And on the pensions and investment issues in the UK, this piece of work by TheCityUK is an interesting read and response to the new Government’s Pension Investment review.
I think it would be unwise to completely ignore Asia, a region which is not suffering from declining birth rates. US market is far too concentrated as well. Diversification is important - recency bias has led investors to believe that you must invest in the US to get returns. History tells us this is not true.
A long lost uncle leaves you some money, putting aside all the usual sensible stuff. Pay off mortgage, get a new V8 throttle monster, go on a nice holiday and consider sacking off work. Then reality bites and that 1k is going to be better off invested in the stock market.
Taking whatever factors you want to take in we are looking to make money short or long term. Pick 5 places to put your money. Take into account high price but guaranteed dividends, false low prices looking for a spike, arsehole companies that are probably on my c*nt list that continue to increase in value.
My 5
1) Amazon. High price, a seemingly endless space for growth 2) Tesla. They will take over the world one day, market leader in a growth market. Pushing every other EV manufacturer along and will be the ones who find a gamechanger of a range and charging solution 3) BAE, not on the list for a nice reason. Loads of conflict worldwide and these guys lead the market in researching, developing and manufacturing different ways for paying customers to vaporise enemy combatants and selling them these bits of kit. 4) BT Group, on here purely for guaranteed dividends. I reckon near enough every pension fund has exposure to this mob of charlatans currently recovering and rallying a mini revival of the share price by laying of staff in Openreach and looking to pursue a contractor workforce. Which is shit for the employees but the city seems to like inhuman practices like that. 5) something I've noticed since tinkering and looking at stocks and shares etc is the biggest conglomerates are quite good at being massive shareholder driven options so it's a coin toss between BAT and BP. Decide which kills more people later and choosing based purely on potential growth and dividend compounding. I'm saying BP, we all need fuel in our cars whether we smoke or not
Amazon - probably worth it just for AWS and their cloud computing alone
I just don't understand Tesla. Why would I buy shares in a company which has 1 product, incredible competition and whose shares are unbelievably expensive? What is Tesla's moat? Forget Musk and the cult of personality, but viewing it as a company - it produces fairly unimpressive, expensive cars which BYD, for example, can produce for a fraction of the cost with better range. Toyota posts 3X profit compared to Tesla and yet has a PE of around 10 against Tesla's 35. Toyota, like most Japanese companies, a whole plethora of other business activities. Plus, they're constantly spending on technological advancements in areas such as synthetic fuels and hydrogen. They also sell petrol, hybrid and EVs - it is not a given that EVs will dominate in 30 years time - companies like Toyota will be able to pivot. Just look at how the European car manufacturers have suffered from going all in on EVs. Buying shares in Tesla, in my opinion, is big risk. I can see the counter argument, however, and would like to hear some opinions!
BAE - good stock, great buy in 2021
BT - huge pension fund liability.
BP - Would be silly to bet against oil with whats going on in Middle East. Also if people ignore these companies because of sustainability - I guarantee in 100 years time Shell and BP will still exist, even if they've moved away from oil. They're in the best position to gain from the energy transition.
I'm trying to start something here man, whats your top 5
Replying to Covered ends multiple posts Thanks bit can't be real as the person has 100 percent battery They never do when posting transfer rumours after all....
Advice please on the following real scenario regarding my father in law’s will:
facts:
1. MIL and FIL own a house valued at £650k and have £100k each in cash. They each own 50% of the property as Tenants in Common. No debts. 2. MIL was admitted to a care home with Alzheimer’s last month. Diagnosed 6 years ago and slowly deteriorating but no way of predicting how many years she will live. Care Home costs £80,000 per annum which is using up her cash as she doesn’t qualify for any financial support. The expectation is that the care home/council will put a charge on her share of the house to cover care home costs if she lives on past the point her cash runs out. 3. They currently have a mirror Will leaving everything to each other. 4. My FIL has anxiety disorder with a family history of heart disease albeit he and she are in their late 80s.
Our worry is that in the event that my FIL dies before my MIL, his assets all go to her which means the care home could call on all of that to pay for her care home costs which could wipe out the entire value if she lives for several years.
We are proposing to arrange for my FIL to update his will leaving his wealth to his son and daughter which limits the amount that can be called upon by the care home/council.
Are we doing the right thing? Are we overlooking anything crucial?
Advice please on the following real scenario regarding my father in law’s will:
facts:
1. MIL and FIL own a house valued at £650k and have £100k each in cash. They each own 50% of the property as Tenants in Common. No debts. 2. MIL was admitted to a care home with Alzheimer’s last month. Diagnosed 6 years ago and slowly deteriorating but no way of predicting how many years she will live. Care Home costs £80,000 per annum which is using up her cash as she doesn’t qualify for any financial support. The expectation is that the care home/council will put a charge on her share of the house to cover care home costs if she lives on past the point her cash runs out. 3. They currently have a mirror Will leaving everything to each other. 4. My FIL has anxiety disorder with a history of heart disease albeit he and she are in their late 80s.
Our worry is that in the event that my FIL dies before my MIL, his assets all go to her which means the care home could call on all of that to pay for her care home costs which could wipe out the entire value if she lives for several years.
We are proposing to arrange for my FIL to update his will leaving his wealth to his son and daughter which limits the amount that can be called upon by the care home/council.
Are we doing the right thing? Are we overlooking anything crucial?
Thanks in advance for your advice/opinions.
You should speak to your lawyer about putting the property in a discretionary living trust for their son & daughter. We’ve done this with our family home and our lawyer advised that this would protect against issues such as this. My concern would be that your MIL has already been admitted to care, so not sure if it would be too late. Hope your lawyer can sort something out for you and the family are OK.
Advice please on the following real scenario regarding my father in law’s will:
facts:
1. MIL and FIL own a house valued at £650k and have £100k each in cash. They each own 50% of the property as Tenants in Common. No debts. 2. MIL was admitted to a care home with Alzheimer’s last month. Diagnosed 6 years ago and slowly deteriorating but no way of predicting how many years she will live. Care Home costs £80,000 per annum which is using up her cash as she doesn’t qualify for any financial support. The expectation is that the care home/council will put a charge on her share of the house to cover care home costs if she lives on past the point her cash runs out. 3. They currently have a mirror Will leaving everything to each other. 4. My FIL has anxiety disorder with a history of heart disease albeit he and she are in their late 80s.
Our worry is that in the event that my FIL dies before my MIL, his assets all go to her which means the care home could call on all of that to pay for her care home costs which could wipe out the entire value if she lives for several years.
We are proposing to arrange for my FIL to update his will leaving his wealth to his son and daughter which limits the amount that can be called upon by the care home/council.
Are we doing the right thing? Are we overlooking anything crucial?
Thanks in advance for your advice/opinions.
You should speak to your lawyer about putting the property in a discretionary living trust for their son & daughter. We’ve done this with our family home and our lawyer advised that this would protect against issues such as this. My concern would be that your MIL has already been admitted to care, so not sure if it would be too late. Hope your lawyer can sort something out for you and the family are OK.
Thanks Tel. From everything I’ve read on property trusts, it seems too late for us as doing it now would very likely be challenged by the council as us attempting to avoid paying care home fees because she was diagnosed 6 years ago and is already in the care home with insufficient cash available to pay for care in less than 2 years. At least having the house ownership as TIC limits the call on the house to 50% of the value.
A long lost uncle leaves you some money, putting aside all the usual sensible stuff. Pay off mortgage, get a new V8 throttle monster, go on a nice holiday and consider sacking off work. Then reality bites and that 1k is going to be better off invested in the stock market.
Taking whatever factors you want to take in we are looking to make money short or long term. Pick 5 places to put your money. Take into account high price but guaranteed dividends, false low prices looking for a spike, arsehole companies that are probably on my c*nt list that continue to increase in value.
My 5
1) Amazon. High price, a seemingly endless space for growth 2) Tesla. They will take over the world one day, market leader in a growth market. Pushing every other EV manufacturer along and will be the ones who find a gamechanger of a range and charging solution 3) BAE, not on the list for a nice reason. Loads of conflict worldwide and these guys lead the market in researching, developing and manufacturing different ways for paying customers to vaporise enemy combatants and selling them these bits of kit. 4) BT Group, on here purely for guaranteed dividends. I reckon near enough every pension fund has exposure to this mob of charlatans currently recovering and rallying a mini revival of the share price by laying of staff in Openreach and looking to pursue a contractor workforce. Which is shit for the employees but the city seems to like inhuman practices like that. 5) something I've noticed since tinkering and looking at stocks and shares etc is the biggest conglomerates are quite good at being massive shareholder driven options so it's a coin toss between BAT and BP. Decide which kills more people later and choosing based purely on potential growth and dividend compounding. I'm saying BP, we all need fuel in our cars whether we smoke or not
Amazon - probably worth it just for AWS and their cloud computing alone
I just don't understand Tesla. Why would I buy shares in a company which has 1 product, incredible competition and whose shares are unbelievably expensive? What is Tesla's moat? Forget Musk and the cult of personality, but viewing it as a company - it produces fairly unimpressive, expensive cars which BYD, for example, can produce for a fraction of the cost with better range. Toyota posts 3X profit compared to Tesla and yet has a PE of around 10 against Tesla's 35. Toyota, like most Japanese companies, a whole plethora of other business activities. Plus, they're constantly spending on technological advancements in areas such as synthetic fuels and hydrogen. They also sell petrol, hybrid and EVs - it is not a given that EVs will dominate in 30 years time - companies like Toyota will be able to pivot. Just look at how the European car manufacturers have suffered from going all in on EVs. Buying shares in Tesla, in my opinion, is big risk. I can see the counter argument, however, and would like to hear some opinions!
BAE - good stock, great buy in 2021
BT - huge pension fund liability.
BP - Would be silly to bet against oil with whats going on in Middle East. Also if people ignore these companies because of sustainability - I guarantee in 100 years time Shell and BP will still exist, even if they've moved away from oil. They're in the best position to gain from the energy transition.
I'm trying to start something here man, whats your top 5
I've also been buying a few dividend stocks in the last couple of years. Overall I'm most happy with Legal&General, a very juicy 7% yield and the share price has been pretty stable. Similar story with Swiss Re, but that's a European stock; but suggests insurance companies are a good solid investment. Having said that I also bought Direct Line, and as I've ranted on about here, almost straight away they announced some kind of problem of a CEO resignation level of seriousness and stopped paying any dividend at all, as well as taking a hit on the share price.🤣
A Lifer recommended me Primary Health Properties, and that pays well too. It did take a hit but has stabilised at just under £1, and analysts keep talking positively about it. Recently I added Land Securities but that's a bit of a punt on my part.
FWIW I agree with @felix_31 about Tesla. Did you see how their latest launch a week ago went? And how he was very vague about when the new cheaper car Musk keeps promising will actually appear. The Chinese have several other companies in the field, producing smaller cheaper cars; people across Europe are saying they are interested in EVs but that price is a huge problem. I also think the Tesla share price is held up by the mass of American "retail investors" who are investing in Musk and his rhetoric, that's never a good thing. You could always buy a good fund that specialises in tech, then for sure you'll have some Tesla, and also Alphabet, Meta, Nvidia, etc, but with the risk spread.
Advice please on the following real scenario regarding my father in law’s will:
facts:
1. MIL and FIL own a house valued at £650k and have £100k each in cash. They each own 50% of the property as Tenants in Common. No debts. 2. MIL was admitted to a care home with Alzheimer’s last month. Diagnosed 6 years ago and slowly deteriorating but no way of predicting how many years she will live. Care Home costs £80,000 per annum which is using up her cash as she doesn’t qualify for any financial support. The expectation is that the care home/council will put a charge on her share of the house to cover care home costs if she lives on past the point her cash runs out. 3. They currently have a mirror Will leaving everything to each other. 4. My FIL has anxiety disorder with a history of heart disease albeit he and she are in their late 80s.
Our worry is that in the event that my FIL dies before my MIL, his assets all go to her which means the care home could call on all of that to pay for her care home costs which could wipe out the entire value if she lives for several years.
We are proposing to arrange for my FIL to update his will leaving his wealth to his son and daughter which limits the amount that can be called upon by the care home/council.
Are we doing the right thing? Are we overlooking anything crucial?
Thanks in advance for your advice/opinions.
You should speak to your lawyer about putting the property in a discretionary living trust for their son & daughter. We’ve done this with our family home and our lawyer advised that this would protect against issues such as this. My concern would be that your MIL has already been admitted to care, so not sure if it would be too late. Hope your lawyer can sort something out for you and the family are OK.
Would be too late for this situation unfortunately, also these trusts have been challenged a number of times and rarely work. If the local authority can get a judge to agree the principal or main reason for the trust being set up was to avoid care fee's then it's not worth the paper it's written on. It's a deliberate deprivation of assets. What reason would you give for having set up the trust?
@telmc32 - yes I would have FIL change his will to leave his 50% (and cash!) to someone other than the MIL.
Advice please on the following real scenario regarding my father in law’s will:
facts:
1. MIL and FIL own a house valued at £650k and have £100k each in cash. They each own 50% of the property as Tenants in Common. No debts. 2. MIL was admitted to a care home with Alzheimer’s last month. Diagnosed 6 years ago and slowly deteriorating but no way of predicting how many years she will live. Care Home costs £80,000 per annum which is using up her cash as she doesn’t qualify for any financial support. The expectation is that the care home/council will put a charge on her share of the house to cover care home costs if she lives on past the point her cash runs out. 3. They currently have a mirror Will leaving everything to each other. 4. My FIL has anxiety disorder with a history of heart disease albeit he and she are in their late 80s.
Our worry is that in the event that my FIL dies before my MIL, his assets all go to her which means the care home could call on all of that to pay for her care home costs which could wipe out the entire value if she lives for several years.
We are proposing to arrange for my FIL to update his will leaving his wealth to his son and daughter which limits the amount that can be called upon by the care home/council.
Are we doing the right thing? Are we overlooking anything crucial?
Thanks in advance for your advice/opinions.
You should speak to your lawyer about putting the property in a discretionary living trust for their son & daughter. We’ve done this with our family home and our lawyer advised that this would protect against issues such as this. My concern would be that your MIL has already been admitted to care, so not sure if it would be too late. Hope your lawyer can sort something out for you and the family are OK.
Thanks Tel. From everything I’ve read on property trusts, it seems too late for us as doing it now would very likely be challenged by the council as us attempting to avoid paying care home fees because she was diagnosed 6 years ago and is already in the care home with insufficient cash available to pay for care in less than 2 years. At least having the house ownership as TIC limits the call on the house to 50% of the value.
My understanding is that the property should be disregarded if your FIL remains living there. Even if they value the property, they have to value it isn’t the valuation of the property that has to be taken, but the beneficial interest. As it’s highly unlikely that you can sell 50% of a house, then this value can actually be nil.
It’s an absolute minefield though that should be taken with a specialist lawyer. We used Caroline Shelton at Irwin Mitchell, I’d known her since they were Thomas Eggar, and she was excellent.
Advice please on the following real scenario regarding my father in law’s will:
facts:
1. MIL and FIL own a house valued at £650k and have £100k each in cash. They each own 50% of the property as Tenants in Common. No debts. 2. MIL was admitted to a care home with Alzheimer’s last month. Diagnosed 6 years ago and slowly deteriorating but no way of predicting how many years she will live. Care Home costs £80,000 per annum which is using up her cash as she doesn’t qualify for any financial support. The expectation is that the care home/council will put a charge on her share of the house to cover care home costs if she lives on past the point her cash runs out. 3. They currently have a mirror Will leaving everything to each other. 4. My FIL has anxiety disorder with a history of heart disease albeit he and she are in their late 80s.
Our worry is that in the event that my FIL dies before my MIL, his assets all go to her which means the care home could call on all of that to pay for her care home costs which could wipe out the entire value if she lives for several years.
We are proposing to arrange for my FIL to update his will leaving his wealth to his son and daughter which limits the amount that can be called upon by the care home/council.
Are we doing the right thing? Are we overlooking anything crucial?
Thanks in advance for your advice/opinions.
You should speak to your lawyer about putting the property in a discretionary living trust for their son & daughter. We’ve done this with our family home and our lawyer advised that this would protect against issues such as this. My concern would be that your MIL has already been admitted to care, so not sure if it would be too late. Hope your lawyer can sort something out for you and the family are OK.
Thanks Tel. From everything I’ve read on property trusts, it seems too late for us as doing it now would very likely be challenged by the council as us attempting to avoid paying care home fees because she was diagnosed 6 years ago and is already in the care home with insufficient cash available to pay for care in less than 2 years. At least having the house ownership as TIC limits the call on the house to 50% of the value.
My understanding is that the property should be disregarded if your FIL remains living there. Even if they value the property, they have to value it isn’t the valuation of the property that has to be taken, but the beneficial interest. As it’s highly unlikely that you can sell 50% of a house, then this value can actually be nil.
It’s an absolute minefield though that should be taken with a specialist lawyer. We used Caroline Shelton at Irwin Mitchell, I’d known her since they were Thomas Eggar, and she was excellent.
To be clear, the council would have to wait for the house to be sold before they can get paid what they were owed relating to their charge over the house so, yes, they get zero until then.
Advice please on the following real scenario regarding my father in law’s will:
facts:
1. MIL and FIL own a house valued at £650k and have £100k each in cash. They each own 50% of the property as Tenants in Common. No debts. 2. MIL was admitted to a care home with Alzheimer’s last month. Diagnosed 6 years ago and slowly deteriorating but no way of predicting how many years she will live. Care Home costs £80,000 per annum which is using up her cash as she doesn’t qualify for any financial support. The expectation is that the care home/council will put a charge on her share of the house to cover care home costs if she lives on past the point her cash runs out. 3. They currently have a mirror Will leaving everything to each other. 4. My FIL has anxiety disorder with a history of heart disease albeit he and she are in their late 80s.
Our worry is that in the event that my FIL dies before my MIL, his assets all go to her which means the care home could call on all of that to pay for her care home costs which could wipe out the entire value if she lives for several years.
We are proposing to arrange for my FIL to update his will leaving his wealth to his son and daughter which limits the amount that can be called upon by the care home/council.
Are we doing the right thing? Are we overlooking anything crucial?
Thanks in advance for your advice/opinions.
You should speak to your lawyer about putting the property in a discretionary living trust for their son & daughter. We’ve done this with our family home and our lawyer advised that this would protect against issues such as this. My concern would be that your MIL has already been admitted to care, so not sure if it would be too late. Hope your lawyer can sort something out for you and the family are OK.
Would be too late for this situation unfortunately, also these trusts have been challenged a number of times and rarely work. If the local authority can get a judge to agree the principal or main reason for the trust being set up was to avoid care fee's then it's not worth the paper it's written on. It's a deliberate deprivation of assets. What reason would you give for having set up the trust?
@telmc32 - yes I would have FIL change his will to leave his 50% (and cash!) to someone other than the MIL.
In my case @Rob7Lee it’s a little complicated, but I am joint owner with my dad on the family home, which is also my primary residence. A discretionary trust was put in place so that I keep the house when he passes and my will (and the trust) then leaves it to my sister when I do. All eventualities covered if I actually go first, with my niece & nephew also benefitting.
Agree it’s too late in @meldrew66 case, but works for me and our circumstances.
Advice please on the following real scenario regarding my father in law’s will:
facts:
1. MIL and FIL own a house valued at £650k and have £100k each in cash. They each own 50% of the property as Tenants in Common. No debts. 2. MIL was admitted to a care home with Alzheimer’s last month. Diagnosed 6 years ago and slowly deteriorating but no way of predicting how many years she will live. Care Home costs £80,000 per annum which is using up her cash as she doesn’t qualify for any financial support. The expectation is that the care home/council will put a charge on her share of the house to cover care home costs if she lives on past the point her cash runs out. 3. They currently have a mirror Will leaving everything to each other. 4. My FIL has anxiety disorder with a history of heart disease albeit he and she are in their late 80s.
Our worry is that in the event that my FIL dies before my MIL, his assets all go to her which means the care home could call on all of that to pay for her care home costs which could wipe out the entire value if she lives for several years.
We are proposing to arrange for my FIL to update his will leaving his wealth to his son and daughter which limits the amount that can be called upon by the care home/council.
Are we doing the right thing? Are we overlooking anything crucial?
Thanks in advance for your advice/opinions.
You should speak to your lawyer about putting the property in a discretionary living trust for their son & daughter. We’ve done this with our family home and our lawyer advised that this would protect against issues such as this. My concern would be that your MIL has already been admitted to care, so not sure if it would be too late. Hope your lawyer can sort something out for you and the family are OK.
Would be too late for this situation unfortunately, also these trusts have been challenged a number of times and rarely work. If the local authority can get a judge to agree the principal or main reason for the trust being set up was to avoid care fee's then it's not worth the paper it's written on. It's a deliberate deprivation of assets. What reason would you give for having set up the trust?
@telmc32 - yes I would have FIL change his will to leave his 50% (and cash!) to someone other than the MIL.
In my case @Rob7Lee it’s a little complicated, but I am joint owner with my dad on the family home, which is also my primary residence. A discretionary trust was put in place so that I keep the house when he passes and my will (and the trust) then leaves it to my sister when I do. All eventualities covered if I actually go first, with my niece & nephew also benefitting.
Agree it’s too late in @meldrew66 case, but works for me and our circumstances.
Yes a slightly different situation to the 'couple' norm - I'd caveat though that I've seen three people now over the past 6-7 years who had trusts set up by legal firms and 2 have lost against the council (Both Dartford) the other is waiting to hear (although that's KCC). Different situation to yours (all husbands and wives) Maybe they are unlucky, but as I understand it, as they could show no other good reason for the trust (when a will/wills could have dealt with it) the view handed down was it was simply a deliberate deprivation of asset (which it was!).
Advice please on the following real scenario regarding my father in law’s will:
facts:
1. MIL and FIL own a house valued at £650k and have £100k each in cash. They each own 50% of the property as Tenants in Common. No debts. 2. MIL was admitted to a care home with Alzheimer’s last month. Diagnosed 6 years ago and slowly deteriorating but no way of predicting how many years she will live. Care Home costs £80,000 per annum which is using up her cash as she doesn’t qualify for any financial support. The expectation is that the care home/council will put a charge on her share of the house to cover care home costs if she lives on past the point her cash runs out. 3. They currently have a mirror Will leaving everything to each other. 4. My FIL has anxiety disorder with a history of heart disease albeit he and she are in their late 80s.
Our worry is that in the event that my FIL dies before my MIL, his assets all go to her which means the care home could call on all of that to pay for her care home costs which could wipe out the entire value if she lives for several years.
We are proposing to arrange for my FIL to update his will leaving his wealth to his son and daughter which limits the amount that can be called upon by the care home/council.
Are we doing the right thing? Are we overlooking anything crucial?
Thanks in advance for your advice/opinions.
You should speak to your lawyer about putting the property in a discretionary living trust for their son & daughter. We’ve done this with our family home and our lawyer advised that this would protect against issues such as this. My concern would be that your MIL has already been admitted to care, so not sure if it would be too late. Hope your lawyer can sort something out for you and the family are OK.
Would be too late for this situation unfortunately, also these trusts have been challenged a number of times and rarely work. If the local authority can get a judge to agree the principal or main reason for the trust being set up was to avoid care fee's then it's not worth the paper it's written on. It's a deliberate deprivation of assets. What reason would you give for having set up the trust?
@telmc32 - yes I would have FIL change his will to leave his 50% (and cash!) to someone other than the MIL.
In my case @Rob7Lee it’s a little complicated, but I am joint owner with my dad on the family home, which is also my primary residence. A discretionary trust was put in place so that I keep the house when he passes and my will (and the trust) then leaves it to my sister when I do. All eventualities covered if I actually go first, with my niece & nephew also benefitting.
Agree it’s too late in @meldrew66 case, but works for me and our circumstances.
I thought that you couldn't put a property into a Trust & remain living in it. Is it not A gift with Reservation ?
Advice please on the following real scenario regarding my father in law’s will:
facts:
1. MIL and FIL own a house valued at £650k and have £100k each in cash. They each own 50% of the property as Tenants in Common. No debts. 2. MIL was admitted to a care home with Alzheimer’s last month. Diagnosed 6 years ago and slowly deteriorating but no way of predicting how many years she will live. Care Home costs £80,000 per annum which is using up her cash as she doesn’t qualify for any financial support. The expectation is that the care home/council will put a charge on her share of the house to cover care home costs if she lives on past the point her cash runs out. 3. They currently have a mirror Will leaving everything to each other. 4. My FIL has anxiety disorder with a history of heart disease albeit he and she are in their late 80s.
Our worry is that in the event that my FIL dies before my MIL, his assets all go to her which means the care home could call on all of that to pay for her care home costs which could wipe out the entire value if she lives for several years.
We are proposing to arrange for my FIL to update his will leaving his wealth to his son and daughter which limits the amount that can be called upon by the care home/council.
Are we doing the right thing? Are we overlooking anything crucial?
Thanks in advance for your advice/opinions.
You should speak to your lawyer about putting the property in a discretionary living trust for their son & daughter. We’ve done this with our family home and our lawyer advised that this would protect against issues such as this. My concern would be that your MIL has already been admitted to care, so not sure if it would be too late. Hope your lawyer can sort something out for you and the family are OK.
Would be too late for this situation unfortunately, also these trusts have been challenged a number of times and rarely work. If the local authority can get a judge to agree the principal or main reason for the trust being set up was to avoid care fee's then it's not worth the paper it's written on. It's a deliberate deprivation of assets. What reason would you give for having set up the trust?
@telmc32 - yes I would have FIL change his will to leave his 50% (and cash!) to someone other than the MIL.
In my case @Rob7Lee it’s a little complicated, but I am joint owner with my dad on the family home, which is also my primary residence. A discretionary trust was put in place so that I keep the house when he passes and my will (and the trust) then leaves it to my sister when I do. All eventualities covered if I actually go first, with my niece & nephew also benefitting.
Agree it’s too late in @meldrew66 case, but works for me and our circumstances.
I thought that you couldn't put a property into a Trust & remain living in it. Is it not A gift with Reservation ?
IHT in upcoming budget. We talked earlier about likely changes in upcoming budget but mainly about pensions and ISA's. The latest gossip seems to be about NI and IHT. On IHT the main gossip seems to be the broad heading "reliefs". Anybody got any any ideas what the specific thinking may be here. I'm particularly wondering about the use of gifts, the 7 year rule and the tapering relief. If I'm thinking of making a gift would someone be wise to make before October 30?
IHT in upcoming budget. We talked earlier about likely changes in upcoming budget but mainly about pensions and ISA's. The latest gossip seems to be about NI and IHT. On IHT the main gossip seems to be the broad heading "reliefs". Anybody got any any ideas what the specific thinking may be here. I'm particularly wondering about the use of gifts, the 7 year rule and the tapering relief. If I'm thinking of making a gift would someone be wise to make before October 30?
As with other potential changes, it would be very unlikely that any IHT changes would apply immediately - not before 6 April 2025.
My guess is that they could remove the £175k 'Main Residence' allowance (when passing to children), and perhaps abolish the passing of unused allowance to a spouse where currently one partner dies and passes their unused allowance (£325k plus £175k) to the surviving partner - thereby allowing the surviving partner to have an allowance of up to £1 million. Also perhaps have different IHT tax rates based on size of estate.
Let's not forget that Starmer has a tax free pension arrangement and probably a considerable net worth while the rest of us are trying to look after our hard earned. IHT really boils my piss.
"Prime Minister Keir Starmer on Thursday faced a Cabinet backlash over planned spending cuts, with several ministers writing to the Prime Minister directly to express concern about proposals to reduce their departmental spending by as much as 20%." (Alliance News)
Let's not forget that Starmer has a tax free pension arrangement and probably a considerable net worth while the rest of us are trying to look after our hard earned. IHT really boils my piss.
Nothing wrong with IHT imo. Lots of ways you can give or invest your wealth before you die. Ime people dont want to let go of it, even if it's in Trust to named beneficiaries.
However, most wealth is tied up in property. (Old) people need to realise this & downsize before they die. Release equity & then give this away to their heirs.
What would be fair in the Budget would be an increasing level of tax based on property values. First £500k no tax. Next £500k 20%, anything over £1m then 40%.
Just in case anyone is not aware and would benefit from this, there is currently an additional relief from inheritance tax if you are able to gift monies on a regular basis out of after tax surplus income, i.e. more than the £3,000 annual exemption.
I am currently putting money each year into Junior ISAs for three grandchildren and until I became aware of this a couple of years thought there was a potential IHT exposure on any excess over and above the £3k per annum I was contributing to these ISAs. However, if you can compile records for each tax year demonstrating you can afford to gift these monies out of surplus after tax income (including that from investment income), then those monies are not subject to IHT. The attached link outlines the record-keeping required. I just wait until I have submitted my tax return each year and then update a spreadsheet showing my income, expenditures (best estimate) and annual gifts for the tax year and keep this in a file along with my will in order my executors can use it when the time comes.
Obviously, I hope this relief isn't changed in the forthcoming budget!
Let's not forget that Starmer has a tax free pension arrangement and probably a considerable net worth while the rest of us are trying to look after our hard earned. IHT really boils my piss.
Nothing wrong with IHT imo. Lots of ways you can give or invest your wealth before you die. Ime people dont want to let go of it, even if it's in Trust to named beneficiaries.
However, most wealth is tied up in property. (Old) people need to realise this & downsize before they die. Release equity & then give this away to their heirs.
What would be fair in the Budget would be an increasing level of tax based on property values. First £500k no tax. Next £500k 20%, anything over £1m then 40%.
Sorry, I don't agree. Paid tax on income to buy a house and gain some assets. Concept of tax on capital gains is fair as the gain is free money, but to pay 40% in IHT so that your child for example can continue to live in their family home is wrong. It's 40% of the estate above and beyond what ever limits are in place at the time. It should be about gain and the only time that gain is realised is when you sell. You bought it, paid for it so why should the state get anything from it when you die? Daylight robbery imo.
I worked for Lloyds Banking Group, a company which employees across the UK. Following the demise of the old “London Allowance” , employees across the country doing the same job at the same grade, can pretty much expect the same salary. I have no direct problem with that.
However, my 4 bed Bexley Semi is £650,000. Whilst a similar property in Halifax is £325,000. So on a comparison my work colleague in Yorkshire has had less of his income spent on his house purchase, a therefore more disposable income for a good life. An his £325,000 home is under the IHT limit.
i have had to spend far more income on property purchase to live in a comparable home. Have had less disposable income for a good life. And then when I die my kids can currently have £500,000 tax free, and the state wants 40% of the other £150,000.
I just don’t see this is fair…… I am penalised by my geographical location in the UK.
I worked for Lloyds Banking Group, a company which employees across the UK. Following the demise of the old “London Allowance” , employees across the country doing the same job at the same grade, can pretty much expect the same salary. I have no direct problem with that.
However, my 4 bed Bexley Semi is £650,000. Whilst a similar property in Halifax is £325,000. So on a comparison my work colleague in Yorkshire has had less of his income spent on his house purchase, a therefore more disposable income for a good life. An his £325,000 home is under the IHT limit.
i have had to spend far more income on property purchase to live in a comparable home. Have had less disposable income for a good life. And then when I die my kids can currently have £500,000 tax free, and the state wants 40% of the other £150,000.
I just don’t see this is fair…… I am penalised by my geographical location in the UK.
Fully understand where you are coming from. Wages in the Fire Brigade are exactly the same no matter what part of the country live and work in ( London waiting aside ). House prices in the London area compared to somewhere like Middlesbrough meant that on a firefighter wage some could afford to buy a house easily while others could not.
Let's not forget that Starmer has a tax free pension arrangement and probably a considerable net worth while the rest of us are trying to look after our hard earned. IHT really boils my piss.
Nothing wrong with IHT imo. Lots of ways you can give or invest your wealth before you die. Ime people dont want to let go of it, even if it's in Trust to named beneficiaries.
However, most wealth is tied up in property. (Old) people need to realise this & downsize before they die. Release equity & then give this away to their heirs.
What would be fair in the Budget would be an increasing level of tax based on property values. First £500k no tax. Next £500k 20%, anything over £1m then 40%.
This would be great if we knew when we going to die and what care we would need later in life. My wife is 68 and therefore her life expectancy is still another 20 years but who knows! Also there are potential care costs to consider. A friend of mine who has suddenly developed dementia at something like 68 has moved into a very nice care home which is costing him something approaching £10k a month. Yes you can cheaper but this is top class. If he'd given his money away goodness where he would be.
I worked for Lloyds Banking Group, a company which employees across the UK. Following the demise of the old “London Allowance” , employees across the country doing the same job at the same grade, can pretty much expect the same salary. I have no direct problem with that.
However, my 4 bed Bexley Semi is £650,000. Whilst a similar property in Halifax is £325,000. So on a comparison my work colleague in Yorkshire has had less of his income spent on his house purchase, a therefore more disposable income for a good life. An his £325,000 home is under the IHT limit.
i have had to spend far more income on property purchase to live in a comparable home. Have had less disposable income for a good life. And then when I die my kids can currently have £500,000 tax free, and the state wants 40% of the other £150,000.
I just don’t see this is fair…… I am penalised by my geographical location in the UK.
I worked for Lloyds too. Benefit is that house prices in the South East usually increase far more than Halifax. I also would not want to live in Halifax!!
Let's not forget that Starmer has a tax free pension arrangement and probably a considerable net worth while the rest of us are trying to look after our hard earned. IHT really boils my piss.
Nothing wrong with IHT imo. Lots of ways you can give or invest your wealth before you die. Ime people dont want to let go of it, even if it's in Trust to named beneficiaries.
However, most wealth is tied up in property. (Old) people need to realise this & downsize before they die. Release equity & then give this away to their heirs.
What would be fair in the Budget would be an increasing level of tax based on property values. First £500k no tax. Next £500k 20%, anything over £1m then 40%.
This would be great if we knew when we going to die and what care we would need later in life. My wife is 68 and therefore her life expectancy is still another 20 years but who knows! Also there are potential care costs to consider. A friend of mine who has suddenly developed dementia at something like 68 has moved into a very nice care home which is costing him something approaching £10k a month. Yes you can cheaper but this is top class. If he'd given his money away goodness where he would be.
He could put money into either a Discounted Gift Trust or a Loan Trust. Both allow access to some of the money during his Lifetime.
Or he could invest into an Investment Bond. Because these contain an element of life assurance they are not assessed as capital for care costs.
As usual.......speak to your friendly financial adviser for your investment needs 😉😄.
In cases where a lot of the money subject to IHT is tied up in property - how do the inheriting children pay off that bill without selling the house immediately? Particularly in cases if they are inheriting a large property - what if they don't have hundreds of thousands of pounds sitting around to pay off 40% over the 500k limit? Is there some sort of time allowance to let them do it?
In cases where a lot of the money subject to IHT is tied up in property - how do the inheriting children pay off that bill without selling the house immediately? Particularly in cases if they are inheriting a large property - what if they don't have hundreds of thousands of pounds sitting around to pay off 40% over the 500k limit? Is there some sort of time allowance to let them do it?
Yep, you struggle to get the grant of probate unless you settle the tax bill, chicken and egg when it's all tied up in assets to dispose of and you can't do a thing without it without going through hoops. Fantastic when you have just lost your nearest and dearest !! as I said, if any tax is to be levied it should be on the growth of the assets NOT the value of the estate. If you paid 2 mil for the assets and they end up being worth 3 mil then it's the 1 mil uplift that should be taxed as the 2 mil has already been income taxed.
Comments
https://www.thecityuk.com/our-work/thecityuk-response-to-the-pensions-investment-review-call-for-evidence/
Thanks bit can't be real as the person has 100 percent battery
They never do when posting transfer rumours after all....
facts:
1. MIL and FIL own a house valued at £650k and have £100k each in cash. They each own 50% of the property as Tenants in Common. No debts.
2. MIL was admitted to a care home with Alzheimer’s last month. Diagnosed 6 years ago and slowly deteriorating but no way of predicting how many years she will live. Care Home costs £80,000 per annum which is using up her cash as she doesn’t qualify for any financial support. The expectation is that the care home/council will put a charge on her share of the house to cover care home costs if she lives on past the point her cash runs out.
3. They currently have a mirror Will leaving everything to each other.
4. My FIL has anxiety disorder with a family history of heart disease albeit he and she are in their late 80s.
Our worry is that in the event that my FIL dies before my MIL, his assets all go to her which means the care home could call on all of that to pay for her care home costs which could wipe out the entire value if she lives for several years.
We are proposing to arrange for my FIL to update his will leaving his wealth to his son and daughter which limits the amount that can be called upon by the care home/council.
Are we doing the right thing? Are we overlooking anything crucial?
Thanks in advance for your advice/opinions.
A Lifer recommended me Primary Health Properties, and that pays well too. It did take a hit but has stabilised at just under £1, and analysts keep talking positively about it. Recently I added Land Securities but that's a bit of a punt on my part.
FWIW I agree with @felix_31 about Tesla. Did you see how their latest launch a week ago went? And how he was very vague about when the new cheaper car Musk keeps promising will actually appear. The Chinese have several other companies in the field, producing smaller cheaper cars; people across Europe are saying they are interested in EVs but that price is a huge problem. I also think the Tesla share price is held up by the mass of American "retail investors" who are investing in Musk and his rhetoric, that's never a good thing. You could always buy a good fund that specialises in tech, then for sure you'll have some Tesla, and also Alphabet, Meta, Nvidia, etc, but with the risk spread.
@telmc32 - yes I would have FIL change his will to leave his 50% (and cash!) to someone other than the MIL.
https://www.ageuk.org.uk/globalassets/age-uk/documents/factsheets/fs38_property_and_paying_for_residential_care_fcs.pdf
However, most wealth is tied up in property. (Old) people need to realise this & downsize before they die. Release equity & then give this away to their heirs.
What would be fair in the Budget would be an increasing level of tax based on property values. First £500k no tax. Next £500k 20%, anything over £1m then 40%.
I am currently putting money each year into Junior ISAs for three grandchildren and until I became aware of this a couple of years thought there was a potential IHT exposure on any excess over and above the £3k per annum I was contributing to these ISAs. However, if you can compile records for each tax year demonstrating you can afford to gift these monies out of surplus after tax income (including that from investment income), then those monies are not subject to IHT. The attached link outlines the record-keeping required. I just wait until I have submitted my tax return each year and then update a spreadsheet showing my income, expenditures (best estimate) and annual gifts for the tax year and keep this in a file along with my will in order my executors can use it when the time comes.
Obviously, I hope this relief isn't changed in the forthcoming budget!
https://www.gabyhardwicke.co.uk/briefing-notes-and-faqs/inheritance-tax-exemption-for-gifts-out-of-surplus-income/
i have had to spend far more income on property purchase to live in a comparable home. Have had less disposable income for a good life. And then when I die my kids can currently have £500,000 tax free, and the state wants 40% of the other £150,000.
Wages in the Fire Brigade are exactly the same no matter what part of the country live and work in ( London waiting aside ).
House prices in the London area compared to somewhere like Middlesbrough meant that on a firefighter wage some could afford to buy a house easily while others could not.
Or he could invest into an Investment Bond. Because these contain an element of life assurance they are not assessed as capital for care costs.
As usual.......speak to your friendly financial adviser for your investment needs 😉😄.