will VG be making a donation to the club on June 2016? Yes or no
The statement is what we're saying on the matter. Others have understood it.
It's a reasonable question from a member. why won't you give a straight answer?

I ask again, will VG be making the planned payment to the football club in June 2016, yes or no?

Maybe.

stonemuse · January 2016

Weegie Addick said:

carly burn said:

Weegie Addick said:
Oh Henry Irving does love a wind-up.

Shame the "all fans united" lasted as long as Wim de Corte's reign...
I think he's asking a perfectly pertinent question.

@rikofold has explained clearly why his tongue is tied and referred those asking to Sharron's comment re 2nd half of the year, which Henry was well aware of, but chose to ignore.

There has been no categorical confirmation that it will be held until Q2 which was our request weeks ago prior to the meeting.

Weegie Addick · January 2016

By my reckoning, a year has 12 months. So the "second half" is July to December.

Norman_Smith · January 2016

@rikofold has explained clearly why his tongue is tied

Then he should call a emergency GM and let the Members decided

IA · January 2016

Emergency GM now to decide what to do in 5 months' time?

Weegie Addick · January 2016

Norman_Smith said:

@rikofold has explained clearly why his tongue is tied

Then he should call a emergency GM and let the Members decided

It us up to members to call such a meeting - there is another thread re this.

Norman_Smith · January 2016

IA said:
Emergency GM now to decide what to do in 5 months' time?

GM in May then but before a payment is made

stonemuse · January 2016

Weegie Addick said:
By my reckoning, a year has 12 months. So the "second half" is July to December.

I'm not being awkward but where does it categorically state Q2? It appears to be rather vague ...we were seeking certainty before making a decision to stay in or not.

Henry Irving · January 2016

Weegie Addick said:

Norman_Smith said:

@rikofold has explained clearly why his tongue is tied

Then he should call a emergency GM and let the Members decided

It us up to members to call such a meeting - there is another thread re this.

The committee members can also call a general meeting is they so choose.

RedChaser · January 2016

Rik you are a one, have you thought about a career change like politics for example

Weegie Addick · January 2016

stonemuse said:

Weegie Addick said:
By my reckoning, a year has 12 months. So the "second half" is July to December.
I'm not being awkward but where does it categorically state Q2? It appears to be rather vague ...we were seeking certainty before making a decision to stay in or not.

We're going in circles here. The statement issued was agreed by the whole committee, so including KM and David Joyes. That is why it is "rather vague". You'll have to make your own mind up whether you trust the inferences or not, but I do believe that the fans ' reps have said they will withhold the June payment.

Henry Irving · January 2016

Weegie Addick said:

carly burn said:

Weegie Addick said:
Oh Henry Irving does love a wind-up.

Shame the "all fans united" lasted as long as Wim de Corte's reign...
I think he's asking a perfectly pertinent question.

@rikofold has explained clearly why his tongue is tied and referred those asking to Sharron's comment re 2nd half of the year, which Henry was well aware of, but chose to ignore.

I didn't ignore it at all.

I made reference to it.

If what Sharon, an very able employee but still an employee, is saying is correct and no payment will be made in June then how is it she, an employee, can say this but a committee member can not? Has Sharon acted incorrectly and said something she shouldn't?

Why leave the ambiguity? Why allow more members to leave? Why not just say "There will be no payment in June" End of, done, everyone is happy and we "move on"

And if @rikofold doesn't want to answer my question because it is coming from me then answer the questions of the other VG members on this thread.

He won't say it because the the statement is, in my opinion, ambiguous. Whether @rikofold realised it was ambiguous at the time he helped draft it or only afterwards I don't know but it is ambiguous and I believe that some of the other committee members knew that it was at the time they drafted it. They teach you that in law school.

paulbaconsarnie · January 2016

Henry Irving said:

Weegie Addick said:

Norman_Smith said:

@rikofold has explained clearly why his tongue is tied

Then he should call a emergency GM and let the Members decided

It us up to members to call such a meeting - there is another thread re this.

The committee members can also call a general meeting is they so choose.

Didn't you suggest on a protest ideas thread that people shouldn't put forward ideas wanting others to make them happen?

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