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Video Referrals

Briefly switched on to the England v Netherlands Hockey World Cup Semi Final yesterday. I noticed that they had a video referral system in place where the captain could question a decision and the decision went to a TV referee who could look at different angles. It worked very well.

I would argue that one of the arguments to not having this in football is because you can go 5 mins without a stoppage. This is similar to hockey, and as I said, it worked!

The referee also had a microphone, every word could be heard. This allowed decisions to be much more clearly explained and understood.

I thought it was worth posting as it shows just another sport moving on with the times that I didn't realise had.

We've had two days of football in this tournament and already it is being plagued by bad decisions.

When will this sport adapt?...
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Comments

  • The commentators were talking about a referral system in football during one of the games last night.

    Each manager having one referral during the game.

    I don't like the idea myself.
  • The commentators were talking about a referral system in football during one of the games last night.

    Each manager having one referral during the game.

    I don't like the idea myself.

    think one is too few, maybe two i think. I think its a great idea, won't take long and at least it humanises the referee. They make mistakes, if they make the odd big incorrect decision then it can be overturned. What pisses off players and managers is that after making an incorrect, split second decision, all whilst running around the pitch, even if the referee realises he's made the wrong call, he very rarely changes it. Nobody can argue with video replays and technology. It's made games like cricket and rugby keep on respecting the officials.
  • Every other major sport has adapted cricket tennis rugby and the rest! Football is still in the dark ages compared to the reat! There will always be controversy until something changes!
  • Two appeals per game. Original decision stands unless video referee has clear evidence to support a reversal. Not rocket science and would avoid much unnecessary controversy.
  • The argument that the FA has always used against any changes in the past was that the game should be the same from the highest levels right down to grass roots. Whilst I can see the logic in that, the financial implications of a wrong decision can be huge. Football has change dramatically in the last 30 years and to keep it as the No1 sport in the world, we have to keep up with the times.

    Some might argue that the game has survived for well over 100 years without video replays and such, but as there was no such technology around, it's a pointless argument.

    Personally, I'm all for any change that improves the game...............
  • Should be kept to one appeal for glaring mistakes only IMO, so the appealing team is 100% sure they are making the correct decision.
  • Should be kept to one appeal for glaring mistakes only IMO, so the appealing team is 100% sure they are making the correct decision.

    If an appeals system was introduced there would be a lot of appeals rejected, initially at least. Ironically, such a process would help to demonstrate how difficult a job referees do and how often the officials get it right. Teams would need to figure out when to appeal. The entertainment might even be enhanced as result.
  • edited June 2014

    The argument that the FA has always used against any changes in the past was that the game should be the same from the highest levels right down to grass roots. Whilst I can see the logic in that, the financial implications of a wrong decision can be huge. Football has change dramatically in the last 30 years and to keep it as the No1 sport in the world, we have to keep up with the times.

    Some might argue that the game has survived for well over 100 years without video replays and such, but as there was no such technology around, it's a pointless argument.

    Personally, I'm all for any change that improves the game...............

    village cricket doesn't have access to video replays, third umpires and referals, but seems to be doing quite fine without it!

    Edit: this is in support of replays and referals, just because you change the system slightly at the top does not create an imbalance down the bottom
  • I have been saying for years that Football needs the appeal system, each manager has one appeal a game, that if he is shown to be right he gets back, that way they would only use it on major incidents, as they risk losing them for a more important call if they are wrong.

    I think it is ridiculous that the most popular and biggest sport in the world, still has games being decided by human error, this is not about replacing Referee's it is about assisting them.

    If the TV companies can get a clear cut replay on screen for us viewing public within 30 seconds, then really no excuse for in the stadium, they could even make it part of the show for fans inside the stadium by showing it on the big screen.
  • edited June 2014

    Should be kept to one appeal for glaring mistakes only IMO, so the appealing team is 100% sure they are making the correct decision.

    If an appeals system was introduced there would be a lot of appeals rejected, initially at least. Ironically, such a process would help to demonstrate how difficult a job referees do and how often the officials get it right. Teams would need to figure out when to appeal. The entertainment might even be enhanced as result.
    eg Mexico vs. Cameroon yesterday. Mexico should have had two goals before they did finally take the lead. However, under a single review system, I imagine they wouldn't have chanced their arm at appealing a marginal offside call. For the second goal, on the other hand, when the ball flicked off the Cameroonian head, that would've been a perfect opportunity for an appeal and a goal to be given.

    Another great example where an appeal system could've been used so far was the Brazil penalty in the first game.
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  • The argument that the FA has always used against any changes in the past was that the game should be the same from the highest levels right down to grass roots. Whilst I can see the logic in that, the financial implications of a wrong decision can be huge. Football has change dramatically in the last 30 years and to keep it as the No1 sport in the world, we have to keep up with the times.

    Some might argue that the game has survived for well over 100 years without video replays and such, but as there was no such technology around, it's a pointless argument.

    Personally, I'm all for any change that improves the game...............

    village cricket doesn't have access to video replays, third umpires and referals, but seems to be doing quite fine without it!
    Exactly. They need to realise that it's almost a different sport at these levels. Do they honestly think sunday league teams are going to give up cos they don't have goal line technology or video replays? Amateur players of sports play for the enjoyment.
  • One appeal per half. Get the appeal right, well done, you used your appeal well. Turns out the ref was right, you lose a substitute. No subs left? No appeals left.

  • Think it would be great to have referrals/appeals, with a limit. You'd find player's honesty would increase. For example, you wouldn't pretend to get fouled, for fear that either the opposition appeal and you get booked for diving, or your manager appeals on your behalf and wastes one of his appeals on your cheatery.
  • In cricket the referrals system has gone on to improve the standard of umpiring in the game! And less terrible decisions are being made!
  • edited June 2014

    Every other major sport has adapted cricket tennis rugby and the rest! Football is still in the dark ages compared to the reat! There will always be controversy until something changes!

    More people watch football than any of those other sports combined. They watch it because it's the greatest sport on earth warts and all. I don't want it sanitised and controversy free.

    Leave the beautiful game alone. Cheats will still cheat and refs will still make bad or mistaken decisions and in the vast majority of matches players will get on and play the game.

    Just my opinion.

  • Just out of curiosity how long did it take for the decision to be made in the Hockey match after it went to video replays

    People say that video referrals will slow the game down but how long does it take for the Referee to tell everyone to fuck off when they surround him demanding that he change his mind... You've seen it take ages sometimes and if you introduce the referral system you can instantly have a rule saying that if players surround the ref (Apart from the Captain who's job it is to appeal) they get an instant yellow card regardless
  • I have said for ages Ref's need to have a microphone, it works in Rugby helps explain decisions to people watching and stops players arguing with him
  • In cricket the referrals system has gone on to improve the standard of umpiring in the game! And less terrible decisions are being made!

    plus if one is made, they just refer, the umpire changes the decision and everyone moves on! There's no "this umpire is a cheat/blind" it's just "we all make mistakes, lets bowl the next one" etc
  • Cricket is slow and has a natural pause after every ball. Football is a different beast altogether.
  • Cricket is slow and has a natural pause after every ball. Football is a different beast altogether.

    there's a natural pause when the ball goes out of play, or when a penalty/free kick/red card is given. Some would say football is also a slow sport.
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  • Im sure i reas an article a couple of years ago that said on average, the ball is only active 60 odd minutes of a 90 minute match, so i think they have time for 30 seconds to check a TV monitor two or three times a game.
  • So many scenarios in football where technology would spoil the sport.
  • No. Not needed, if you are not happy with the game I have loved for over forty years, watch something else.

    In cricket the umpires now call for replays of run outs when the batsman is virtually past the stumps because they are shit scared of making an error.

    A rugby game between Bath and Worcester with no serious injuries, had eighteen and a half minutes added on a few weeks back, it took six minutes for the video ref to make up his mind over whether one incident was a sin bin offence.

    Even with replays too many decisions are a matter of opinion, not fact. Two people see the same incident, one thinks it's a pen, the other doesn't.

    Leave it be, warts and all.
  • So many scenarios in football where technology would spoil the sport.

    name some

    No. Not needed, if you are not happy with the game I have loved for over forty years, watch something else.

    In cricket the umpires now call for replays of run outs when the batsman is virtually past the stumps because they are shit scared of making an error.

    A rugby game between Bath and Worcester with no serious injuries, had eighteen and a half minutes added on a few weeks back, it took six minutes for the video ref to make up his mind over whether one incident was a sin bin offence.

    Even with replays too many decisions are a matter of opinion, not fact. Two people see the same incident, one thinks it's a pen, the other doesn't.

    Leave it be, warts and all.

    if it comes to "two people have differing opinions" then like in cricket it's "umpire's call" so the on field ref's decision would stand.

    for cricket it's more because the ball is thrown at such a pace that even when a player looks like they're in they could still be out (bat not planted on the ground when bails are removed).

    Does anyone really care if they have to stay in a ground 6 minutes longer? It also allows the players to take on water/take instructions from the manager. I've yet to see compelling arguements against referals that doesn't include "i want to go home a bit earlier to do the hoovering my missus wanted me to do this morning"
  • So many scenarios in football where technology would spoil the sport.

    name some

    No. Not needed, if you are not happy with the game I have loved for over forty years, watch something else.

    In cricket the umpires now call for replays of run outs when the batsman is virtually past the stumps because they are shit scared of making an error.

    A rugby game between Bath and Worcester with no serious injuries, had eighteen and a half minutes added on a few weeks back, it took six minutes for the video ref to make up his mind over whether one incident was a sin bin offence.

    Even with replays too many decisions are a matter of opinion, not fact. Two people see the same incident, one thinks it's a pen, the other doesn't.

    Leave it be, warts and all.

    if it comes to "two people have differing opinions" then like in cricket it's "umpire's call" so the on field ref's decision would stand.

    for cricket it's more because the ball is thrown at such a pace that even when a player looks like they're in they could still be out (bat not planted on the ground when bails are removed).

    Does anyone really care if they have to stay in a ground 6 minutes longer? It also allows the players to take on water/take instructions from the manager. I've yet to see compelling arguements against referals that doesn't include "i want to go home a bit earlier to do the hoovering my missus wanted me to do this morning"
    Sorry, no proper answer to any of my points there. Almost all cricket decisions are matters of fact, almost all football ones are matters of opinion. Club cricket umpire friend of mine says the same thing as me about run outs, I will defer to him.

    Six minutes that means you miss the last train home? I know that can happen now, but it would be more frequent - and I mentioned eighteen minutes, by the way KA...

    The big argument all you people who want to turn the game on its head use is about getting it 100% right, what's the point in another bloke looking at a replay if when he tells the ref he thinks he got it wrong, the ref disagrees and the original decision stands, as you suggest? What's the point in referring it at all if the ref already has his opinion?

    No sorry mate, nothing to convince me there.
  • edited June 2014

    So many scenarios in football where technology would spoil the sport.

    name some

    No. Not needed, if you are not happy with the game I have loved for over forty years, watch something else.

    In cricket the umpires now call for replays of run outs when the batsman is virtually past the stumps because they are shit scared of making an error.

    A rugby game between Bath and Worcester with no serious injuries, had eighteen and a half minutes added on a few weeks back, it took six minutes for the video ref to make up his mind over whether one incident was a sin bin offence.

    Even with replays too many decisions are a matter of opinion, not fact. Two people see the same incident, one thinks it's a pen, the other doesn't.

    Leave it be, warts and all.

    if it comes to "two people have differing opinions" then like in cricket it's "umpire's call" so the on field ref's decision would stand.

    for cricket it's more because the ball is thrown at such a pace that even when a player looks like they're in they could still be out (bat not planted on the ground when bails are removed).

    Does anyone really care if they have to stay in a ground 6 minutes longer? It also allows the players to take on water/take instructions from the manager. I've yet to see compelling arguements against referals that doesn't include "i want to go home a bit earlier to do the hoovering my missus wanted me to do this morning"
    Sorry, no proper answer to any of my points there. Almost all cricket decisions are matters of fact, almost all football ones are matters of opinion. Club cricket umpire friend of mine says the same thing as me about run outs, I will defer to him.

    Six minutes that means you miss the last train home? I know that can happen now, but it would be more frequent - and I mentioned eighteen minutes, by the way KA...

    The big argument all you people who want to turn the game on its head use is about getting it 100% right, what's the point in another bloke looking at a replay if when he tells the ref he thinks he got it wrong, the ref disagrees and the original decision stands, as you suggest? What's the point in referring it at all if the ref already has his opinion?

    No sorry mate, nothing to convince me there.
    I think it's more you didn't understand what I said. If there's a moment where the fourth official feels there's a grey area (like there is with cricket, LBW's and catches) so there was a small amount of contact for a penalty then the original on field referee's decision stands. If there is clearly an incorrect decision (a player diving for a penalty, a player being clattered to the floor and no penalty given, a two footed tackle getting off scott free, or a player diving to get some one sent off - there's a whole host of things that a ref can get wrong or not see) then the fourth official will inform the referee that he has made the incorrect decision and would advise to change it. Only after a appeal by one of the teams

    As i said, there can be a situation where the batsman does not have his feet grounded behind the line and his batted ungrounded when it would look to the naked eye to probably be safe. It happens a lot more than you would think, it's simply a precautionary measure. Plus, it's not a referral by the team, it's by the umpire and was bought in a lot longer before team referals and doesn't count towards any team's referrals. There is no other measure bought in before hand in football that a referee would need constant reassurances about like run outs. Only having 1 or 2 referrals each side per game to contest a decision would be used very sparingly, like it is in cricket.

    It's not turning the game on it's head, it's literally giving the referee's the technology that's already there, and is already displayed on big screens in every premier league stadium.

    I think claiming that the referral system would mean that people would miss trains is clutching a straws frankly. This is the way that sport is going and football will eventually succum to the changes. You better start swimmin...
  • Sadly I fear you are right. Modern life is shit.
  • Watching rugby has been massively improved - more understanding of the complexities all round - the rare long wait (it's usually a couple of minutes, max as I'm sure you know Algarve!) is always filled with chat on the terraces either about the issue under review or a catch up on the game in general. Results of referrals are always greeted with a sense of excitement. But rugby and cricket are not football.

    The opening Brazil game would have been utterly different, and far better, had technology spotted the cheating dive in the 70th minute. Football would have won in that case, and many others - hand of god anyone? Geoff Hurst's 'goal'. Teams (and countries) have wallowed for years after the injustice of events such as these. This is not good for the game and in this day and age, totally unnecessary.

    An added bonus with referral systems is that players would be far less likely to dive/claim headbutts etc if they knew their actions would be reviewed.
  • Watching rugby has been massively improved - more understanding of the complexities all round - the rare long wait (it's usually a couple of minutes, max as I'm sure you know Algarve!) is always filled with chat on the terraces either about the issue under review or a catch up on the game in general. Results of referrals are always greeted with a sense of excitement. But rugby and cricket are not football.

    The opening Brazil game would have been utterly different, and far better, had technology spotted the cheating dive in the 70th minute. Football would have won in that case, and many others - hand of god anyone? Geoff Hurst's 'goal'. Teams (and countries) have wallowed for years after the injustice of events such as these. This is not good for the game and in this day and age, totally unnecessary.

    An added bonus with referral systems is that players would be far less likely to dive/claim headbutts etc if they knew their actions would be reviewed.

    Jeez. I really hope we never get this in football.

  • Great discussion development there Shooters.
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