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Next manager - Ben Garner confirmed (p256)
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Although I agree with the sentiment the comments are disrespectful to Exeter, a good, well run football club who deserve a bit more respect.BR7_addick said:Just think also what it would mean to Taylor, without tooting our own horns, I would say a manager who’s been slogging it away for 4 years at that shitty ground in carrot crunching land would dream of a shot at our place. You can see him pouring his heart and soul into it, he played the game in a similar fashion.13 -
That doesn’t give any context though.BigRedEvil said:Exeter under Taylor, 9th,5th,9th and then promotion. So not hugely successful bar this season.
Would rather get Warburton
If he had one of the lowest budgets he’s done superb, if he had one of the highest budgets he’s done okay/okay/okay then superb.Best case he’s done excellent as a manager, worst case he’s improved as a manager.9 -
Quite an arrogance about this view. Agree it’s probably a footballing step up but I wouldn’t quite put it like you have.BR7_addick said:Just think also what it would mean to Taylor, without tooting our own horns, I would say a manager who’s been slogging it away for 4 years at that shitty ground in carrot crunching land would dream of a shot at our place. You can see him pouring his heart and soul into it, he played the game in a similar fashion.3 -
Carrots are way better than meat…just sayin’.4
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We are on the outside looking in at Exeter and actually know nothing of what went on, season by season. It's like Exeter fans making a judgement on us. There are no more critical fans than the fans of the club being analysed which is why I originally searched for their views on Taylor and why I came to the conclusion that, with the right backing and club(s) he could become another Eddie Howe - their backgrounds are similar.BigRedEvil said:Exeter under Taylor, 9th,5th,9th and then promotion. So not hugely successful bar this season.
Would rather get Warburton
I've already posted some quotes from their Forum about him but this particular one serves to explain why it might have taken them four years to get promoted but also why I think he could be another Howe principally the bit about being "humble" but also accountability when things didn't go right - we've had one Manager in particular who still, to this day, takes all the plaudits when things go right and blames the world and its mother when they don't:
In four seasons MT has rebuilt a couple of attacking teams now, quite frankly i actually believe last season in periods-that was probably the most formidable attacking team (Randall,Randall,Jay,Bowman) i've ever seen at SJP. Its been a long ten years in League 2 and Matty had gone close, but for me you have to praise him because people were quite rightly questioning if it was ever going to happen, we had just received the Watkins and Randall Money and Fans expectations changed drastically and he got his Marquee signings in and has now fantastically completed the job. For me Taylor is on course to be our Best Manager ever, He's also my favourite manager ever in that he is very humble and will take accountability and i'm sure if things do wrong and he wasn't the man to take the club forward, he would be the first person to say so.
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Oh completely, but this is the place to be arrogant about us right? And we are pretty massive in comparison to Exeter, same league or not.ShootersHillGuru said:
Quite an arrogance about this view. Agree it’s probably a footballing step up but I wouldn’t quite put it like you have.BR7_addick said:Just think also what it would mean to Taylor, without tooting our own horns, I would say a manager who’s been slogging it away for 4 years at that shitty ground in carrot crunching land would dream of a shot at our place. You can see him pouring his heart and soul into it, he played the game in a similar fashion.2 -
I would be happy with Matt Taylor, although if we want a young coach/manager, who plays a variant of 3-5-2 and has not only played for the club but got promoted under Chris powell, didnt we already have one of those?2
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Sorry to be pedantic but the 2019/20 never technically finished. Exeter were 3 points off 3rd with 9 games to go. At least he got plenty of experience challenging at the top half of a division.12
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We did but is Taylor a better coach, tactician etc?Todds_right_hook said:I would be happy with Matt Taylor, although if we want a young coach/manager, who plays a variant of 3-5-2 and has not only played for the club but got promoted under Chris powell, didnt we already have one of those?2 -
Would be interested to see what Exeter's budget was like over the last 4 years compared to the rest of League 2. If they had a budget in the bottom half but consistently competed towards the top would suggest Taylor has done a really good job. By contrast if they had the biggest in the league then he hasn't performed that well.2
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I think the truth lies somewhere between the two views - we have the potential to be "massive" as, dare I say, a Sheffield Wednesday but the bottom line is that next season all three of the clubs will be in League 1. As they might be the season after, the season after that and the season after that.BR7_addick said:
Oh completely, but this is the place to be arrogant about us right? And we are pretty massive in comparison to Exeter, same league or not.ShootersHillGuru said:
Quite an arrogance about this view. Agree it’s probably a footballing step up but I wouldn’t quite put it like you have.BR7_addick said:Just think also what it would mean to Taylor, without tooting our own horns, I would say a manager who’s been slogging it away for 4 years at that shitty ground in carrot crunching land would dream of a shot at our place. You can see him pouring his heart and soul into it, he played the game in a similar fashion.
It's a bit like saying this season we are a bigger club than Peterborough who were in the Championship this season, or Wycombe possibly next season, but the proof is actually where the clubs sit at any particular time not just based on support. As we've found in being in League 1 in six out of seven consecutive seasons we have, as much as it pains me to say, actually, become a League 1 club in the same way as Millwall are a Championship club and Palace a Premier League Club. Yet some would still blindly argue that we are bigger than both of them.5 -
They had an inflated budget due to the amount of money they made selling players. They obviously had to replace them, at some cost.Covered_End_Lad said:Would be interested to see what Exeter's budget was like over the last 4 years compared to the rest of League 2. If they had a budget in the bottom half but consistently competed towards the top would suggest Taylor has done a really good job. By contrast if they had the biggest in the league then he hasn't performed that well.
I would imagine they would be quite high on total spend but also quite low on net spend.
The consistency achieved with that player turn over is quite impressive either way.3 -
I don’t agree that we are massive I just mean when compared to Exeter, I’m not having for a second that it isn’t a step up, I don’t think anyone in the football world would be shocked by Taylor moving to a side in the same division when making the relevant comparisons of the two clubs.Addick Addict said:
I think the truth lies somewhere between the two views - we have the potential to be "massive" as, dare I say, a Sheffield Wednesday but the bottom line is that next season all three of the clubs will be in League 1. As they might be the season after, the season after that and the season after that.BR7_addick said:
Oh completely, but this is the place to be arrogant about us right? And we are pretty massive in comparison to Exeter, same league or not.ShootersHillGuru said:
Quite an arrogance about this view. Agree it’s probably a footballing step up but I wouldn’t quite put it like you have.BR7_addick said:Just think also what it would mean to Taylor, without tooting our own horns, I would say a manager who’s been slogging it away for 4 years at that shitty ground in carrot crunching land would dream of a shot at our place. You can see him pouring his heart and soul into it, he played the game in a similar fashion.
It's a bit like saying this season we are a bigger club than Peterborough who were in the Championship this season, or Wycombe possibly next season, but the proof is actually where the clubs sit at any particular time not just based on support. As we've found in being in League 1 in six out of seven consecutive seasons we have, as much as it pains me to say, actually, become a League 1 club in the same way as Millwall are a Championship club and Palace a Premier League Club. Yet some would still blindly argue that we are bigger than both of them.3 -
***Warburton spotted at the Valley***Just driving past the Valley, the clues are there if you look close enough!
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I'm gonna tell you its utter gibberish. Not one coherent sentence.addick1956 said:
I have just pointed out that I wasn't wrong on this yet you insist that wasn't the case.ValleyGary said:
You usually are...addick1956 said:
Watford and Fleetwood have hired already . The rest with managers are signing players and we are tracing last years disaster when we had a manager who apparently was bi passed on some signings of which , somewere late anyway . We then scrabbled around in September. The answer was Soarè.DA9 said:
That’s the spirit!addick1956 said:We will hire who ever is left on the self in late August.
When I pointed out in mid June our recruitment was slow and not in line with smashing the league I was rounded on by all. Now everyone agrees last summer was piss poor.
That is why I say thar, history doesn't exactly point to anything else does it , with Tommy.
Why he just doesn't do his badges and have done with it.
3 managers in 20 months isn't goi g to attract a high flyer does it.
I hope I am wrong.
I also said that a less than half fit Aneke wasn't a good idea. What happened he missed most of the games from Jan to April 30th..or perhaps we only played
He played 9 games of 22 or 23 available , started 4 completed 2 and collected 4 yellow cards straight of. He didn't actually change many came outcomes apart from Cheltenham and maybe Shrewsbury.
But you will tell.me that is wrong too.6 -
But not one with four years experience and a promotion under his belt.Todds_right_hook said:I would be happy with Matt Taylor, although if we want a young coach/manager, who plays a variant of 3-5-2 and has not only played for the club but got promoted under Chris powell, didnt we already have one of those?2 -
Dont think there is an issue playing 3-5-2 but under JJ it wasnt working. That doesnt mean it cant, just might need a tweak from someone more experienced to make it work.Todds_right_hook said:I would be happy with Matt Taylor, although if we want a young coach/manager, who plays a variant of 3-5-2 and has not only played for the club but got promoted under Chris powell, didnt we already have one of those?3 -
Did that gag really warrant that photo size?
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Taylor is different from JJ and Bowyer in that he started as a defensive coach at Exeter, then was successful as their U23 Premier League coach (probably why he gets youngsters and wants to promote them) and then stepped up to manage the first team - he's been on a six year journey in doing that. He hasn't learnt how to manage at CAFC with the influences that are prevalent here in the way that JJ did under Bowyer and Bowyer did under Robinson. The other aspect is that the voice and much of what they say is the same whether they are coach or manager.Scoham said:
We did but is Taylor a better coach, tactician etc?Todds_right_hook said:I would be happy with Matt Taylor, although if we want a young coach/manager, who plays a variant of 3-5-2 and has not only played for the club but got promoted under Chris powell, didnt we already have one of those?
Taylor would come to the Club knowing about its history, its fans etc but without any pre-conceived ideas about the squad and more to the point without the players having any pre-conceived ideas about him. On a much grander scale I would liken it to Steven Gerrard taking all that he has learnt about managing at Rangers and Villa before he eventually possibly becomes Liverpool Manager. There's nothing that Gerrard doesn't know about Liverpool but they didn't want him learning his craft there.4 - Sponsored links:
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I dont get this -Quote-- The fact that he has not manged above L 2 is a negative for me. Since when has man mangement been comensurate with a high League.team. I doubt if the most successful managers started at Real Madrid Barcelona.Man City etc They started near the bottom in some respects, then worked ,up Like a good scout will spot potential,in a young player, before he (the player) gets a greedy agentCovered End said:Re Matt Taylor -
Exeter are a lower L1/top L2 team.
The fact that it took Taylor 4 years to get Exeter promoted in 2nd place, isn't a massive plus for me.
The fact that he's probably a really nice bloke, isn't a massive plus for me, so was JJ.
The fact that he's not managed above L2 is a negative for me.
The fact that he switched from goalie to outfield at age 23, doesn't really clinch it for me that he's a wonderfully versatile manager/coach. To be blunt, it is not relevant.
I'm not unhappy if it's Taylor, but I know the likes of Warburton have the better CV.3 -
Coaching is an art. It’s not just knowing what you want to get across to the players, it’s being good at getting it across. Much like teaching. Where coaching moves that even further forward is when the coach has innovative ideas and is able to get his players to buy into his ideas and ideals. You need to add man management into the mix. The ability to blend the squad to get the best out of them. Lots of variables but it’s no coincidence that very successful coaches and football innovators are often able to reproduce their success. No idea whether Taylor fits my view or not but he’s young, on the upward curve of a career and has achieved some success. I don’t think we’ll be able to get much better at this point.2
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On our budget and finacial position. As frustrating as it would be,I would take 4 yearsCovered End said:
So Charlton fans will be happy to give Taylor 4 years to get Charlton promoted?BR7_addick said:
You think cos it took 4 years it’s a bad thing? I see it as a good thing, shows what a bit of faith and patience can do in the midst of modern day revolving door management.Covered End said:Re Matt Taylor -
Exeter are a lower L1/top L2 team.
The fact that it took Taylor 4 years to get Exeter promoted in 2nd place, isn't a massive plus for me.
The fact that he's probably a really nice bloke, isn't a massive plus for me, so was JJ.
The fact that he's not managed above L2 is a negative for me.
The fact that he switched from goalie to outfield at age 23, doesn't really clinch it for me that he's a wonderfully versatile manager/coach. To be blunt, it is not relevant.
I'm not unhappy if it's Taylor, but I know the likes of Warburton have the better CV.Also shows he improved as a manager with time in his first role.
Err, that is definitely not happening, in anyone's world.2 -
If the fans could see a progression year on year in squad allied to an attractive style of football then I think most would see that something is being built and worth the wait.paulg1947 said:
On our budget and finacial position. As frustrating as it would be,I would take 4 yearsCovered End said:
So Charlton fans will be happy to give Taylor 4 years to get Charlton promoted?BR7_addick said:
You think cos it took 4 years it’s a bad thing? I see it as a good thing, shows what a bit of faith and patience can do in the midst of modern day revolving door management.Covered End said:Re Matt Taylor -
Exeter are a lower L1/top L2 team.
The fact that it took Taylor 4 years to get Exeter promoted in 2nd place, isn't a massive plus for me.
The fact that he's probably a really nice bloke, isn't a massive plus for me, so was JJ.
The fact that he's not managed above L2 is a negative for me.
The fact that he switched from goalie to outfield at age 23, doesn't really clinch it for me that he's a wonderfully versatile manager/coach. To be blunt, it is not relevant.
I'm not unhappy if it's Taylor, but I know the likes of Warburton have the better CV.Also shows he improved as a manager with time in his first role.
Err, that is definitely not happening, in anyone's world.3 -
I think it also has some similarities to the Powell and Bowyer appointments. Both understood the club but had spent enough time away from Charlton that they didn’t have existing relationships and ideas about staff and players. I know Bowyer was a coach under Robinson but not for long.Addick Addict said:
Taylor is different from JJ and Bowyer in that he started as a defensive coach at Exeter, then was successful as their U23 Premier League coach (probably why he gets youngsters and wants to promote them) and then stepped up to manage the first team - he's been on a six year journey in doing that. He hasn't learnt how to manage at CAFC with the influences that are prevalent here in the way that JJ did under Bowyer and Bowyer did under Robinson. The other aspect is that the voice and much of what they say is the same whether they are coach or manager.Scoham said:
We did but is Taylor a better coach, tactician etc?Todds_right_hook said:I would be happy with Matt Taylor, although if we want a young coach/manager, who plays a variant of 3-5-2 and has not only played for the club but got promoted under Chris powell, didnt we already have one of those?
Taylor would come to the Club knowing about its history, its fans etc but without any pre-conceived ideas about the squad and more to the point without the players having any pre-conceived ideas about him. On a much grander scale I would liken it to Steven Gerrard taking all that he has learnt about managing at Rangers and Villa before he eventually possibly becomes Liverpool Manager. There's nothing that Gerrard doesn't know about Liverpool but they didn't want him learning his craft there.2 -
I never understand this.The Red Robin said:
I think it also has some similarities to the Powell and Bowyer appointments. Both understood the club but had spent enough time away from Charlton that they didn’t have existing relationships and ideas about staff and players. I know Bowyer was a coach under Robinson but not for long.Addick Addict said:
Taylor is different from JJ and Bowyer in that he started as a defensive coach at Exeter, then was successful as their U23 Premier League coach (probably why he gets youngsters and wants to promote them) and then stepped up to manage the first team - he's been on a six year journey in doing that. He hasn't learnt how to manage at CAFC with the influences that are prevalent here in the way that JJ did under Bowyer and Bowyer did under Robinson. The other aspect is that the voice and much of what they say is the same whether they are coach or manager.Scoham said:
We did but is Taylor a better coach, tactician etc?Todds_right_hook said:I would be happy with Matt Taylor, although if we want a young coach/manager, who plays a variant of 3-5-2 and has not only played for the club but got promoted under Chris powell, didnt we already have one of those?
Taylor would come to the Club knowing about its history, its fans etc but without any pre-conceived ideas about the squad and more to the point without the players having any pre-conceived ideas about him. On a much grander scale I would liken it to Steven Gerrard taking all that he has learnt about managing at Rangers and Villa before he eventually possibly becomes Liverpool Manager. There's nothing that Gerrard doesn't know about Liverpool but they didn't want him learning his craft there.
It's probably very important that people running the business side of the club understand the history so they understand why certain things work and certain things don't. But does that really also translate to the manager of the first team?
Are we any different to any other club in the fact we have a ground, a training ground, play 11 a side football on a similar size pitch? The fans want to win football matches, preferably with aesthetically pleasing football, and the minimum expectation is that they players look like they care and are putting in the required effort. Doesn't that describe every club?5 -
I dunno, ask Curbs, Powell and Bowyer.Cafc43v3r said:
I never understand this.The Red Robin said:
I think it also has some similarities to the Powell and Bowyer appointments. Both understood the club but had spent enough time away from Charlton that they didn’t have existing relationships and ideas about staff and players. I know Bowyer was a coach under Robinson but not for long.Addick Addict said:
Taylor is different from JJ and Bowyer in that he started as a defensive coach at Exeter, then was successful as their U23 Premier League coach (probably why he gets youngsters and wants to promote them) and then stepped up to manage the first team - he's been on a six year journey in doing that. He hasn't learnt how to manage at CAFC with the influences that are prevalent here in the way that JJ did under Bowyer and Bowyer did under Robinson. The other aspect is that the voice and much of what they say is the same whether they are coach or manager.Scoham said:
We did but is Taylor a better coach, tactician etc?Todds_right_hook said:I would be happy with Matt Taylor, although if we want a young coach/manager, who plays a variant of 3-5-2 and has not only played for the club but got promoted under Chris powell, didnt we already have one of those?
Taylor would come to the Club knowing about its history, its fans etc but without any pre-conceived ideas about the squad and more to the point without the players having any pre-conceived ideas about him. On a much grander scale I would liken it to Steven Gerrard taking all that he has learnt about managing at Rangers and Villa before he eventually possibly becomes Liverpool Manager. There's nothing that Gerrard doesn't know about Liverpool but they didn't want him learning his craft there.
It's probably very important that people running the business side of the club understand the history so they understand why certain things work and certain things don't. But does that really also translate to the manager of the first team?
Are we any different to any other club in the fact we have a ground, a training ground, play 11 a side football on a similar size pitch? The fans want to win football matches, preferably with aesthetically pleasing football, and the minimum expectation is that they players look like they care and are putting in the required effort. Doesn't that describe every club?1 -
And i will be 78 then.How optimistic is that?paulg1947 said:
On our budget and finacial position. As frustrating as it would be,I would take 4 yearsCovered End said:
So Charlton fans will be happy to give Taylor 4 years to get Charlton promoted?BR7_addick said:
You think cos it took 4 years it’s a bad thing? I see it as a good thing, shows what a bit of faith and patience can do in the midst of modern day revolving door management.Covered End said:Re Matt Taylor -
Exeter are a lower L1/top L2 team.
The fact that it took Taylor 4 years to get Exeter promoted in 2nd place, isn't a massive plus for me.
The fact that he's probably a really nice bloke, isn't a massive plus for me, so was JJ.
The fact that he's not managed above L2 is a negative for me.
The fact that he switched from goalie to outfield at age 23, doesn't really clinch it for me that he's a wonderfully versatile manager/coach. To be blunt, it is not relevant.
I'm not unhappy if it's Taylor, but I know the likes of Warburton have the better CV.Also shows he improved as a manager with time in his first role.
Err, that is definitely not happening, in anyone's world.0 -
But there are dozens of other reasons Curbishley and Powell were successful, that haven't applied to almost any other manager we have had in the last 30 years.The Red Robin said:
I dunno, ask Curbs, Powell and Bowyer.Cafc43v3r said:
I never understand this.The Red Robin said:
I think it also has some similarities to the Powell and Bowyer appointments. Both understood the club but had spent enough time away from Charlton that they didn’t have existing relationships and ideas about staff and players. I know Bowyer was a coach under Robinson but not for long.Addick Addict said:
Taylor is different from JJ and Bowyer in that he started as a defensive coach at Exeter, then was successful as their U23 Premier League coach (probably why he gets youngsters and wants to promote them) and then stepped up to manage the first team - he's been on a six year journey in doing that. He hasn't learnt how to manage at CAFC with the influences that are prevalent here in the way that JJ did under Bowyer and Bowyer did under Robinson. The other aspect is that the voice and much of what they say is the same whether they are coach or manager.Scoham said:
We did but is Taylor a better coach, tactician etc?Todds_right_hook said:I would be happy with Matt Taylor, although if we want a young coach/manager, who plays a variant of 3-5-2 and has not only played for the club but got promoted under Chris powell, didnt we already have one of those?
Taylor would come to the Club knowing about its history, its fans etc but without any pre-conceived ideas about the squad and more to the point without the players having any pre-conceived ideas about him. On a much grander scale I would liken it to Steven Gerrard taking all that he has learnt about managing at Rangers and Villa before he eventually possibly becomes Liverpool Manager. There's nothing that Gerrard doesn't know about Liverpool but they didn't want him learning his craft there.
It's probably very important that people running the business side of the club understand the history so they understand why certain things work and certain things don't. But does that really also translate to the manager of the first team?
Are we any different to any other club in the fact we have a ground, a training ground, play 11 a side football on a similar size pitch? The fans want to win football matches, preferably with aesthetically pleasing football, and the minimum expectation is that they players look like they care and are putting in the required effort. Doesn't that describe every club?
Pardew knew the club, Jackson knew the club, Les Reed knew the club.
Was it, in any way, the same club in when Bowyer came back than when left?0 -
We've been in league one for most of the last 13 years; maybe we need to reassess where we feel we should be.ShootersHillGuru said:
If the fans could see a progression year on year in squad allied to an attractive style of football then I think most would see that something is being built and worth the wait.paulg1947 said:
On our budget and finacial position. As frustrating as it would be,I would take 4 yearsCovered End said:
So Charlton fans will be happy to give Taylor 4 years to get Charlton promoted?BR7_addick said:
You think cos it took 4 years it’s a bad thing? I see it as a good thing, shows what a bit of faith and patience can do in the midst of modern day revolving door management.Covered End said:Re Matt Taylor -
Exeter are a lower L1/top L2 team.
The fact that it took Taylor 4 years to get Exeter promoted in 2nd place, isn't a massive plus for me.
The fact that he's probably a really nice bloke, isn't a massive plus for me, so was JJ.
The fact that he's not managed above L2 is a negative for me.
The fact that he switched from goalie to outfield at age 23, doesn't really clinch it for me that he's a wonderfully versatile manager/coach. To be blunt, it is not relevant.
I'm not unhappy if it's Taylor, but I know the likes of Warburton have the better CV.Also shows he improved as a manager with time in his first role.
Err, that is definitely not happening, in anyone's world.0
