EGAddick, I know guys that earn 70-80K a year yet they only pay 18-20% tax by doing the ltd company route and yes, they are uk residents. Can you explain how these guys are not in the top rate of tax? This is all legal too. I am not arguing here, I am just puzzled as to how these guys can legally pay minimal tax yet quite clearly earn enough for the higher rate of tax.
EGAddick, I know guys that earn 70-80K a year yet they only pay 18-20% tax by doing the ltd company route and yes, they are uk residents. Can you explain how these guys are not in the top rate of tax? This is all legal too. I am not arguing here, I am just puzzled as to how these guys can legally pay minimal tax yet quite clearly earn enough for the higher rate of tax.
Firstly it depends what they do but there are literally hundrerds of ways of reducing a tax bill by creatively manipulating the system (and it doesn't always require the services of 'top accountants') - there are things like vaguely legal offshore deferment schemes (which have come under scrutiny recently) as well as avoidance schemes that are more suitable for companies that can prove their assets are not liable to UK tax. But basically if you're a footballer, you're an employee and therefore liable to the same rates as anyone else employed in a company here.
I understand you EGA but as I said earlier, if a footballer set up a ltd company and the football club give a contract to his company to supply a footballer, could he then not avoid the higher rate of tax? I am asking this as at least two guys sit in my same cluster of desks in my office doing the same but have set up ltd companies and paid via this route. In my eyes they are not sub contractors as they have been doing the same work for at least two years out of the same office. Same scenario but different job. Who knows, they might be tax avoiding!
I doubt these guys are going to pay full tax, I know a Aussie bloke who lives in this country and earns 150k, he pays very little tax on that. Sad but the truth
I don't think a footballer could, for a number of reasons including that others (before and since) continue to set a precedence that they are employed for doing the same thing. A club, as well as the player, would also get into all sorts of legal wranglings as to what the difference is between them being an employee or providing a service as a player under contract. I don't think you can entirely confuse this issue with third-party ownership, which ironically involved Tevez back in 2009, as that is a separate entity whereby investors can own shares in a player and entitle themselves to proportions of his transfer fee, but the real answer is no-one really knows - every case is different but on the whole I would imagine it would be very hard for a player to argue that he should be taxed differently to any other player who is simply an employee.
As for the people who sit amongst you, they may not have the same rights you do as an employee, ie they could lose their contracts with the company without forfeit etc, every situation is different.
All Tevez would have to do is set up as a company say tevez limited and pay himself a certain wage from City and 'loose the rest' so he wouldn't have to pay the high tax rate. Nothing better then doing the taxman over
I think its just nuts to think he's knowhere near the real top earners in the Premiership yet those earning figures are simply grotesque....almost, nah f*** it definately, insulting to ya average football fan and `man in the street'.
I mean ffs the guy plays football. Obviously market forces dictate all this but you can't get away from the fact the bloke is as thick as two short planks and brings nothing to the table of life 'cept hes got a natural talent for kicking a ball about. Should it really be worth that much?
Jeez, everyone's a tax expert all of a sudden. "Set up a company". Genius.
Actually, it really is as easy as that. It's how `contract' workers operate.
To encourage independant company creation and growth there are, shall we say, `flexible' tax paying methods/systems. Pound for pound, companies can pay far less taxes than your everyday employee who gets mugged/taxed at source. That bit of it works fine to a degree but seeing as this kinda perk has to be and is open to all they don't specify a company size......you can do it all on your lonesome.
I work in engineering and one of the biggest engineering projects on a global scale running at the moment is `Crossrail' here in the south of England. It involves multiple big hitter companies and 10's of thousands of workers. The vast majority of those workers are drafted in `for the boom time' and will be `contract' workers. Every single one of them will have `created' a company with one chief exec, one general member of staff, one tea lady....themselves. Whoever they work for doesn't pay them directly, it pays their company for their services. They inturn `pay' themselves the minimum wage with the minimum tax obligations with the rest going into a company account of which they obviously control. You could `set up' your company yourself straight forwardly enough but most people do it through agencies known as `umbrella companies'. For a small monthly fee they run all your accounting for you. Agents at these companies can `run' hundreds of accounts and all those individual monthly fees add up. There are some blokes that work this system to its crazy maximum and believe me you can claim tax back on ANYTHING ranging from the simple fact of eating each day to claiming your big ass plasma is actually a computer monitor.
The downsides of this employment method are the usuals, no holiday/sick pay, fluid job security (with 1 weeks notice typically) etc. It works for some fella's, not for others.
I think its just nuts to think he's knowhere near the real top earners in the Premiership yet those earning figures are simply grotesque....almost, nah f*** it definately, insulting to ya average football fan and `man in the street'.
I mean ffs the guy plays football. Obviously market forces dictate all this but you can't get away from the fact the bloke is as thick as two short planks and brings nothing to the table of life 'cept hes got a natural talent for kicking a ball about. Should it really be worth that much?
Yes.
Football is one of the most desirable professions on earth. Carlos Tevez has the talent to make him proportionally one of the most accomplished members of his profession, and his position makes him even more valuable. Football in this country generates billions a year, why shouldn't the professionals at the top end earn their share ?
I think its just nuts to think he's knowhere near the real top earners in the Premiership yet those earning figures are simply grotesque....almost, nah f*** it definately, insulting to ya average football fan and `man in the street'.
I mean ffs the guy plays football. Obviously market forces dictate all this but you can't get away from the fact the bloke is as thick as two short planks and brings nothing to the table of life 'cept hes got a natural talent for kicking a ball about. Should it really be worth that much?
Yes.
Football is one of the most desirable professions on earth
Yeah it undoubtedly is.....but I can't help but feel maybe it shouldn't be.
Jeez, everyone's a tax expert all of a sudden. "Set up a company". Genius.
Exactly Corporation tax and national insurance contributions on all the earnings/dividends for a limited company mean he'll be paying around 40% anyway if he were a limited company in this country May be more I think corporation tax has gone up from 28% to 33%
Comments
I know guys that earn 70-80K a year yet they only pay 18-20% tax by doing the ltd company route and yes, they are uk residents. Can you explain how these guys are not in the top rate of tax? This is all legal too. I am not arguing here, I am just puzzled as to how these guys can legally pay minimal tax yet quite clearly earn enough for the higher rate of tax.
As for the people who sit amongst you, they may not have the same rights you do as an employee, ie they could lose their contracts with the company without forfeit etc, every situation is different.
I mean ffs the guy plays football. Obviously market forces dictate all this but you can't get away from the fact the bloke is as thick as two short planks and brings nothing to the table of life 'cept hes got a natural talent for kicking a ball about. Should it really be worth that much?
To encourage independant company creation and growth there are, shall we say, `flexible' tax paying methods/systems. Pound for pound, companies can pay far less taxes than your everyday employee who gets mugged/taxed at source. That bit of it works fine to a degree but seeing as this kinda perk has to be and is open to all they don't specify a company size......you can do it all on your lonesome.
I work in engineering and one of the biggest engineering projects on a global scale running at the moment is `Crossrail' here in the south of England. It involves multiple big hitter companies and 10's of thousands of workers. The vast majority of those workers are drafted in `for the boom time' and will be `contract' workers. Every single one of them will have `created' a company with one chief exec, one general member of staff, one tea lady....themselves. Whoever they work for doesn't pay them directly, it pays their company for their services. They inturn `pay' themselves the minimum wage with the minimum tax obligations with the rest going into a company account of which they obviously control. You could `set up' your company yourself straight forwardly enough but most people do it through agencies known as `umbrella companies'. For a small monthly fee they run all your accounting for you. Agents at these companies can `run' hundreds of accounts and all those individual monthly fees add up.
There are some blokes that work this system to its crazy maximum and believe me you can claim tax back on ANYTHING ranging from the simple fact of eating each day to claiming your big ass plasma is actually a computer monitor.
The downsides of this employment method are the usuals, no holiday/sick pay, fluid job security (with 1 weeks notice typically) etc. It works for some fella's, not for others.
Football is one of the most desirable professions on earth. Carlos Tevez has the talent to make him proportionally one of the most accomplished members of his profession, and his position makes him even more valuable. Football in this country generates billions a year, why shouldn't the professionals at the top end earn their share ?
Corporation tax and national insurance contributions on all the earnings/dividends for a limited company mean he'll be paying around 40% anyway if he were a limited company in this country
May be more I think corporation tax has gone up from 28% to 33%