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Climate Change - IPCC Report
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It depends what report you read mate. Hydrogen has to be manufactured and the carbon involved in its production is greater than the carbon used by using natural gas according to alot of reports.rikofold said:
Hydrogen's the future, but I have a feeling that will go the way of the everlasting light bulb.Weegie Addick said:The best way to change for the better is to consume less of everything and live simpler lives. However, no-one makes money out of that and no-one in power benefits.
The idea that electric cars are the future is ludicrous when their batteries have a lifespan of c 10 years and are made with ‘rare earth minerals’. Now why doesn’t that phrase alone cause alarm bells to ring?
Energy is a massive issue, we should be installing solar Pv alot more but the electricity grid cannot deal with the increased voltage if we do and there is little desire from the energy companies to spend the money upgrading the network. I have a renewables business and we are installing 100's of heat pumps every year. I firmly believe this is the only way to reduce emissions but to do that we need a way of generating the electricity nationally to supply the demand.at the moment the only sensible way is a mix of wind, solar and nuclear2 -
Nuclear is the future, and again people need to be brought along, as the default is to go Three Mile Island/Chernobyl.
There really needs to be a straight conversation about nuclear, and how it's worth the investment2 -
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If you have to ask, you can't afford it.ShootersHillGuru said:1 -
Investment is the key word mate. The only people willing to invest in nuclear power in the uk are the French. Japan was dipping their toe in but pulled the plug on the site in Anglesey. I agree muscular should be one of our main providers but they should be developed and owned by the UK government. Far too important to be in the hands of foreign governments or companies imo. The issue with that is no government would have the balls to spend the money and do it as all the moaning minis would be kicking off demonstratingRothko said:Nuclear is the future, and again people need to be brought along, as the default is to go Three Mile Island/Chernobyl.
There really needs to be a straight conversation about nuclear, and how it's worth the investment1 -
We are now at the point where there are two credible positions on climate change.
1: We're fucked.
2: We're really fucked, and it's our own fault.0 -
Very good. That’s my point though really. It’s the way forward but unless it’s subsidised massively people won’t be able to afford it.Huskaris said:
If you have to ask, you can't afford it.ShootersHillGuru said:1 -
The French (in my limited knowledge) really are thought leaders when it comes to nuclear.AndyG said:
Investment is the key word mate. The only people willing to invest in nuclear power in the uk are the French. Japan was dipping their toe in but pulled the plug on the site in Anglesey. I agree muscular should be one of our main providers but they should be developed and owned by the UK government. Far too important to be in the hands of foreign governments or companies imo. The issue with that is no government would have the balls to spend the money and do it as all the moaning minis would be kicking off demonstratingRothko said:Nuclear is the future, and again people need to be brought along, as the default is to go Three Mile Island/Chernobyl.
There really needs to be a straight conversation about nuclear, and how it's worth the investment
We are going to have to do it sooner or later, might as well crack on0 -
Obviously depends on the size of the property but they start around the £6k region. They is a government grant called RHI ( renewable heat incentive ) which is a quarterly payment for 7 years which is designed to repay the install cost and also pay your heating costs for 7 years. Doesnt help with the upfront cost but it is still a good scheme based on ROIShootersHillGuru said:0 -
I'm not punting for business by the way lol my business is based in the north west and we install mainly for local authorities and housing associations but not down south lol0
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I completely agree. We are going to have to collectively be taxed, and the cash redistibuted to everyone to get green energy sorted for this.ShootersHillGuru said:
Very good. That’s my point though really. It’s the way forward but unless it’s subsidised massively people won’t be able to afford it.Huskaris said:
If you have to ask, you can't afford it.ShootersHillGuru said:
The green taxes we have seen so far are nothing compared to what we will see, and it's for the best.
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The biggest problem is that the vast majority of the world isn’t having similar discussions. It’s simply not on the agenda in Japan for example.0
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It isnt just financial though. If you look at the figures for what is planned in terms of numbers for heat pump installs nationally it is massive and there just isnt the skills base to get near that volume. The technology is fantastic but needs to be installed by someone who knows what they are doing otherwise they can be really inefficient and cost fortunes to run. Believe it or not my business which is based in north wales is the largest heat pump installer in the uk and I only have 24 fully trained installers. The industry estimate is that in excess of 100,000 is neededHuskaris said:
I completely agree. We are going to have to collectively be taxed, and the cash redistibuted to everyone to get green energy sorted for this.ShootersHillGuru said:
Very good. That’s my point though really. It’s the way forward but unless it’s subsidised massively people won’t be able to afford it.Huskaris said:
If you have to ask, you can't afford it.ShootersHillGuru said:
The green taxes we have seen so far are nothing compared to what we will see, and it's for the best.0 -
Andy, what's the story with heat pumps and microbore central heating pipes, is there an issue there or Is it about the right pump and installation?0
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Heat pumps are more efficient if you can reduce the flow temperature of the water circulating. So ideally you want a good fast circulation otherwise the drop in temperature by the time the water gets back to the heat pump reduces its efficiency. However some heat pumps are fine with microbore uptown a certain output. For example a Mitsubishi 5kw unit will be fine or a vaillant 7kw also. Any larger then you need 15mm pipeworkRothko said:Andy, what's the story with heat pumps and microbore central heating pipes, is there an issue there or Is it about the right pump and installation?0 -
I’m oop northAndyG said:I'm not punting for business by the way lol my business is based in the north west and we install mainly for local authorities and housing associations but not down south lol0 -
@AndyG
Sorry Andy but for an average four bed detached house with cavity wall insulation what would be the annual cost of running a heat pump ?0 -
You need to change your name lolShootersHillGuru said:
I’m oop northAndyG said:I'm not punting for business by the way lol my business is based in the north west and we install mainly for local authorities and housing associations but not down south lol0 -
I was reading about heat pumps being very noisy, us that true @AndyG?0
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It depends on the temperature that you like your home mate but if you kept it at a constant 20 degrees you would be looking at approx £700 per year and RHI payments on that kind of property would be approx £1,600.00 per year for 7 years.ShootersHillGuru said:@AndyG
Sorry Andy but for an average four bed detached house with cavity wall insulation what would be the annual cost of running a heat pump ?
The best way of looking at working out the financials is if you take the running cost you currently pay and compare that to the £700 ish for a heat pump. The install cost on a 4 bed property should be approx 8k. The rhi payments are approx £11.2k so it should repay the install cost and pay for your heating and hot water for 7 years0 - Sponsored links:
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It depends on the make mate there are some that are yes but most top brands such as vaillant or Mitsubishi are no louder than a fridge so not noticed most of the timeME14addick said:I was reading about heat pumps being very noisy, us that true @AndyG?1 -
Well we had to pay about double that for the installation of one for a four bed house. We will get most of the install cost back over 7 years but RHI won’t cover the running cost. Our heating bills do seem to have reduced. I’ll let you know how well it works at actually heating the house in mid-winter!AndyG said:
It depends on the temperature that you like your home mate but if you kept it at a constant 20 degrees you would be looking at approx £700 per year and RHI payments on that kind of property would be approx £1,600.00 per year for 7 years.ShootersHillGuru said:@AndyG
Sorry Andy but for an average four bed detached house with cavity wall insulation what would be the annual cost of running a heat pump ?
The best way of looking at working out the financials is if you take the running cost you currently pay and compare that to the £700 ish for a heat pump. The install cost on a 4 bed property should be approx 8k. The rhi payments are approx £11.2k so it should repay the install cost and pay for your heating and hot water for 7 years0 -
North/South divide mate lolWeegie Addick said:
Well we had to pay about double that for the installation of one for a four bed house. We will get most of the install cost back over 7 years but RHI won’t cover the running cost. Our heating bills do seem to have reduced. I’ll let you know how well it works at actually heating the house in mid-winter!AndyG said:
It depends on the temperature that you like your home mate but if you kept it at a constant 20 degrees you would be looking at approx £700 per year and RHI payments on that kind of property would be approx £1,600.00 per year for 7 years.ShootersHillGuru said:@AndyG
Sorry Andy but for an average four bed detached house with cavity wall insulation what would be the annual cost of running a heat pump ?
The best way of looking at working out the financials is if you take the running cost you currently pay and compare that to the £700 ish for a heat pump. The install cost on a 4 bed property should be approx 8k. The rhi payments are approx £11.2k so it should repay the install cost and pay for your heating and hot water for 7 years
That is what my company charge up here but we do buy the units very well from the manufacturers as we install so many0 -
That’s actually pretty attractive but it’s a prohibitive cost for the vast majority of homes don’t you think ? Until the government are able to offer schemes where the average family can consider getting a heat pump it’s going to remain quite niche isn’t it ? Not going to have any impact on climate change.AndyG said:
It depends on the temperature that you like your home mate but if you kept it at a constant 20 degrees you would be looking at approx £700 per year and RHI payments on that kind of property would be approx £1,600.00 per year for 7 years.ShootersHillGuru said:@AndyG
Sorry Andy but for an average four bed detached house with cavity wall insulation what would be the annual cost of running a heat pump ?
The best way of looking at working out the financials is if you take the running cost you currently pay and compare that to the £700 ish for a heat pump. The install cost on a 4 bed property should be approx 8k. The rhi payments are approx £11.2k so it should repay the install cost and pay for your heating and hot water for 7 years0 -
Yes I agree. We are so busy as one of our local authorities will give anyone who wants a heat pump a 0% interest loan which is paid back out of their RHI payments which more than cover the repayments and it isnt means tested in anyway so alot of people are installing them. I'm sure other areas will follow otherwise the uk has no chance in meeting its emissions targetsShootersHillGuru said:
That’s actually pretty attractive but it’s a prohibitive cost for the vast majority of homes don’t you think ? Until the government are able to offer schemes where the average family can consider getting a heat pump it’s going to remain quite niche isn’t it ?AndyG said:
It depends on the temperature that you like your home mate but if you kept it at a constant 20 degrees you would be looking at approx £700 per year and RHI payments on that kind of property would be approx £1,600.00 per year for 7 years.ShootersHillGuru said:@AndyG
Sorry Andy but for an average four bed detached house with cavity wall insulation what would be the annual cost of running a heat pump ?
The best way of looking at working out the financials is if you take the running cost you currently pay and compare that to the £700 ish for a heat pump. The install cost on a 4 bed property should be approx 8k. The rhi payments are approx £11.2k so it should repay the install cost and pay for your heating and hot water for 7 years0 -
Suspect they'll go for a scrappage scheme and front load the money.ShootersHillGuru said:
That’s actually pretty attractive but it’s a prohibitive cost for the vast majority of homes don’t you think ? Until the government are able to offer schemes where the average family can consider getting a heat pump it’s going to remain quite niche isn’t it ? Not going to have any impact on climate change.AndyG said:
It depends on the temperature that you like your home mate but if you kept it at a constant 20 degrees you would be looking at approx £700 per year and RHI payments on that kind of property would be approx £1,600.00 per year for 7 years.ShootersHillGuru said:@AndyG
Sorry Andy but for an average four bed detached house with cavity wall insulation what would be the annual cost of running a heat pump ?
The best way of looking at working out the financials is if you take the running cost you currently pay and compare that to the £700 ish for a heat pump. The install cost on a 4 bed property should be approx 8k. The rhi payments are approx £11.2k so it should repay the install cost and pay for your heating and hot water for 7 years
Likewise for EVs, which would push me over the line for a ID4 or e-niro0 -
Indeed. I’m in Scotland 😀AndyG said:
North/South divide mate lolWeegie Addick said:
Well we had to pay about double that for the installation of one for a four bed house. We will get most of the install cost back over 7 years but RHI won’t cover the running cost. Our heating bills do seem to have reduced. I’ll let you know how well it works at actually heating the house in mid-winter!AndyG said:
It depends on the temperature that you like your home mate but if you kept it at a constant 20 degrees you would be looking at approx £700 per year and RHI payments on that kind of property would be approx £1,600.00 per year for 7 years.ShootersHillGuru said:@AndyG
Sorry Andy but for an average four bed detached house with cavity wall insulation what would be the annual cost of running a heat pump ?
The best way of looking at working out the financials is if you take the running cost you currently pay and compare that to the £700 ish for a heat pump. The install cost on a 4 bed property should be approx 8k. The rhi payments are approx £11.2k so it should repay the install cost and pay for your heating and hot water for 7 years
That is what my company charge up here but we do buy the units very well from the manufacturers as we install so many0 -
It seems a little bit odd that when someone arrives at a position in an argument that isn't held by the the majority (who often count among their number "people who don't care either way on any issue") that we have to try and put them down. I don't recall ever watching a YT video on climate change or indeed on denying climate change. As written earlier , I am very much for the whole population, where possible, doing all the common sense things as we move forward. Recycling, using cars less, considering our neighbour, clean oceans, reversing deforestation. What I am NOT for is the new religion of Environmentalism. Guilting the human race. Legalistic types policing others in their "poor attempts at keeping up with the strong who are green and therefore "good people". All the worst aspects of organised religion resurfacing in Environmentalism. At least the original version promised Salvation. This new religion offers nothing.Cloudworm said:
Someone’s been watching YouTube videoooos!ValleyOfTears said:
You are absolutely right Leuth. Blaming us for climate change is not right. And we discover one eruption of Krakatoa emits more harm to the atmosphere than a billion long haul flights anyway. But we can't blame molten lava for our global unhappiness, or gain superiority over volcanic debris so we dump it on the bloke on the street.. Wasn't it ever this?Leuth said:Blaming 'us' for this isn't right either. The blame lies at the top. The elites. The barons. Those who ordain the logging, the drilling, the burning.
Let us recycle our crap. Be concerned about ruining air quality by lazily driving everywhere in town unnecessarily.
But policing eachother and guilting the poor bloke on the street because of deforestation of the Amazon basin or the depletion of coral and bowing to the God of Gaia really has to stop. We've all had enough..If you really need the hit of blaming someone ...start with Krakatoa.
That's all!1 -
It offers the prevention of the end of life as we know it and is actually real, rather than made up sky people.
Pull your head out of your arse and see that massive changes need to be made7 -
Thats all very well but I don’t think you are taking seriously the very real crisis point we are reaching. Messing around with food packaging and switching off the hall light isn’t going to cut it any more. You mention a religion of environmentalism but in loose terms that is exactly what is going to be needed by every human on the planet if our civilisation as we know it is to survive. We all need to buy into a fanaticism of cutting emissions on a evangelical scale. Unless we do there will without any question be millions of lives lost. The problem for most of us is that saving the planet and green initiatives are becoming a business opportunity. That’s fine but unless everybody can afford to buy into the future the outcomes will be achieved too slowly.ValleyOfTears said:
It seems a little bit odd that when someone arrives at a position in an argument that isn't held by the the majority (who often count among their number "people who don't care either way on any issue") that we have to try and put them down. I don't recall ever watching a YT video on climate change or indeed on denying climate change. As written earlier , I am very much for the whole population, where possible, doing all the common sense things as we move forward. Recycling, using cars less, considering our neighbour, clean oceans, reversing deforestation. What I am NOT for is the new religion of Environmentalism. Guilting the human race. Legalistic types policing others in their "poor attempts at keeping up with the strong who are green and therefore "good people". All the worst aspects of organised religion resurfacing in Environmentalism. At least the original version promised Salvation. This new religion offers nothing.Cloudworm said:
Someone’s been watching YouTube videoooos!ValleyOfTears said:
You are absolutely right Leuth. Blaming us for climate change is not right. And we discover one eruption of Krakatoa emits more harm to the atmosphere than a billion long haul flights anyway. But we can't blame molten lava for our global unhappiness, or gain superiority over volcanic debris so we dump it on the bloke on the street.. Wasn't it ever this?Leuth said:Blaming 'us' for this isn't right either. The blame lies at the top. The elites. The barons. Those who ordain the logging, the drilling, the burning.
Let us recycle our crap. Be concerned about ruining air quality by lazily driving everywhere in town unnecessarily.
But policing eachother and guilting the poor bloke on the street because of deforestation of the Amazon basin or the depletion of coral and bowing to the God of Gaia really has to stop. We've all had enough..If you really need the hit of blaming someone ...start with Krakatoa.
That's all!3
