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Julian Assange: "Hero or Helmet?"
LuckyReds
Posts: 5,866
A bit of a polarising subject, but Julian Assange - is he a hero, or is he a helmet?
So the UN's Working Group on Arbitrary Detention have officially decided that he should be released and receive compensation from both the UK and Swedish governments due to his "arbitrary detention"; the detention that is, which involves him skipping bail and hiding in an embassy whilst there's a European Arrest Warrant out in his name for rape.
It's quite clear that the man himself is a narcissist - not that this should detract from his achievements, which actually seem to be limited to being the self imposed "Editor In Chief" of Wikileaks. That is, he enabled other people to put their necks on the line by breaching things like the Official Secrets Act but, as an individual, actually didn't do anything that dangerous himself.
There's also a very interesting site - https://govwaste.co.uk/ - which looks at how the £13,700,000+ that's been spent on securing the Ecuadorian embassy could've been used elsewhere.
My vote? Helmet. After wasting £13.7 million pounds on this debacle I think there should be some form of direct consultation with Ecuador and the situation of him residing in their embassy should be resolved once and for all. Preferably this would involve his arrest, facing the rape investigation in Sweden and (perhaps after any subsequent sentences out there) coming back and doing some time for his bail breaches in the UK.
If the best we could get was safe passage to Ecuador I'd take that though; ultimately, the sooner we can forget that this guy even exists the better.
So the UN's Working Group on Arbitrary Detention have officially decided that he should be released and receive compensation from both the UK and Swedish governments due to his "arbitrary detention"; the detention that is, which involves him skipping bail and hiding in an embassy whilst there's a European Arrest Warrant out in his name for rape.
It's quite clear that the man himself is a narcissist - not that this should detract from his achievements, which actually seem to be limited to being the self imposed "Editor In Chief" of Wikileaks. That is, he enabled other people to put their necks on the line by breaching things like the Official Secrets Act but, as an individual, actually didn't do anything that dangerous himself.
There's also a very interesting site - https://govwaste.co.uk/ - which looks at how the £13,700,000+ that's been spent on securing the Ecuadorian embassy could've been used elsewhere.
My vote? Helmet. After wasting £13.7 million pounds on this debacle I think there should be some form of direct consultation with Ecuador and the situation of him residing in their embassy should be resolved once and for all. Preferably this would involve his arrest, facing the rape investigation in Sweden and (perhaps after any subsequent sentences out there) coming back and doing some time for his bail breaches in the UK.
If the best we could get was safe passage to Ecuador I'd take that though; ultimately, the sooner we can forget that this guy even exists the better.
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Comments
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Helmet1
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Bit of both10
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Helmet should walk out the door get nicked be shipped to Sweden, or shut up and stay in doors2
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Scum.0
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Target practice on Salisbury Plain.0
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I'm not sure why he's blamed for the £13.7m spent on watching the Ecuadorian embassy. That was a government decision.
He should go to Sweden to face charges for rape.
My gut says that Sweden/UK/Ecuador should not extradite him to the US, which I believe is ultimately the reason why he's hiding in South America.3 -
Helmet0
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Helmet should walk out the door get nicked be shipped to Sweden.... exactly right1
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For those of you calling him a helmet, if you believed that policitally motivated charges had been invented with the intention of getting you shipped off to the US, would you abide by your bail conditions? I suspect not. The acid test is whether those rape allegations are genuine or not. I suspect we may never know.14
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Mostly a helmet0
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Disgusting Treacherous helmet. Hope he gets what’s coming to him!0
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Sex case Sex case hang him hang him hang him
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he shouold go back to sewden to answer the charges against him. Instead he abuses the asylum system to escape the law.2
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If it was just my money at stake, I might agree with you, but you forgot to mention "in the process screwing over all those supporters who put forward their hard-earned money to get you out on bail in the first place". But he doesn't give a shit, cos it's all about him.AddicksAddict said:For those of you calling him a helmet, if you believed that policitally motivated charges had been invented with the intention of getting you shipped off to the US, would you abide by your bail conditions? I suspect not.
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I suspect you are right. It is very difficult indeed to believe that a nation like Sweden would involve itself in some concocted set up put in train by the CIA. (Sadly not quite so unbelievable that the so-called Land of the Free would set something up though.) So who knows what the complainants, Miss A and Miss W are up to?AddicksAddict said:For those of you calling him a helmet, if you believed that policitally motivated charges had been invented with the intention of getting you shipped off to the US, would you abide by your bail conditions? I suspect not. The acid test is whether those rape allegations are genuine or not. I suspect we may never know.
As to the police costs, totally ridiculous. We should have just suspended all diplomatic relations with Ecuador, shut their embassy, sent their diplomats home and then arrested Assange and deported him to Sweden. So soon as he got on the plane, the diplomats could have been invited back while losing no sleep over whether they accepted the invitation or carried out a tit-for-tat expulsion.0 -
His lawyer has pretty much confessed on his behalf though.AddicksAddict said:For those of you calling him a helmet, if you believed that policitally motivated charges had been invented with the intention of getting you shipped off to the US, would you abide by your bail conditions? I suspect not. The acid test is whether those rape allegations are genuine or not. I suspect we may never know.
Quote 1, courtesy of his lawyer:Emmerson said earlier that he was not challenging the fact that they "found Mr Assange's sexual behaviour in these encounters disreputable, discourteous, disturbing or even pushing towards the boundaries of what they were comfortable with". But the sexual activities that occurred had taken place with consent, he argued, and, unlike in Sweden, could not be criminalised in the English jurisdiction.
If it were false and entirely politically motivated then getting your lawyer to claim "Yeah, it could be illegal in Sweden but it isn't here!" is probably a bit of a dumb move..
Not nearly as dumb as openly admitting that the incident did occur though. In fact, it would also be considered rape in this country.
Quote 2, courtesy of his lawyer:They fell asleep and she woke up by his penetrating her. She immediately asked if he was wearing anything. He answered: "You." She said: "You better not have HIV." He said: "Of course not." She may have been upset, but she clearly consented to its [the sexual encounter's] continuation and that is a central consideration.
So, the facts as per his own lawyer:
-> She expressed a desire not to have sexual intercourse without protection;
-> Assange had sexual intercourse with her, using protection;
-> Later on, she was woken up to Assange having sex with her again - but without protection, explicitly against the wishes that she expressed earlier on.
The lawyer's defence actually seems to revolve around the suggestion that he gained implied permission from her, during the act, and she was only capable of giving that implied consent because he had accidentally woken her up.
Considering this version of events is actually part of his defence, but still relies on him violating her permission - I would consider it pretty clear that he is guilty.
Here's the source for the quotes: http://www.theguardian.com/media/2011/jul/12/julian-assange-extradition-live-coverage
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My natural instinct ordinarily would be 'helmet.'
However the older I get the less faith I have in the 'Establishment' and part of me regards him as a 'hero' for the non-violent trouble he has caused to it.7 -
The Afghans who were working alongside US forces who had their names leaked may not be in agreement about the trouble he caused being "non-violent". Same goes for the MI6 guys who had to be pulled out of Russia and China thanks to Snowden's leaks containing their names.LenGlover said:My natural instinct ordinarily would be 'helmet.'
However the older I get the less faith I have in the 'Establishment' and part of me regards him as a 'hero' for the non-violent trouble he has caused to it.
His games have risked the lives of a lot of people who haven't been caught up in any dodgy deeds, and in the case of some of them have simply been trying to make their country a better place.5 -
Pasty faced wimp.
The kid who couldn't pull a girl when he was at school.0 - Sponsored links:
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Total helmet. Sweden is not a 3rd world country after all so he will get a fair hearing. He might even be acquitted. It's got to be better than skulking in an embassy toilet for the past 3 years.3
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Full on helmet1
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I wouldn't have endangered people's lives by whistleblowing in the first place.AddicksAddict said:For those of you calling him a helmet, if you believed that policitally motivated charges had been invented with the intention of getting you shipped off to the US, would you abide by your bail conditions? I suspect not. The acid test is whether those rape allegations are genuine or not. I suspect we may never know.
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Curate's egg for me. Good in parts.
Totally support the wikileaks effort but can't condone what appears to be unsavoury behaviour of the worst kind.0 -
He's done an interview in tomorrow's Voice of the Valley.10
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After reading this a cowardly no good rapist helmet scum ched Evans supporting nonce helmet2
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Looks like Noel Edmunds1
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NLA so no real thought on him then .1
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I hope I never get on the wrong side of you NLA!nth london addick said:After reading this a cowardly no good rapist helmet scum ched Evans supporting nonce helmet
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Helmet ...and a dangerous one at that.0
