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Terry Pratchett: Choosing to die

Moving and thought provoking drama. Well done to the beeb.

Surprised they showed the guy going through with it.

Right or wrong? Discuss.
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Comments

  • Not 100% where I stand, but I'd like the choice if I was suffering from a terminal illness.

    Horrific but superb documentary.
  • I think the right to choose when to end ones own life is fundamental. I don't want to end my days unable to care for myself, perhaps in a painful terminal condition feeling as if I am a burden to my loved ones.
  • Missed this tonight, will have to watch on iplayer. I do have some personal experience of a similar situation, in my mind without a doubt people should have the choice or if they are far too incapacitated to make the decision and are in pain or not functioning at all then it is the only humane thing to do. People have to realise that doctors assist in this sort of thing all the time, I think there should be rules but there are some cases when there really is no other option.
  • Watching the two guys talk so lucidly about it, made me 100% certain that the British legal system has no place in the process.
  • If you have a terminal illness then I can see no reason why you should not be able to decide when you want to die, so that you can die peacefully and with dignity. However there must be safeguards to ensure that people are not being coerced or encouraged to do it.
  • I couldn't believe how relaxed Andrew was in killing himself. No doubts in his mind at all. Never thought the BBC would show all stages of it.

    Very moving.
  • The thing that gets me is that the current legislation means that people choose to end their lives far earlier than they might do otherwise, so that their friends and family aren't at risk of prosecution for assisting them. A properly thought through system that protected the vulnerable from coercion and enabled those with terminal illness or serious degenerative disease to go at a time of their own choosing is the humane thing to do.
  • Let people do what they want but don't bloody ram it down our throats. I don't want to think about dying, I don't want to see people die. Keep it off the TV please. Now it's on Newsnight and 5Live. You can bet it will be discussed tomorrow with Nicky Campbell, Victoria Derbyshire, Sheaghla Fogerty and Jeremey Vine.

    If someone says "Everyones got an off button" I'll kill 'em!

  • made me 100% certain that the British legal system has no place in the process.
    This is ridiculous.

    Personally, I feel that the choice should be an individuals. However, as others have stated there must be safeguards. A vulnerable person has every right to representation (often but not always this will be a lawyer).

    Criticism should not be directed in a sweeping generalisation of the legal system in this Country. But instead, if you don't like the law, well criticise the politicians that made it, or better still encourage them to change the law.  
  • When you allow it to happen you can then concerntrate on ensuring it is very difficult to enter in to it. You wouldn't want somebody doing it on a whim - if somebody had given it a lot of thought over a considerable period and their quality of life is not good you should allow them the dignity of controlling their death.
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  • edited June 2011

    Great Programe horrific subject . I know my thoughts on it and they havent changed in fact they were enhanced by last nights programme, i would hate for my wife and kids to watch me debilitate to such an extreeme that i would feel like i was burdening them with my care alongside the grief of having to deal with my certain death.

    The right to die should be a basic human right and not one that is made by those who are not concernd with the person whilst alive.

    It will become law once a way to Tax it is found

  • Speaking as someone who's father's recently been diagnosed with incurable brain cancer, I couldn't bring myself to watch it.

    To a degree, I've kind of got my head round the fact he may not have too long left but the thought of seeing him wasting away is hard to take.

     

  • made me 100% certain that the British legal system has no place in the process.
    This is ridiculous.

    Personally, I feel that the choice should be an individuals. However, as others have stated there must be safeguards. A vulnerable person has every right to representation (often but not always this will be a lawyer).

    Criticism should not be directed in a sweeping generalisation of the legal system in this Country. But instead, if you don't like the law, well criticise the politicians that made it, or better still encourage them to change the law.  



    Badly worded. Was aimed more at the legal system becoming involved in the aftermath i.e threats to prosecute family members who have travelled alongside the person.

    Of course the process should be regulated.
  • edited June 2011
    But going back to the programme, it was one of the most poignant and upsetting things I've ever seen. I kind of wished I hadn't seen it, because even now I'm still upset about it.
  • Didn't upset me, looked as though the guy was just taking a nap. What is sad is that he had to go to Switzerland earlier than was really necessary as once he'd got worse he wouldn't have been able to go there unassisted. As NLA said if someone is terminally ill and causing distress to themselves and their loved ones why shouldn't they have the right to die when they wish?
  • Speaking as someone who's father's recently been diagnosed with incurable brain cancer, I couldn't bring myself to watch it.

    To a degree, I've kind of got my head round the fact he may not have too long left but the thought of seeing him wasting away is hard to take.

     

    Just recently been through a very similar situation to the one you are facing Dave.

    As hard as it is,you will get some solace from the fact that you were there for him through what is going to be a very difficult time.
    All the best.
  • Speaking as someone who's father's recently been diagnosed with incurable brain cancer, I couldn't bring myself to watch it.

    To a degree, I've kind of got my head round the fact he may not have too long left but the thought of seeing him wasting away is hard to take.

     

    Just recently been through a very similar situation to the one you are facing Dave.


    As hard as it is,you will get some solace from the fact that you were there for him through what is going to be a very difficult time.

    All the best.
    Cheers mate.
  • It was a brilliant piece of documentary making about a very difficult subject. I have nothing but awe for the courage and fortitude of the individuals involved and their families and can only hope that in a similar situation I would half the spirit they demonstrated.

    My views on the matter did not change one iota, it is an obscenity than in a civilised society we are expected to watch our nearest and dearest endure unbearable suffering that we would be rightly prosecuted for if it were our pet.

    However it was still difficult to watch and I see today that the BBC is under attack from certain sections for it's apparent "pro assisted death" bias and 900 complaints have already been made.

    Personally, for me, it was less about the issue and more about the remarkable individuals featured and how they came to their decision.

  • Speaking as someone who's father's recently been diagnosed with incurable brain cancer, I couldn't bring myself to watch it.

    To a degree, I've kind of got my head round the fact he may not have too long left but the thought of seeing him wasting away is hard to take.

     


    Mate having been through a terminally ill cancer with my dad, it is a horrible horrible thing to face up to but you do need to, good luck and i wish for you all the best because it changed my life, and not for the best in every way

     

    i hope you find hope where sometimes yu feel there is little, chin up be strong and tell them everything that you need, clear the air, tell them the truth, but never miss a chnace to tell them because when the time has gone you wont get a 2nd chance.

     

     

    i feel for you not a nice time

  • The pro-life mob really get on my tits. Banging on about the sanctity of life and accusing people of murder etc. What the fuck has it got to do with them? Beyond making sure that the person in question is not being coerced and is capable of making an informed decision there is nothing that anyone else does or says that should be relevant.
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  • Always find it amusing that if you have a pet dog that is in constant pain and suffering the "humane" thing to do is have it put to sleep as it's deemed as cruel to allow the animal to suffer, and rightly so. Yet for our own species, we make them suffer an agonising and slow death. We should have the choice to leave this world with dignity and not by having to resort to suicide which can sometimes end in failure thus causing even more suffering.......

    Anyone wanna buy a second-hand soap box?
  • The pro-life mob really get on my tits. Banging on about the sanctity of life and accusing people of murder etc. What the fuck has it got to do with them? Beyond making sure that the person in question is not being coerced and is capable of making an informed decision there is nothing that anyone else does or says that should be relevant.




    There is a strange correlation between right-to-lifers and those that believe in the death sentence.

     

  • The pro-life mob really get on my tits. Banging on about the sanctity of life and accusing people of murder etc. What the fuck has it got to do with them? Beyond making sure that the person in question is not being coerced and is capable of making an informed decision there is nothing that anyone else does or says that should be relevant.


    There is a strange correlation between right-to-lifers and those that believe in the death sentence.

     


    There is also a strange correlation between those who are eager to kill the innocent yet vehemently oppose the death penalty for murderers.

    Just to clarify I am pro life and anti capital punishment so my position is consistent.

    I didn't see the Pratchett programme so cannot comment specifically. However most posts on here suggest that it was pro euthanasia.

    I await a BBC documentary suggesting how the quality of life of the sick and vulnerable can be improved removing the need to kill themselves andopposing  coercion of the innocent to do away with themselves for various utilitarian reasons. I won't hold my breath though.

  • And what happens when even that 'improved' quality of life becomes unbearable? When you are in constant pain and/or cannot function in any meaningful way? At what point does the individuals ability to make up his own mind overide the opinion of some busybody who has nothing whatsoever to do with the situation?
  • Len, it was more Terry Pratchett finding out for himself what he'd like to do if the time comes (he's got Alzheimers).

    It was very much a personal journey for him as it was looking into the arguments.  I thought it was quite well balanced to be honest, he visited a cabbie in a hospice who didnt want to die voluntarily and TP's asistant accompanied him and was very much against assisted suicide and mentioned it on multiple occasions.

    In my mind, a lot of these terminal illnesses affect the mind as much as the body and no matter how good a hospice and it's staff are, or how dedicated a family is you can't change that.

    Personally, after having time to dwell on it I am neither pro-life or pro-death - but I would like to have that choice without repurcussions if - heaven forbid - I needed to make it.

  • Speaking as someone who's father's recently been diagnosed with incurable brain cancer, I couldn't bring myself to watch it.

    To a degree, I've kind of got my head round the fact he may not have too long left but the thought of seeing him wasting away is hard to take.

     


    Mate having been through a terminally ill cancer with my dad, it is a horrible horrible thing to face up to but you do need to, good luck and i wish for you all the best because it changed my life, and not for the best in every way

     

    i hope you find hope where sometimes yu feel there is little, chin up be strong and tell them everything that you need, clear the air, tell them the truth, but never miss a chnace to tell them because when the time has gone you wont get a 2nd chance.

     

     

    i feel for you not a nice time

    Cheers fella. I'm lucky in the respect that I've always had a great relationship with him and will never look back and say "I wish we'd done this, that" etc. My only regret is that he won't get to see my daughter (his only grand kid) grow up but sh*t happens.

    He's not actually terminal yet but they've told him that the treatment he starts on Thursday can only contain it and it will come back.

  • The pro-life mob really get on my tits. Banging on about the sanctity of life and accusing people of murder etc. What the fuck has it got to do with them? Beyond making sure that the person in question is not being coerced and is capable of making an informed decision there is nothing that anyone else does or says that should be relevant.


    There is a strange correlation between right-to-lifers and those that believe in the death sentence.

     


    There is also a strange correlation between those who are eager to kill the innocent yet vehemently oppose the death penalty for murderers.

    Just to clarify I am pro life and anti capital punishment so my position is consistent.

    I didn't see the Pratchett programme so cannot comment specifically. However most posts on here suggest that it was pro euthanasia.

    I await a BBC documentary suggesting how the quality of life of the sick and vulnerable can be improved removing the need to kill themselves andopposing  coercion of the innocent to do away with themselves for various utilitarian reasons. I won't hold my breath though.




    The two who were featured last night were in no way co-erced.

    Their families had tried to talk them out of it, when they failed they accepted their decision.

    What is wrong with putting legislation in place which gives people the choice?
  • Len, it was more Terry Pratchett finding out for himself what he'd like to do if the time comes (he's got Alzheimers).

    It was very much a personal journey for him as it was looking into the arguments.  I thought it was quite well balanced to be honest, he visited a cabbie in a hospice who didnt want to die voluntarily and TP's asistant accompanied him and was very much against assisted suicide and mentioned it on multiple occasions.

    In my mind, a lot of these terminal illnesses affect the mind as much as the body and no matter how good a hospice and it's staff are, or how dedicated a family is you can't change that.

    Personally, after having time to dwell on it I am neither pro-life or pro-death - but I would like to have that choice without repurcussions if - heaven forbid - I needed to make it.




    Perfect summary of the documentary. When the priest on News Night suggested that the program was unbalanced he drew derision from almost all present. Even some of the pro-lifers.
  • and (apparently) some of the Charlton Lifers!
  • And what happens when even that 'improved' quality of life becomes unbearable? When you are in constant pain and/or cannot function in any meaningful way? At what point does the individuals ability to make up his own mind overide the opinion of some busybody who has nothing whatsoever to do with the situation?


    Palliative care (eg increasing doses of morphine) sometimes has the effect of shortening life but the INTENT is to reduce pain not kill. That in my eyes is humane and acceptable.

    Governments interfere in our lives, many think too much. However if governments do have a role it is to protect the weak and vulnerable and for that reason, in my opinion, assisted suicide should not be legalised. It is too open to potential abuse. Unscrupulous relatives wanting to claim an inheritance, overworked HHS workers stopping what they perceive as bed blocking,etc, etc. Then there is the question of what IS quality of life and who decides? In my view if euthanasia is legalised then it rapidly becomes a slippery slope towards eugenics.

    The Terry Pratchetts of this world are rich enough and influential enough not to be exploited. Whilst I'm sorry that such a talented author has been cursed with Alzheimers my concern is for the anonymous thousands, millions even who need protection once they become vulnerable.

    Concerns have already been expressed by influential doctors about misuse of the Liverpool Care Pathway in NHS hospitals.

     http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/letters/6133157/Dying-patients.html

     

    Legalisation of euthanasia can only put the vulnerable in yet more danger in my opinion.

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