Paulie's got loads of mates since it was his birthday yesterday, if it's yours today open a thread and you'll be fine, if not make yourself known to Paulie and his new mates
Haha. Turning up with Paulie would be the highlight of the evening.
The people who run this meeting are going to need to be very strong. There is a great danger of one section of views taking over with strong personalities. Although most people agree that there is a lot going wrong in the club, there is certainly no agreement as to what that is and even less agreement as to what we should/can do about it.
The people who run this meeting are going to need to be very strong. There is a great danger of one section of views taking over with strong personalities. Although most people agree that there is a lot going wrong in the club, there is certainly no agreement as to what that is and even less agreement as to what we should/can do about it.
If those that turn up are serious about trying to effect change they will show the deserved respect to their fellow fans that turn up alongside them. If they don't they are just going to be a hindrance and not a help. Whilst we can't pre-empt any agreements made at the meeting, we can safely say that we will need a collective approach to find and implement any workable solutions.
Who is going to be chairing this meeting; and who will be on the panel? Just out of interest
I don't think there will be a "panel" precisely to avoid the perception of "same old faces", "dominant characters" , etc, and ensure a cross-section of opinions are heard.
Paulie's got loads of mates since it was his birthday yesterday, if it's yours today open a thread and you'll be fine, if not make yourself known to Paulie and his new mates
Haha. Turning up with Paulie would be the highlight of the evening.
I genuinely hope that the meeting goes well as I do think that it is necessary and being done for the right reasons. But I must say that, in my opinion, most of the 'crisis' around the club is built up by people fundamentally talking themselves into believing that there is a crisis.
If this meeting will allow people to see that, then I am all for it because I do think that this sentiment is the biggest threat to the club at the moment.
Though I do not agree with everything that RD has done, I am generally in favour, but, generally, I do not, for the life of me, see what questions could be put to KM that could be answered any more fully than they have been already - generally if people do not believe or trust the answers given, that is their right, but the club really cannot do any more and to simply continue to ask the same questions in the hope that you will eventually get the answer you want will not get anyone anywhere and will only succeed in fuelling the toxic atmosphere at the club.
So, for example:
- Is the club going to spend huge amounts of money that it does not have to get into the Premiership? - "No"
- What are the aims of the current administration? - "Stay up, make the club financially solvent, improve facilities, and play youth players"
- Is the owner just in it for the money? - "No and he is losing huge amounts of money each month"
- Why were so many new managers appointed so quickly - "The owner genuinely thought he was doing the best for the club and still does"
- Are all our good young players going to be shipped off to SL? - "No, none have so far"
- Is RD acting in the best interests of CAFC as he sees it? - "Yes"
- Why is RD ripping the heart out of the club? "He doesn't think he is"
- Why did we not buy a striker in the transfer window? - "We tried unsuccessfully"
As I say, I am really not trying to be negative, in fact I applaud the Trust for taking action, but I do hope that the Trust will continue to try and be fair to the club as well.
If you haven't already done so, I suggest that you read a fantastic post from daveaddick on the "Bothered" thread which summarises the situation perfectly IMO, and the serious concerns a lot of us have regarding the future of our Club.
Furthermore, I think it highlights the fact that it would be futile for the Trust/any group of fans to request an audience with Katrien as a means of opening communication channels - "falling on deaf ears" is the phrase that comes to mind.
The announcement of the meeting on 18th Feb shows that things have gone too far downhill for such to be anything but a waste of time.
I have no idea what the outcome of next week's meeting will be, but I would guess that others already have a game plan up their sleeves should some form of action be agreed on the night. If not at this stage, then I suspect a huge number of candles will be burned over the following weeks before one is formed.
"Most of the 'crisis' around the club is built up by people fundamentally talking themselves into believing that there is a crisis."
You're forgetting that three key figures have publicly stated that RD likes to select the team. This is of course biased towards players whom have been deemed unworthy of Liege or Ujpest. An ex-employee has also gone on record and stated that winning isn't the most important thing for RD.
To support that we have a 'coach' who a couple of months ago was deemed not good enough for Liege, whilst Liege have a coach deemed not to be good enough for us yet most of us would like.
Moving on from Powell and Yann, the treatment of Morrison was abysmal. Letting him go on a free yet paying signing on fees plus wages to Onyewu and Johnson makes no sense neither on the pitch nor financially.
That's all concrete stuff and only from the top of my head. There are many, many more questions and things we can infer. At the best we can call Roland misguided, at worst a megalomaniac only out for himself.
You mix all that together, combine the worst form in the country plus pitiful morale with a coach who won't even acknowledge travelling fans, and I don't think the word 'crisis' can be called hyperbole.
OK, my mistake. I had thought that the idea of the meeting was to try to get the club to respond to the Trust and answer its questions, not to force RD to change tack and policy on how he is running things.
@ StevieK. The meeting has been organised by the Trust,but on behalf of the wider fan base. As we have seen there are several strands of opinion about the current direction. Yours is one, you are not alone, it deserves respect, and if you came and gave that view at the meeting you would be treated with respect too, I'm sure.
For the record the Trust view is summarized in our recent statements. Nowhere in those statements will you read the phrase "ripping the heart out of the club" nor will you find any example where a Trust board member used such a phrase on here. However that is how many people feel, and their feelings should be respected too. Not least because it is likely to affect their interest in paying good money to support the Club.
Sorry, I did not mean any offence by that. I am just trying to highlight what I see as a problem - people have very strong views (which they are entitled to) but they do not tend to lend themselves to questions that the club can answer in any way that would satisfy the people concerned.
As I say, I am right behind the Trust in this and will definitely try to make it. In my opinion, it is exactly what the Trust should be doing. I am just struggling to envisage what the beneficial outcomes might look like.
I am also rather worried that some poor soul (presumably the person who ends chairing the meeting) is going to left with a mandate of 100 different random concerns, opinions, and grievances (some of them completely valid, some of them at least partly conspiracy theory, some of them contradictory) that they are mandated to 'go and do something about', when they really have no power to do any such thing.
"Most of the 'crisis' around the club is built up by people fundamentally talking themselves into believing that there is a crisis."
You're forgetting that three key figures have publicly stated that RD likes to select the team. This is of course biased towards players whom have been deemed unworthy of Liege or Ujpest. An ex-employee has also gone on record and stated that winning isn't the most important thing for RD.
To support that we have a 'coach' who a couple of months ago was deemed not good enough for Liege, whilst Liege have a coach deemed not to be good enough for us yet most of us would like.
Moving on from Powell and Yann, the treatment of Morrison was abysmal. Letting him go on a free yet paying signing on fees plus wages to Onyewu and Johnson makes no sense neither on the pitch nor financially.
That's all concrete stuff and only from the top of my head. There are many, many more questions and things we can infer. At the best we can call Roland misguided, at worst a megalomaniac only out for himself.
You mix all that together, combine the worst form in the country plus pitiful morale with a coach who won't even acknowledge travelling fans, and I don't think the word 'crisis' can be called hyperbole.
Perfectly valid and reasonable approach to make such rational assumptions. Problem is a sizeable number of people who would normally go along with you, like myself, are struggling to equate what is happening with rational assumptions, and are losing our traditional instincts to just stick with it and see what happens.
In an ideal world as fans if we could raise the dough and buy it then that would be perfect, put someone of the standard of David White as chairman and a well respected uk experience manager in it believe the club would really prosper and I would be 100% behind a change like that, but anyone who buys the club from twochalets is going to have other agendas like moving us from the valley as I don't see anyone really thinking that you can make money from cafc any other way
That bothers me a great deal now if someone said Rd was going to do that and could prove it I believe a lot of people who see concerns but no more than what have been there and pissed people off with in the past would be more up for the whole Rd out scenario
Far too much presumption and analysis is being played out before an event has even occurred.
Also seems to be huge degree of perfection and expectation being expected / placed upon non-professionals who this isn't there job.
Of course debate the pros and cons of the current regime, suggestions for the way forward etc
Buy personally think it would benefit everyone if the scrutiny on this open meeting before its even occurred eased up.
For me the broadest base of support and ideas from accross the Charlton support increases the chance of the strategy working. IMO It is the only way that it will work. Agree that picking things to pieces before the meeting it is not going to help. As long as approach is open and attempting to be inclusive, and open then that is a good place to start. The broad support from ITTV, Not 606, and blogs gives the whole thing some chance of working and is one of the few things regarding Charlton's situation that has cheered me up and given me some hope. The Trust leaflet announcing the open meeting pulls things together nicely.
“This meeting is intended to be an opportunity to bring together as many as possible of the various organisational, internet and publication elements of the Charlton family, as well as individual supporters, and to secure the widest possible mandate for any approach we jointly decide to adopt.
“We will also seek input via the CAS Trust website from those who cannot attend the meeting.
“Based on conclusions from the meeting, we plan to agree a unified and appropriate supporters’ response at the earliest opportunity.”
Sorry, I did not mean any offence by that. I am just trying to highlight what I see as a problem - people have very strong views (which they are entitled to) but they do not tend to lend themselves to questions that the club can answer in any way that would satisfy the people concerned.
As I say, I am right behind the Trust in this and will definitely try to make it. In my opinion, it is exactly what the Trust should be doing. I am just struggling to envisage what the beneficial outcomes might look like.
I am also rather worried that some poor soul (presumably the person who ends chairing the meeting) is going to left with a mandate of 100 different random concerns, opinions, and grievances (some of them completely valid, some of them at least partly conspiracy theory, some of them contradictory) that they are mandated to 'go and do something about', when they really have no power to do any such thing.
That's a fair comment. The people organising it are well aware of the dangers you describe win your last paragraph. I think it would be unwise to expect that next morning we all wake up and say, "Right, this is what we are all going to do". But just getting people together who care enough to turn up, will bring positive results. I'm sure of that.
Comments
I will be there from Zurich
If this meeting will allow people to see that, then I am all for it because I do think that this sentiment is the biggest threat to the club at the moment.
Though I do not agree with everything that RD has done, I am generally in favour, but, generally, I do not, for the life of me, see what questions could be put to KM that could be answered any more fully than they have been already - generally if people do not believe or trust the answers given, that is their right, but the club really cannot do any more and to simply continue to ask the same questions in the hope that you will eventually get the answer you want will not get anyone anywhere and will only succeed in fuelling the toxic atmosphere at the club.
So, for example:
- Is the club going to spend huge amounts of money that it does not have to get into the Premiership? - "No"
- What are the aims of the current administration? - "Stay up, make the club financially solvent, improve facilities, and play youth players"
- Is the owner just in it for the money? - "No and he is losing huge amounts of money each month"
- Why were so many new managers appointed so quickly - "The owner genuinely thought he was doing the best for the club and still does"
- Are all our good young players going to be shipped off to SL? - "No, none have so far"
- Is RD acting in the best interests of CAFC as he sees it? - "Yes"
- Why is RD ripping the heart out of the club? "He doesn't think he is"
- Why did we not buy a striker in the transfer window? - "We tried unsuccessfully"
As I say, I am really not trying to be negative, in fact I applaud the Trust for taking action, but I do hope that the Trust will continue to try and be fair to the club as well.
If you haven't already done so, I suggest that you read a fantastic post from daveaddick on the "Bothered" thread which summarises the situation perfectly IMO, and the serious concerns a lot of us have regarding the future of our Club.
Furthermore, I think it highlights the fact that it would be futile for the Trust/any group of fans to request an audience with Katrien as a means of opening communication channels - "falling on deaf ears" is the phrase that comes to mind.
The announcement of the meeting on 18th Feb shows that things have gone too far downhill for such to be anything but a waste of time.
I have no idea what the outcome of next week's meeting will be, but I would guess that others already have a game plan up their sleeves should some form of action be agreed on the night. If not at this stage, then I suspect a huge number of candles will be burned over the following weeks before one is formed.
I'm keeping the faith.
You're forgetting that three key figures have publicly stated that RD likes to select the team. This is of course biased towards players whom have been deemed unworthy of Liege or Ujpest. An ex-employee has also gone on record and stated that winning isn't the most important thing for RD.
To support that we have a 'coach' who a couple of months ago was deemed not good enough for Liege, whilst Liege have a coach deemed not to be good enough for us yet most of us would like.
Moving on from Powell and Yann, the treatment of Morrison was abysmal. Letting him go on a free yet paying signing on fees plus wages to Onyewu and Johnson makes no sense neither on the pitch nor financially.
That's all concrete stuff and only from the top of my head. There are many, many more questions and things we can infer. At the best we can call Roland misguided, at worst a megalomaniac only out for himself.
You mix all that together, combine the worst form in the country plus pitiful morale with a coach who won't even acknowledge travelling fans, and I don't think the word 'crisis' can be called hyperbole.
And little likelihood of the latter.
The meeting has been organised by the Trust,but on behalf of the wider fan base. As we have seen there are several strands of opinion about the current direction. Yours is one, you are not alone, it deserves respect, and if you came and gave that view at the meeting you would be treated with respect too, I'm sure.
For the record the Trust view is summarized in our recent statements. Nowhere in those statements will you read the phrase "ripping the heart out of the club" nor will you find any example where a Trust board member used such a phrase on here. However that is how many people feel, and their feelings should be respected too. Not least because it is likely to affect their interest in paying good money to support the Club.
As I say, I am right behind the Trust in this and will definitely try to make it. In my opinion, it is exactly what the Trust should be doing. I am just struggling to envisage what the beneficial outcomes might look like.
I am also rather worried that some poor soul (presumably the person who ends chairing the meeting) is going to left with a mandate of 100 different random concerns, opinions, and grievances (some of them completely valid, some of them at least partly conspiracy theory, some of them contradictory) that they are mandated to 'go and do something about', when they really have no power to do any such thing.
That bothers me a great deal now if someone said Rd was going to do that and could prove it I believe a lot of people who see concerns but no more than what have been there and pissed people off with in the past would be more up for the whole Rd out scenario
At least we wouldn't run out of Guinness...
Perfect candidate and the beer issue would improve
Also seems to be huge degree of perfection and expectation being expected / placed upon non-professionals who this isn't there job.
Of course debate the pros and cons of the current regime, suggestions for the way forward etc
Buy personally think it would benefit everyone if the scrutiny on this open meeting before its even occurred eased up.
http://www.newsshopper.co.uk/sport/charlton/11780097._/
“This meeting is intended to be an opportunity to bring together as many as possible of the various organisational, internet and publication elements of the Charlton family, as well as individual supporters, and to secure the widest possible mandate for any approach we jointly decide to adopt.
“We will also seek input via the CAS Trust website from those who cannot attend the meeting.
“Based on conclusions from the meeting, we plan to agree a unified and appropriate supporters’ response at the earliest opportunity.”