The hopeful optimist in me would like to think that the seemingly well judged signings of Watt, Johnson, Eagles and Diarra, all either British or with English league experience and, all but one, non-network players, is a sign that the network is finally getting to grips with what this club needs to succeed in its league.
The cynic in me worries the fact they were mostly short term deals done after the transfer deadline, and, at least partially, after the fans' fairly ugly reaction to the Norwich game suggest that they might be short term fixes brought in to allow us to revert to a more conventional approach to staying in the division, and that they will not be retained in the summer and we will instead go back to being sent young European players largely from within the network.
Looks like the optimist is on dodgy ground due to them being signed outside the window and therefore could only be English league based.
They were free agents so could have been signed from Mars and still been eligible to play, hence us being able to sign Diarra (French, not Martian).
Talking of finance and network players, how much to acquire Watt, Buyens, Bulot and Ben Haim. I'd guess £5M minimum. And would an independent CAFC be able to land all of those given where we have come from?
Add Vetokele and Gudmundson from the open market plus Ben Haim, Bikey and now Johnson in defence and we have ourselves a new team just 12 months after that debacle at Bramall Lane.
The current team which is finding its feet in this division has been acquired virtually overnight. As I have always maintained the opportunity was there because most of the last squad was out of contract.
This squad hasn't won anything but there is now a very strong platform for 2015-16.
Personally I think yann would be more influential now than he was in any other cafc team he played in
You could easily fit yann in this starting 11 and he would compliment watt and igor perfectly
The reason we pumped long balls to him was not as a tactical solution, it was down to the lack of confidence within the team and mgmt, players hid, they wanted rid of the ball and he was so good at putting himself amongst the opposition that cowardly players used him as their outlet,
The shame was that they didn't need to but we failed to overcome that issue and became predictable
Like it or not that could only be fixed on the training ground and instead of being brave we chose to use it, and the more cuts, bandages and bruising he got the more it was forgiven
Talking of finance and network players, how much to acquire Watt, Buyens, Bulot and Ben Haim. I'd guess £5M minimum. And would an independent CAFC be able to land all of those given where we have come from?
Add Vetokele and Gudmundson from the open market plus Ben Haim, Bikey and now Johnson in defence and we have ourselves a new team just 12 months after that debacle at Bramall Lane.
The current team which is finding its feet in this division has been acquired virtually overnight. As I have always maintained the opportunity was there because most of the last squad was out of contract.
This squad hasn't won anything but there is now a very strong platform for 2015-16.
Out of which only Watt has a contract for next season, although personally I can live without Buyens and I'll need to see Bulot in his current form for a bit longer before I'm convinced this version is here for the medium term.
We'll see what lessons RD learns, but I doubt if he's had a head transplant since the end of the transfer window. Johnson, Diarra and Eagles are here because they were all available short term on the cheap and we looked to be at serious risk of relegation.
I like to see us win 3-0 as much as anyone, especially because I fear the consequences of League One, but I don't stand on my head every time the wind changes.
No need for a hold up man if you play to feet moving forwards....
Exactly. Yann is a top quality player and he would get into our current team with ease. BUT, I'm not sure we need a like-for-like replacement for him anymore with the style of football Luzon likes to play.
Really? I disagree. It appears to me that the longer he is way from us the better Yann was......
That's always the way Greenie. I have wanted a mobile 23 year old who is good in the air and can hold the ball up away from home so we are not under constant pressure. we have some great attacking players now but a year down the line we still don't have the plan B striker. Other than Igor ,no other forward we tried have been able to head the ball. my way of playing is to feet, but the option of a bullet header in the box is fine as well.
Yann has gone. Move on. His successor is Nadir Ciftci of Dundee Utd. Please buy him Katrein! £3M tops.
But I do worry about signings like Lepoint a total donkey and despite being decent, four centre backs over 30 and other older players who do not fit the plan for the future. However I'd like TBH, RJ, Eagles and Diarra on board longer. Perhaps Bulot and AA on perms.
Talking of finance and network players, how much to acquire Watt, Buyens, Bulot and Ben Haim. I'd guess £5M minimum. And would an independent CAFC be able to land all of those given where we have come from?
Add Vetokele and Gudmundson from the open market plus Ben Haim, Bikey and now Johnson in defence and we have ourselves a new team just 12 months after that debacle at Bramall Lane.
The current team which is finding its feet in this division has been acquired virtually overnight. As I have always maintained the opportunity was there because most of the last squad was out of contract.
This squad hasn't won anything but there is now a very strong platform for 2015-16.
Out of which only Watt has a contract for next season, although personally I can live without Buyens and I'll need to see Bulot in his current form for a bit longer before I'm convinced this version is here for the medium term.
We'll see what lessons RD learns, but I doubt if he's had a head transplant since the end of the transfer window. Johnson, Diarra and Eagles are here because they were all available short term on the cheap and we looked to be at serious risk of relegation.
I like to see us win 3-0 as much as anyone, especially because I fear the consequences of League One, but I don't stand on my head every time the wind changes.
Fair enough, but RD can't have failed to notice the three signings coinciding with the vast improvement in performances - and results. The question is whether he will be stubborn enough to go back to network/foreign only or will he acknowledge they have their place - ALONGSIDE a core of Championship experience not INSTEAD OF. I don't for one minute think that over the next few seasons we won't see any network signings/loans again, but he might adapt the model instead of throwing it out entirely. It's not a question of 'head transplants' - three signings of Championship-proven players have transformed the team, he watches the performances according to KM and will have seen the difference it makes... and how much more attractive/lucrative a business opportunity the team can be.
I am not optimistic because of the results, I am optimistic because of the performances (even Derby, an improved second half showed plenty of spirit though not quite enough quality) and I honestly think RD is pragmatic enough to alter his plans in the name of profit. If adding a few Johnsons and Eagles to the likes of the Buyens and Bulots will make Charlton a solid championship team then he's got no reason not to make those additions.
Yann wasn't just a hold up player. He was actually better with the ball on the floor. At the same time he had strength, power and somehow manager to win 9/10 headers, if not 10.
Talking of finance and network players, how much to acquire Watt, Buyens, Bulot and Ben Haim. I'd guess £5M minimum. And would an independent CAFC be able to land all of those given where we have come from?
Add Vetokele and Gudmundson from the open market plus Ben Haim, Bikey and now Johnson in defence and we have ourselves a new team just 12 months after that debacle at Bramall Lane.
The current team which is finding its feet in this division has been acquired virtually overnight. As I have always maintained the opportunity was there because most of the last squad was out of contract.
This squad hasn't won anything but there is now a very strong platform for 2015-16.
Out of which only Watt has a contract for next season, although personally I can live without Buyens and I'll need to see Bulot in his current form for a bit longer before I'm convinced this version is here for the medium term.
We'll see what lessons RD learns, but I doubt if he's had a head transplant since the end of the transfer window. Johnson, Diarra and Eagles are here because they were all available short term on the cheap and we looked to be at serious risk of relegation.
I like to see us win 3-0 as much as anyone, especially because I fear the consequences of League One, but I don't stand on my head every time the wind changes.
Fair enough, but RD can't have failed to notice the three signings coinciding with the vast improvement in performances - and results. The question is whether he will be stubborn enough to go back to network/foreign only or will he acknowledge they have their place - ALONGSIDE a core of Championship experience not INSTEAD OF. I don't for one minute think that over the next few seasons we won't see any network signings/loans again, but he might adapt the model instead of throwing it out entirely. It's not a question of 'head transplants' - three signings of Championship-proven players have transformed the team, he watches the performances according to KM and will have seen the difference it makes... and how much more attractive/lucrative a business opportunity the team can be.
I am not optimistic because of the results, I am optimistic because of the performances (even Derby, an improved second half showed plenty of spirit though not quite enough quality) and I honestly think RD is pragmatic enough to alter his plans in the name of profit. If adding a few Johnsons and Eagles to the likes of the Buyens and Bulots will make Charlton a solid championship team then he's got no reason not to make those additions.
Bit of a stretch to put the results down to Eagles or Diarra, though. Johnson I would agree has been influential, but no more so than Watt, Bulot and Henderson. So RD can just as easily argue it was the network that did it and with some justification.
I think this season has largely been dictated by a reluctance to pay what decent Championship forwards usually cost - a mistake Jimenez didn't make in 2012 - and RD's attempt to prove himself right over selling Kermorgant.
I recognise that you can easily burn money in this league and achieve very little, but everyone knew that the squad was screaming out for another striker and most that Tucudean would never be that player. It's evident Peeters was telling him that too.
Anyway let's hope for more of the same against Forest, network or not.
Talking of finance and network players, how much to acquire Watt, Buyens, Bulot and Ben Haim. I'd guess £5M minimum. And would an independent CAFC be able to land all of those given where we have come from?
Add Vetokele and Gudmundson from the open market plus Ben Haim, Bikey and now Johnson in defence and we have ourselves a new team just 12 months after that debacle at Bramall Lane.
The current team which is finding its feet in this division has been acquired virtually overnight. As I have always maintained the opportunity was there because most of the last squad was out of contract.
This squad hasn't won anything but there is now a very strong platform for 2015-16.
Out of which only Watt has a contract for next season, although personally I can live without Buyens and I'll need to see Bulot in his current form for a bit longer before I'm convinced this version is here for the medium term.
We'll see what lessons RD learns, but I doubt if he's had a head transplant since the end of the transfer window. Johnson, Diarra and Eagles are here because they were all available short term on the cheap and we looked to be at serious risk of relegation.
I like to see us win 3-0 as much as anyone, especially because I fear the consequences of League One, but I don't stand on my head every time the wind changes.
Fair enough, but RD can't have failed to notice the three signings coinciding with the vast improvement in performances - and results. The question is whether he will be stubborn enough to go back to network/foreign only or will he acknowledge they have their place - ALONGSIDE a core of Championship experience not INSTEAD OF. I don't for one minute think that over the next few seasons we won't see any network signings/loans again, but he might adapt the model instead of throwing it out entirely. It's not a question of 'head transplants' - three signings of Championship-proven players have transformed the team, he watches the performances according to KM and will have seen the difference it makes... and how much more attractive/lucrative a business opportunity the team can be.
I am not optimistic because of the results, I am optimistic because of the performances (even Derby, an improved second half showed plenty of spirit though not quite enough quality) and I honestly think RD is pragmatic enough to alter his plans in the name of profit. If adding a few Johnsons and Eagles to the likes of the Buyens and Bulots will make Charlton a solid championship team then he's got no reason not to make those additions.
Bit of a stretch to put the results down to Eagles or Diarra, though. Johnson I would agree has been influential, but no more so than Watt, Bulot and Henderson. So RD can just as easily argue it was the network that did it and with some justification.
I think this season has largely been dictated by a reluctance to pay what decent Championship forwards usually cost - a mistake Jimenez didn't make in 2012 - and RD's attempt to prove himself right over selling Kermorgant.
I recognise that you can easily burn money in this league and achieve very little, but everyone knew that the squad was screaming out for another striker and most that Tucudean would never be that player. It's evident Peeters was telling him that too.
Anyway let's hope for more of the same against Forest, network or not.
Yes, I think that's fair. I do still think though that if RD can be convinced/persuaded as to the merits of spending more money on older players with less resale value than 'hot prospects' we will see a shift in the kind of business done - for the better of the team. It's notable that Watt, Henderson and Bulot didn't actually cost him in transfer fees due to the network model, nor did he have to pay another team to sign Eagles, Diarra and Johnson, so we have to wait and see whether he's willing to actually pay transfer fees for players he won't make a lot of money on, directly.
Kermorgant was a mistake, that much is clear and I am sure RD knows it himself. There is no chance of him saying as much of course!
Talking of finance and network players, how much to acquire Watt, Buyens, Bulot and Ben Haim. I'd guess £5M minimum. And would an independent CAFC be able to land all of those given where we have come from?
Add Vetokele and Gudmundson from the open market plus Ben Haim, Bikey and now Johnson in defence and we have ourselves a new team just 12 months after that debacle at Bramall Lane.
The current team which is finding its feet in this division has been acquired virtually overnight. As I have always maintained the opportunity was there because most of the last squad was out of contract.
This squad hasn't won anything but there is now a very strong platform for 2015-16.
Out of which only Watt has a contract for next season, although personally I can live without Buyens and I'll need to see Bulot in his current form for a bit longer before I'm convinced this version is here for the medium term.
We'll see what lessons RD learns, but I doubt if he's had a head transplant since the end of the transfer window. Johnson, Diarra and Eagles are here because they were all available short term on the cheap and we looked to be at serious risk of relegation.
I like to see us win 3-0 as much as anyone, especially because I fear the consequences of League One, but I don't stand on my head every time the wind changes.
Fair enough, but RD can't have failed to notice the three signings coinciding with the vast improvement in performances - and results. The question is whether he will be stubborn enough to go back to network/foreign only or will he acknowledge they have their place - ALONGSIDE a core of Championship experience not INSTEAD OF. I don't for one minute think that over the next few seasons we won't see any network signings/loans again, but he might adapt the model instead of throwing it out entirely. It's not a question of 'head transplants' - three signings of Championship-proven players have transformed the team, he watches the performances according to KM and will have seen the difference it makes... and how much more attractive/lucrative a business opportunity the team can be.
I am not optimistic because of the results, I am optimistic because of the performances (even Derby, an improved second half showed plenty of spirit though not quite enough quality) and I honestly think RD is pragmatic enough to alter his plans in the name of profit. If adding a few Johnsons and Eagles to the likes of the Buyens and Bulots will make Charlton a solid championship team then he's got no reason not to make those additions.
Bit of a stretch to put the results down to Eagles or Diarra, though. Johnson I would agree has been influential, but no more so than Watt, Bulot and Henderson. So RD can just as easily argue it was the network that did it and with some justification.
I think this season has largely been dictated by a reluctance to pay what decent Championship forwards usually cost - a mistake Jimenez didn't make in 2012 - and RD's attempt to prove himself right over selling Kermorgant.
I recognise that you can easily burn money in this league and achieve very little, but everyone knew that the squad was screaming out for another striker and most that Tucudean would never be that player. It's evident Peeters was telling him that too.
Anyway let's hope for more of the same against Forest, network or not.
Yes, I think that's fair. I do still think though that if RD can be convinced/persuaded as to the merits of spending more money on older players with less resale value than 'hot prospects' we will see a shift in the kind of business done - for the better of the team. It's notable that Watt, Henderson and Bulot didn't actually cost him in transfer fees due to the network model, nor did he have to pay another team to sign Eagles, Diarra and Johnson, so we have to wait and see whether he's willing to actually pay transfer fees for players he won't make a lot of money on, directly.
Kermorgant was a mistake, that much is clear and I am sure RD knows it himself. There is no chance of him saying as much of course!
I hope you are right, and you may be. What though is your reading of the de Camargo fiasco at Standard?
I can't recall us paying a fee for kermogant.i don't think anyone of us new him when he signed only Powell. But how many would slag him before he even played for us if he had come from the network.you got to give these players a chance if it doesn't always workout. And if it doesn't fit here it might at another network club. Look at watt didn't work at liege but looks good for us. Thuram didn't work here he is 1st choice at liege now. Saying they are not good enough for championship is crap you don't no to you try. We signed Paul Williams for Woodford he played for England. Man Utd signed Falco for £57 million he looked class but he don't for them. We can try players for nothing and if it don't work send them back.i think our team is taking shape now and who knowswhat might have been if Henderson had stayed fit. With some of the youngsters coming through we should be more optimistic. COYR
I can't recall us paying a fee for kermogant.i don't think anyone of us new him when he signed only Powell. But how many would slag him before he even played for us if he had come from the network.you got to give these players a chance if it doesn't always workout. And if it doesn't fit here it might at another network club. Look at watt didn't work at liege but looks good for us. Thuram didn't work here he is 1st choice at liege now. Saying they are not good enough for championship is crap you don't no to you try. We signed Paul Williams for Woodford he played for England. Man Utd signed Falco for £57 million he looked class but he don't for them. We can try players for nothing and if it don't work send them back.i think our team is taking shape now and who knowswhat might have been if Henderson had stayed fit. With some of the youngsters coming through we should be more optimistic. COYR
We're not signing them for nothing, though, network or otherwise. The combined fees for Nego, Reza and Polish Pete were approximately £2m, according to the club's own accounts. Lepoint, Watt and Tucudean are likely to have been about £1m each. This is £5m added to the club's debt to Staprix and then charged at 3 per cent interest. We won't recover the outlay on at least four of the six and only one - Watt - looks likely to be successful. Five of those players would never have been signed but for RD's model and eventually that debt is likely to have to be paid down, even if it is when the club is sold. We're not going to get the money back by sending them on to St Trinians.
I agree clubs have always made mistakes in the transfer market and always will, the difference is that these were wilful and unnecessary mistakes made because of RD's flawed approach.
I can't recall us paying a fee for kermogant.i don't think anyone of us new him when he signed only Powell. But how many would slag him before he even played for us if he had come from the network.you got to give these players a chance if it doesn't always workout. And if it doesn't fit here it might at another network club. Look at watt didn't work at liege but looks good for us. Thuram didn't work here he is 1st choice at liege now. Saying they are not good enough for championship is crap you don't no to you try. We signed Paul Williams for Woodford he played for England. Man Utd signed Falco for £57 million he looked class but he don't for them. We can try players for nothing and if it don't work send them back.i think our team is taking shape now and who knowswhat might have been if Henderson had stayed fit. With some of the youngsters coming through we should be more optimistic. COYR
We're not signing them for nothing, though, network or otherwise. The combined fees for Nego, Reza and Polish Pete were approximately £2m, according to the club's own accounts. Lepoint, Watt and Tucudean are likely to have been about £1m each. This is £5m added to the club's debt to Staprix and then charged at 3 per cent interest. We won't recover the outlay on at least four of the six and only one - Watt - looks likely to be successful. Five of those players would never have been signed but for RD's model and eventually that debt is likely to have to be paid down, even if it is when the club is sold. We're not going to get the money back by sending them on to St Trinians.
I agree clubs have always made mistakes in the transfer market and always will, the difference is that these were wilful and unnecessary mistakes made because of RD's flawed approach.
I don't think it's the approach that is flawed but rather the execution. The key to making such a system work is to have a really good international scouting system. Portuguese clubs for example are really good at scouting in Brazil, finding rough diamond and selling them on the richer European clubs after a couple of years.
I can't recall us paying a fee for kermogant.i don't think anyone of us new him when he signed only Powell. But how many would slag him before he even played for us if he had come from the network.you got to give these players a chance if it doesn't always workout. And if it doesn't fit here it might at another network club. Look at watt didn't work at liege but looks good for us. Thuram didn't work here he is 1st choice at liege now. Saying they are not good enough for championship is crap you don't no to you try. We signed Paul Williams for Woodford he played for England. Man Utd signed Falco for £57 million he looked class but he don't for them. We can try players for nothing and if it don't work send them back.i think our team is taking shape now and who knowswhat might have been if Henderson had stayed fit. With some of the youngsters coming through we should be more optimistic. COYR
We're not signing them for nothing, though, network or otherwise. The combined fees for Nego, Reza and Polish Pete were approximately £2m, according to the club's own accounts. Lepoint, Watt and Tucudean are likely to have been about £1m each. This is £5m added to the club's debt to Staprix and then charged at 3 per cent interest. We won't recover the outlay on at least four of the six and only one - Watt - looks likely to be successful. Five of those players would never have been signed but for RD's model and eventually that debt is likely to have to be paid down, even if it is when the club is sold. We're not going to get the money back by sending them on to St Trinians.
I agree clubs have always made mistakes in the transfer market and always will, the difference is that these were wilful and unnecessary mistakes made because of RD's flawed approach.
I don't think it's the approach that is flawed but rather the execution. The key to making such a system work is to have a really good international scouting system. Portuguese clubs for example are really good at scouting in Brazil, finding rough diamond and selling them on the richer European clubs after a couple of years.
Perhaps, but it think it is underpinned by an unrealistic view about cost that ironically is itself resulting in money being wasted because what is spent goes on the wrong players.
We all know the squad was short in November but I suspect it was not strengthened because of concerns about the coach. Our season melted away during home fixtures against bottom teams but we are back now.
Team for 2015-16 on current contracts: Henderson Solly, Gomez, Bikey, Wiggins Gudmundsson, Cousins, Jackson, Harriott Vetokele, Watt
So let's not have any crying wolf about short term deals. I don't know how long Bulot has left with Liege but I'm fairly sure Buyens is out of contract this summer. We will see if they sign for us in 2015-16 or not.
M.Duchatelet has two choices this summer: sell players and carry on pissing about mid-table. Or retain current talent and seek to attract Bulot Buyens and Ben Haim back plus other better players onto new deals, i.e, continue with the momentum of the previous 12 months.
There is of course an elephant in the roo. Are Duchatelet and Luzon simply fattening up the squad before a summer sale?! Can't do much about that except defer my ST purchase and write long winded articles about our club taking the right path!
I would maintain that retaining the best players adds value to the squad and club by June 2016. Any players not good enough for a top eight challenge can go to STTV or Alcorcun. The prize of arriving in the FAPL far outweighs any short term transfer profits. I remain convinced we are on the right path to make a challenge next season.
We will always face the possibility of first team regulars contracts and loans expiring but I don't think that means the strategy is flawed. This squad was put together last summer and is maturing rapidly. It has been augmented recently and I think we are 2/3 of the way there.
We can now recognise a first XI and a style of play emerging. The club needs to take that forward and get extensions to Bulot and Gudmundsson because we are going somewhere.
Even Chris Powell was talking up our strike force! And they are both 22, both on contract until 2018. I've been banging on about the age profile of our squad for a while now but next August is where it counts with our front six moving into their prime (assuming Bulot stays)
Let's see how the final 12 games go but our new coach may deliver a very exciting proposition which might secure backing over the summer.
Am I really the only one who is interested in how inter-network transfer fees are agreed? We refer to a transfer "market" because there are supply and demand factors, external factors such as impending insolvency, and negotiating skills at work in that market. The only factor from that list which is involved in the network model is supply.
So how are the fees calculated, and who does it? What tools do they use? Transfermarkt? No, surely not?
No you make the money back when the successful ones Are sold to liege or bigger clubs.thats why he can turn over more players like polish Pete because if it didn't work here he can loan them to one of the other clubs.have you written of polish Pete because I haven't yet he might come back stronger and better.he still seems to be scoring.I think some of you have forgotten how we didn't sign anyone under Jimenez. It's going to be interesting on here when we do actually sell one off our players to liege.which will happen.
We all know the squad was short in November but I suspect it was not strengthened because of concerns about the coach. Our season melted away during home fixtures against bottom teams but we are back now.
Team for 2015-16 on current contracts: Henderson Solly, Gomez, Bikey, Wiggins Gudmundsson, Cousins, Jackson, Harriott Vetokele, Watt
So let's not have any crying wolf about short term deals. I don't know how long Bulot has left with Liege but I'm fairly sure Buyens is out of contract this summer. We will see if they sign for us in 2015-16 or not.
M.Duchatelet has two choices this summer: sell players and carry on pissing about mid-table. Or retain current talent and seek to attract Bulot Buyens and Ben Haim back plus other better players onto new deals, i.e, continue with the momentum of the previous 12 months.
There is of course an elephant in the roo. Are Duchatelet and Luzon simply fattening up the squad before a summer sale?! Can't do much about that except defer my ST purchase and write long winded articles about our club taking the right path!
I would maintain that retaining the best players adds value to the squad and club by June 2016. Any players not good enough for a top eight challenge can go to STTV or Alcorcun. The prize of arriving in the FAPL far outweighs any short term transfer profits. I remain convinced we are on the right path to make a challenge next season.
We will always face the possibility of first team regulars contracts and loans expiring but I don't think that means the strategy is flawed. This squad was put together last summer and is maturing rapidly. It has been augmented recently and I think we are 2/3 of the way there.
We can now recognise a first XI and a style of play emerging. The club needs to take that forward and get extensions to Bulot and Gudmundsson because we are going somewhere.
Even Chris Powell was talking up our strike force! And they are both 22, both on contract until 2018. I've been banging on about the age profile of our squad for a while now but next August is where it counts with our front six moving into their prime (assuming Bulot stays)
Let's see how the final 12 games go but our new coach may deliver a very exciting proposition which might secure backing over the summer.
So have you really just completely swung from incredibly pro-Network to something must be done anti-Network and then back to incredibly pro-Network or did you just have some kind of extended concussion that's worn off?
I can't recall us paying a fee for kermogant.i don't think anyone of us new him when he signed only Powell. But how many would slag him before he even played for us if he had come from the network.you got to give these players a chance if it doesn't always workout. And if it doesn't fit here it might at another network club. Look at watt didn't work at liege but looks good for us. Thuram didn't work here he is 1st choice at liege now. Saying they are not good enough for championship is crap you don't no to you try. We signed Paul Williams for Woodford he played for England. Man Utd signed Falco for £57 million he looked class but he don't for them. We can try players for nothing and if it don't work send them back.i think our team is taking shape now and who knowswhat might have been if Henderson had stayed fit. With some of the youngsters coming through we should be more optimistic. COYR
We're not signing them for nothing, though, network or otherwise. The combined fees for Nego, Reza and Polish Pete were approximately £2m, according to the club's own accounts. Lepoint, Watt and Tucudean are likely to have been about £1m each. This is £5m added to the club's debt to Staprix and then charged at 3 per cent interest. We won't recover the outlay on at least four of the six and only one - Watt - looks likely to be successful. Five of those players would never have been signed but for RD's model and eventually that debt is likely to have to be paid down, even if it is when the club is sold. We're not going to get the money back by sending them on to St Trinians.
I agree clubs have always made mistakes in the transfer market and always will, the difference is that these were wilful and unnecessary mistakes made because of RD's flawed approach.
I don't think it's the approach that is flawed but rather the execution. The key to making such a system work is to have a really good international scouting system. Portuguese clubs for example are really good at scouting in Brazil, finding rough diamond and selling them on the richer European clubs after a couple of years.
Perhaps, but it think it is underpinned by an unrealistic view about cost that ironically is itself resulting in money being wasted because what is spent goes on the wrong players.
If we buy the wrong players, then that's the fault of the scouts or whoever it is that's making the choices. And that applies to UK purchases, thinking back to the likes of Luke Varney, McLeod and Andy Gray....
I can't recall us paying a fee for kermogant.i don't think anyone of us new him when he signed only Powell. But how many would slag him before he even played for us if he had come from the network.you got to give these players a chance if it doesn't always workout. And if it doesn't fit here it might at another network club. Look at watt didn't work at liege but looks good for us. Thuram didn't work here he is 1st choice at liege now. Saying they are not good enough for championship is crap you don't no to you try. We signed Paul Williams for Woodford he played for England. Man Utd signed Falco for £57 million he looked class but he don't for them. We can try players for nothing and if it don't work send them back.i think our team is taking shape now and who knowswhat might have been if Henderson had stayed fit. With some of the youngsters coming through we should be more optimistic. COYR
We're not signing them for nothing, though, network or otherwise. The combined fees for Nego, Reza and Polish Pete were approximately £2m, according to the club's own accounts. Lepoint, Watt and Tucudean are likely to have been about £1m each. This is £5m added to the club's debt to Staprix and then charged at 3 per cent interest. We won't recover the outlay on at least four of the six and only one - Watt - looks likely to be successful. Five of those players would never have been signed but for RD's model and eventually that debt is likely to have to be paid down, even if it is when the club is sold. We're not going to get the money back by sending them on to St Trinians.
I agree clubs have always made mistakes in the transfer market and always will, the difference is that these were wilful and unnecessary mistakes made because of RD's flawed approach.
I don't think it's the approach that is flawed but rather the execution. The key to making such a system work is to have a really good international scouting system. Portuguese clubs for example are really good at scouting in Brazil, finding rough diamond and selling them on the richer European clubs after a couple of years.
Perhaps, but it think it is underpinned by an unrealistic view about cost that ironically is itself resulting in money being wasted because what is spent goes on the wrong players.
If we buy the wrong players, then that's the fault of the scouts or whoever it is that's making the choices. And that applies to UK purchases, thinking back to the likes of Luke Varney, McLeod and Andy Gray....
Yes, but where these players come from Standard Liege that's a more difficult argument to make. We sign them because they are at Standard Liege and already on the payroll. They are mistakes made at SL and the cost of those mistakes is to a greater or lesser extent being left on the CAFC books - Tucudean being the obvious example.
I know it's said in Jest Sometimes, But can the word "move on" be put in room 101 Because it's crass and boring now. When i say i want a 23 year old target man who is mobile and can do bullet headers, how am i talking about Yann, FFS. I got my wish to get Igor and Watt playing together, now the option of said striker above and Eagles and Aherne-grant, Playing a part and we would be getting somewhere.
As a history Buff, who talks about the Romans,Anglo Saxons, Tudors, and Stuarts, plus the house of Hanover, what was that you said?
Am I really the only one who is interested in how inter-network transfer fees are agreed? We refer to a transfer "market" because there are supply and demand factors, external factors such as impending insolvency, and negotiating skills at work in that market. The only factor from that list which is involved in the network model is supply.
So how are the fees calculated, and who does it? What tools do they use? Transfermarkt? No, surely not?
No, you are not alone. It's a question that I would like to be answered. I would imagine the two blokes with laptops have a say in it, which is a worry in itself as they can't even seem to be able to tell the difference between good players and bad ones, let alone what the hell they are all worth.
In terms of current players, I would like to see the better ones with shortish contracts, get improved/longer deals. Watt for example, could potentially see out his last season with us and move on for nothing, and we would be out of pocket. He is starting to resurrect his career with us and by the end of next season there could be all kinds of clubs sniffing around.
I can't recall us paying a fee for kermogant.i don't think anyone of us new him when he signed only Powell. But how many would slag him before he even played for us if he had come from the network.you got to give these players a chance if it doesn't always workout. And if it doesn't fit here it might at another network club. Look at watt didn't work at liege but looks good for us. Thuram didn't work here he is 1st choice at liege now. Saying they are not good enough for championship is crap you don't no to you try. We signed Paul Williams for Woodford he played for England. Man Utd signed Falco for £57 million he looked class but he don't for them. We can try players for nothing and if it don't work send them back.i think our team is taking shape now and who knowswhat might have been if Henderson had stayed fit. With some of the youngsters coming through we should be more optimistic. COYR
We're not signing them for nothing, though, network or otherwise. The combined fees for Nego, Reza and Polish Pete were approximately £2m, according to the club's own accounts. Lepoint, Watt and Tucudean are likely to have been about £1m each. This is £5m added to the club's debt to Staprix and then charged at 3 per cent interest. We won't recover the outlay on at least four of the six and only one - Watt - looks likely to be successful. Five of those players would never have been signed but for RD's model and eventually that debt is likely to have to be paid down, even if it is when the club is sold. We're not going to get the money back by sending them on to St Trinians.
I agree clubs have always made mistakes in the transfer market and always will, the difference is that these were wilful and unnecessary mistakes made because of RD's flawed approach.
I don't think it's the approach that is flawed but rather the execution. The key to making such a system work is to have a really good international scouting system. Portuguese clubs for example are really good at scouting in Brazil, finding rough diamond and selling them on the richer European clubs after a couple of years.
Perhaps, but it think it is underpinned by an unrealistic view about cost that ironically is itself resulting in money being wasted because what is spent goes on the wrong players.
If we buy the wrong players, then that's the fault of the scouts or whoever it is that's making the choices. And that applies to UK purchases, thinking back to the likes of Luke Varney, McLeod and Andy Gray....
Yes, but where these players come from Standard Liege that's a more difficult argument to make. We sign them because they are at Standard Liege and already on the payroll. They are mistakes made at SL and the cost of those mistakes is to a greater or lesser extent being left on the CAFC books - Tucudean being the obvious example.
When I say scouts I wasn't referring to Phil Chapple and his team, but rather the scouts that RD has for his network, as I assume the idea of the network is to pool scouting resources to some extent. Whether the player was signed for us, SL or one of the other network clubs, it's this initial purchase which is the most important one. Polish Pete was clearly scouted and signed by someone, and despite him being a Charlton signing from outside, I assume someone in the network was responsible as Phil Chapple wouldn't be scouting the Dutch second division!
Comments
Add Vetokele and Gudmundson from the open market plus Ben Haim, Bikey and now Johnson in defence and we have ourselves a new team just 12 months after that debacle at Bramall Lane.
The current team which is finding its feet in this division has been acquired virtually overnight. As I have always maintained the opportunity was there because most of the last squad was out of contract.
This squad hasn't won anything but there is now a very strong platform for 2015-16.
You could easily fit yann in this starting 11 and he would compliment watt and igor perfectly
The reason we pumped long balls to him was not as a tactical solution, it was down to the lack of confidence within the team and mgmt, players hid, they wanted rid of the ball and he was so good at putting himself amongst the opposition that cowardly players used him as their outlet,
The shame was that they didn't need to but we failed to overcome that issue and became predictable
Like it or not that could only be fixed on the training ground and instead of being brave we chose to use it, and the more cuts, bandages and bruising he got the more it was forgiven
We'll see what lessons RD learns, but I doubt if he's had a head transplant since the end of the transfer window. Johnson, Diarra and Eagles are here because they were all available short term on the cheap and we looked to be at serious risk of relegation.
I like to see us win 3-0 as much as anyone, especially because I fear the consequences of League One, but I don't stand on my head every time the wind changes.
But I do worry about signings like Lepoint a total donkey and despite being decent, four centre backs over 30 and other older players who do not fit the plan for the future. However I'd like TBH, RJ, Eagles and Diarra on board longer. Perhaps Bulot and AA on perms.
I am not optimistic because of the results, I am optimistic because of the performances (even Derby, an improved second half showed plenty of spirit though not quite enough quality) and I honestly think RD is pragmatic enough to alter his plans in the name of profit. If adding a few Johnsons and Eagles to the likes of the Buyens and Bulots will make Charlton a solid championship team then he's got no reason not to make those additions.
I think this season has largely been dictated by a reluctance to pay what decent Championship forwards usually cost - a mistake Jimenez didn't make in 2012 - and RD's attempt to prove himself right over selling Kermorgant.
I recognise that you can easily burn money in this league and achieve very little, but everyone knew that the squad was screaming out for another striker and most that Tucudean would never be that player. It's evident Peeters was telling him that too.
Anyway let's hope for more of the same against Forest, network or not.
Kermorgant was a mistake, that much is clear and I am sure RD knows it himself. There is no chance of him saying as much of course!
I agree clubs have always made mistakes in the transfer market and always will, the difference is that these were wilful and unnecessary mistakes made because of RD's flawed approach.
Team for 2015-16 on current contracts:
Henderson
Solly, Gomez, Bikey, Wiggins
Gudmundsson, Cousins, Jackson, Harriott
Vetokele, Watt
So let's not have any crying wolf about short term deals. I don't know how long Bulot has left with Liege but I'm fairly sure Buyens is out of contract this summer. We will see if they sign for us in 2015-16 or not.
M.Duchatelet has two choices this summer: sell players and carry on pissing about mid-table. Or retain current talent and seek to attract Bulot Buyens and Ben Haim back plus other better players onto new deals, i.e, continue with the momentum of the previous 12 months.
There is of course an elephant in the roo. Are Duchatelet and Luzon simply fattening up the squad before a summer sale?! Can't do much about that except defer my ST purchase and write long winded articles about our club taking the right path!
I would maintain that retaining the best players adds value to the squad and club by June 2016. Any players not good enough for a top eight challenge can go to STTV or Alcorcun. The prize of arriving in the FAPL far outweighs any short term transfer profits. I remain convinced we are on the right path to make a challenge next season.
We will always face the possibility of first team regulars contracts and loans expiring but I don't think that means the strategy is flawed. This squad was put together last summer and is maturing rapidly. It has been augmented recently and I think we are 2/3 of the way there.
We can now recognise a first XI and a style of play emerging. The club needs to take that forward and get extensions to Bulot and Gudmundsson because we are going somewhere.
Even Chris Powell was talking up our strike force! And they are both 22, both on contract until 2018. I've been banging on about the age profile of our squad for a while now but next August is where it counts with our front six moving into their prime (assuming Bulot stays)
Let's see how the final 12 games go but our new coach may deliver a very exciting proposition which might secure backing over the summer.
So how are the fees calculated, and who does it? What tools do they use? Transfermarkt? No, surely not?
Because it's crass and boring now.
When i say i want a 23 year old target man who is mobile and can do bullet headers, how am i talking about Yann, FFS.
I got my wish to get Igor and Watt playing together, now the option of said striker above and Eagles and Aherne-grant, Playing a part and we would be getting somewhere.
As a history Buff, who talks about the Romans,Anglo Saxons, Tudors, and Stuarts, plus the house of Hanover, what was that you said?
Move on................!!!
In terms of current players, I would like to see the better ones with shortish contracts, get improved/longer deals. Watt for example, could potentially see out his last season with us and move on for nothing, and we would be out of pocket. He is starting to resurrect his career with us and by the end of next season there could be all kinds of clubs sniffing around.
Whether the player was signed for us, SL or one of the other network clubs, it's this initial purchase which is the most important one. Polish Pete was clearly scouted and signed by someone, and despite him being a Charlton signing from outside, I assume someone in the network was responsible as Phil Chapple wouldn't be scouting the Dutch second division!
None of Yann's bromance boys on here yet to point out he scored 2 last night?