[cite]Posted By: InspectorSands[/cite]This is what I don't get (and I was 11 at the time so it wasn't as if knew the full story then...) - if Glikstein loved the club so much, why did he allow the ownership of club and ground to become separate?
Didnt Mr Noades do the same thing at Palarse, I seem to remember a conversation with a Palarse radio commentator who said he believed some CPFC fans did not understand why he would not sell the ground, Noades wanted to protect the Club from Goldburg?
[cite]Posted By: InspectorSands[/cite]This is what I don't get (and I was 11 at the time so it wasn't as if knew the full story then...) - if Glikstein loved the club so much, why did he allow the ownership of club and ground to become separate?
Somebody with a good inside track once told me that Gliksten perceived Hulyer pretty quickly as possibly (probably) a fantasist but certainly an egotist. He therefore allegedly thought he could sell Hulyer the Club straight away and maybe screw more money out of him at a later date for the ground.
The Gliksten version was allegedly that he saw somebody willing to invest money in the Club so sold in the best interests of the Club. However as Hulyer was something of an unknown quantity he decided to protect the Club to some extent by retaining the ground. His alleged version also argues that subsequent events concerning Hulyer proved him right.
Pay your money and take your choice as to the version you believe.
I was also told that Albert Gliksten was the "Fan / football enthusiast" whereas his brother, Stanley, saw Charlton more as another business opportunity. Albert died late forties /early fifties so that assertion may be borne out by the subsequent lack of investment once Stanley took over until his death in 1962.
Michael is Stanley's son I believe so would probably have inherited his fathers business ethos regarding the Club. Certainly the sale of promising young players who could have got us back to the first division like Hinton, Bailey, Bonds and Glover to name just 4 from the 60s would suggest that viewpoint is not unreasonable. The same happened again when success looked possible in the 70s with the sale of Killer and Flash.
All that said though it should be borne in mind that Michael was only 23 when he became Chairman following the death of his father. The rest of the Board at the time were of a similar vintage to his father and may well have had their own axes to grind / investments to enhance / protect. It is therefore hardly surprising that such a young inexperienced chairman presided over what appeared to us fans to be some bizarre decisions.
Great post, Len.
I new Michael was young but didn't realise he was only 23 when he became Chairman.
Albert was the fan and brother Stanley the businessman ........so after Albert died there was a period of a dozen years of Stanley in control - which totally explains why there was virtually no investment in the club during the 50's at a time when the rest of football was booming.
It's posts like this that fill in the missing bits of the story and helps us understand why a club that was still non-League in 1920 was leading the First Division in 1936 - but never pushed on and became the giant it could easily have been.
And why the policies of the club resulted in the club withering away to the point of oblivion.
Just to say myself and I think three others (if the're on here they will obviously know who they are) got into the Valley on the Thursday night before the Stoke game and painted the slogans such as "No sellout to Selhurst" and "Charlton must not die". Stupidly I also wrote my first name after one slogan and was worried I would be tracked down and arrested. We also poured paint on the Chairmans seat in the west stand. The funny thing is we ran out of paint and had to climb back out to get some more and then climb back in again. I was so proud when I read the story in the The Mirror and thought at least I did my little bit to show how everybody felt.
I concur with Oggy on Len's post. Wyn Grant is another who is great in filling in some of the truths about that period of our history. If you ask any Charlton fan over 50 they would always describe us as a selling club. That's because we sold anyone any good for 40 years.
My recollection of most seasons during the 70's and early 80's was the cry on the last home game of "Gliksten out".
At family get togethers, my Grandad, Dad and Uncles would all sound off about how Charlton were sold short by the Glikstens; how they sold all the good players to recoup the original investments made in the club during the 1930's.
I believe that Michael Gliksten tried his hardest to move the club forward but was thwarted one way or another.
My uncle first started taking me to the valley in the mid sixties and i will always remember this game as we drove and parked in our USUAL Spot and walked down from the village, after the game my uncle drove us home and when he dropped me off we both went in for a tea and just sat there looking at each other with nothing to say.
my uncle had been a supporter since the 50's and just said.. Charlton will never die.
What a great thread. Its funny how reading a thread such as this can bring back a lot of memories long forgotten. 1985 does seem like a long while ago, but in many ways seems like only yesterday. The leaflet we got in the previous home game was pretty special...so much so I was convinced it was a hoax. It wasnt until I got the Evening News at Welling Corner that night that the reality of the situation began to slowly sink in. I remember getting to the ground really early for the "last game" Young enough to think that we would be able to do something to stop the unthinkable. As I wrote elsewhere recently, I remember looking around the ground near to kick off, wondering why we hadnt pulled in 20,000 in protest. Such I guess was the apathy for the game in those days. It has to go down as the oddest game Ive ever attended in as much as it didnt seem real...the protests, the pitch invasions (I was in the centre circle at half time), the bigger invasion at the end of the game, the anger....but more than anything the overwhelming sense that we had been let down.....Im not sure by whom, but I remember wandering around the ground until 5.45pm, at which point I was asked to leave by a friendly copper, the feeling was just horrible emptiness...a waste, a terrible mistake...just unbelivievable numbness...it really was as if a family member had died. I remember the boycott Selhurst campaign, but I couldnt resist going, in fact the remainder of that season saw me take in more away games than I had ever been to previously. Who could have envisaged at the Stoke game, the unlikely events at Carlisle later that season.....This is Charlton, this is my life.
Off_It, I also had a season ticket that season. I was in the North stand. Strangest day of my life. As other have said, the move from the Valley probably had to happen to enable us to be where we are today.
During the sixties and seventies, there was a huge amount of apathy around with no real focus. Fans were bewildered, angry and cynical. We did not have sites like this to start a fans led protest. That is why is was all the more remarkable that people did get together and fight rather than grumble and vote with their feet.
I remember a bloke at work who was some kind of distant relative of Rick Everitt started bringing in copies of the VOTV and kept me informed of developments/ rumours. The battle for the Valley was an incredible chapter in our history but that was all ahead of us on this unbelievable and gut wrenching day. After the Hulyer/high court battle which saw us saved with minutes to go, it was hard to believe the turn that events has taken at a time when we really started to think we had a team which could lead us back to the promised land.
Charlton 'Til I Die.
If you haven't read Rick's book, beg steal or borrow a copy.
I was at the game, took some turf home, and can remember someone with a shopping trolly loading it up with turf. Can also remember the BBC radio black cabs at both the palarse game and the stoke games parked behind The Valley club.
I was at the game and it does to me feel an age ago, on the pitch at full time. Didn't go again after this game until 1988.
My Grandad did not have a nice word to say about the Gliksteins and I think worked for them at some point in the 20's or 30's; I grew up trained to despise them and what they had done to our CAFC.
Funny thing was Grandad was from Rotherhithe and actually supported Millwall......
Just want to add that I was there. I was 12 at the time and what was odd was that I sat in The West Stand for the first time as if to mark the occasion as special. I also remember being there with my parents where as normally I'd go to the match with my two brothers and a man who collected ornamental frogs.
Normally we'd stand on the bit of terrace by the Jimmy Seed Stand for the first half and walk around the back of The West Stand to stand next to The Covered End for the second half. During the first half I always used to stand on the gate that let the ambulance onto the pitch (if necessary). At least I think that was its purpose. I always used to hang around there with a couple of other kids (are you reading this?)and we'd fetch the ball whenever it came over the gate and/or take the friendly piss out of Kevin Dickenson for his perm. I remember that sometimes (when I was only 7 or 8) I found the games so dull that I used to try and count the crowd, which my brother found ridiculous until one day when I only got it wrong by 7!
I've had a S/T for about 35 years and only missed about 5 homes games throughout. I was on the east terrace before the game, (which had been fenced off) and on the pitch at half time and at the end. I thought we would never survive at Palace and it all seemed surreal. I was fighting back the tears as I left The Valley to go home, thinking I would never be returning to my second home.It was a bereavment in its own kind of way.
I was there, but from the moment I had been handed that bit of paper at the previous match, I felt numb, a little in denial, but also overwhelmingly angry. Not just angry at those in charge, but equally at those four or so thousand so called supporters who turned up to watch us die that day.
I was convinced that the majority of those who were on the pitch digging up bits of turf, or spouting vitriol at the board, were just one match wonders who had not been alongside me in the weeks and months preceding this match. Of course that is only partially true, but I knew that shouting at the board was pointless and therefore it was much easier to sling abuse at these faceless parasites who were acting like vultures all around me.
I apologise to any of you genuine fans who had to listen to me spouting a verbal tirade in your direction, but I just had to scream that, had you arseholes bothered to turn up regularly at the Valley then maybe we wouldn't be in this position know. Almost certainly untrue, but it was an irrational response to what was a truly dismal time in my life.
I couldn't join in, because by doing so I felt that it would mean that we wouldn't be back and I never ever thought that would be the case. At the time I had not long been married, just been promoted, had bought my first house, was planning a family, but more importantly I didn't have the first idea about how to reverse what had happened.
Fortunately history shows that someone and latterly many, had the knowledge, skill and dedication to carry out what fans like me were unable to, and for that I will be eternally grateful.
i think it is great and well timed that today we sit here feeling quite safe for another year atleast due to the comitment of a few good men and the money they have put in very poinginent indeed
[cite]Posted By: Airman Brown[/cite]Big opportunity at half-time on Saturday for fans to acknowledge Lennie Lawrence's role in keeping the club alive at Selhurst Park. Let's do it.
[cite]Posted By: Telnotinoz[/cite]Jesus, it seems like just a few years ago, not a quarter century.....thats just down right scary
Agreed ... but I just looked at the picture hanging on the wall next to my desk at home ... wide angle shot of the last game ... when you look at the ground then and now, you realise it was so long ago.
I loved the Covered End in those days but it looks like a factory shed ... although the atmosphere was probably better !
Comments
Didnt Mr Noades do the same thing at Palarse, I seem to remember a conversation with a Palarse radio commentator who said he believed some CPFC fans did not understand why he would not sell the ground, Noades wanted to protect the Club from Goldburg?
Great post, Len.
I new Michael was young but didn't realise he was only 23 when he became Chairman.
Albert was the fan and brother Stanley the businessman ........so after Albert died there was a period of a dozen years of Stanley in control - which totally explains why there was virtually no investment in the club during the 50's at a time when the rest of football was booming.
It's posts like this that fill in the missing bits of the story and helps us understand why a club that was still non-League in 1920 was leading the First Division in 1936 - but never pushed on and became the giant it could easily have been.
And why the policies of the club resulted in the club withering away to the point of oblivion.
At family get togethers, my Grandad, Dad and Uncles would all sound off about how Charlton were sold short by the Glikstens; how they sold all the good players to recoup the original investments made in the club during the 1930's.
I believe that Michael Gliksten tried his hardest to move the club forward but was thwarted one way or another.
my uncle had been a supporter since the 50's and just said.. Charlton will never die.
Look at the picture and look at the stadium now.
Well said Tel
I was eventually escorted out of the ground about 6 pm by a very sympathetic Copper.
It felt like leaving the grave of a parent after the funeral - I didn't know what to do with myself.
I remember a bloke at work who was some kind of distant relative of Rick Everitt started bringing in copies of the VOTV and kept me informed of developments/ rumours. The battle for the Valley was an incredible chapter in our history but that was all ahead of us on this unbelievable and gut wrenching day. After the Hulyer/high court battle which saw us saved with minutes to go, it was hard to believe the turn that events has taken at a time when we really started to think we had a team which could lead us back to the promised land.
Charlton 'Til I Die.
If you haven't read Rick's book, beg steal or borrow a copy.
Better than Stone Island and Lacoste any day.
Only thing I remember was that the ref was crap and Jimmy Hill said something at half time about having a word in his ear
A mate of mine proudly has some turf from the pitch in his back garden. Shows it off at every BBQ.
My Grandad did not have a nice word to say about the Gliksteins and I think worked for them at some point in the 20's or 30's; I grew up trained to despise them and what they had done to our CAFC.
Funny thing was Grandad was from Rotherhithe and actually supported Millwall......
Normally we'd stand on the bit of terrace by the Jimmy Seed Stand for the first half and walk around the back of The West Stand to stand next to The Covered End for the second half. During the first half I always used to stand on the gate that let the ambulance onto the pitch (if necessary). At least I think that was its purpose. I always used to hang around there with a couple of other kids (are you reading this?)and we'd fetch the ball whenever it came over the gate and/or take the friendly piss out of Kevin Dickenson for his perm. I remember that sometimes (when I was only 7 or 8) I found the games so dull that I used to try and count the crowd, which my brother found ridiculous until one day when I only got it wrong by 7!
I thought we would never survive at Palace and it all seemed surreal. I was fighting back the tears as I left The Valley to go home, thinking I would never be returning to my second home.It was a bereavment in its own kind of way.
I was there, but from the moment I had been handed that bit of paper at the previous match, I felt numb, a little in denial, but also overwhelmingly angry. Not just angry at those in charge, but equally at those four or so thousand so called supporters who turned up to watch us die that day.
I was convinced that the majority of those who were on the pitch digging up bits of turf, or spouting vitriol at the board, were just one match wonders who had not been alongside me in the weeks and months preceding this match. Of course that is only partially true, but I knew that shouting at the board was pointless and therefore it was much easier to sling abuse at these faceless parasites who were acting like vultures all around me.
I apologise to any of you genuine fans who had to listen to me spouting a verbal tirade in your direction, but I just had to scream that, had you arseholes bothered to turn up regularly at the Valley then maybe we wouldn't be in this position know. Almost certainly untrue, but it was an irrational response to what was a truly dismal time in my life.
I couldn't join in, because by doing so I felt that it would mean that we wouldn't be back and I never ever thought that would be the case. At the time I had not long been married, just been promoted, had bought my first house, was planning a family, but more importantly I didn't have the first idea about how to reverse what had happened.
Fortunately history shows that someone and latterly many, had the knowledge, skill and dedication to carry out what fans like me were unable to, and for that I will be eternally grateful.
Didn't realise that i was reading posts from 2 years ago, good reading.
Aye, 13 at the time, was there in the covered end.
have my piece of the pitch in the back yard.
25 YEARS!!!!
With you on that one Airman
Agreed ... but I just looked at the picture hanging on the wall next to my desk at home ... wide angle shot of the last game ... when you look at the ground then and now, you realise it was so long ago.
I loved the Covered End in those days but it looks like a factory shed ... although the atmosphere was probably better !