I think that Jones has a problem when going into clubs where the players think that they are bigger than the team. This was definitely the case at Stoke where the Coates family funded a lot of individual talent who thought that they were better than a coach who came from Luton. The same may have been the case at Southampton as well. At Luton he brought players through who wanted to improve and gelled them into a team. What do we think of our group of players. Some believe they are better than the team, but are there enough who recognise where we are as a team and want to join in with the effort and coaching that Jones will expect and give. If so he is the right man for the job, if not, nobody is the right man for the job.
I think that Jones hss a problem when going into clubs where the players think that they are bigger than the team. This was definitely the case at Stoke where the Coates family funded a lot of individual talent who thought that they were better ghan a coach who came from Luton. The same may have been the case at Southampton as well. At Luton he brought players through who wanted to improve and gelled them into a team. What do we think of our group of players. Some believe they are better than the team, but are there enough who recognise where we are as a team and want to join in with the effort and coaching that Jones will expect and give. If so he is the right man for the job, if not, nobody is the right man for the job.
I think he actually came out and said as much about the Southampton scenario.
My concern at the moment is how some are seeing Jones as a saviour or the new messiah or the right fit! What does ‘the right fit’ mean, he once had a post at the club?
As many have said, it’s not just about a good manager it’s everything around the manager needs to be in unison and unfortunately behind the scenes at the moment, still appears to be floundering, making the managers job far harder than it should be.
I think that Jones hss a problem when going into clubs where the players think that they are bigger than the team. This was definitely the case at Stoke where the Coates family funded a lot of individual talent who thought that they were better ghan a coach who came from Luton. The same may have been the case at Southampton as well. At Luton he brought players through who wanted to improve and gelled them into a team. What do we think of our group of players. Some believe they are better than the team, but are there enough who recognise where we are as a team and want to join in with the effort and coaching that Jones will expect and give. If so he is the right man for the job, if not, nobody is the right man for the job.
I think he actually came out and said as much about the Southampton scenario.
This is one of the reasons why Powell and Bowyer appealed to their squads of players because they’d played at the top level and were former England Internationals whom they not only respected but could learn from.
First half against Blackpool was as bad as anything recently and we escaped with a point out of sheer luck. Fleming isn't the answer.
Genuinely staggering what an interview or two can do.
Truly baffled. He's completely under qualified but just a nice bloke, like Holden.
That first half was just as bad as anything else I've seen this season, we were lucky not to be 2 or 3 down and then we wouldn't have had a chance second-half.
If the Jones links are true, I will be absolutely buzzing. First proper manager since God knows when. Regardless of how bad he did at Southampton, he was a premier league manager. A premier league team decided he could be the man for the job, and some of us aren't sure? I reckon he will shock a few if this happens, fingers crossed
Wow, I had no idea Darren Moore is so out of favour.
He only got Sheff Wer promoted because they had a ridiculous wage budget and even then he only just managed it. Seems he’s rather limited as managers go
My concern at the moment is how some are seeing Jones as a saviour or the new messiah or the right fit! What does ‘the right fit’ mean, he once had a post at the club?
As many have said, it’s not just about a good manager it’s everything around the manager needs to be in unison and unfortunately behind the scenes at the moment, still appears to be floundering, making the managers job far harder than it should be.
Personally speaking I don't think he's a messiah necessarily but I do like the idea of him being able to impose a proper system and attitude throughout an entire club that reinvented it - to the extent that his own departure wasn't catastrophic and they went on to promotion.
This is precisely what needs to happen at Charlton - we've got a squad that just feels a bit listless and hodgepodge and (Dobson and May aside) currently doesn't seem to have much in the way of leadership or genuine belief.
The problem of course is that Jones succeeded once but has failed elsewhere - and our weird ownership structure will probably make things more difficult.
We need someone to do for us what Jones did for Luton. But I don't know if he is that person, or a busted flush.
Why are people digging Fleming out, it’s unnecessary, he’s just holding the reins until a new head coach / manager gets appointed. I thought he got the lads motivated to put their bodies on line against a team with the best home record in the league. Fair play to him and Pearcey for that.
Admittedly we were under the cosh first half and had the rub of the green but I couldn’t see any other result than defeat had Appleton still been in charge.
The line up was always going be based on defence with the object of getting something from the game and that was mission accomplished by the caretakers and that’s all they are. In fact it was almost the perfect smash and grab in the final quarter.
If honest I would be more comfortable with a manager whom has succeeded at more than one club (ie Rowett); but if it is to be Jones I hope we get the inspirational Luton version.
As someone else said he seems like a manager with two outcomes, real success or real failure and nothing in-between.
Rowett would be a great choice as he's done great everywhere he's been (except Stoke where everyone fails) and has that Charlton connection, but I suspect he'd be looking for a bigger job.
Delighted the club are pursuing Jones but suspect it would be sorted by now if it was going to happen.
My concern at the moment is how some are seeing Jones as a saviour or the new messiah or the right fit! What does ‘the right fit’ mean, he once had a post at the club?
As many have said, it’s not just about a good manager it’s everything around the manager needs to be in unison and unfortunately behind the scenes at the moment, still appears to be floundering, making the managers job far harder than it should be.
Personally speaking I don't think he's a messiah necessarily but I do like the idea of him being able to impose a proper system and attitude throughout an entire club that reinvented it - to the extent that his own departure wasn't catastrophic and they went on to promotion.
This is precisely what needs to happen at Charlton - we've got a squad that just feels a bit listless and hodgepodge and (Dobson and May aside) currently doesn't seem to have much in the way of leadership or genuine belief.
The problem of course is that Jones succeeded once but has failed elsewhere - and our weird ownership structure will probably make things more difficult.
We need someone to do for us what Jones did for Luton. But I don't know if he is that person, or a busted flush.
Or if those egos behind the scenes will allow them/him do that?
Wow, I had no idea Darren Moore is so out of favour.
He only got Sheff Wer promoted because they had a ridiculous wage budget and even then he only just managed it. Seems he’s rather limited as managers go
Only just managed it is a harsh statement when they got nearly 100 points
the 2nd leg against Peterborough was football dominance from start to finish
There’s a reason Fleming has got to the age of 55 and has never managed anyone
Nothing against him personally, but it’s clear he’s a coach. I have no issue with him sticking around in that capacity either if the new manager feels that’s what’s right, but to think that having never managed in his career and that he’s going to come in and be up to turning us around is wishful thinking
Havent thrown my thoughts in much around a new man, would be quietly impressed and excited to see Jones brought in. Pretty surprised at some of the reactions to Jones, especially when looking at the barrel we've been scrapping in the last few years.
Appleton - Journeyman lower league name Holden - A nobody in terms of management really Garner - Did alright in the league below where he had some very good players for the level, achieved nothing of note Jackson - Cheap, fan placating, first jobber option Adkins - Achieved something of note a ways ago, hard done by really Bowyer - Appointed as a cheap option, turned out alright
All of the names mentioned to be in the running are light years away from that list above and thats something. If it is Jones, it would be the first time in years we've brought in a manager with an idea and a bit of success backing it up .
Yeah so he failed at Saints and Stoke, Powell failed at management everywhere else after us being sacked by Huddersfield and Southend that doesent sound like the profile of the "right man" but 99% of the fan base would love it if he was brought back in. Theres no guarantees of any of Neil, Jones, Warnock, Powell, Warburton or any of them working out anyway.
Why are people digging Fleming out, it’s unnecessary, he’s just holding the reins until a new head coach / manager gets appointed. I thought he got the lads motivated to put their bodies on line against a team with the best home record in the league. Fair play to him and Pearcey for that.
Admittedly we were under the cosh first half and had the rub of the green but I couldn’t see any other result than defeat had Appleton still been in charge.
The line up was always going be based on defence with the object of getting something from the game and that was mission accomplished by the caretakers and that’s all they are. In fact it was almost the perfect smash and grab in the final quarter.
Whilst I don’t think anyone is digging Fleming out as such, I do very much agree with your final paragraph.
Fleming came in and did exactly what a caretaker needs to do in the position we are in, and try and get us through to the next manager without getting battered. We did that, though on another day I do think it could have gone the other way.
It’s almost like cup tie/knock out mentality, just getting the players up for that one/two games you are in charge. It’s very different to managing a team over a 46 game league campaign.
Why are people digging Fleming out, it’s unnecessary, he’s just holding the reins until a new head coach / manager gets appointed. I thought he got the lads motivated to put their bodies on line against a team with the best home record in the league. Fair play to him and Pearcey for that.
Admittedly we were under the cosh first half and had the rub of the green but I couldn’t see any other result than defeat had Appleton still been in charge.
The line up was always going be based on defence with the object of getting something from the game and that was mission accomplished by the caretakers and that’s all they are. In fact it was almost the perfect smash and grab in the final quarter.
This...
He is not the right man for the role currently, but as shocking as we looked first half the difference and why we were not a few down at half time (apart from the Rhodes missed chance) was bodies back in the box. The previous weeks bodies in the box were missing, attacking players left with loads of space. Granted it was not pretty but the job was done, someone on here said "Keystone cops on ice" totally agree but they were there. As i say, he is not the answer but i thought at least he tried to defend...
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https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11095/12880318/nathan-jones-admits-southampton-spell-was-a-huge-learning-curve-after-three-month-reign
Same could be levelled at Potter when at Chelsea.
As many have said, it’s not just about a good manager it’s everything around the manager needs to be in unison and unfortunately behind the scenes at the moment, still appears to be floundering, making the managers job far harder than it should be.
That first half was just as bad as anything else I've seen this season, we were lucky not to be 2 or 3 down and then we wouldn't have had a chance second-half.
If the Jones links are true, I will be absolutely buzzing. First proper manager since God knows when. Regardless of how bad he did at Southampton, he was a premier league manager. A premier league team decided he could be the man for the job, and some of us aren't sure? I reckon he will shock a few if this happens, fingers crossed
This is precisely what needs to happen at Charlton - we've got a squad that just feels a bit listless and hodgepodge and (Dobson and May aside) currently doesn't seem to have much in the way of leadership or genuine belief.
The problem of course is that Jones succeeded once but has failed elsewhere - and our weird ownership structure will probably make things more difficult.
We need someone to do for us what Jones did for Luton. But I don't know if he is that person, or a busted flush.
Why are people digging Fleming out, it’s unnecessary, he’s just holding the reins until a new head coach / manager gets appointed. I thought he got the lads motivated to put their bodies on line against a team with the best home record in the league. Fair play to him and Pearcey for that.
Admittedly we were under the cosh first half and had the rub of the green but I couldn’t see any other result than defeat had Appleton still been in charge.
The line up was always going be based on defence with the object of getting something from the game and that was mission accomplished by the caretakers and that’s all they are. In fact it was almost the perfect smash and grab in the final quarter.
Lets leave rival clubs managers alone shall we.
As someone else said he seems like a manager with two outcomes, real success or real failure and nothing in-between.
Delighted the club are pursuing Jones but suspect it would be sorted by now if it was going to happen.
the 2nd leg against Peterborough was football dominance from start to finish
Nothing against him personally, but it’s clear he’s a coach. I have no issue with him sticking around in that capacity either if the new manager feels that’s what’s right, but to think that having never managed in his career and that he’s going to come in and be up to turning us around is wishful thinking
Appleton - Journeyman lower league name
Holden - A nobody in terms of management really
Garner - Did alright in the league below where he had some very good players for the level, achieved nothing of note
Jackson - Cheap, fan placating, first jobber option
Adkins - Achieved something of note a ways ago, hard done by really
Bowyer - Appointed as a cheap option, turned out alright
All of the names mentioned to be in the running are light years away from that list above and thats something. If it is Jones, it would be the first time in years we've brought in a manager with an idea and a bit of success backing it up .
Yeah so he failed at Saints and Stoke, Powell failed at management everywhere else after us being sacked by Huddersfield and Southend that doesent sound like the profile of the "right man" but 99% of the fan base would love it if he was brought back in. Theres no guarantees of any of Neil, Jones, Warnock, Powell, Warburton or any of them working out anyway.
Fleming came in and did exactly what a caretaker needs to do in the position we are in, and try and get us through to the next manager without getting battered. We did that, though on another day I do think it could have gone the other way.
It’s almost like cup tie/knock out mentality, just getting the players up for that one/two games you are in charge. It’s very different to managing a team over a 46 game league campaign.
He is not the right man for the role currently, but as shocking as we looked first half the difference and why we were not a few down at half time (apart from the Rhodes missed chance) was bodies back in the box. The previous weeks bodies in the box were missing, attacking players left with loads of space. Granted it was not pretty but the job was done, someone on here said "Keystone cops on ice" totally agree but they were there. As i say, he is not the answer but i thought at least he tried to defend...