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The Takeover Thread v3.0 - DONE! - Methven interview in the Telegraph (p55)
Comments
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We can debate the last decade without parachute payments but that doesn't change where we are today. For this month has seen a return of a structured SMT where the members each have several years experience at League One and Championship level.
A segment of the fanbase may wish to embrace nostalgic pessimism reflecting that the 90s and early 2000's might never be repeated. Equally others will show blind faith in SE7 Partners and GFP. Those who have watched "Welcome to Wrexham" will be aware of this divide between "happy clappers" and those who are far more pessimistic. But here's the thing:
We now have the opportunity to embrace a potential rebuild... embrace the chaos of CAFC... and see whether Scott, Methven, Holden, Rodwell et al can deliver a squad worthy of our club, worthy of a top six wage budget.
Yes investors can inject equity so as to boost the wage bill. But surely the role of the SMT is to run the club to budget:
- exit players who won't feature... another ten are out of contract next summer
- grow ticket sales
- grow commercial revenue
- develop young players over 30-50 games so as to enhance their value to us AND in the market
- enhance player sales as 60% goes towards the wage budget
- make less player acquisition mistakes
- above all, develop a coherent and cohesive narrative
The three investors are hands off and wish to see progress. They are set to make a fortune if we can secure two promotions. They've contributed some £25M to the cause covering acquisition and two years of losses. One doubts that they envisaged Port Vale at home in August as a "must win" but here we are!
As fans we all want a win tomorrow, followed by a return to Wembley next May.
But it may take longer and there may well be casualties on the journey. The investors will want to know that all aspects of the club are on a path back to a top half Championship club. Our stadium, our Academy and our Community Trust are already there... and then some.
But our recruitment, our sports science and our football is mid table League One
The old is dying and the new cannot be born. In this interregnum there arises a great diversity of morbid symptoms - Gramsci The Prison Diaries.12 -
I’d prefer automatic promotion to a return to Wembley next May. But I’ll go back to my cloud cuckoo land. See you there.9
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"Run the club to budget".
God I hate hearing that word budget.
Don't get me wrong, of course the club has to have a budget, it would be foolish not to.
But you know when management start banging on about budget publicly it's usually a clear sign that it isn't big enough.
Don't want to hear it in the next 2 weeks.13 -
If the owners have that kind of collateral why not just pay off the contracts and get rid of the deadwood so that we can buy replacements? May work out more costly keeping the unwanted players around and missing promotion for another season.Sex DubaiCAFC said:I have copied this from another post, but I think this sums it up well, and the position we are in! Hence why Ipswich was able to spend more on wages.
'The owners could put in £100m tomorrow, and that would help offset any financial losses, but would have zero effect to the TURNOVER of the company. The company's turnover comes from money made from daily operations, player sales, etc.
So the salaries being higher than 60% of TURNOVER is unaffected by however much money the owners put in, whether it be a loan (which causes problems in other ways under FFP), share capital, or even a good old injection of cash into the bank account.
So, if there's no wriggle room on the salaries to turnover ratio, throwing any amount of cash in isn't going to make any difference.
The only way that ratio can be improved, is by getting more bums on seats during a match day (with, you would hope, a equal increase in revenue streams from purchasing programmes, food, drink, and purchases from the shop. However, most of these opportunites seem to have been contracted out.), improved marketing/sponsorship deals (Steve Sutherlands job) or things like CATV revenues (which I believe runs out this month, because of the new Sky TV deal.) Or, the other side of the equation, reducing the wage bill.'0 -
Whatever equity the owners invest IS INCLUDED FOR TURNOVER PURPOSES WHEN CALCULATING FFP FOR WAGES : TURNOVER CALCULATIONS IN DIVISION 1 AND 2
HAVE WE GOT THAT NOW???!!!!3 -
Are you telling me we can’t use FFP as an excuse for not getting in players who know how to play football that will get us out of this shithole , 3 more windows time and we should be pushing for promotionsupaclive said:Whatever equity the owners invest IS INCLUDED FOR TURNOVER PURPOSES WHEN CALCULATING FFP FOR WAGES : TURNOVER CALCULATIONS IN DIVISION 1 AND 2
HAVE WE GOT THAT NOW???!!!!
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This mob have funds to cover the debt for 24 months and will want out before then if that's all they are seeing.seriously_red said:
We can debate the last decade without parachute payments but that doesn't change where we are today. For this month has seen a return of a structured SMT where the members each have several years experience at League One and Championship level.
A segment of the fanbase may wish to embrace nostalgic pessimism reflecting that the 90s and early 2000's might never be repeated. Equally others will show blind faith in SE7 Partners and GFP. Those who have watched "Welcome to Wrexham" will be aware of this divide between "happy clappers" and those who are far more pessimistic. But here's the thing:
We now have the opportunity to embrace a potential rebuild... embrace the chaos of CAFC... and see whether Scott, Methven, Holden, Rodwell et al can deliver a squad worthy of our club, worthy of a top six wage budget.
Yes investors can inject equity so as to boost the wage bill. But surely the role of the SMT is to run the club to budget:
- exit players who won't feature... another ten are out of contract next summer
- grow ticket sales
- grow commercial revenue
- develop young players over 30-50 games so as to enhance their value to us AND in the market
- enhance player sales as 60% goes towards the wage budget
- make less player acquisition mistakes
- above all, develop a coherent and cohesive narrative
The three investors are hands off and wish to see progress. They are set to make a fortune if we can secure two promotions. They've contributed some £25M to the cause covering acquisition and two years of losses. One doubts that they envisaged Port Vale at home in August as a "must win" but here we are!
As fans we all want a win tomorrow, followed by a return to Wembley next May.
But it may take longer and there may well be casualties on the journey. The investors will want to know that all aspects of the club are on a path back to a top half Championship club. Our stadium, our Academy and our Community Trust are already there... and then some.
But our recruitment, our sports science and our football is mid table League One
The old is dying and the new cannot be born. In this interregnum there arises a great diversity of morbid symptoms - Gramsci The Prison Diaries.2 -
And they are not going to spend a bean more.Six-a-bag-of-nuts said:"Run the club to budget".
God I hate hearing that word budget.
Don't get me wrong, of course the club has to have a budget, it would be foolish not to.
But you know when management start banging on about budget publicly it's usually a clear sign that it isn't big enough.
Don't want to hear it in the next 2 weeks.0 -
FFP has suddenly become a hot topic! How did it start to become discussed more than rumours? Ah, it is the ultimate rumour.0
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Been quite the narrative shift from 'we're after players with Championship interest' to the FFP line in the past week.
Been 3 weeks since we've signed anyone, only rumour is someone who failed their medical previously.23 - Sponsored links:
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ANY players aged under 21 at start of the season don't count towards FFP either.
Gotta be half of our squad!!0 -
Because there are supporters who keep going on about 3 or 4 windows to rebuild the squad l. The keeping to a budget and we cannot just spend because the 60% wage rule.mendonca said:FFP has suddenly become a hot topic! How did it start to become discussed more than rumours? Ah, it is the ultimate rumour.
All of which is ru bbish. If you are a wealthy enough owner you can buy a first class squad of players by the start of the season and cover the cost buy putting more money into the club and not break the 60% rule
Do I want owners thst wealthy yes. It worked for Ipdwich. Bournemouth Btrntford
Norwich and so on.
And of course New Castle.2 -
This new lot.
I call...
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More of them in the director’s box than we have in the squad.7
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I have very low expectations & little faith in Methven & his mob are matching those. Not overly impressed so far. Squad is predictably half baked & underdone.10 games in & after the transfer window will give supporters a good guide.It will have to be a very good few weeks & a change on the current direction of travel.2
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It's the same old story. Charlton oversold to uninitiated and I'll informed ownership groups.
Methven more than likely loose with the truth.
Over promised, as per the brochure.
These people don't seem to expect a quick turnaround on the pitch but do want things to happen quickly in the revenue stakes. And If we, the support base, don't attend and spend money then neither will they to any great level.
But they always fail to see how the two go hand in hand.
And until one of these twonks do, this sorry affair will continue5 -
No, I'm saying the structural damage at Charlton has been ongoing for 10 years, not 3!mcgrandall said:
Unless you are crediting TS with the improved players that have been brought in this summer so far, they have been around a lot longer than 3 weeks.Todds_right_hook said:
Sorry for being picky you've made a very good point which I agree with. 10 years of structural damage, not 3!!Rothko said:The idea you can turn round 3 years of structural damage in 3 weeks is for the birds3 -
Never trusted them in the first place. Got bad news written all over it and for some reason everyone was blind to every single warning we got about Methven. Fuck knows what their plans but it doesn't look like getting promoted is part of it
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If Methven & these owners bought the club, why aren’t they building a competitive squad ? What is the point of a non competitive league one team that the only achievement currently appears to be scraping a mid table finish ?Methven & Scott & the hierarchy will still get paid a healthy wage (naturally), mid table or relegation. All the talk of passion & progression - its looking like horseshit. All the wealthy investors, I am finding it difficult working out the rationale. What’s the point of putting a half baked squad together & a mediocre squad?Ican see any loanees definitely getting a game but that’s about it.0
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Yep. People never want to hear it. Even after the last ten years.Croydon said:Never trusted them in the first place. Got bad news written all over it and for some reason everyone was blind to every single warning we got a out Methven. Fuck knows what their plans but it doesn't look like getting promoted is part of it1 - Sponsored links:
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I think the vast majority of fans were/are sceptical, but thought/still think it only reasonable to make the first judgement when the transfer window closes.26
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Sceptical from the start. Nothing that has happened so far has really changed that view. It is fair to give 10 games & see what team is put together. Not impressed so far. I am struggling to see why Methven bothers, if it is not to be successful or the US group of investors either.Croydon said:Never trusted them in the first place. Got bad news written all over it and for some reason everyone was blind to every single warning we got about Methven. Fuck knows what their plans but it doesn't look like getting promoted is part of itI really hope that I am proven wrong & Methven makes a go of it but not seeing it so far on the current slow moving car wreck of a plan.0 -
Another bizarre takeover it seems, why buy the club but not strengthen the first team? Or maybe they are happy wasting x amount of millions funding a L1 struggle0
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True enough. We always have to give these people time. More than they deserve for the most part But I suppose we have to wait.Covered End said:I think the vast majority of fans were/are sceptical, but thought/still think it only reasonable to make the first judgement when the transfer window closes.
But you can feel it brewing.
Reckon things will get pretty toxic if a competitive squad isn't assembled.
And rightly so.2 -
I have a fellow supporter friend who has a conspiracy theory. That they are in cohorts with Duchatelet and the whole thing is a property ploy. Run the club down so that it becomes insolvent and then cash in on on the property. I know that it would be difficult with the valley access issues and Greenwich council but maybe not completely off the wall?BigRedEvil said:Another bizarre takeover it seems, why buy the club but not strengthen the first team? Or maybe they are happy wasting x amount of millions funding a L1 struggle0 -
Yep. Crossed my mind.CafcWest said:
I have a fellow supporter friend who has a conspiracy theory. That they are in cohorts with Duchatelet and the whole thing is a property ploy. Run the club down so that it becomes insolvent and then cash in on on the property. I know that it would be difficult with the valley access issues and Greenwich council but maybe not completely off the wall?BigRedEvil said:Another bizarre takeover it seems, why buy the club but not strengthen the first team? Or maybe they are happy wasting x amount of millions funding a L1 struggle
Just as ESI were in cahoots with him so that he could split the football club from the Valley and SL. It's the only reason they turned up in the first place.0 -
Todds_right_hook said:
No, I'm saying the structural damage at Charlton has been ongoing for 10 years, not 3!mcgrandall said:
Unless you are crediting TS with the improved players that have been brought in this summer so far, they have been around a lot longer than 3 weeks.Todds_right_hook said:
Sorry for being picky you've made a very good point which I agree with. 10 years of structural damage, not 3!!Rothko said:The idea you can turn round 3 years of structural damage in 3 weeks is for the birdsI wasn't disagreeing, just pointing out the second part was also inaccurate. They have had ever since the SPA was signed to plan for start of the season.There seems to be a lot of posts that suggest they only started when the takeover concluded, like the one you quoted.1 -
They've known the size of the task since January when they were basically in charge then!mcgrandall said:Todds_right_hook said:
No, I'm saying the structural damage at Charlton has been ongoing for 10 years, not 3!mcgrandall said:
Unless you are crediting TS with the improved players that have been brought in this summer so far, they have been around a lot longer than 3 weeks.Todds_right_hook said:
Sorry for being picky you've made a very good point which I agree with. 10 years of structural damage, not 3!!Rothko said:The idea you can turn round 3 years of structural damage in 3 weeks is for the birdsI wasn't disagreeing, just pointing out the second part was also inaccurate. They have had ever since the SPA was signed to plan for start of the season.There seems to be a lot of posts that suggest they only started when the takeover concluded, like the one you quoted.1 -
supaclive said:
They've known the size of the task since January when they were basically in charge then!mcgrandall said:Todds_right_hook said:
No, I'm saying the structural damage at Charlton has been ongoing for 10 years, not 3!mcgrandall said:
Unless you are crediting TS with the improved players that have been brought in this summer so far, they have been around a lot longer than 3 weeks.Todds_right_hook said:
Sorry for being picky you've made a very good point which I agree with. 10 years of structural damage, not 3!!Rothko said:The idea you can turn round 3 years of structural damage in 3 weeks is for the birdsI wasn't disagreeing, just pointing out the second part was also inaccurate. They have had ever since the SPA was signed to plan for start of the season.There seems to be a lot of posts that suggest they only started when the takeover concluded, like the one you quoted.True, but to be fair to them, after being messed around by TS I can see why they would need an agreement in principle first before starting recruitment this summer.Maybe there is time to turn it around, but I've not been impressed by what I've seen so far. Looks like it is the usual excuses of FFP and competing with Championship clubs. Plus the leaks to certain fans compared to communication from the SMT is a bit suspect imo, as it only appears to divide the fan base.0 -
If you still think this is a property play then you're off your nut. There are literally more than a dozen sites within a mile of The Valley that are easier, cheaper and quicker to build on
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