Gross Misconduct

BowieAddick

Hi wondering if anyone can give any advice, my husband lost his temper at work with someone on Friday and mouthed off at him in a fairly industrial manner, he didn't threaten him but admits he was offensive.
This guy is now complaining to the General Manager of the company that this constitutes gross misconduct on my husbands part and wants him sacked.
Any advice would be greatly appreciated

Henry Irving

BA, inbox me.

Airman Brown

I shouldn't think the complainant's view of whether it's gross misconduct is of any importance. Proper process is for the complainant to raise a grievance. The employer then decides whether a disciplinary process is warranted. The process then decides the sanction, not the complainant.

Leroy Ambrose

There's no easy answer to this. Every workplace is different. It may set out in a staff handbook, or under terms & conditions of employment exactly what does/does not constitute gross misconduct, or it may not - leaving it much more open to interpretation. I would imagine it would very much depend on the situation and the circumstances surrounding it. If there was actual verbal abuse involved (even if wasn't specific threats) then it may very well constitute gross misconduct. If it was general swearing (i.e. not aimed at someone, but rather swearing in general frustration based on someone else's behaviour) then that's probably likely to be looked on more leniently. In any case, despite what the other party may want, they can't just demand someone be sacked - due process will have to be followed. If there's a Trade Union in the workplace, he would be well advised to seek their help via an accredited rep. If not, then he should probably be upfront about it, offer to apologise and bury the hatchet, and speak to HR if necessary.

All that is my opinion, of course - I was a Trade Union official for six years, so know a little about this kind of thing, but am not a professional.

cafcdave123

As I understand it, it depends on how offensive he was, I he told the c#nt to get f#cked it’ll depend on the company bosses and what they want to do (could still be used as an excuse to bin him off tbh).

Any mention of race/religion/sexual orientation then if the guy pushes it then there is very little the company can do.

Elthamaddick

did he lose his temper with a colleague or client?

LenGlover

There must presumably have been a reason he lost his temper?

The other party could be equally culpable.

harveys_gardener

Can't imagine running to the boss complaining "he called me nasty, nasty names" will cut him any favours. Notwithstanding what the company rules are, it might boil down to how the two individuals are viewed by the GM and how important they are to the company.

jdsd42

I would seek advice from the Citizens advice Bereau -

maybe_baby

Ask your husband to try apologising to the gentleman concerned...it cuts out an awful lot of na na na na na.

BowieAddick

EA - it was with a colleague.

There was no mention of race or religion or anything like that he called him a few choice words (including the two quoted by cafcdave123), it was over a work issue where he felt the other guy was taking the piss and not doing what he had been asked (by someone else) leaving my husband to do the work instead.

In terms of value to the company, I think that is a no contest as my husband builds Outside Broadcast Trucks for them and the other guy is the storeman.

BowieAddick

He has apologised this morning but the guy seems determined to take this further with management or at the very least make him sweat.

maybe_baby

BowieAddick said:

He has apologised this morning but the guy seems determined to take this further with management or at the very least make him sweat.

The apology will take the sting out of the complaint...well done your other half.

lolwray

Airman Brown said:

I shouldn't think the complainant's view of whether it's gross misconduct is of any importance. Proper process is for the complainant to raise a grievance. The employer then decides whether a disciplinary process is warranted. The process then decides the sanction, not the complainant.

this

BowieAddick

Leroy, it is only a small firm in terms of permanent staff so no union rep or anything like that, HR basically consists of the General Manager I believe who is the one handling the guys complaint. He admits he did swear at the guy and as I mentioned has apologised.
It seems to me that they are waiting to see what the complainant wants to do which is strange as has been previously said he can make a complaint but it is up to the company what punishment is handed out.

nth_london_addick

It is standard practice in most firms to ask the complainant what they would like to see as the resolution to a complaint of this nature

I wouldve thought that the complainant wouldve follwed the grievance procedure outlined by the company in its disciplinary and grievance policy

This does not by no means , mean that the company follow the wishes of the complainant,

I would say if your husband has no history of anything like this and shows true regret and remorse in the way he handled the situation then a warning would prob be the outcome

By offering an appology already i would say that would be a big plus in his corner

Swisdom

His employer are unlikely to want to do a full investigation, disciplinary etc and would probably rather sit the parties down and talk it through. Shake hands at the end of it and move on. Provided the language wasn't too horrendous this should be relatively straightforward.

Worst case scenario - Hubby might have to take an official warning on file but that will go away after a couple of years

If all else fails - speak to the GMB union. Anyone can join and they would be entitled to work alongside you through a disciplinary hearing etc. They'll know the loopholes or ensure fair play.

Jayajosh

Footballers do it all the time and never get sacked so I wouldn't worry too much. We all get passionate about our work at times.

BowieAddick

NLA - I am not sure there is a disciplinary and grievance policy.
He does regret the way he handled the situation and the stupid thing is it is only because he is so conscientious and work orientated (60-70 hrs a week sometimes more) that he got frustrated by someone else who he saw as taking the piss and not pulling their weight that he lost his rag. It wasn't that he was having to do the work that annoyed him but that the other guy wasn't doing the job the company is paying him for and because he cares passionately for the company he lost his temper

nth_london_addick

BA

During my time at coca cola i held the same values with regards to my work and did similar hours

During that time i did have moments where i done the same my commitment and passion for my work and the company always played in my favour

Without offering false hope i am sure if things happen how you say he will be fine

There has to be a code of conduct i would pressume within the business it may be worth looking into that just to ease your nerves

It is also worthwhile remembering tgat if your hubby has no previous disciplinary record to speak of dismissing people is very hard for all businesses to do without entering a legal minefield

se9addick

You never know BA, the boss might share your husbands opinion of the contribution of this employee to his company and say "fair enough"!

Rubbish situation but hopefully sense will prevail considering it was a one off.

Goonerhater

Gross mis-conduct dosnt mean you get the bullet--it could --- but its not written in the big HR bible that it does. If hubbs has a clean record and is a valued worker it will at most(or should) mean a written warning(maybe final written warning).

BowieAddick

Thanks everyone feeling a bit better just have to see what tomorrow brings

BowieAddick

An update on my husband's situation, it is 99% certain that the guy has dropped his complaint just waiting for confirmation. Breathed a huge sigh of relief and told him to keep his mouth shut in future.
Thanks to everyone who offered advice it really helped, when my husband went in this morning and started talking about procedures and getting union advice I think they convinced the other guy to accept the apology and move on.
Thanks again

nth_london_addick

Great news and breath easy BA

Tell hubby to phone you and rant in future

se9addick

Good news BA

maybe_baby

Apologies usually give peace to all parties...nice to hear a happy ending.

MrOneLung

But if it doesnt settle down I know someone who knows someone who could disappear the other fella....

BowieAddick

I will bear that in mind MrOneLung

Miserableoldgit

MrOneLung said:

But if it doesnt settle down I know someone who knows someone who could disappear the other fella....

"Freemasons" thread ?

masicat

Miserableoldgit said:

MrOneLung said:

But if it doesnt settle down I know someone who knows someone who could disappear the other fella....

"Freemasons" thread ?

I will sort today.