France bring back National Service
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Two months?
Good luck with that.1 -
Compulsory military service is a shite idea. But the notion of bringing people together for a month, to do something useful could work if done properly... That's the key.9
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Have you been reading this forum recently? And I thought that most of us were trying to achieve the same objective.McBobbin said:Compulsory military service is a shite idea. But the notion of bringing people together for a month, to do something useful could work if done properly... That's the key.
Imagine what two months of compulsory intergration for the greater good, across all the communities within France is going to do.
It will end in tears.0 -
Like a training camp in Portugal...?McBobbin said:Compulsory military service is a shite idea. But the notion of bringing people together for a month, to do something useful could work if done properly... That's the key.
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Why are those guys wearing bakewell tarts on their heads?Covered End said:Interesting.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-446256256 -
They are from the Patisserie Legion.iaitch said:
Why are those guys wearing bakewell tarts on their heads?Covered End said:Interesting.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-4462562511 -
I wouldn't mind, but every time a car backfires the whole country surrenders.8
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How long does it take to learn how to surrender?8
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To be fair, the guys in the tank brigade have a harder time. It's not easy learning to drive a vehicle with 5 reverse gears and one forward (in case they get attacked from the rear)smudge7946 said:How long does it take to learn how to surrender?
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My Swiss mates grumble a little bit about military service but none of them seem to want to abolish it. What makes it such a shite idea?McBobbin said:Compulsory military service is a shite idea. But the notion of bringing people together for a month, to do something useful could work if done properly... That's the key.
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Think the notion of national service is being associated with the British version in the fifties. Army service.
Get away from that and think service to the nation that might involve any type of community initiative from clearing canals to collecting litter and suddenly the idea becomes quite appealing to me at least.
No idea if the French can make it work with today’s youth but I hope they do and wish the project well.4 -
At least they have a button that pops up the white flag rather than having to wave it manually thoughDaveMehmet said:
To be fair, the guys in the tank brigade have a harder time. It's not easy learning to drive a vehicle with 5 reverse gears and one forward (in case they get attacked from the rear)smudge7946 said:How long does it take to learn how to surrender?
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It would work if everyone had to do it, can't see that being the case though, can you really imagine someone like Jacob Rees-Mogg allowing their child to go collecting litter with Gaz and McKenzie?ShootersHillGuru said:Think the notion of national service is being associated with the British version in the fifties. Army service.
Get away from that and think service to the nation that might involve any type of community initiative from clearing canals to collecting litter and suddenly the idea becomes quite appealing to me at least.
No idea if the French can make it work with today’s youth but I hope they do and wish the project well.0 -
For two months I think it would be very hard for anyone to feel that it wasn’t right for them. I think it will be hard to make it cost effective and the administration will be very difficult but apart from that I think it’s a great idea to be honest.Stu_of_Kunming said:
It would work if everyone had to do it, can't see that being the case though, can you really imagine someone like Jacob Rees-Mogg allowing their child to go collecting litter with Gaz and McKenzie?ShootersHillGuru said:Think the notion of national service is being associated with the British version in the fifties. Army service.
Get away from that and think service to the nation that might involve any type of community initiative from clearing canals to collecting litter and suddenly the idea becomes quite appealing to me at least.
No idea if the French can make it work with today’s youth but I hope they do and wish the project well.
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Can you imagine Gaz and McKenzie not turning round and saying "fuck off you c*nTs", "when can I have a fag", "nah I ain't giving yer my f"£ckin phone", "Err, this is long..."1
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They're looking for potential recruits to their version of the SAS - motto: "Who cares who wins?"2
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I think there will be people like that but if that’s the case then fine exclude them but make them pay for it. Benefits, tax, confiscation of goods. Don’t want to do it and it’s going to cost you £5000 ? Hard to administer but I think once the decision has been made to have a national service you have to find a way to make it work.soapy_jones said:Can you imagine Gaz and McKenzie not turning round and saying "fuck off you c*nTs", "when can I have a fag", "nah I ain't giving yer my f"£ckin phone", "Err, this is long..."
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if you make it more like community service you are punishing people that have done nothing wrong.ShootersHillGuru said:Think the notion of national service is being associated with the British version in the fifties. Army service.
Get away from that and think service to the nation that might involve any type of community initiative from clearing canals to collecting litter and suddenly the idea becomes quite appealing to me at least.
No idea if the French can make it work with today’s youth but I hope they do and wish the project well.0 -
community/national service whatever you want to call it ...surely their should be a punishment if you refuse to take probably the first opportunity to contribute some positive to society ?cafcdave123 said:
if you make it more like community service you are punishing people that have done nothing wrong.ShootersHillGuru said:Think the notion of national service is being associated with the British version in the fifties. Army service.
Get away from that and think service to the nation that might involve any type of community initiative from clearing canals to collecting litter and suddenly the idea becomes quite appealing to me at least.
No idea if the French can make it work with today’s youth but I hope they do and wish the project well.
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I just think that as we use community service as a punishment for breaking the law in this country it would be unfair. I would have no problem with military service as it teaches somethinglolwray said:
community/national service whatever you want to call it ...surely their should be a punishment if you refuse to take probably the first opportunity to contribute some positive to society ?cafcdave123 said:
if you make it more like community service you are punishing people that have done nothing wrong.ShootersHillGuru said:Think the notion of national service is being associated with the British version in the fifties. Army service.
Get away from that and think service to the nation that might involve any type of community initiative from clearing canals to collecting litter and suddenly the idea becomes quite appealing to me at least.
No idea if the French can make it work with today’s youth but I hope they do and wish the project well.0 - Sponsored links:
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What nonsense. How is it a punishment ? Young people getting the opportunity to do something that they would never normally get to do for a couple of months in their lifetime. Meet new people, make friends. Come out the other side feeling like you have contributed. I personally can’t see a down side to it. There will of course be people who won’t buy into it or even attend but have in place proper sanctions for those people. I’m willing to bet most of those that attend will look back on it as a positive experience.cafcdave123 said:
if you make it more like community service you are punishing people that have done nothing wrong.ShootersHillGuru said:Think the notion of national service is being associated with the British version in the fifties. Army service.
Get away from that and think service to the nation that might involve any type of community initiative from clearing canals to collecting litter and suddenly the idea becomes quite appealing to me at least.
No idea if the French can make it work with today’s youth but I hope they do and wish the project well.
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By picking up crisp packets from the side of a canal?
That's not 'service' - it's outsourcing prison labour ffs!3 -
ShootersHillGuru said:
What nonsense. How is it a punishment ? Young people getting the opportunity to do something that they would never normally get to do for a couple of months in their lifetime. Meet new people, make friends. Come out the other side feeling like you have contributed. I personally can’t see a down side to it. There will of course be people who won’t buy into it or even attend but have in place proper sanctions for those people. I’m willing to bet most of those that attend will look back on it as a positive experience.cafcdave123 said:
if you make it more like community service you are punishing people that have done nothing wrong.ShootersHillGuru said:Think the notion of national service is being associated with the British version in the fifties. Army service.
Get away from that and think service to the nation that might involve any type of community initiative from clearing canals to collecting litter and suddenly the idea becomes quite appealing to me at least.
No idea if the French can make it work with today’s youth but I hope they do and wish the project well.
As I have stated above, we use community service as a punishment for breaking the law. why should young people have to perform the same tasks as people who drink drive/burgle houses/beat their wives up?
I'm not disagreeing with the idea of a service just saying that I don't believe it is fair to make them do the things that are currently done by criminals.0 -
If everyone had to do it, criminals wouldn't, they could do something more useful, like digging and filling holes.cafcdave123 said:ShootersHillGuru said:
What nonsense. How is it a punishment ? Young people getting the opportunity to do something that they would never normally get to do for a couple of months in their lifetime. Meet new people, make friends. Come out the other side feeling like you have contributed. I personally can’t see a down side to it. There will of course be people who won’t buy into it or even attend but have in place proper sanctions for those people. I’m willing to bet most of those that attend will look back on it as a positive experience.cafcdave123 said:
if you make it more like community service you are punishing people that have done nothing wrong.ShootersHillGuru said:Think the notion of national service is being associated with the British version in the fifties. Army service.
Get away from that and think service to the nation that might involve any type of community initiative from clearing canals to collecting litter and suddenly the idea becomes quite appealing to me at least.
No idea if the French can make it work with today’s youth but I hope they do and wish the project well.
As I have stated above, we use community service as a punishment for breaking the law. why should young people have to perform the same tasks as people who drink drive/burgle houses/beat their wives up?
I'm not disagreeing with the idea of a service just saying that I don't believe it is fair to make them do the things that are currently done by criminals.0 -
but they'd still be performing tasks that are deemed a fit punishment for criminals0
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The debate has moved on a bit, but is there actually any evidence that national service is a good thing? Why do we need to train everyone to be in the army? Id rather spendy time doing something else. But, I am warming to the idea in terms of getting people from all backgrounds together to give them new experiences that will actually help them later in life. Some people have barely left their home town... What we should get people to do I've no idea!SantaClaus said:
My Swiss mates grumble a little bit about military service but none of them seem to want to abolish it. What makes it such a shite idea?McBobbin said:Compulsory military service is a shite idea. But the notion of bringing people together for a month, to do something useful could work if done properly... That's the key.
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Answered your own question there McB. I doubt they would ever be front line, God help us if they were.McBobbin said:
The debate has moved on a bit, but is there actually any evidence that national service is a good thing? Why do we need to train everyone to be in the army? Id rather spendy time doing something else. But, I am warming to the idea in terms of getting people from all backgrounds together to give them new experiences that will actually help them later in life. Some people have barely left their home town... What we should get people to do I've no idea!SantaClaus said:
My Swiss mates grumble a little bit about military service but none of them seem to want to abolish it. What makes it such a shite idea?McBobbin said:Compulsory military service is a shite idea. But the notion of bringing people together for a month, to do something useful could work if done properly... That's the key.
Off the top of my head, the forces instil, discipline, a sense of camaraderie, life skills, social skills and give direction.0 -
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There is a big value in this if it's done properly
Community work is under funded and under resourced. Claiming back overgrown areas is an easy one and something firms have their employees doing by running volunteering schemes. It doesn't all have to be bullshit graft for the sake of it.
Yeah ok, clearing up an area knackered by fly tipping is one however having people reclaim and value areas is a longer term thing. Youngsters have more to offer than manual labour, ideas, insight should all be part of it.
Yeah maybe cleaning up a tow path is something, however with a running people and time budget it can be something longer term. That tow path can be invested in and not just made a bit less murderey or rapey but be turned into a nice, scenic part of the local landscape.
The initial cost will be big and it won't be without an on going cost. At some point though something will change. Maybe a couple of lighbulbs will be shone onto an opportunity or two for kids and adults that wouldn't otherwise have had that.
I can't see it taking off in this country, as a nation we are a very selfish society and more so now than ever before. I wish I get proved wrong but no way would a Labour government go for this as an idea and no way will a conservative government pay for it or resource it properly. Although they would do if they could see a margin to be had be privatising it2 -
I think it can if you want it to... I'd hate the army (based on what mates of mine in the armed forces have told me)!soapy_jones said:
Answered your own question there McB. I doubt they would ever be front line, God help us if they were.McBobbin said:
The debate has moved on a bit, but is there actually any evidence that national service is a good thing? Why do we need to train everyone to be in the army? Id rather spendy time doing something else. But, I am warming to the idea in terms of getting people from all backgrounds together to give them new experiences that will actually help them later in life. Some people have barely left their home town... What we should get people to do I've no idea!SantaClaus said:
My Swiss mates grumble a little bit about military service but none of them seem to want to abolish it. What makes it such a shite idea?McBobbin said:Compulsory military service is a shite idea. But the notion of bringing people together for a month, to do something useful could work if done properly... That's the key.
Off the top of my head, the forces instil, discipline, a sense of camaraderie, life skills, social skills and give direction.
It would only work if everyone did it as well.
One study I read a while back shows that conscription actually increases the crime rate!
https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/0c44/09ede2c99272ed1f57547f978a9c87a87342.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjOtevtkvbbAhWysqQKHfnaCRQQFjAKegQIBBAB&usg=AOvVaw08IDtQ9uTm95wGGCTuoSlp
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