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Teams that are in the "wrong" division

Chizz
Chizz Posts: 28,558
in Other Football and Sports

Whenever I look at a league table, there's invariably one or two teams that simply shouldn't be in that division. There's no science behind it; and, of course, teams are in the division they're in, based (almost always) on which division they deserve to be in.

Bolton Wanderers, for example. They should be an eternal hoverer between the top two divisions. A crap team in the Premier League or high flyers in the Championship. They simply should not be in the third tier. It just don't feel right.

And Fulham. Lovely little club in the shadow of their big neighbours. They should be somewhere between the bottom half of the Championship and the top two-thirds of League One. Not - as they are today - in the top half of the Premier League, six places off a Champions League spot.

The following teams seem to be in the wrong division. It would be interesting to see what others think and if anyone has additions to this list - or think any of these teams actually are in the "right" division.

Accrington Stanley

Bolton

Bournemouth

Brentford

Brighton

Bromley

Burnley

Crystal Palace

Fulham

Hull

Norwich

Oldham Athletic

Oxford United

Salford City

Southampton

Swansea

Wolves

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Comments

  • Algarveaddick
    Algarveaddick Posts: 21,495
    About half the national league shouldn't be there. All teams that were "on the coupon" when I were a lad feel out of place in non-League. 
  • DaveMehmet
    DaveMehmet Posts: 21,960
    From your list, I'd say Norwich, Hull & Swansea are probably in the right division. Barnsley from L1 and Notts Co from L2 should probably be a division higher
  • blackpool72
    blackpool72 Posts: 24,225
    A bit harsh on Fulham saying bottom half championship , top half league one. 
    Id say top half championship personally. 
  • DaveMehmet
    DaveMehmet Posts: 21,960
    I'll also add Wrexham. This is only their 4th season at this level since they joined the league
  • ShootersHillGuru
    ShootersHillGuru Posts: 50,940
    Money skews everything 
  • letthegoodtimesroll
    letthegoodtimesroll Posts: 11,174
    Every team is where they are and where they are heading at the end of this season on merit. To suggest otherwise is delusional or sour grapes.
  • Carter
    Carter Posts: 14,477
    Southampton from that list are the ones that scream top division to me 

    Brighton, Wolves, Bolton, Palace, Norwich, Oxford and Oldham I see as 2nd tier 

    Bournemouth, Burnley, Brentford, Fulham, Hull, Swansea all 3rd tier and below 

    Bromley, Salford and Accrington. Nah, non-league 

    Credit to all of them who are where they are on merit/money/a succession of good decisions but thats where I see them. I reckon this would be a similar theme to "what music do you love" as those opinions by me are largely based on where these clubs were in my formulative years of growing into football. 
  • Mortimerwasgod
    Mortimerwasgod Posts: 590
    Weirdly I was pondering that about us last time i was at the Valley. If you consider location, near the O2/Canary wharf, 20 minute train into central london, it feels as if it could be "elite". Then if we completed the stadium so it was a full box, so a second tier on East stand and totally replace the Jimmy Seed, increase capacity to 48k, does this make us "belong" higher. Unlike Wrexham who are a pet project, i think always see us as a good investment with an upward trajectory that could be top 6 prem high. Am i demented, probably, but i just see us as sexy potential (bit like Jane from Neighbours in her glasses)!
  • thai malaysia addick
    thai malaysia addick Posts: 18,845
    Swindon, Huddersfield higher
    Burton, Stevenage lower
  • eastterrace6168
    eastterrace6168 Posts: 25,447
    edited March 13
    What about Charlton Athletic...are we in the "right" division, i'd say yes we are, and currently deserve to be be a top half Championship at least...

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  • SoundAsa£
    SoundAsa£ Posts: 22,756
    edited March 13
    I don’t think Chizz is saying that teams don’t deserve to be where they find themselves but where it “seems” they should actually be…… in the minds eye that is.
    Hope that makes sense.🫤
  • ShootersHillGuru
    ShootersHillGuru Posts: 50,940
    There very much used to be a “natural order” back in the sixties and seventies and before but money has really altered those natural perceptions of where teams “should” be. A good example I think is of course Wrexham but the two that scream money made it possible are Brentford and Bournemouth 
  • thai malaysia addick
    thai malaysia addick Posts: 18,845
    ShootersHillGuru said:
    There very much used to be a “natural order” back in the sixties and seventies and before but money has really altered those natural perceptions of where teams “should” be. A good example I think is of course Wrexham but the two that scream money made it possible are Brentford and Bournemouth 
    I think that’s true. The general order of things was largely dictated by attendance size and potential attendance/size of catchment area. I don’t know the facts but gate receipts must be a significant lower percentage of income these days.
  • Karim_myBagheri
    Karim_myBagheri Posts: 13,847
    Arsenal. They should of been relegated years ago but they stayed up due to the football league making sure they stay up. If they went down who knows they could be about as big as Leyton Orient is now. 
  • sam3110
    sam3110 Posts: 22,589
    Bournemouth, league 1 at best

    Brentford, likewise

    Palace, where Millwall, West Brom etc are right now (In danger of promotion to the top tier some seasons, in danger of dropping to League 1 others)

    Sunderland, middling championship team

    Bolton, playoff perennials in the championship 

  • North Lower Neil
    North Lower Neil Posts: 23,427
    eastterrace6168 said:
    What about Charlton Athletic...are we in the "right" division, i'd say yes we are, and currently deserve to be be a top half Championship at least...
    Always think our natural position size-wise is midtable Championship.

    We over achieved for a few years in the PL, and we were under achieving sitting midtable in L1.

    We're in that Norwich/Ipswich, West Brom, Sheffield United type bracket where we're somewhere between 21st and 44th in terms of club size.
  • OhMyGodden
    OhMyGodden Posts: 349
    Luton should be non league
  • Stig
    Stig Posts: 29,575
    Algarveaddick said:
    About half the national league shouldn't be there. All teams that were "on the coupon" when I were a lad feel out of place in non-League. 
    I was working out how close I am to doing the 92 (still a long way off), and realised that I'd lost Carlisle, Dagenham, Morecambe, Rochdale, Scunthorpe and Southend due to relegations. Dagenham and Morecambe, I can just about take, but I feel cheated with the others. 
  • Blackheathboy
    Blackheathboy Posts: 241
    Spurs ….busted flush 
  • CharltonManor1966
    CharltonManor1966 Posts: 449
    Well - my team of the last 40 odd years is Southampton.
    The top players that have consistently come through their system and been sold on over the decades is unbelievable.
    Obviously they are 'struggling' a bit this last couple of years and what will happen when their parachute money runs down next year? 

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  • wolfgang
    wolfgang Posts: 685
    Carter said:
     ... those opinions by me are largely based on where these clubs were in my formulative years of growing into football. 
    Exactly, and Wolves were the top team when I first started taking an interest.  They are a top tier club for me as are Burnley.
  • thai malaysia addick
    thai malaysia addick Posts: 18,845
    OhMyGodden said:
    Luton should be non league
    Luton are a classic all-over-the-place club. I wonder how their fans have faced the highs and lows.
  • StrikerFirmani
    StrikerFirmani Posts: 2,790
    thai malaysia addick said:
    OhMyGodden said:
    Luton should be non league
    Luton are a classic all-over-the-place club. I wonder how their fans have faced the highs and lows.
    Yep, Luton are a strange club but never should have been non league. 

    I remember them in the 1959 FA Cup final against Forrest, thought it was strange they made it.   
  • CharltonManor1966
    CharltonManor1966 Posts: 449
    thai malaysia addick said:
    OhMyGodden said:
    Luton should be non league
    Luton are a classic all-over-the-place club. I wonder how their fans have faced the highs and lows.
    Never been the same since Eric Morecambe left the planet.....
  • EveshamAddick
    EveshamAddick Posts: 7,089
    Wonder how much this is to do with grounds/capacity? Hard to believe  Bournemouth and Brentford can maintain top tier status with capacities of 11,000 and 17,000.
  • StrikerFirmani
    StrikerFirmani Posts: 2,790
    I think how you perceive clubs is all relative to your age because mainly we note clubs when we first start taking an interest in football.

    For me that starting list of clubs would be:  Based on the 50's & early 60's

    Top tier      Wolves, Burnley, Bolton, Fulham.   The later 3 similar to us between top & second tier.       

    Second tier   Brighton, Swansea, Hull, Norwich.  All spent a fair bit of time in the third tier as well.

    Third tier  Brentford, Bournemouth, Palace, Oldham, Southampton came to prominence start of 60's.  Accrington first club I remember dropping out of League for financial reasons.   

    Non League   Oxford took Accrington's place in 1960, Bromley,  Salford. 
  • CharltonManor1966
    CharltonManor1966 Posts: 449
    Bromley are an interesting case? Doing so well in L2. How far can they go with their tiny ground and low finances? Personally I hope they make it to L1.......
  • jimmymelrose
    jimmymelrose Posts: 10,059
    The only team literally in the wrong division is Arsenal because they're the only team, as far as I'm aware, to be pushed up a division without having won promotion.
  • JaShea99
    JaShea99 Posts: 5,561
    MK Dons.
  • Chris_from_Sidcup
    Chris_from_Sidcup Posts: 36,879
    StrikerFirmani said:
    thai malaysia addick said:
    OhMyGodden said:
    Luton should be non league
    Luton are a classic all-over-the-place club. I wonder how their fans have faced the highs and lows.
    Yep, Luton are a strange club but never should have been non league. 

    I remember them in the 1959 FA Cup final against Forrest, thought it was strange they made it.   
    One of the earliest tv games i remember as a kid was Luton beating Arsenal 3-2 to win the league cup. No way should Luton have ever been non-league. 

    League one i'd say, and once they move into their new 25k stadium they've got a shout of establishing themselves as a championship side.

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