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Michael Hector - March 2025: signed for Dagenham and Redbridge til end of season (p31)

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  • superclive98
    superclive98 Posts: 4,766
    Leuth said:
    Like, he's about the 5th closest to the ball of our players when their guy chests it down. He's the only one to recognise imminent danger and advance to meet him. Then someone else sticks a leg out of nowhere and puts it through his legs. It's unlucky as hell and to blame him for the goal is absurd
    He was the 5th closest of our players to the ball and had no need to rush forward  especially when, once you get there, you don't do anything.
    If he had stayed where he was the ball wouldn't have got to the player that scored. It was nothing to do with bad luck and all to do with bad decision making.
  • Leuth
    Leuth Posts: 23,314
    SELR_addicks said:
    Leuth said:
    Like, him and Jones are fast becoming one of the few good things about our team
    Funny that our best players are our centre backs and our weakness is in defense. Try squaring that circle. 

    'But look at his range of passing!' as we fail to get another clean sheet. 
    He's been defending very well recently. Is our weakness really in defence? There are weaknesses everywhere, but no more so than in midfield and wide areas 
  • Leuth
    Leuth Posts: 23,314
    superclive98 said:
    Leuth said:
    Like, he's about the 5th closest to the ball of our players when their guy chests it down. He's the only one to recognise imminent danger and advance to meet him. Then someone else sticks a leg out of nowhere and puts it through his legs. It's unlucky as hell and to blame him for the goal is absurd
    He was the 5th closest of our players to the ball and had no need to rush forward  especially when, once you get there, you don't do anything.
    If he had stayed where he was the ball wouldn't have got to the player that scored. It was nothing to do with bad luck and all to do with bad decision making.
    If Edun hadn't been dozy that player would have been three yards offside 
  • SELR_addicks
    SELR_addicks Posts: 15,446
    edited December 2023
    Leuth said:
    SELR_addicks said:
    Leuth said:
    Like, him and Jones are fast becoming one of the few good things about our team
    Funny that our best players are our centre backs and our weakness is in defense. Try squaring that circle. 

    'But look at his range of passing!' as we fail to get another clean sheet. 
    He's been defending very well recently. Is our weakness really in defence? There are weaknesses everywhere, but no more so than in midfield and wide areas 
    14th in the league for goals conceded. 
    Last league clean sheet was in October. 
    3 clean sheets all season.

    You tell me. 
  • Leuth
    Leuth Posts: 23,314
    SELR_addicks said:
    Leuth said:
    SELR_addicks said:
    Leuth said:
    Like, him and Jones are fast becoming one of the few good things about our team
    Funny that our best players are our centre backs and our weakness is in defense. Try squaring that circle. 

    'But look at his range of passing!' as we fail to get another clean sheet. 
    He's been defending very well recently. Is our weakness really in defence? There are weaknesses everywhere, but no more so than in midfield and wide areas 
    14th in the league for goals conceded. 
    Last league clean sheet was in October. 

    You tell me. 
    Our weakness is letting goals in, sure (alongside not having many sources of goals besides two players). But Charlton Life seems to have this curious belief that all goals ever are the fault of the centre-backs 
  • SELR_addicks
    SELR_addicks Posts: 15,446
    edited December 2023
    Leuth said:
    SELR_addicks said:
    Leuth said:
    SELR_addicks said:
    Leuth said:
    Like, him and Jones are fast becoming one of the few good things about our team
    Funny that our best players are our centre backs and our weakness is in defense. Try squaring that circle. 

    'But look at his range of passing!' as we fail to get another clean sheet. 
    He's been defending very well recently. Is our weakness really in defence? There are weaknesses everywhere, but no more so than in midfield and wide areas 
    14th in the league for goals conceded. 
    Last league clean sheet was in October. 

    You tell me. 
    Our weakness is letting goals in, sure (alongside not having many sources of goals besides two players). But Charlton Life seems to have this curious belief that all goals ever are the fault of the centre-backs 
    Outside of the last 4 games do you really think Hector has been a reliable defender between August and early December? 

    You can't just whitewash most of the season because the guy has played well in 4 games. (and still concedes easy goals even in those games). 
  • ShootersHillGuru
    ShootersHillGuru Posts: 50,619
    Our midfield doesn’t defend well enough. In my opinion that’s where a lot of our defensive frailties start.
  • superclive98
    superclive98 Posts: 4,766
    Leuth said:
    superclive98 said:
    Leuth said:
    Like, he's about the 5th closest to the ball of our players when their guy chests it down. He's the only one to recognise imminent danger and advance to meet him. Then someone else sticks a leg out of nowhere and puts it through his legs. It's unlucky as hell and to blame him for the goal is absurd
    He was the 5th closest of our players to the ball and had no need to rush forward  especially when, once you get there, you don't do anything.
    If he had stayed where he was the ball wouldn't have got to the player that scored. It was nothing to do with bad luck and all to do with bad decision making.
    If Edun hadn't been dozy that player would have been three yards offside 
    I agree with that but if Hector had just held position their player wouldn't have been left unmarked, onside or offside.
    As usual, Hector has a rush of blood to the head and leaves a player free in our box, who just happens to score.
    As you have said before, he was our 5th closest player to that dropping ball. He had no need to be going for it.

  • Leuth
    Leuth Posts: 23,314
    SELR_addicks said:
    Leuth said:
    SELR_addicks said:
    Leuth said:
    SELR_addicks said:
    Leuth said:
    Like, him and Jones are fast becoming one of the few good things about our team
    Funny that our best players are our centre backs and our weakness is in defense. Try squaring that circle. 

    'But look at his range of passing!' as we fail to get another clean sheet. 
    He's been defending very well recently. Is our weakness really in defence? There are weaknesses everywhere, but no more so than in midfield and wide areas 
    14th in the league for goals conceded. 
    Last league clean sheet was in October. 

    You tell me. 
    Our weakness is letting goals in, sure (alongside not having many sources of goals besides two players). But Charlton Life seems to have this curious belief that all goals ever are the fault of the centre-backs 
    Outside of the last 4 games do you really think Hector has been a reliable defender between September and early December? 
    I've broken it all down in this thread. There are four games this season where he's completely screwed up and we've lost points (no, yesterday isn't one of them, besides he did the only good attacking play anyone managed and we scored from it). Two were in a row early season. Two were in a row vs Lincoln and Blackpool. He's clustered his errors, which makes it seem like he's played much worse than he actually has. So, apart from in those four games, I'd say yes he very much has. 
  • Leuth
    Leuth Posts: 23,314
    ShootersHillGuru said:
    Our midfield doesn’t defend well enough. In my opinion that’s where a lot of our defensive frailties start.
    Yeah. Us dropping deeper and inviting Burton onto us and not challenging for loose balls is what got us into the mess in the first place 
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  • Leuth
    Leuth Posts: 23,314
    superclive98 said:
    Leuth said:
    superclive98 said:
    Leuth said:
    Like, he's about the 5th closest to the ball of our players when their guy chests it down. He's the only one to recognise imminent danger and advance to meet him. Then someone else sticks a leg out of nowhere and puts it through his legs. It's unlucky as hell and to blame him for the goal is absurd
    He was the 5th closest of our players to the ball and had no need to rush forward  especially when, once you get there, you don't do anything.
    If he had stayed where he was the ball wouldn't have got to the player that scored. It was nothing to do with bad luck and all to do with bad decision making.
    If Edun hadn't been dozy that player would have been three yards offside 
    I agree with that but if Hector had just held position their player wouldn't have been left unmarked, onside or offside.
    As usual, Hector has a rush of blood to the head and leaves a player free in our box, who just happens to score.
    As you have said before, he was our 5th closest player to that dropping ball. He had no need to be going for it.

    That player was being marked by T Watson initially! But he's a much worse footballer than Hector, by a very long way, so he sort of just stood there and didn't even try to address the situation 
  • Leuth
    Leuth Posts: 23,314
    Like, Hector has fuckin Tennai Watson outside him. He has to do the work of two men defensively 
  • Talal
    Talal Posts: 11,485
    His mistakes may have only led to goals in 4 games but he has absolutely been poor in more than that. 
  • superclive98
    superclive98 Posts: 4,766
    Leuth said:
    SELR_addicks said:
    Leuth said:
    SELR_addicks said:
    Leuth said:
    SELR_addicks said:
    Leuth said:
    Like, him and Jones are fast becoming one of the few good things about our team
    Funny that our best players are our centre backs and our weakness is in defense. Try squaring that circle. 

    'But look at his range of passing!' as we fail to get another clean sheet. 
    He's been defending very well recently. Is our weakness really in defence? There are weaknesses everywhere, but no more so than in midfield and wide areas 
    14th in the league for goals conceded. 
    Last league clean sheet was in October. 

    You tell me. 
    Our weakness is letting goals in, sure (alongside not having many sources of goals besides two players). But Charlton Life seems to have this curious belief that all goals ever are the fault of the centre-backs 
    Outside of the last 4 games do you really think Hector has been a reliable defender between September and early December? 
    I've broken it all down in this thread. There are four games this season where he's completely screwed up and we've lost points (no, yesterday isn't one of them, besides he did the only good attacking play anyone managed and we scored from it). Two were in a row early season. Two were in a row vs Lincoln and Blackpool. He's clustered his errors, which makes it seem like he's played much worse than he actually has. So, apart from in those four games, I'd say yes he very much has. 
    Just because he hasn't regularly made the glaring errors, that you highlight, throughout the season doesn't mean that he has played well in all the other games.
    He cannot be relied upon to defend properly and must be a nightmare to play alongside because he frequently goes AWOL.
    I'd rather have 2 Lloyd Jones type players than a Jones/Hector combo (not that I am saying that Jones is the best thing since sliced bread, just that he is far more reliable than Hector).
  • Leuth
    Leuth Posts: 23,314
    But he's playing well now. 

    Him and Jones are the centre-backs of a really good side, potentially. AMB, Dobson and May can be in that side too. CBT possibly. We just need full-backs (RB certainly, jury out on Edun), two midfielders who actually do anything, at least one winger who actually does anything and gets involved, and a forward who can complement May. I'm very annoyed by all this 'May, CBT, Dobson and Jones are the only good players' slander. Hector is totally in that bracket playing like this! It isn't like all of the above don't screw up loads either 
  • Leuth
    Leuth Posts: 23,314
    superclive98 said:
    Leuth said:
    SELR_addicks said:
    Leuth said:
    SELR_addicks said:
    Leuth said:
    SELR_addicks said:
    Leuth said:
    Like, him and Jones are fast becoming one of the few good things about our team
    Funny that our best players are our centre backs and our weakness is in defense. Try squaring that circle. 

    'But look at his range of passing!' as we fail to get another clean sheet. 
    He's been defending very well recently. Is our weakness really in defence? There are weaknesses everywhere, but no more so than in midfield and wide areas 
    14th in the league for goals conceded. 
    Last league clean sheet was in October. 

    You tell me. 
    Our weakness is letting goals in, sure (alongside not having many sources of goals besides two players). But Charlton Life seems to have this curious belief that all goals ever are the fault of the centre-backs 
    Outside of the last 4 games do you really think Hector has been a reliable defender between September and early December? 
    I've broken it all down in this thread. There are four games this season where he's completely screwed up and we've lost points (no, yesterday isn't one of them, besides he did the only good attacking play anyone managed and we scored from it). Two were in a row early season. Two were in a row vs Lincoln and Blackpool. He's clustered his errors, which makes it seem like he's played much worse than he actually has. So, apart from in those four games, I'd say yes he very much has. 
    Just because he hasn't regularly made the glaring errors, that you highlight, throughout the season doesn't mean that he has played well in all the other games.
    He cannot be relied upon to defend properly and must be a nightmare to play alongside because he frequently goes AWOL.
    I'd rather have 2 Lloyd Jones type players than a Jones/Hector combo (not that I am saying that Jones is the best thing since sliced bread, just that he is far more reliable than Hector).
    Defending properly is what he's been doing really well! His errors have largely been trying to be too cute with his passing. But then again he's been involved in 4 our of our last 5 goals, so
  • SELR_addicks
    SELR_addicks Posts: 15,446
    edited December 2023
    Leuth said:
    But he's playing well now. 

    Him and Jones are the centre-backs of a really good side, potentially. AMB, Dobson and May can be in that side too. CBT possibly. We just need full-backs (RB certainly, jury out on Edun), two midfielders who actually do anything, at least one winger who actually does anything and gets involved, and a forward who can complement May. I'm very annoyed by all this 'May, CBT, Dobson and Jones are the only good players' slander. Hector is totally in that bracket playing like this! It isn't like all of the above don't screw up loads either 
    You want to purely focus on 3/4 games and ignore the previous 18 games? 

    Yes he's in a bit of form. But he's been average/poor for a lot more games than just your 4. 

    If we want to pick and choose 'good games' from all of our players, we should be top of the league and wouldn't have lost a game. It's a poor way of judging a player's ability. 
  • Leuth
    Leuth Posts: 23,314
    It's not just that he's playing well though. It's that he's looking a cut above most of our do-nothings 
  • Leuth
    Leuth Posts: 23,314
    Like, Edun has been screwing up and costing us points and has been completely ineffectual as a forward or creative player (unlike Hector!) and he's STILL been the better of the full-backs. Where's their thread of declamatory criticism? Or are they so obviously mediocre that they need no criticism nor defending? 
  • Braziliance
    Braziliance Posts: 8,355
    edited December 2023
    I don't think I've ever seen Jones make a mistake really or lose a battle. Nothing significant anyway. I've seen Hector make plenty on the other hand. 

    3 clean sheets in 21 league games says it is a defensive error. Jones is the better defender so you find another defender better than Hector to improve the team. Building a winning team really is that simple. There's about 10 centre backs alone in this league to choose from. Just have to spend the money

    You could find a system to suit Hector but he isn't worth accommodating for like that. He should be able to play in a back 4 and lead an inexperienced defense. 
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  • Leuth
    Leuth Posts: 23,314
    Braziliance said:
    I don't think I've ever seen Jones make a mistake really or lose a battle. Nothing signicant anyway. I've seen Hector make plenty on the other hand. 

    3 clean sheets in 21 league games says it is a defensive error. Jones is the better defender so you find another defender better than Hector to improve the team. Building a winning team really is that simple. There's about 10 centre backs alone in this league to choose from. Just have to spend the money

    You could find a system to suit Hector but he isn't worth accommodating for like that. He should be able to play in a back 4 and lead an inexperienced defense. 
    Lincoln's equaliser, Stevenage's goal, Jones could have done much better on both. He got booked yesterday and then had to not make a challenge which led to them going through - Hector tidied it up. He's definitely made fewer errors than Hector but he's also made a lot less play than Hector. Their styles complement each other, though - two of Jones and our distribution would be, well, a bit more hit and hope, plus Jones isn't quite as masterful one-on-one
  • soapy_jones
    soapy_jones Posts: 21,351
    Well I suppose it's either us or Billy Smarts Circus!
  • LargeAddick
    LargeAddick Posts: 32,560
    As I said elsewhere the other day, his form has picked up now it’s time to get a new contract from either us or another club. I didn’t want him to renew last summer and don’t now thank you. 
  • se9addick
    se9addick Posts: 32,034
    I must be the only one not really buying into this Hector renaissance. He’s been a bit better the past month than he was the rest of the season, but that’s a very, very low bar. 

    He still gives the ball away too often and fails to deal/clear balls. Given his pedigree he should be a top defender in this division but he’s nowhere near that standard. 
  • Braziliance
    Braziliance Posts: 8,355
    Leuth said:
    Braziliance said:
    I don't think I've ever seen Jones make a mistake really or lose a battle. Nothing signicant anyway. I've seen Hector make plenty on the other hand. 

    3 clean sheets in 21 league games says it is a defensive error. Jones is the better defender so you find another defender better than Hector to improve the team. Building a winning team really is that simple. There's about 10 centre backs alone in this league to choose from. Just have to spend the money

    You could find a system to suit Hector but he isn't worth accommodating for like that. He should be able to play in a back 4 and lead an inexperienced defense. 
    Lincoln's equaliser, Stevenage's goal, Jones could have done much better on both. He got booked yesterday and then had to not make a challenge which led to them going through - Hector tidied it up. He's definitely made fewer errors than Hector but he's also made a lot less play than Hector. Their styles complement each other, though - two of Jones and our distribution would be, well, a bit more hit and hope, plus Jones isn't quite as masterful one-on-one
    I just think you really like him tbf, I reckon most people would have Jones over Hector. Which is fine at this point, I've got bias towards certain players.

    Either way, he's not my biggest issue atm, doesn't help there's so much other guff in the team and a dry lunch of a manager 
  • LargeAddick
    LargeAddick Posts: 32,560
    Leuth said:
    It's not just that he's playing well though. It's that he's looking a cut above most of our do-nothings 
    He’s not playing that well and being a cut above everyone else, even if that were true, isn’t much of a barometer is it. 
  • Leuth
    Leuth Posts: 23,314
    edited December 2023
    Braziliance said:
    Leuth said:
    Braziliance said:
    I don't think I've ever seen Jones make a mistake really or lose a battle. Nothing signicant anyway. I've seen Hector make plenty on the other hand. 

    3 clean sheets in 21 league games says it is a defensive error. Jones is the better defender so you find another defender better than Hector to improve the team. Building a winning team really is that simple. There's about 10 centre backs alone in this league to choose from. Just have to spend the money

    You could find a system to suit Hector but he isn't worth accommodating for like that. He should be able to play in a back 4 and lead an inexperienced defense. 
    Lincoln's equaliser, Stevenage's goal, Jones could have done much better on both. He got booked yesterday and then had to not make a challenge which led to them going through - Hector tidied it up. He's definitely made fewer errors than Hector but he's also made a lot less play than Hector. Their styles complement each other, though - two of Jones and our distribution would be, well, a bit more hit and hope, plus Jones isn't quite as masterful one-on-one
    I just think you really like him tbf, I reckon most people would have Jones over Hector. Which is fine at this point, I've got bias towards certain players.

    Either way, he's not my biggest issue atm, doesn't help there's so much other guff in the team and a dry lunch of a manager 
    If I had a squad of Jones, Hector and peak Alessandro Nesta, I'd [s]play a back three[/s] pick Jones and Nesta, sure. But if nothing else changed about this squad, I'd put Hector alongside Dobson in midfield 
  • Braziliance
    Braziliance Posts: 8,355
    edited December 2023
    se9addick said:
    I must be the only one not really buying into this Hector renaissance. He’s been a bit better the past month than he was the rest of the season, but that’s a very, very low bar. 

    He still gives the ball away too often and fails to deal/clear balls. Given his pedigree he should be a top defender in this division but he’s nowhere near that standard. 
    I honestly think there's at least 10 centre backs that would be better suited to us than him.

    I will never dispute his passing range and his ability to make things look cool. 

    But the reality is, we are a soft touch team with no character and Hector is not the type of character/defender who is going to turn that around. He's at the end of his career and looking for an easy pay day imo, it suits him being in London and he's already got his footballing memories. 

    Without sounding a bit Disney, we need someone looking to start their own footballing history, no more of these over the hill types who are looking for an easy pay day, I.e. Hector, Gunter, Watson, Matthews etc.

    If we are going to sign older players, I want them in the mould of Ricky Holmes and May. Looking to prove a point still and hungry. 
  • NabySarr
    NabySarr Posts: 4,284
    I’ve weighed in on this many times before, it would be great if we sign a defender that is better defensively than Hector, but we can’t ignore the stuff he does with the ball. Ideally we sign a brilliant ball-playing centre back that is better than Hector but I don’t think it’s that easy to find them. I think upgrading other areas is a lot easier to do and will improve us defensively just as much (if not more)

    Top teams in this league have centre backs that are good on the ball, I’m sure that’s important to Appleton and how he wants to play also. If we replace Hector, the replacement needs to be good on the ball. Otherwise we will see a lot of sideways between centre backs before long balls that lose possession 
  • Leuth
    Leuth Posts: 23,314
    "Hector, Gunter, Watson, Matthews"

    Putting Hector in this company is genuinely actionable, and I'll waive all the legal fees 

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