[cite]Posted By: Bournemouth Addick[/cite]
Remind me who it was that got us into this terrible effing mess again? Was it a) the old dear who works behind the tea bar in the County Court for minimum wage or thereabouts or b) someone pulling in £100k plus (plus bonuses, expense account, company car, etc).
I thought it was the Govt's mishandling the economy that got us into it myself rather than blaming it all on the Bankers, who everyone in Labour love using as a scapegoat to deflect away from their inadequacies.
[cite]Posted By: Bournemouth Addick[/cite]
Remind me who it was that got us into this terrible effing mess again? Was it a) the old dear who works behind the tea bar in the County Court for minimum wage or thereabouts or b) someone pulling in £100k plus (plus bonuses, expense account, company car, etc).
I thought it was the Govt's mishandling the economy that got us into it myself rather than blaming it all on the Bankers, who everyone in Labour love using as a scapegoat to deflect away from their inadequacies.
Oh please, even the arch capitalist Greenspan acknowledges that the incredibly destructive greed of the bankers was the prime reason for the GFC.
Governments of all political colours across the world put their faith in de-regulation aand laissez faire and the banks - principally in the US and UK - royally screwed them in return.
Who invented sub-prime mortgages and CDS deals? Sure, you can argue the governments should have had better regulations in place but the banks would have fought like crazy to stop that.
A union has won its High Court bid to halt government cost-cutting measures which threatened to reduce the level of redundancy pay for civil servants.
Lawyers for the Public and Commercial Services Union (PCS) argued changes made to the Civil Service Compensation Scheme without agreement were unlawful.
"Maybe it's the 30 days annual holiday, flexi-time, final salary pensions for virtually no contribution, half day for Maunday Thursday, day off for the Queens Birthday, the 7.12 day, the generous sick leave "allowance" or the fact that most of them do absolutely fcuk all for their money that has particularly wound them up this time". - or the fact that the changes were illegal after all
Average public sector pay rise last year was 3.8% in the private sector it was -0.1%. The average salary last year in public vs private sector was £2000 more in the public sector (national office of statistics). Without the Private sector the public sector does not exist, so
Regardless of the Bankers playing russian roulette the Government was already hundreds of Billions of pounds in debt, at least with the bail outs and public ownership of Northern Rock and RBS at least now there is something of value in the balance sheets that can be held onto or sold for profit. This is certainly not a criticism of the people that works their nuts off for their money in the public sector, the likes of paramedics, nurses and teachers but those in Government that believed that they could keep spending and all would be alright. They have caused more problems than any Bank
The next 4 years will see strikes all over the show as the Government try to sort out the public sector problem, making them so unpopular that they won't get into power again, for that reason a coalition government where all parties have to make that decision would not be a bad thing.
[cite]Posted By: T[/cite]Average public sector pay rise last year was 3.8% in the private sector it was -0.1%. The average salary last year in public vs private sector was £2000 more in the public sector (national office of statistics). Without the Private sector the public sector does not exist, so
Regardless of the Bankers playing russian roulette the Government was already hundreds of Billions of pounds in debt, at least with the bail outs and public ownership of Northern Rock and RBS at least now there is something of value in the balance sheets that can be held onto or sold for profit. This is certainly not a criticism of the people that works their nuts off for their money in the public sector, the likes of paramedics, nurses and teachers but those in Government that believed that they could keep spending and all would be alright. They have caused more problems than any Bank
The next 4 years will see strikes all over the show as the Government try to sort out the public sector problem, making them so unpopular that they won't get into power again, for that reason a coalition government where all parties have to make that decision would not be a bad thing.
Labour's got a very clear strategy over the next few years and joining a coalition to clear up the mess they've made isn't part of it.
[cite]Posted By: T[/cite]Average public sector pay rise last year was 3.8% in the private sector it was -0.1%. The average salary last year in public vs private sector was £2000 more in the public sector (national office of statistics). Without the Private sector the public sector does not exist, so
Regardless of the Bankers playing russian roulette the Government was already hundreds of Billions of pounds in debt, at least with the bail outs and public ownership of Northern Rock and RBS at least now there is something of value in the balance sheets that can be held onto or sold for profit. This is certainly not a criticism of the people that works their nuts off for their money in the public sector, the likes of paramedics, nurses and teachers but those in Government that believed that they could keep spending and all would be alright. They have caused more problems than any Bank
The next 4 years will see strikes all over the show as the Government try to sort out the public sector problem, making them so unpopular that they won't get into power again, for that reason a coalition government where all parties have to make that decision would not be a bad thing.
Labour's got a very clear strategy over the next few years and joining a coalition to clear up the mess they've made isn't part of it.
Don't know where you got those figures from but spekaing from my personal experience they are very much wrong. Most local government staff for instance have had nothing like that sort of rise for many, many years and in fact for pretty much all of the last Labour administration have received rises of less than inflation year after year.
There are many things wrong in the public sector but surprisingly enough I think blaming myself and my colleagues for a worldwide banking collapse is a bit rich as I don't remember anyone asking me whether we should start lending money we didn't have to people who couldn't pay it back...
They're National Office of Statistics (http://www.statistics.gov.uk/hub/labour-market/people-in-work/earnings/index.html) numbers widely circulated when they were released at the beginning of the year. My wife works in the public sector and has 3.5% over the next 3 years guranteed, mainly due to the union she doesn't belong to negotiating on her behalf. My rise last year was 0.2% which actually means that i'm worse off due to inflation.
Without singling out political parties i'm not sure that anyone that racked up that abount of debt and turned around to say "it's alright we've got a strategy" is fit to put that strategy into action. Nor would i think it fair that whoever is in this new government gets tarred negativity for tying to sort out these problems not of their making. Even the BOE top man recently said that who ever wins the election will have to make such drastic cuts that they wouldn't get power for another generation.
I agree there are many things wrong with the public sector also but saying the Banks are to blame is ironic given that the Government are happy to borrow to plump up the public sector the tune of several hundred billion or so without any view on how to pay it back!
Jesus - here we go again. Public sector workers are all bone idle, paid too much, have a job for life and have seventy five sicks days a year. Private sector workers work their nuts off, get paid in tea bags and prawn cocktail crisps, get fired every three weeks and are summarily executed if they have a day off for a severed artery.
In reality, people doing crappy, menial jobs are paid slightly more in the public sector. They have a modicum of job security over the private sector, but have no chance of career advancement, nothing in the way of job satisfaction and a pension scheme that has been brutalised so badly that anyone who has joined the civil service in the last twelve years now has a pension scheme that is in the lowest quartile of comparable schemes across the country. Some people in the public sector have received well over the odds in salary rises in the past couple of years, but most public sector workers haven't. People doing skilled jobs in the public sector (professional occupations, like IT, Accountancy etc) are paid well under the odds compared with the private sector, have to work more hours unpaid than in the private sector, and often have to do the job of three people because investment in their departments is cut to the bone and the people they're working with are generally shite.
As ever, the truth is that most people in this country get shat on in the workplace - be they public sector or private sector - in different ways. If you think they've got it good in the civil service, why don't you go and work in it? Believe me - after spending ten years in it from an early age, then working on and off in it since, I would never, ever go back - it was a living hell most of the time.
The salary figures may be correct because many Civil Service depts did multi-year deals, not for one minute thinking that inflation would drop to 0.5%.
Comments
Strike now on the 24th, instead of the 19th
BOOOOOOO
Oh please, even the arch capitalist Greenspan acknowledges that the incredibly destructive greed of the bankers was the prime reason for the GFC.
Governments of all political colours across the world put their faith in de-regulation aand laissez faire and the banks - principally in the US and UK - royally screwed them in return.
Who invented sub-prime mortgages and CDS deals? Sure, you can argue the governments should have had better regulations in place but the banks would have fought like crazy to stop that.
Lawyers for the Public and Commercial Services Union (PCS) argued changes made to the Civil Service Compensation Scheme without agreement were unlawful.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8672150.stm
"Maybe it's the 30 days annual holiday, flexi-time, final salary pensions for virtually no contribution, half day for Maunday Thursday, day off for the Queens Birthday, the 7.12 day, the generous sick leave "allowance" or the fact that most of them do absolutely fcuk all for their money that has particularly wound them up this time". - or the fact that the changes were illegal after all
Regardless of the Bankers playing russian roulette the Government was already hundreds of Billions of pounds in debt, at least with the bail outs and public ownership of Northern Rock and RBS at least now there is something of value in the balance sheets that can be held onto or sold for profit. This is certainly not a criticism of the people that works their nuts off for their money in the public sector, the likes of paramedics, nurses and teachers but those in Government that believed that they could keep spending and all would be alright. They have caused more problems than any Bank
The next 4 years will see strikes all over the show as the Government try to sort out the public sector problem, making them so unpopular that they won't get into power again, for that reason a coalition government where all parties have to make that decision would not be a bad thing.
Labour's got a very clear strategy over the next few years and joining a coalition to clear up the mess they've made isn't part of it.
Don't know where you got those figures from but spekaing from my personal experience they are very much wrong. Most local government staff for instance have had nothing like that sort of rise for many, many years and in fact for pretty much all of the last Labour administration have received rises of less than inflation year after year.
There are many things wrong in the public sector but surprisingly enough I think blaming myself and my colleagues for a worldwide banking collapse is a bit rich as I don't remember anyone asking me whether we should start lending money we didn't have to people who couldn't pay it back...
Without singling out political parties i'm not sure that anyone that racked up that abount of debt and turned around to say "it's alright we've got a strategy" is fit to put that strategy into action. Nor would i think it fair that whoever is in this new government gets tarred negativity for tying to sort out these problems not of their making. Even the BOE top man recently said that who ever wins the election will have to make such drastic cuts that they wouldn't get power for another generation.
I agree there are many things wrong with the public sector also but saying the Banks are to blame is ironic given that the Government are happy to borrow to plump up the public sector the tune of several hundred billion or so without any view on how to pay it back!
In reality, people doing crappy, menial jobs are paid slightly more in the public sector. They have a modicum of job security over the private sector, but have no chance of career advancement, nothing in the way of job satisfaction and a pension scheme that has been brutalised so badly that anyone who has joined the civil service in the last twelve years now has a pension scheme that is in the lowest quartile of comparable schemes across the country. Some people in the public sector have received well over the odds in salary rises in the past couple of years, but most public sector workers haven't. People doing skilled jobs in the public sector (professional occupations, like IT, Accountancy etc) are paid well under the odds compared with the private sector, have to work more hours unpaid than in the private sector, and often have to do the job of three people because investment in their departments is cut to the bone and the people they're working with are generally shite.
As ever, the truth is that most people in this country get shat on in the workplace - be they public sector or private sector - in different ways. If you think they've got it good in the civil service, why don't you go and work in it? Believe me - after spending ten years in it from an early age, then working on and off in it since, I would never, ever go back - it was a living hell most of the time.