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Electric Cars
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With the EV market being so immature, and charging infrastructure struggling to keep up (obviously will improve in the future), I think hybrid is definitely the way to go at the moment.
Imagine spending 40/50/60+ thousand on an EV only for Toulyota, or anybody else, to release their market changing new battery tech, this decimating the resale value of your expensive new car that you're tied in a finance and final payemnt deal for the foreseeable future.1 -
If I had to put money on it, I would go for solar produced hydrogen. We are not ready now but we need a technology that has a fill as you need capability. This will drive the process forwards as it becomes more apparent EVs are not the answer.0
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Two electric cars in the family a Fiat 500e and a BMW IX. The Fiat is perfect for whizzing around town and has more than enough range for the odd journey into deepest Surrey (and back). The BMW is the ugliest car I've ever owned (from the front) but the comfiest I've ever sat in and driven around in. We got it because we'd had three Range Rovers stolen - the last one, a plug in hybrid Sport got stolen twice in the same week. It seems so far the thieves aren't as interested in all electric SUVs round here.
Long term trips to pick up the oldest to and from university were a pain at first as the charging infrastructure on the motorways is inadequate and often broken. I've now found two reliable stops that allow me to do it with only one charge.
One of the major plus sides to EVs in Richmond is that with an EV the parking is free for the entire maximum time allowance at any public parking space.
If it wasn't for the car thefts I'd rather be in the new Rangie Sport hybrid though. That has a much longer all electric range now (almost double my last one). Then I could do all my local driving as EV only and not be faced with terror at previously uncharted long range trips. Trips abroad wouldn't require so much planning either.
Sorry for the long post but it seems folk on this thread are genuinely interested in other's opinions / experiences.4 -
There's a company based at the Bicester Heritage Centre that have just started selling fully synthetic fuel. It's been developed primarily for use in classic cars.Redrobo said:
Will synthetic fuel be available by then, and at a sensible price?cafcfan said:
If Toyota's claims come to fruition by 2027, as they suggest, it will make all current electric cars obsolete overnight. Nothing could compete with a 10 minute charge, half the weight, half the cost and twice the range. Tesla could find itself being about as useful as a Sinclair C5: doing the automotive equivalent of betamax or plasma TVs.Danepak said:https://amp.theguardian.com/business/2023/jul/04/toyota-claims-battery-breakthrough-electric-cars745 miles distance on a single charge.
And that charge would take less than 10 mins.No need to change cars and keep the garage network. Greener than batteries.
Downsides are, it's only available at that one place and starts at £3.80 per litre.
It's a start though0 -
For now - give it timeRichmondSE10Exile said:Two electric cars in the family a Fiat 500e and a BMW IX. The Fiat is perfect for whizzing around town and has more than enough range for the odd journey into deepest Surrey (and back). The BMW is the ugliest car I've ever owned (from the front) but the comfiest I've ever sat in and driven around in. We got it because we'd had three Range Rovers stolen - the last one, a plug in hybrid Sport got stolen twice in the same week. It seems so far the thieves aren't as interested in all electric SUVs round here.
Long term trips to pick up the oldest to and from university were a pain at first as the charging infrastructure on the motorways is inadequate and often broken. I've now found two reliable stops that allow me to do it with only one charge.
One of the major plus sides to EVs in Richmond is that with an EV the parking is free for the entire maximum time allowance at any public parking space.
If it wasn't for the car thefts I'd rather be in the new Rangie Sport hybrid though. That has a much longer all electric range now (almost double my last one). Then I could do all my local driving as EV only and not be faced with terror at previously uncharted long range trips. Trips abroad wouldn't require so much planning either.
Sorry for the long post but it seems folk on this thread are genuinely interested in other's opinions / experiences.
Same for the cost of charging. The tax revenue that will be lost on petrol/diesel will ultimately be loaded somewhere else.
Its the right direction of travel but the maths will change over time.2 -
Its the longer motorway journeys that I wonder about. How do you plan when you dont know if a point will be free or functioning when you arrive? What’s your plan B? And since you have to stay there for a period of time, what’s the environment like, if it’s not a standard service station?I have several apps now which are supposed to answer the questions but so far my experience is, they don’t do it very well.2
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how does that work without a home charger?, don't most charge them on their driveway overnight?Rothko said:We've been full electric for about 18 months, honestly it's been fine, no hassle with charging even without a home charger, done a few long distance runs and it's been great. Probably going to get another EV soon, either an MG4 or MG ZS, and I think we're full converted0 -
Off a 3 pin plug?Elthamaddick said:
how does that work without a home charger?, don't most charge them on their driveway overnight?Rothko said:We've been full electric for about 18 months, honestly it's been fine, no hassle with charging even without a home charger, done a few long distance runs and it's been great. Probably going to get another EV soon, either an MG4 or MG ZS, and I think we're full converted0 -
We have a package that includes public charging, so I'll pop to the charger next to Costa, plug it in for an hour, do some work whilst having a coffee, and then drive it home. As most of the driving is school runs and local stuff, it does the job once a weekElthamaddick said:
how does that work without a home charger?, don't most charge them on their driveway overnight?Rothko said:We've been full electric for about 18 months, honestly it's been fine, no hassle with charging even without a home charger, done a few long distance runs and it's been great. Probably going to get another EV soon, either an MG4 or MG ZS, and I think we're full converted0 -
That’s another thing! My PHEV needs 10 hours or more and the battery is much smaller than a full EV. I have a wallbox installed at home but that still takes 4 hours or so. I don’t mind any of that, it’s the same as plugging in your phone overnight. But on a long journey its a different matter.guinnessaddick said:
Off a 3 pin plug?Elthamaddick said:
how does that work without a home charger?, don't most charge them on their driveway overnight?Rothko said:We've been full electric for about 18 months, honestly it's been fine, no hassle with charging even without a home charger, done a few long distance runs and it's been great. Probably going to get another EV soon, either an MG4 or MG ZS, and I think we're full converted0 -
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Over Christmas I drove to Manchester, then to Liverpool and back in my full EV. Didn't really have an issue, probably took slightly longer (combination of driving more efficiently and slightly longer rest stops) but I found plenty of places to charge. To answer your question though it does take a bit more planning, but on the major routes there at least does seem to be plenty of options. In other parts of the country though it seems there are still black holes that need to be fixed quickly.PragueAddick said:Its the longer motorway journeys that I wonder about. How do you plan when you dont know if a point will be free or functioning when you arrive? What’s your plan B? And since you have to stay there for a period of time, what’s the environment like, if it’s not a standard service station?I have several apps now which are supposed to answer the questions but so far my experience is, they don’t do it very well.0 -
Ouch!DaveMehmet said:
There's a company based at the Bicester Heritage Centre that have just started selling fully synthetic fuel. It's been developed primarily for use in classic cars.Redrobo said:
Will synthetic fuel be available by then, and at a sensible price?cafcfan said:
If Toyota's claims come to fruition by 2027, as they suggest, it will make all current electric cars obsolete overnight. Nothing could compete with a 10 minute charge, half the weight, half the cost and twice the range. Tesla could find itself being about as useful as a Sinclair C5: doing the automotive equivalent of betamax or plasma TVs.Danepak said:https://amp.theguardian.com/business/2023/jul/04/toyota-claims-battery-breakthrough-electric-cars745 miles distance on a single charge.
And that charge would take less than 10 mins.No need to change cars and keep the garage network. Greener than batteries.
Downsides are, it's only available at that one place and starts at £3.80 per litre.
It's a start thoughThat price has to plummet and I suspect it will.It surely has to be the way forward and is greener than electric.0 -
Redrobo said:
Ouch!DaveMehmet said:
There's a company based at the Bicester Heritage Centre that have just started selling fully synthetic fuel. It's been developed primarily for use in classic cars.Redrobo said:
Will synthetic fuel be available by then, and at a sensible price?cafcfan said:
If Toyota's claims come to fruition by 2027, as they suggest, it will make all current electric cars obsolete overnight. Nothing could compete with a 10 minute charge, half the weight, half the cost and twice the range. Tesla could find itself being about as useful as a Sinclair C5: doing the automotive equivalent of betamax or plasma TVs.Danepak said:https://amp.theguardian.com/business/2023/jul/04/toyota-claims-battery-breakthrough-electric-cars745 miles distance on a single charge.
And that charge would take less than 10 mins.No need to change cars and keep the garage network. Greener than batteries.
Downsides are, it's only available at that one place and starts at £3.80 per litre.
It's a start thoughThat price has to plummet and I suspect it will.It surely has to be the way forward and is greener than electric.
I read an article the other day that claimed NOx levels at exhaust are similar to petrol/diesel.
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You can poke all that ev and SUV bollocks. A two litre diesel that can do 900 miles from full and still have quarter of a tank left, quite happy with that thanks.0
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Charging points are going to be a real issue. At present when EV’s are still relatively uncommon it’s not so bad with the number of public charging points currently available and home charging. What happens with streets of terraced houses with no drive and a pavement between the house and the kerb. What if you can’t park it outside your own house ? What about blocks of flats ? What about the inadequacies of the national grid supply ? For me there are far too many hurdles for it to fully work with the present technology.2
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I believe the process to make the synthetic fuel uses CO2 from air, and that is returned via the exhaust. So neutral overall which is the measure that all should be judged by. I have no idea of the production process and as to if that produces unwanted gasses.bobmunro said:Redrobo said:
Ouch!DaveMehmet said:
There's a company based at the Bicester Heritage Centre that have just started selling fully synthetic fuel. It's been developed primarily for use in classic cars.Redrobo said:
Will synthetic fuel be available by then, and at a sensible price?cafcfan said:
If Toyota's claims come to fruition by 2027, as they suggest, it will make all current electric cars obsolete overnight. Nothing could compete with a 10 minute charge, half the weight, half the cost and twice the range. Tesla could find itself being about as useful as a Sinclair C5: doing the automotive equivalent of betamax or plasma TVs.Danepak said:https://amp.theguardian.com/business/2023/jul/04/toyota-claims-battery-breakthrough-electric-cars745 miles distance on a single charge.
And that charge would take less than 10 mins.No need to change cars and keep the garage network. Greener than batteries.
Downsides are, it's only available at that one place and starts at £3.80 per litre.
It's a start thoughThat price has to plummet and I suspect it will.It surely has to be the way forward and is greener than electric.
I read an article the other day that claimed NOx levels at exhaust are similar to petrol/diesel.
It would be fantastic if planes and ships could run on it as well.
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Doesn’t help that on our last long trip to Devon, a lot of the motorway service stations only had two or three charging bays. So whilst it was only 30-40 minutes to charge up, we had to wait an hour just to get a slot.colthe3rd said:
Over Christmas I drove to Manchester, then to Liverpool and back in my full EV. Didn't really have an issue, probably took slightly longer (combination of driving more efficiently and slightly longer rest stops) but I found plenty of places to charge. To answer your question though it does take a bit more planning, but on the major routes there at least does seem to be plenty of options. In other parts of the country though it seems there are still black holes that need to be fixed quickly.PragueAddick said:Its the longer motorway journeys that I wonder about. How do you plan when you dont know if a point will be free or functioning when you arrive? What’s your plan B? And since you have to stay there for a period of time, what’s the environment like, if it’s not a standard service station?I have several apps now which are supposed to answer the questions but so far my experience is, they don’t do it very well.1 -
Yeah the south west does seem to be one of those areas lacking at the moment. I'm not a blinkered ev evangelist, there are without doubts issues with them, however most of those issues can be overcome with proper investment if governments and corporations are serious about reducing air polluting vehicles, it's a huge if though.MrOneLung said:
Doesn’t help that on our last long trip to Devon, a lot of the motorway service stations only had two or three charging bays. So whilst it was only 30-40 minutes to charge up, we had to wait an hour just to get a slot.colthe3rd said:
Over Christmas I drove to Manchester, then to Liverpool and back in my full EV. Didn't really have an issue, probably took slightly longer (combination of driving more efficiently and slightly longer rest stops) but I found plenty of places to charge. To answer your question though it does take a bit more planning, but on the major routes there at least does seem to be plenty of options. In other parts of the country though it seems there are still black holes that need to be fixed quickly.PragueAddick said:Its the longer motorway journeys that I wonder about. How do you plan when you dont know if a point will be free or functioning when you arrive? What’s your plan B? And since you have to stay there for a period of time, what’s the environment like, if it’s not a standard service station?I have several apps now which are supposed to answer the questions but so far my experience is, they don’t do it very well.2 -
Exactly. Now imagine if Google Maps factored in such downtime into its estimates of journey times. Who’d like to see that? I can think of one group of companies who would…MrOneLung said:
Doesn’t help that on our last long trip to Devon, a lot of the motorway service stations only had two or three charging bays. So whilst it was only 30-40 minutes to charge up, we had to wait an hour just to get a slot.colthe3rd said:
Over Christmas I drove to Manchester, then to Liverpool and back in my full EV. Didn't really have an issue, probably took slightly longer (combination of driving more efficiently and slightly longer rest stops) but I found plenty of places to charge. To answer your question though it does take a bit more planning, but on the major routes there at least does seem to be plenty of options. In other parts of the country though it seems there are still black holes that need to be fixed quickly.PragueAddick said:Its the longer motorway journeys that I wonder about. How do you plan when you dont know if a point will be free or functioning when you arrive? What’s your plan B? And since you have to stay there for a period of time, what’s the environment like, if it’s not a standard service station?I have several apps now which are supposed to answer the questions but so far my experience is, they don’t do it very well.
The train operators😂0 -
To add to that, yesterday we drove back from holiday on the German coast, due south through Berlin, which is half way, so lunchtime. It was steaming hot, like 35c. Knowing the route a bit now, we decided to stop off the autobahn, just find a forested area, maybe with a lake, there are loads around there. My wife to our amazement found such a spot which had a charger. It was even more amazing when we got there, a dirttrack road with tracks off into the forest, and there on a fence was a charger, available for public use. I tried to swipe my Shell card, not accepted. Then my debit card (multi currency) not accepted. Then I saw the QR code, opened that on my phone, filled in my details and the debit card. It informed me I’d be debited €95. I assumed that was a max limit and it would only debit me what I would use on that short stop. I pressed to accept, the connection to my bank came up, and then…the connection circle just slowly rotated, and nothing went through.Fortunately…we have a PHEV….0
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I know very little about synthetic petrol, so I looked it up. On the face of it, it looks much greener than normal petrol. It requires electricity to produce the hydrogen; I couldn’t find anywhere that compared with the electricity to power an electric vehicle but I suspect it is less.Redrobo said:
Ouch!DaveMehmet said:
There's a company based at the Bicester Heritage Centre that have just started selling fully synthetic fuel. It's been developed primarily for use in classic cars.Redrobo said:
Will synthetic fuel be available by then, and at a sensible price?cafcfan said:
If Toyota's claims come to fruition by 2027, as they suggest, it will make all current electric cars obsolete overnight. Nothing could compete with a 10 minute charge, half the weight, half the cost and twice the range. Tesla could find itself being about as useful as a Sinclair C5: doing the automotive equivalent of betamax or plasma TVs.Danepak said:https://amp.theguardian.com/business/2023/jul/04/toyota-claims-battery-breakthrough-electric-cars745 miles distance on a single charge.
And that charge would take less than 10 mins.No need to change cars and keep the garage network. Greener than batteries.
Downsides are, it's only available at that one place and starts at £3.80 per litre.
It's a start thoughThat price has to plummet and I suspect it will.It surely has to be the way forward and is greener than electric.0 -
The cynic in me would likely agree - however these are pretty much the same car companies that currently build IC cars, with one or two exceptions.Showmetheway2gohome said:The only thing certain about electric cars is our politicians must be getting some good back handlers from the electric car industry the way they are trying to force us to have them.3 -
cloud cuckoo land - sadlycolthe3rd said:
Yeah the south west does seem to be one of those areas lacking at the moment. I'm not a blinkered ev evangelist, there are without doubts issues with them, however most of those issues can be overcome with proper investment if governments and corporations are serious about reducing air polluting vehicles, it's a huge if though.MrOneLung said:
Doesn’t help that on our last long trip to Devon, a lot of the motorway service stations only had two or three charging bays. So whilst it was only 30-40 minutes to charge up, we had to wait an hour just to get a slot.colthe3rd said:
Over Christmas I drove to Manchester, then to Liverpool and back in my full EV. Didn't really have an issue, probably took slightly longer (combination of driving more efficiently and slightly longer rest stops) but I found plenty of places to charge. To answer your question though it does take a bit more planning, but on the major routes there at least does seem to be plenty of options. In other parts of the country though it seems there are still black holes that need to be fixed quickly.PragueAddick said:Its the longer motorway journeys that I wonder about. How do you plan when you dont know if a point will be free or functioning when you arrive? What’s your plan B? And since you have to stay there for a period of time, what’s the environment like, if it’s not a standard service station?I have several apps now which are supposed to answer the questions but so far my experience is, they don’t do it very well.
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I don't know but would doubt Google "estimates" journey times in the sense you probably mean it. I am sure its journey times are based on actual journeys along your specified route and will automatically include stops for refuelling made by the cars (phones) it tracks. You are able to specify your fuel type for Google to suggest more fuel-efficient routes so providing sufficient EVs have made your journey it is already being calculated by the great god Google.PragueAddick said:
Exactly. Now imagine if Google Maps factored in such downtime into its estimates of journey times. Who’d like to see that? I can think of one group of companies who would…MrOneLung said:
Doesn’t help that on our last long trip to Devon, a lot of the motorway service stations only had two or three charging bays. So whilst it was only 30-40 minutes to charge up, we had to wait an hour just to get a slot.colthe3rd said:
Over Christmas I drove to Manchester, then to Liverpool and back in my full EV. Didn't really have an issue, probably took slightly longer (combination of driving more efficiently and slightly longer rest stops) but I found plenty of places to charge. To answer your question though it does take a bit more planning, but on the major routes there at least does seem to be plenty of options. In other parts of the country though it seems there are still black holes that need to be fixed quickly.PragueAddick said:Its the longer motorway journeys that I wonder about. How do you plan when you dont know if a point will be free or functioning when you arrive? What’s your plan B? And since you have to stay there for a period of time, what’s the environment like, if it’s not a standard service station?I have several apps now which are supposed to answer the questions but so far my experience is, they don’t do it very well.
The train operators😂0 -
I don’t know either, but I doubt your version too. How would it know the reason for stopping is just to refuel? And how, in the case of cars with fuel tanks, does it know whether you need a stop at all? My previous car could do the run I’m talking about on one tank, so provided I fuelled up beforehand, no fuel stops. The new one, we had to stop twice. ( second one might not have been necessary if I could have used that charge point.Hex said:
I don't know but would doubt Google "estimates" journey times in the sense you probably mean it. I am sure its journey times are based on actual journeys along your specified route and will automatically include stops for refuelling made by the cars (phones) it tracks. You are able to specify your fuel type for Google to suggest more fuel-efficient routes so providing sufficient EVs have made your journey it is already being calculated by the great god Google.PragueAddick said:
Exactly. Now imagine if Google Maps factored in such downtime into its estimates of journey times. Who’d like to see that? I can think of one group of companies who would…MrOneLung said:
Doesn’t help that on our last long trip to Devon, a lot of the motorway service stations only had two or three charging bays. So whilst it was only 30-40 minutes to charge up, we had to wait an hour just to get a slot.colthe3rd said:
Over Christmas I drove to Manchester, then to Liverpool and back in my full EV. Didn't really have an issue, probably took slightly longer (combination of driving more efficiently and slightly longer rest stops) but I found plenty of places to charge. To answer your question though it does take a bit more planning, but on the major routes there at least does seem to be plenty of options. In other parts of the country though it seems there are still black holes that need to be fixed quickly.PragueAddick said:Its the longer motorway journeys that I wonder about. How do you plan when you dont know if a point will be free or functioning when you arrive? What’s your plan B? And since you have to stay there for a period of time, what’s the environment like, if it’s not a standard service station?I have several apps now which are supposed to answer the questions but so far my experience is, they don’t do it very well.
The train operators😂
Don’t get me wrong, I would love this EV thing to work (so long as they sort out the disposal of batteries issue) but I see a lot of wishful thinking going on here both at government level and among users. And that isn’t healthy, especially while EVs are too expensive for exactly the kind of people who most need a car to carry out good work (e.g. nurses priced out of property in London).1 -
Although I don't know how Google do it, I know how I would do it given the data available (probably from the National Street Gazetteer).PragueAddick said:
I don’t know either, but I doubt your version too. How would it know the reason for stopping is just to refuel? And how, in the case of cars with fuel tanks, does it know whether you need a stop at all? My previous car could do the run I’m talking about on one tank, so provided I fuelled up beforehand, no fuel stops. The new one, we had to stop twice. ( second one might not have been necessary if I could have used that charge point.Hex said:
I don't know but would doubt Google "estimates" journey times in the sense you probably mean it. I am sure its journey times are based on actual journeys along your specified route and will automatically include stops for refuelling made by the cars (phones) it tracks. You are able to specify your fuel type for Google to suggest more fuel-efficient routes so providing sufficient EVs have made your journey it is already being calculated by the great god Google.PragueAddick said:
Exactly. Now imagine if Google Maps factored in such downtime into its estimates of journey times. Who’d like to see that? I can think of one group of companies who would…MrOneLung said:
Doesn’t help that on our last long trip to Devon, a lot of the motorway service stations only had two or three charging bays. So whilst it was only 30-40 minutes to charge up, we had to wait an hour just to get a slot.colthe3rd said:
Over Christmas I drove to Manchester, then to Liverpool and back in my full EV. Didn't really have an issue, probably took slightly longer (combination of driving more efficiently and slightly longer rest stops) but I found plenty of places to charge. To answer your question though it does take a bit more planning, but on the major routes there at least does seem to be plenty of options. In other parts of the country though it seems there are still black holes that need to be fixed quickly.PragueAddick said:Its the longer motorway journeys that I wonder about. How do you plan when you dont know if a point will be free or functioning when you arrive? What’s your plan B? And since you have to stay there for a period of time, what’s the environment like, if it’s not a standard service station?I have several apps now which are supposed to answer the questions but so far my experience is, they don’t do it very well.
The train operators😂
Don’t get me wrong, I would love this EV thing to work (so long as they sort out the disposal of batteries issue) but I see a lot of wishful thinking going on here both at government level and among users. And that isn’t healthy, especially while EVs are too expensive for exactly the kind of people who most need a car to carry out good work (e.g. nurses priced out of property in London).
Think of the journey from The Valley shop to Woolwich Ferry. Google will be using a network where, in its simplest form, will look like lines connected together at node points. Each node represents a connection/intersection of roads and each line is a section of road. The road length is known as is the speed limit. As you pass through each node Google calculates how long it took you to make that part of your trip. Scale that up to 10s or 100s of vehicles (mobile phones) and Google knows how long each section of road takes to traverse. That is every section of road in the country. It's a small step to calculate your journey time.
Google probably have algorithms that adjusts journey times on roads sections that have a place to refuel. They will know from their tracking which vehicles stopped to refuel so may increase their journey times accordingly. This calculation may alter depending on fuel type.
It is quite simple really and is ready for road-pricing. Extend the underlying network into car parks and your monthly bill will cover parking as well !0 -
When I plan our european driving holidays abroad, I try to do a max of 3.5 hrs a day and google is a great way to plan it.0
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Modern satnavs that would surely be standard in all EV’s are able to calculate journeys in real time, based on distance, speed, route and traffic conditions. That’s far more useful than a google prediction taking into account a stop for charging, refilling, a mars bar or a piss. Quite frankly until an EV can provide me with a charge to get me from Leeds to London return I really can’t be doing with it. Certainly not at the price wanted for a car large enough for my needs and spec I want.1
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The satnav will still be using a network as I described. One of the EVs I test drove told me an out-of-date speed limit for a road in Greenwich (a black mark from me). I am confident Google's network and calculations will be better than those of a satnav unless, of course, you are purchasing an EV like me that uses Google for its navigation !ShootersHillGuru said:Modern satnavs that would surely be standard in all EV’s are able to calculate journeys in real time, based on distance, speed, route and traffic conditions. That’s far more useful than a google prediction taking into account a stop for charging, refilling, a mars bar or a piss. Quite frankly until an EV can provide me with a charge to get me from Leeds to London return I really can’t be doing with it. Certainly not at the price wanted for a car large enough for my needs and spec I want.0 -
This argument is in danger of becoming a bit of a diversion, but anyway. My car has a TomTom satnav, which I’m quite impressed with. It proposed the same route home on Sunday as Google, and gave a time of arrival. Basically I drove at around the max speed allowed and the time of arrival hardly changed - until we stopped. Then the new time of arrival was later by the amount of time we spent filling up, and later having lunch. It also spotted traffic delays ahead, and adjusted the arrival time by the amount of the projected delay. As the delay built up it eventually automatically re-routed us, and having done that, improved the arrival time back to what it had been before the delay ahead was spotted. Cool! But the point is it did not try to build in for us a pitstop of any kind and I dont believe Google does either.Hex said:
The satnav will still be using a network as I described. One of the EVs I test drove told me an out-of-date speed limit for a road in Greenwich (a black mark from me). I am confident Google's network and calculations will be better than those of a satnav unless, of course, you are purchasing an EV like me that uses Google for its navigation !ShootersHillGuru said:Modern satnavs that would surely be standard in all EV’s are able to calculate journeys in real time, based on distance, speed, route and traffic conditions. That’s far more useful than a google prediction taking into account a stop for charging, refilling, a mars bar or a piss. Quite frankly until an EV can provide me with a charge to get me from Leeds to London return I really can’t be doing with it. Certainly not at the price wanted for a car large enough for my needs and spec I want.
BTW, if you are ever in Germany, I’d always get a second opinion before believing Google Maps. It’s quite a well-known problem.2
