What a crazy situation. I don't get what their owner gets out of this, based in US, pumps over £10M into a two bob club in S London each year, a club that is generally unpopular and realistically has zero chance of getting into the PL.
Why would he continue for any length of time?
Bust within 5 years with Bolton, Middlesbrough, Leeds, Brentford and others.
Maybe he likes two bob clubs. Maybe he bought the club with the intention of trying to make some money but then got the bug. It does happen, even for a scummy club like ours.
I'm sure Blackpool had 'zero chance of getting into the PL' as well.
I could be wrong but it sounds like it grates on you that we have a chairman prepared to bankroll us.
It doesn't grate on me - just cold calculated observation In 12 months our squad has become younger, better and we are in the top eight for the first time since 2008. Our losses are down by £3.5m over the last two seasons and we have one or two players who are a bit special.
I hadn't realised the financials were that bad and can see why your chairman voted in favour of loss limits going up again - as you simply have no plan to cut back. Clubs have been bank rolled for years but sooner or later the owner runs out of money or loses interest.
It's not entirely clear what is the ambition of our new owner but he has made a big difference in less than a year. A win on Saturday will give us three points but will also be a symbolic victory of new vs old.
You continue to treat the consequences of the cup run and the fees from the sale of key players in January as if they were structural and have an ongoing effect on the position.
The structural change in 2013/14 was the reduction in playing budget, by the previous lot, which almost got us relegated. If RD has provided a squad of the current quality within that budget then that is the real gain, but it isn't £3.5m or anything like that, as you well know.
To compensate you put great weight on outsourcing catering and shirt sponsorship, while ignoring falling ticket revenue. It is unrealistic - or at best disproportionate.
What's left? Paul Hart is a potential saving of £200k, maybe the same again for miscellaneous other staff changes.
Based on known factors Charlton's 2014/15 loss seems likely to be higher than last year's, unless one of two things happen - a similar FA Cup run (or perhaps the play-off final) or the sale of a key player (taking into account compensation for Poyet).
That is RD's dilemma, but you can't have it both ways. If he ups the player budget to chase the PL the losses are likely to rise further as well.
You continue to attack a cut in losses of CAFC as if this is a bad thing... There are a number of changes in the P&L happening simultaneously - I observe a simple downwards trend in losses over the last few years and conclude we are in a better place than at any time since 2007. inflation busting losses year on year not only threaten the stability of clubs but they also take the club further and further away from fans simply because fan efforts and small increments on the gate become a drop in the debt ocean It enables the club benefactors and chairman to tell fans where to go unless they have access to £50m in order to fund five years losses.
I haven't seen the detailed P&L for Cafc for last season but the bottom line was just £100k different to the supporters Trust forecast or 0.5% of turnover. And the club CFO has stated that the budgeted loss this season will be similar. The FFP result is down from £6m to £2.5m over two seasons. This is for a variety of reasons. And it is before the seven figure contribution this season (and next) from the shirt and catering deals. For sure one can debate the mix of changes but this new era is going to see one CAFC revenue stream grow beyond recognition...
Given the step change in the quality of players at Cafc it seems rational to anticipate a step change in transfer revenue received in forthcoming years. In case people haven't noticed Standard Liege sold €25m of players over the summer. Given that Liege have been owned for over three years by M.Duchatelet it's reasonable to expect him to attempt to repeat this with CAFC.
Of course we are eighth and not fourth or even second. How we fare over the next few games and what player business we do in January will tell us whether we are to be a selling club or a net purchaser of talent to push on for a Wembley appearance.
The good news is that we are in a position tonight for this to be a realistic proposition over the next 18 months. And that's a long way from last February as Holloway has acknowledged in the media. A first win vs Millwall since 1996 and perhaps more fans will dare to believe again?!
Given the prospect of a guaranteed £125m payout over five years for achieving promotion it also appears rational that M.Duchatelet will continue to add to the squad to enhance our chances. Especially given that even if we fail, we will attract significant offers for our top players in order to pay the bills.
What's confusing is why we are discussing success, play-offs and selling players for top dollar on a thread dedicated to Millwall
What a crazy situation. I don't get what their owner gets out of this, based in US, pumps over £10M into a two bob club in S London each year, a club that is generally unpopular and realistically has zero chance of getting into the PL.
Why would he continue for any length of time?
Bust within 5 years with Bolton, Middlesbrough, Leeds, Brentford and others.
Maybe he likes two bob clubs. Maybe he bought the club with the intention of trying to make some money but then got the bug. It does happen, even for a scummy club like ours.
I'm sure Blackpool had 'zero chance of getting into the PL' as well.
I could be wrong but it sounds like it grates on you that we have a chairman prepared to bankroll us.
No, what grates is that a scummy club like yours fails to see the long term benefits of FFP.
The long term benefits would have been a more competitive league with lower costs and clubs staying in business. Huge debts are simply not sustainable.
P.s. is your manager completly off his rocker?
Do what? The FFP protects those with money and the infrastructure to spend more. How does a little club make an impact if it always has to spend within its limited revenues? You need some leeway for clubs to break out of their cycle and into the next tier.
You cannot begin to accuse us of splashing any cash. You've just gone & spent a reported £2.4m on a striker.....our transfer record is £800k from 1989!
We are a small club trying to compete with lots of bigger clubs in this league. It's the wages that are a killer, but with cliubs like yourselves spending millions, we have to pay the wage to attract some sort of standard of player.
I do agree however with another post that we need to restructure in a way that has us set up as the leading football academy for south London and Kent/Sussex etc, we need to be attracting the best talent and giving them the opportunities to progress and then make money that way by selling them on. Likewise by scouring the lower leagues for young talent, like we did with Morison, and we should've done with Austin. That's the way we'll survive long term without any magical increases in crowds / external revenue.
Sure we splashed €3m on a striker and he must be worth £6-7m already given that he's now a proven goalscorer in the Championship on 8 goals... and your manager is a tad worried he might appear tomorrow!
We are making an impact and cutting losses simultaneously and that is confusing people in terms of how and for us what is the game plan. Watford with their links to Italy and Spain are doing the same as us - signing and loaning players who are cheaper than the local market.
Thing is every other Cafc signing over the summer was for free or a loan and we released 17 players with another three players, Hamer, Poyet and Dervite declining new contracts. Two of them are on silly money on the bench in the FAPL - in fact one is on loan (on the bench) at Huddersfield! Our costs are about £5m lower than yours because two successive boards have refused to keep paying big money for the likes of Fuller and Bailey. Fuller reportedly wanted 10% of our player budget and has no resale value... Our star striker is 12 years younger, possibly on less money but when he goes it will pay for at least one years club losses!
The future of second tier football is to sign up young hungry talent from here and abroad. Not to pay top dollar for aged ex-fapl players.
I've no desire to see any club go to the wall but any club losing £10m who already has £40-50 m of debt will soon be drowned with £100m of red ink!
This is not in the fans interests and not in football's interests! The only way to limit that was FFP but that changed a few weeks back.
We were in the same position as Millwall pre- 1998 but we grew our academy and our crowds to compete with the best. As a kid I never dreampt I would see 4-2 wins at Highbury or goal of the season equalisers vs Man Utd, let alone a 7-6 win on penalties at Wembley...
Every fan and every club deserves a crack at that dream but not if they are throwing cash and debt at the players and agents instead of running their club properly. The new landscape is going to be harsh and I sense some clubs won't make it.
Comments
inflation busting losses year on year not only threaten the stability of clubs but they also take the club further and further away from fans simply because fan efforts and small increments on the gate become a drop in the debt ocean
It enables the club benefactors and chairman to tell fans where to go unless they have access to £50m in order to fund five years losses.
I haven't seen the detailed P&L for Cafc for last season but the bottom line was just £100k different to the supporters Trust forecast or 0.5% of turnover.
And the club CFO has stated that the budgeted loss this season will be similar.
The FFP result is down from £6m to £2.5m over two seasons. This is for a variety of reasons. And it is before the seven figure contribution this season (and next) from the shirt and catering deals.
For sure one can debate the mix of changes but this new era is going to see one CAFC revenue stream grow beyond recognition...
Given the step change in the quality of players at Cafc it seems rational to anticipate a step change in transfer revenue received in forthcoming years. In case people haven't noticed Standard Liege sold €25m of players over the summer. Given that Liege have been owned for over three years by M.Duchatelet it's reasonable to expect him to attempt to repeat this with CAFC.
Of course we are eighth and not fourth or even second. How we fare over the next few games and what player business we do in January will tell us whether we are to be a selling club or a net purchaser of talent to push on for a Wembley appearance.
The good news is that we are in a position tonight for this to be a realistic proposition over the next 18 months. And that's a long way from last February as Holloway has acknowledged in the media. A first win vs Millwall since 1996 and perhaps more fans will dare to believe again?!
Given the prospect of a guaranteed £125m payout over five years for achieving promotion it also appears rational that M.Duchatelet will continue to add to the squad to enhance our chances. Especially given that even if we fail, we will attract significant offers for our top players in order to pay the bills.
What's confusing is why we are discussing success, play-offs and selling players for top dollar on a thread dedicated to Millwall
We are making an impact and cutting losses simultaneously and that is confusing people in terms of how and for us what is the game plan. Watford with their links to Italy and Spain are doing the same as us - signing and loaning players who are cheaper than the local market.
Thing is every other Cafc signing over the summer was for free or a loan and we released 17 players with another three players, Hamer, Poyet and Dervite declining new contracts. Two of them are on silly money on the bench in the FAPL - in fact one is on loan (on the bench) at Huddersfield!
Our costs are about £5m lower than yours because two successive boards have refused to keep paying big money for the likes of Fuller and Bailey. Fuller reportedly wanted 10% of our player budget and has no resale value... Our star striker is 12 years younger, possibly on less money but when he goes it will pay for at least one years club losses!
The future of second tier football is to sign up young hungry talent from here and abroad. Not to pay top dollar for aged ex-fapl players.
I've no desire to see any club go to the wall but any club losing £10m who already has £40-50 m of debt will soon be drowned with £100m of red ink!
This is not in the fans interests and not in football's interests! The only way to limit that was FFP but that changed a few weeks back.
We were in the same position as Millwall pre- 1998 but we grew our academy and our crowds to compete with the best. As a kid I never dreampt I would see 4-2 wins at Highbury or goal of the season equalisers vs Man Utd, let alone a 7-6 win on penalties at Wembley...
Every fan and every club deserves a crack at that dream but not if they are throwing cash and debt at the players and agents instead of running their club properly. The new landscape is going to be harsh and I sense some clubs won't make it.