Learning a Foreign language
Comments
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I really think that's over simplifying it, id suggest the difference in difficulty is why Chinese students start to learn to write at a later stage than western students.seth plum said:
The written language is marks in an imaginary rectangle, as opposed to on an imaginary line.The_President said:Couldnt imagine learning a non Latin alphabet language like Chinese - must be so tough.
The basic western alphabet has 26 letters, the basic strokes in Chinese is 8. In both cases it is how these things are put together.
The written Oriental languages are all the same.
It is like if you speak English you can read Italian even if you can't speak it.0 -
lolStu_of_Kunming said:
Sadly my reading/writing in still miles behind my speaking/listening, mostly because I don't need it on a day to day basis and I'm an awful student.
Being single for quite a while helped a lot with the speaking
Pillow talk is the way forward - until you find she only wants to improve her English!
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The level of English is so low here that unless someone actively studies it, they have almost no interest in learning it.Oggy Red said:
lolStu_of_Kunming said:
Sadly my reading/writing in still miles behind my speaking/listening, mostly because I don't need it on a day to day basis and I'm an awful student.
Being single for quite a while helped a lot with the speaking
Pillow talk is the way forward - until you find she only wants to improve her English!
I live in one of the poorest / least educated provinces in China, a world away from Beijing / Shanghai.0 -
I'm learning Japanese (slowly!). One thing I do is listen to Japanese pop/rock music. It's really helped me with listening comprehension. Translating lyrics, figuring out the meanings and their context and learning the new words that pop up all help and it doesn't feel like studying. Just listening to music and making the train commute a bit more bearable.
Good luck finding some nice French music though!2 -
The younger generation is fine, but good luck finding someone over 50 who speaks mandarin.....
Even in the office most people just speak kunminghua, unless they're making an effort for me.0 -
Being an English speaker who can speak Mandarin must make you very marketable over there , Stu?0
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Jessie, I just find you 1) Speak such sense in your posts and 2) They are in perfect English ! (better than mine)
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Mr. President. If these are any good to you, pm me and we can try and arrange something.
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The more I move away from teaching the more helpful it becomes, sadly I'm nowhere near the level of someone like Siv, unless you can pass exams it's not great.The_President said:Being an English speaker who can speak Mandarin must make you very marketable over there , Stu?
More than anything it gets me more respect from the locals. You'd be amazed how many people have been here years and can't speak a work.
I've been to almost every province in China, I'd say Yunnan is one of the worst for it, for example, in sichuan / chengdu, people will speak their dialect but can switch into mandarin, in Kunming a large part of the population just can't speak mandarinJessieAddick said:
That's the same here in my city Wuxi. I suppose it's the same in most places in China, even in Shanghai older people speak in native dialect. And yes I agree it must be a bit annoying for you. Like I said on here some time ago, China is so big it's almost like the whole European continent in terms of languages/dialects, if you know what I mean.Stu_of_Kunming said:The younger generation is fine, but good luck finding someone over 50 who speaks mandarin.....
Even in the office most people just speak kunminghua, unless they're making an effort for me.1 -
quite trueAlwaysneil said:Really fluent people can apparently dream in their various languages. I can only dream in English and porn.
i actually do if i am in france or spain for any length of time0 -
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You are probably right.Stu_of_Kunming said:
I really think that's over simplifying it, id suggest the difference in difficulty is why Chinese students start to learn to write at a later stage than western students.seth plum said:
The written language is marks in an imaginary rectangle, as opposed to on an imaginary line.The_President said:Couldnt imagine learning a non Latin alphabet language like Chinese - must be so tough.
The basic western alphabet has 26 letters, the basic strokes in Chinese is 8. In both cases it is how these things are put together.
The written Oriental languages are all the same.
It is like if you speak English you can read Italian even if you can't speak it.
I posted in an attempt to show that Chinese is not as daunting as people initially think it is.0 -
We have similar problems north of Watford ;-)Stu_of_Kunming said:
The more I move away from teaching the more helpful it becomes, sadly I'm nowhere near the level of someone like Siv, unless you can pass exams it's not great.The_President said:Being an English speaker who can speak Mandarin must make you very marketable over there , Stu?
More than anything it gets me more respect from the locals. You'd be amazed how many people have been here years and can't speak a work.
I've been to almost every province in China, I'd say Yunnan is one of the worst for it, for example, in sichuan / chengdu, people will speak their dialect but can switch into mandarin, in Kunming a large part of the population just can't speak mandarinJessieAddick said:
That's the same here in my city Wuxi. I suppose it's the same in most places in China, even in Shanghai older people speak in native dialect. And yes I agree it must be a bit annoying for you. Like I said on here some time ago, China is so big it's almost like the whole European continent in terms of languages/dialects, if you know what I mean.Stu_of_Kunming said:The younger generation is fine, but good luck finding someone over 50 who speaks mandarin.....
Even in the office most people just speak kunminghua, unless they're making an effort for me.4 -
Pinyin helps :8seth plum said:
You are probably right.Stu_of_Kunming said:
I really think that's over simplifying it, id suggest the difference in difficulty is why Chinese students start to learn to write at a later stage than western students.seth plum said:
The written language is marks in an imaginary rectangle, as opposed to on an imaginary line.The_President said:Couldnt imagine learning a non Latin alphabet language like Chinese - must be so tough.
The basic western alphabet has 26 letters, the basic strokes in Chinese is 8. In both cases it is how these things are put together.
The written Oriental languages are all the same.
It is like if you speak English you can read Italian even if you can't speak it.
I posted in an attempt to show that Chinese is not as daunting as people initially think it is.0 -
Steve McLaren picked up Dutch quite quickly. He sounded fluent in one of his interviews.9
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@jimmymelrose is your man. He is now living permanently in France & speaks it fluently. His job is as a language teacher, but teaching English to foreign students. He's married to an Argentinian & they have 3 children, who can all speak, French, English & Spanish. I find it great that an 8 year old boy can speak French in his native country but as soon as he comes over here (like they did last month) he can speak English just like that.3
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Not as well as Joey Barton and his French... Wouldnt have known he was English had I not known himSolidgone said:Steve McLaren picked up Dutch quite quickly. He sounded fluent in one of his interviews.
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That's wonderful, its always amazes me here that most Luxembourgeois can speak Luxembourghish,French,English and German fluently, I suppose it helps with Luxembourghish being sorta a German dialect. They just switch between languages like just flicking a switch.golfaddick said:@jimmymelrose is your man. He is now living permanently in France & speaks it fluently. His job is as a language teacher, but teaching English to foreign students. He's married to an Argentinian & they have 3 children, who can all speak, French, English & Spanish. I find it great that an 8 year old boy can speak French in his native country but as soon as he comes over here (like they did last month) he can speak English just like that.
My colleague, whose parents come from Italy, speaks English with me, then his parents ring up and he's off talking Italian, then his daughter will call and he's speaking Luxembourghish, and then speaks to his wife in French - all fluently.0 -
Tried to learn French several times, been evening school for 2 years once a week but wasn't enough to drum it in me.
Especially as part was written which held no interest.
Understand quite well and can follow a conversation but to express myself in french is challenging0 -
One really useful thing about learning Spanish has been how easy it has subsequently been to pick up some other bits of Latin languages like Italian and Romanian. I studied those two to different levels, particularly the latter as I go there quite a bit for work, and found the basis that Spanish gave me was really useful for their grammar and vocabulary.1
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Just watch old episodes of Allo Allo, good moaning1
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And there's a secret ...... learn the basics when you're a kid.golfaddick said:@jimmymelrose is your man. He is now living permanently in France & speaks it fluently. His job is as a language teacher, but teaching English to foreign students. He's married to an Argentinian & they have 3 children, who can all speak, French, English & Spanish. I find it great that an 8 year old boy can speak French in his native country but as soon as he comes over here (like they did last month) he can speak English just like that.
A good friend of mine is married to a French woman and their young 4 year old learned to speak English with his Dad, and French with his mother.
He can effortlessly switch from fluent English to fluent French and back again.
And when I make a mistake in French, he'll casually correct me.
I've learned and understood more French conversation from that little lad.
He makes it sound simple.
Morale of the story: young kids can make the most natural teachers.
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This is the only expression you’ll need to learn in FrenchCAFCBourne said:Tried to learn French several times, been evening school for 2 years once a week but wasn't enough to drum it in me.
Especially as part was written which held no interest.
Understand quite well and can follow a conversation but to express myself in french is challenging
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Definitely true. I think it's proven that the younger you learn, the better, and it stays with you. So my modest French and German seems to return quickly and naturally from somewhere deep inside my brain when I return to those countries, but Czech, it's an absolute bastard to get to grips with. As a Slavic language it has no relation with those I have learnt.Oggy Red said:
And there's a secret ...... learn the basics when you're a kid.golfaddick said:@jimmymelrose is your man. He is now living permanently in France & speaks it fluently. His job is as a language teacher, but teaching English to foreign students. He's married to an Argentinian & they have 3 children, who can all speak, French, English & Spanish. I find it great that an 8 year old boy can speak French in his native country but as soon as he comes over here (like they did last month) he can speak English just like that.
A good friend of mine is married to a French woman and their young 4 year old learned to speak English with his Dad, and French with his mother.
He can effortlessly switch from fluent English to fluent French and back again.
And when I make a mistake in French, he'll casually correct me.
I've learned and understood more French conversation from that little lad.
He makes it sound simple.
Morale of the story: young kids can make the most natural teachers.
Doesn't really help anyone over 25 or so, we can't wind back the clock...
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My granddaughter is 16 months old and can say about 20 words and one of those is hello in French. Her other grandmother is French so talks to her in French all the time. My daughter can speak German and Spanish and her husband French.0
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"What I want to say actually is that it's better to find something you're interested in, whether it's the culture or the people (or other things). Learning a language can be tough and boring but if you love a specific subject it won't be that hard and the chances of you giving up half way will be much lower."
Looks like French porn may be the way forward then Pres.2 -
Perhaps your granddaughter can help Ricky Otto.Mosscat said:My granddaughter is 16 months old and can say about 20 words and one of those is hello in French. Her other grandmother is French so talks to her in French all the time. My daughter can speak German and Spanish and her husband French.
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Mosscat said:
My granddaughter is 16 months old and can say about 20 words and one of those is hello in French. Her other grandmother is French so talks to her in French all the time. My daughter can speak German and Spanish and her husband French.
If all those people around the little one continue speaking to her in their native tongue, as she gets a little older she'll naturally be able to express herself in those languages.
Little kids also have the gift of not mixing one language into another - they seem to be able to compartmentalise one from the other and switch effortlessly.
It's a real asset for kids to be brought up bilingually.
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Living in Italy now and have studied Italian on and off for years before coming here, I'd say my Italian is decent but not fluent now. However, when I was a kid I spoke it fluently and my mum even claims it was my first language! But I stopped speaking it at about 6 years old and totally forgot every word of it! So have had to relearn over the years but I feel like I'll never get back that instinctive speaking but I hope so!
I feel like I can speak more than I understand which is said to be strange by some as usually when learning a language you generally understand more than you speak.
I remember going on a TEFL course and was told that after the age of 12 the chances of mastering a language drop by 99%, that's mastering though and I believe that changes if you live in the country of said language you're trying to learn.
Also vocab is more important than grammar because if you know 1000 words in any language you know 70% of the language.2 -
Looks like me outside me shop at Grove Park BR station, before I moved FrenchsideDaveMehmet said:
This is the only expression you’ll need to learn in FrenchCAFCBourne said:Tried to learn French several times, been evening school for 2 years once a week but wasn't enough to drum it in me.
Especially as part was written which held no interest.
Understand quite well and can follow a conversation but to express myself in french is challenging0 -
Or even learn French in One Word ?DaveMehmet said:
This is the only expression you’ll need to learn in FrenchCAFCBourne said:Tried to learn French several times, been evening school for 2 years once a week but wasn't enough to drum it in me.
Especially as part was written which held no interest.
Understand quite well and can follow a conversation but to express myself in french is challenging
Putain!
One size fits all. It's not what you say, it's how you say it.
But be careful. It can offend.
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