Mason Burstow - on loan to Bolton from Hull (p53)

bolloxbolder said:

A word of caution if I may. There are many like Mason who looked equally as good to me in the under 23s, who the club thought would make it. I'm thinking Azeez, Sho Silva, Hanlon and Umerah.

Let's just see how he goes. Same with Kanu and Gavin. This time last year Aaron Henry was the coming man and his progress appears to have stalled. 

Very fair point. You could even use Morgan as an example of someone who has maybe not reached the heights hoped for, and he actually is part of the squad. 

That said, all the while signs are promising let's HOPE Burstow really is a big deal without letting that become expectation. 

bolloxbolder said:

A word of caution if I may. There are many like Mason who looked equally as good to me in the under 23s, who the club thought would make it. I'm thinking Azeez, Sho Silva, Hanlon and Umerah.

Let's just see how he goes. Same with Kanu and Gavin. This time last year Aaron Henry was the coming man and his progress appears to have stalled. 

I don’t watch u-23 or u-18 football but has Henry stalled or is it that we have a bigger first team squad which means he can develop in his age groups rather than be played in the first team?

Scoham said:

paulsturgess said:

Scoham said:

paulsturgess said:

Scoham said:

paulsturgess said:

 Scoham said:

Jonniesta said:

Good chance he'll make his full debut in the pizza cup I reckon. Would be good to see him get some proper minutes out there. But, however good he his, doesn't stop a proven striker being our top priority in January... we still only have 2 established front men. 

Hopefully he gives JJ something to think about by then. I don’t see the point in bringing in another striker unless they’re a clear step up from Washington.

Err, what if Washington gets injured? 

If there’s good value out there and a player who will definitely improve us (like when we brought in BWP) then that’s a signing worth making.

What we don’t need is a 10 goal a season League 1 striker on a 2/3 year contract when we have two young players who have the potential to be far better than that.

Why block Davison and Burstow’s progress by signing an average striker when they’ve scored a decent number of goals between them?

Don’t wanna block burstows progress if he’s good enough, no idea about him and hope he’s shit hot and the next Grant. But for the
moment, assuming he isn’t.

Davison is a trier but clearly not good enough which I think we’ve seen across an extended period now. He’s definitely a substantial step down from Washington as an overall package in my opinion. Your point was that you don’t want a striker in unless they’re a significant improvement on Washington - obviously I would love that too but on if that’s not realistic it’s essential we sign another striker who is on a par with Washington because Davison just isn’t, and if Washington and/or stockley get injured and we’re lining up with Davison and then an unknown kid on the bench and hoping to be climbing up and troubling the top 6 , for me that ain’t gonna happen. 

We just about got away without a proper 2nd striker when we had Taylor in the play off season, and that was only cos Taylor was so exceptionally good (way above stockley or Washington) - and when he was suspended after that red card we went on an awful run with our makeshift attack. 

Point being - in my view we 100% need a 3rd good quality league one striker. It isn’t and wont be Davison, if it’s Burstow brilliant. Otherwise it’s a signing. 

What extended period are you judging Davison on? Forget everything before this season, he’s a now a far better player. He’s shown he’s a threat since August by scoring 4 goals despite not having a run of starts and most of that being under Adkins management.

Put him in place of Washington in a full strength team and he’ll score goals. I didn’t need to see the game yesterday to know a midfield of Morgan, Kirk and Arter is a significant downgrade compared to Dobson, Gilbey and Lee - the latter has far more mobility, energy and creativity. It must be far easier to play in a team like that where you’ll get more touches of the ball and can rely on them and the wing backs getting good passes and crosses into the box.

Washington’s strengths are his work rate and movement, the gap between him and Davison isn’t that big.

Really don’t agree with this. He scored 6 goals in 30 games in the conference/ league two just last season so I’m not sure what merits the suggestion he’s somehow transformed into some ruthless animal this season… but it’s not really his goalscoring I’m worried about - he’s got a couple of scrappy goals this season as you say and he evidently works hard, but to be honest anyone not completely shit can score a handful at this level if you’ve got some half decent players around you. See Paul Benson - who he reminds me of a bit actually. I’d like him to come good but I’ve seen enough of him this season and his all round game just isn’t good enough IMO. Washington is no Taylor for sure but for me the gap between him and Davison is more than material enough to justify replacing him in the squad.

He’s clearly improved since/due to those loan spells. He’s far more physical than Benson, both stronger and quicker. Combined with the effort he puts in and getting into goalscoring positions that makes him a dangerous player at this level.

I’m not saying he’s completely transformed but the way he’s improved and his age suggests he has room to get even better. He’s still only 22. I’d hate to see us let him go while he’s developing his all round game and replace him with another Washington type who we know isn’t up to the Championship.

I love the "he's still only 22".

At that age he should be a regular in a 1st team somewhere. I see a "youngster" being someone under 20. Then again I was brought up with players like Bowyer & Konch who played 1st team football aged 16. 

golfaddick said:

Scoham said:

paulsturgess said:

Scoham said:

paulsturgess said:

Scoham said:

paulsturgess said:

 Scoham said:

Jonniesta said:

Good chance he'll make his full debut in the pizza cup I reckon. Would be good to see him get some proper minutes out there. But, however good he his, doesn't stop a proven striker being our top priority in January... we still only have 2 established front men. 

Hopefully he gives JJ something to think about by then. I don’t see the point in bringing in another striker unless they’re a clear step up from Washington.

Err, what if Washington gets injured? 

If there’s good value out there and a player who will definitely improve us (like when we brought in BWP) then that’s a signing worth making.

What we don’t need is a 10 goal a season League 1 striker on a 2/3 year contract when we have two young players who have the potential to be far better than that.

Why block Davison and Burstow’s progress by signing an average striker when they’ve scored a decent number of goals between them?

Don’t wanna block burstows progress if he’s good enough, no idea about him and hope he’s shit hot and the next Grant. But for the
moment, assuming he isn’t.

Davison is a trier but clearly not good enough which I think we’ve seen across an extended period now. He’s definitely a substantial step down from Washington as an overall package in my opinion. Your point was that you don’t want a striker in unless they’re a significant improvement on Washington - obviously I would love that too but on if that’s not realistic it’s essential we sign another striker who is on a par with Washington because Davison just isn’t, and if Washington and/or stockley get injured and we’re lining up with Davison and then an unknown kid on the bench and hoping to be climbing up and troubling the top 6 , for me that ain’t gonna happen. 

We just about got away without a proper 2nd striker when we had Taylor in the play off season, and that was only cos Taylor was so exceptionally good (way above stockley or Washington) - and when he was suspended after that red card we went on an awful run with our makeshift attack. 

Point being - in my view we 100% need a 3rd good quality league one striker. It isn’t and wont be Davison, if it’s Burstow brilliant. Otherwise it’s a signing. 

What extended period are you judging Davison on? Forget everything before this season, he’s a now a far better player. He’s shown he’s a threat since August by scoring 4 goals despite not having a run of starts and most of that being under Adkins management.

Put him in place of Washington in a full strength team and he’ll score goals. I didn’t need to see the game yesterday to know a midfield of Morgan, Kirk and Arter is a significant downgrade compared to Dobson, Gilbey and Lee - the latter has far more mobility, energy and creativity. It must be far easier to play in a team like that where you’ll get more touches of the ball and can rely on them and the wing backs getting good passes and crosses into the box.

Washington’s strengths are his work rate and movement, the gap between him and Davison isn’t that big.

Really don’t agree with this. He scored 6 goals in 30 games in the conference/ league two just last season so I’m not sure what merits the suggestion he’s somehow transformed into some ruthless animal this season… but it’s not really his goalscoring I’m worried about - he’s got a couple of scrappy goals this season as you say and he evidently works hard, but to be honest anyone not completely shit can score a handful at this level if you’ve got some half decent players around you. See Paul Benson - who he reminds me of a bit actually. I’d like him to come good but I’ve seen enough of him this season and his all round game just isn’t good enough IMO. Washington is no Taylor for sure but for me the gap between him and Davison is more than material enough to justify replacing him in the squad.

He’s clearly improved since/due to those loan spells. He’s far more physical than Benson, both stronger and quicker. Combined with the effort he puts in and getting into goalscoring positions that makes him a dangerous player at this level.

I’m not saying he’s completely transformed but the way he’s improved and his age suggests he has room to get even better. He’s still only 22. I’d hate to see us let him go while he’s developing his all round game and replace him with another Washington type who we know isn’t up to the Championship.

I love the "he's still only 22".

At that age he should be a regular in a 1st team somewhere. I see a "youngster" being someone under 20. Then again I was brought up with players like Bowyer & Konch who played 1st team football aged 16. 

Players develop at different rates, Davison's only a year older than when Grant started scoring regularly for us. Michael Smith has just hit the best scoring form of his career at 30.

Not being as talented as two players who went on to play for England doesn't mean he can't become a good League 1 player. He's made progress from the player who was on loan in the Conference a year ago, no reason why that shouldn't continue.

Elthamaddick said:

one player is 'young at still only 22 blah blah'

yet Morgan at 21 is finished according to some??

Not the same people saying it. Morgan’s not finished but for me he needs to go and play regular football, he’s not going to develop playing the odd cup game and occasionally coming off the bench.

Davison on the other hand has shown an end product this season and is a better player than he was a year ago. He has a realistic chance of taking Washington’s place.

paulsturgess said:

Scoham said:

paulsturgess said:

Scoham said:

paulsturgess said:

 Scoham said:

Jonniesta said:

Good chance he'll make his full debut in the pizza cup I reckon. Would be good to see him get some proper minutes out there. But, however good he his, doesn't stop a proven striker being our top priority in January... we still only have 2 established front men. 

Hopefully he gives JJ something to think about by then. I don’t see the point in bringing in another striker unless they’re a clear step up from Washington.

Err, what if Washington gets injured? 

If there’s good value out there and a player who will definitely improve us (like when we brought in BWP) then that’s a signing worth making.

What we don’t need is a 10 goal a season League 1 striker on a 2/3 year contract when we have two young players who have the potential to be far better than that.

Why block Davison and Burstow’s progress by signing an average striker when they’ve scored a decent number of goals between them?

Don’t wanna block burstows progress if he’s good enough, no idea about him and hope he’s shit hot and the next Grant. But for the
moment, assuming he isn’t.

Davison is a trier but clearly not good enough which I think we’ve seen across an extended period now. He’s definitely a substantial step down from Washington as an overall package in my opinion. Your point was that you don’t want a striker in unless they’re a significant improvement on Washington - obviously I would love that too but on if that’s not realistic it’s essential we sign another striker who is on a par with Washington because Davison just isn’t, and if Washington and/or stockley get injured and we’re lining up with Davison and then an unknown kid on the bench and hoping to be climbing up and troubling the top 6 , for me that ain’t gonna happen. 

We just about got away without a proper 2nd striker when we had Taylor in the play off season, and that was only cos Taylor was so exceptionally good (way above stockley or Washington) - and when he was suspended after that red card we went on an awful run with our makeshift attack. 

Point being - in my view we 100% need a 3rd good quality league one striker. It isn’t and wont be Davison, if it’s Burstow brilliant. Otherwise it’s a signing. 

What extended period are you judging Davison on? Forget everything before this season, he’s a now a far better player. He’s shown he’s a threat since August by scoring 4 goals despite not having a run of starts and most of that being under Adkins management.

Put him in place of Washington in a full strength team and he’ll score goals. I didn’t need to see the game yesterday to know a midfield of Morgan, Kirk and Arter is a significant downgrade compared to Dobson, Gilbey and Lee - the latter has far more mobility, energy and creativity. It must be far easier to play in a team like that where you’ll get more touches of the ball and can rely on them and the wing backs getting good passes and crosses into the box.

Washington’s strengths are his work rate and movement, the gap between him and Davison isn’t that big.

Really don’t agree with this. He scored 6 goals in 30 games in the conference/ league two just last season so I’m not sure what merits the suggestion he’s somehow transformed into some ruthless animal this season… but it’s not really his goalscoring I’m worried about - he’s got a couple of scrappy goals this season as you say and he evidently works hard, but to be honest anyone not completely shit can score a handful at this level if you’ve got some half decent players around you. See Paul Benson - who he reminds me of a bit actually. I’d like him to come good but I’ve seen enough of him this season and his all round game just isn’t good enough IMO. Washington is no Taylor for sure but for me the gap between him and Davison is more than material enough to justify replacing him in the squad.

He was clearly a better option than Stockley for a time this season, despite Stockley being better in the air, and he’s had at least two efforts unluckily blocked on the line. Stockley’s had tap ins and a penalty to add to his tally, but has missed some easy headed chances in recent games. The big difference for me is that Stockley is invaluable defensively. 

JamesSeed said:

YTS1978 said:

Haven't seen this lad play yet, but he sounds promising. Could say the keeper maybe should have saved it, but it was hit with real power. Shearer would always say "get it on target and work the keeper". Exactly what he did. Sometimes you earn a bit of luck by being direct and taking the chance on. Not stopping and looking for a cut back or lay off. You can see the lads brimming with confidence so just maybe with suspensions and injuries he'll grab his chance in the 1st team.

I think he benefitted from the fact that he hit it close to the keeper, because the keeper had spread in anticipation of the shot. The pace of the shot was also key. 

If you can hit the ball hard and low, instead of spongefooting it slowly towards the goal or sending it flying into row Z, that's a decent start

JamesSeed said:

paulsturgess said:

Scoham said:

paulsturgess said:

Scoham said:

paulsturgess said:

 Scoham said:

Jonniesta said:

Good chance he'll make his full debut in the pizza cup I reckon. Would be good to see him get some proper minutes out there. But, however good he his, doesn't stop a proven striker being our top priority in January... we still only have 2 established front men. 

Hopefully he gives JJ something to think about by then. I don’t see the point in bringing in another striker unless they’re a clear step up from Washington.

Err, what if Washington gets injured? 

If there’s good value out there and a player who will definitely improve us (like when we brought in BWP) then that’s a signing worth making.

What we don’t need is a 10 goal a season League 1 striker on a 2/3 year contract when we have two young players who have the potential to be far better than that.

Why block Davison and Burstow’s progress by signing an average striker when they’ve scored a decent number of goals between them?

Don’t wanna block burstows progress if he’s good enough, no idea about him and hope he’s shit hot and the next Grant. But for the
moment, assuming he isn’t.

Davison is a trier but clearly not good enough which I think we’ve seen across an extended period now. He’s definitely a substantial step down from Washington as an overall package in my opinion. Your point was that you don’t want a striker in unless they’re a significant improvement on Washington - obviously I would love that too but on if that’s not realistic it’s essential we sign another striker who is on a par with Washington because Davison just isn’t, and if Washington and/or stockley get injured and we’re lining up with Davison and then an unknown kid on the bench and hoping to be climbing up and troubling the top 6 , for me that ain’t gonna happen. 

We just about got away without a proper 2nd striker when we had Taylor in the play off season, and that was only cos Taylor was so exceptionally good (way above stockley or Washington) - and when he was suspended after that red card we went on an awful run with our makeshift attack. 

Point being - in my view we 100% need a 3rd good quality league one striker. It isn’t and wont be Davison, if it’s Burstow brilliant. Otherwise it’s a signing. 

What extended period are you judging Davison on? Forget everything before this season, he’s a now a far better player. He’s shown he’s a threat since August by scoring 4 goals despite not having a run of starts and most of that being under Adkins management.

Put him in place of Washington in a full strength team and he’ll score goals. I didn’t need to see the game yesterday to know a midfield of Morgan, Kirk and Arter is a significant downgrade compared to Dobson, Gilbey and Lee - the latter has far more mobility, energy and creativity. It must be far easier to play in a team like that where you’ll get more touches of the ball and can rely on them and the wing backs getting good passes and crosses into the box.

Washington’s strengths are his work rate and movement, the gap between him and Davison isn’t that big.

Really don’t agree with this. He scored 6 goals in 30 games in the conference/ league two just last season so I’m not sure what merits the suggestion he’s somehow transformed into some ruthless animal this season… but it’s not really his goalscoring I’m worried about - he’s got a couple of scrappy goals this season as you say and he evidently works hard, but to be honest anyone not completely shit can score a handful at this level if you’ve got some half decent players around you. See Paul Benson - who he reminds me of a bit actually. I’d like him to come good but I’ve seen enough of him this season and his all round game just isn’t good enough IMO. Washington is no Taylor for sure but for me the gap between him and Davison is more than material enough to justify replacing him in the squad.

He was clearly a better option than Stockley for a time this season, despite Stockley being better in the air, and he’s had at least two efforts unluckily blocked on the line. Stockley’s had tap ins and a penalty to add to his tally, but has missed some easy headed chances in recent games. The big difference for me is that Stockley is invaluable defensively. 

Neither is amazing, neither is awful. Hopefully Burstow will turn out to be better than both. 👍

Don’t really agree with that, and if it was briefly the case I think it was a management issue rather than a player ability point. Another hard working effort from Davison yesterday with some decent enough hold up but still looked a chugger to me. Hard game to judge him on in fairness in the circumstances though.

The pulling power to get talented young footballers to chose Charlton at 16 like Mason, Aribo and Lookman by their parents and representatives is they will get opportunities IF they are deemed good enough while still 18 or 19. In Deji and Joe Gomez's case they made debuts at 17 but both had been at Cafc a lot longer with Deji joining at 13 and Joe even younger.

Ralfi Hand had a Premier team trial waiting for him to start if Cafc had not offered him a two year scholars contract. Coming from Dartford and knowing Daniel Kanu and also he would be Joining a winning group of 16 to 18 year olds with excellent coaches meant it was a no brainer for Ralfi and his dad Trevor.  

The transition from youth football to men's football can see young guys dreams disappear but Mason Burstow and Deji Elerewe have and will get opportunities to make it at just 18. Other talented footballers like Kanu and Hand, who are both 1st year scholars are in the academy with burning ambition and are eager for advancement.

Have to say young Mason didn't look especially chuffed to be there

Thought it was a decent cameo from him, didn’t look lost or out of place.

Want to feel old?