Football and the Referendum.

pettgra

This post is not meant to start wider thread on the Referendum.
Saw a comment from Mrs. Brady saying that an exit would make it very difficult to sign players from the EU; however, she did not say how or why.
If we exited and she is correct, our Roly may have to look at other areas of recruitment. God help us.

Miserableoldgit

http://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/jan/29/karren-brady-warns-brexit-british-clubs

pettgra

Miserableoldgit said:

http://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/jan/29/karren-brady-warns-brexit-british-clubs

Thankyou. I will have a gander.

A-R-T-H-U-R

I think it's cruel to have tarred and feathered her just for being a Tory peer.

cafcfan

It doesn't say specifically in the article but I assume she is implying that footballers from EU countries would have to meet the same criteria as footballers from non-EU countries do now. That is, in order to qualify to get a work permit a player must have played in 75% of his country's COMPETITIVE games (friendlies don't count) during the two years preceding the application for a work permit AND his country must have a FIFA world ranking of 70 or above averaged over those two years.
However, what that would mean for players already here would presumably depend upon whether any changes were retrospectively applied or not. This seems doubtful as contracts were signed in good faith, etc, etc and it would be extremely harsh.
But, clearly, many of the individuals from EU countries currently plying their trade in the Championship and below would not meet these criteria.

Solidgone

British clubs will no longer be able to play in the European games. ;0)

Valiantphil

Good - then perhaps we can work on improving our home grown talent.

AddicksAddict

EU Players already here would be able to stay at their current clubs. However, if they moved to another UK club they would have to meet the work permit criteria.

stevexreeve

Would Katrien be able to stay?

Is there some rule that if you know the right people and have a fancy job title you can stay as long as you like.

northstandsteve

Great I'm voting out then.

smudge7946

When I want Ms Bradys opinion, it will be about the best way to defraud the hard working tax payers of this country in order to get a football ground on the cheap.

killerandflash

In reality it's unlikely to be a 100% break, even if we leave the EU. There would be long negotiations to work out the exact arrangements, and there would be nothing to stop the UK having different immigration rules for footballers than say farmworkers or builders

NornIrishAddick

killerandflash said:

In reality it's unlikely to be a 100% break, even if we leave the EU. There would be long negotiations to work out the exact arrangements, and there would be nothing to stop the UK having different immigration rules for footballers than say farmworkers or builders

It's likely they'd be treated as "high net worth" individuals, like bankers and oligarchs, so would be welcomed with open arms.

Admittedly, Loic Nego would probably have been banned...

A-R-T-H-U-R

NornIrishAddick said:

killerandflash said:

In reality it's unlikely to be a 100% break, even if we leave the EU. There would be long negotiations to work out the exact arrangements, and there would be nothing to stop the UK having different immigration rules for footballers than say farmworkers or builders

It's likely they'd be treated as "high net tax payers" , like bankers and oligarchs, so would be welcomed with open arms.

Admittedly, Loic Nego would probably have been banned...

It's OK everyone, Gove is leading the out campaign. Clever move by Cameron to get his odious mate to drive the electorate to the In campaign cause!

letthegoodtimesroll

A-R-T-H-U-R said:

NornIrishAddick said:

killerandflash said:

In reality it's unlikely to be a 100% break, even if we leave the EU. There would be long negotiations to work out the exact arrangements, and there would be nothing to stop the UK having different immigration rules for footballers than say farmworkers or builders

It's likely they'd be treated as "high net tax payers" , like bankers and oligarchs, so would be welcomed with open arms.

Admittedly, Loic Nego would probably have been banned...

It's OK everyone, Gove is leading the out campaign. Clever move by Cameron to get his odious mate to drive the electorate to the In campaign cause!

I have to admit that was my first thought when I heard this and that it might win a few 'stay in' votes though to be honest I suspect come the summer when Europe is totally swamped with migrants and the media are having a frenzy that this vote is only going to go one way no matter anything else that is done or said...

stevexreeve

Don't understand why "high net tax payers" like footballers and bankers can work here.

It's OUR bloody money they're using to pay the taxes.

I'd prefer to keep lower paid immigrants like (nurses and teachers?) so we actually get value out of them!

cafcfan

STEVEREEVE said:

Don't understand why "high net tax payers" like footballers and bankers can work here.

It's OUR bloody money they're using to pay the taxes.

I'd prefer to keep lower paid immigrants like (nurses and teachers?) so we actually get value out of them!

What? Really, what? There's no sense in that statement, I hesitate to call it a constructed argument.

Do you actually think the UK gets no value out of, for example, Citigroup, the US financial services behemoth that employs around 10,000 people in the UK? A significant number of those people will be foreign. To illustrate: my relationship manager is Greek, her husband is from the US. All these people pay income tax mostly at the higher rate and together with their large number of competitors bring huge wealth to the UK.
But you'd like them gone?

Edited to add: The UK is the world’s largest exporter of financial services, generating a trade surplus of over £47bn in 2011. The industry contributed £63bn in tax to the exchequer in 2011-12 – 11.6% of all tax receipts.

SDAddick

cafcfan said:

What? Really, what? There's no sense in that statement, I hesitate to call it a constructed argument.

Do you actually think the UK gets no value out of, for example, Citigroup, the US financial services behemoth that employs around 10,000 people in the UK? A significant number of those people will be foreign. To illustrate: my relationship manager is Greek, her husband is from the US. All these people pay income tax mostly at the higher rate and together with their large number of competitors bring huge wealth to the UK.
But you'd like them gone?

Edited to add: The UK is the world’s largest exporter of financial services, generating a trade surplus of over £47bn in 2011. The industry contributed £63bn in tax to the exchequer in 2011-12 – 11.6% of all tax receipts.

I'm loathe to defend the financial sector, so I'll just add that a lot of those employees will pay income tax, and there are plenty of UK citizens who won't.

I'm hoping to move back to London (I'm American), and would be likely be paying a much* higher rate of income tax than I currently do in the states. I am okay with that, as I feel the UK Government (assuming Cameron et al don't manage to completely destroy it in the next few months) will provide me with basic services that I expect out of a Government (healthcare, infrastructure, etc.), and it provides many services to those who need them most.

*Higher income tax when compared to US Federal Income Tax, when you throw state income tax in it gets a little closer

Also, does the UK have a "Capital Gains Tax," a tax on earning from stocks (bonds, equity, etc.)?

cafcfan

SDAddick said:

cafcfan said:

What? Really, what? There's no sense in that statement, I hesitate to call it a constructed argument.

Do you actually think the UK gets no value out of, for example, Citigroup, the US financial services behemoth that employs around 10,000 people in the UK? A significant number of those people will be foreign. To illustrate: my relationship manager is Greek, her husband is from the US. All these people pay income tax mostly at the higher rate and together with their large number of competitors bring huge wealth to the UK.
But you'd like them gone?

Edited to add: The UK is the world’s largest exporter of financial services, generating a trade surplus of over £47bn in 2011. The industry contributed £63bn in tax to the exchequer in 2011-12 – 11.6% of all tax receipts.

Also, does the UK have a "Capital Gains Tax," a tax on earning from stocks (bonds, equity, etc.)?

Yes. For higher rate tax payers its 28% of any gains. But there's an annual £11,100 "allowance" under that you don't pay CGT and you can offset loses against gains. Earnings such as dividends are treated as income. But from April the tax arrangements are changing, so that a £5,000 tax free dividend allowance will be introduced. Dividends above this level will be taxed at 7.5% (basic rate), 32.5% (higher rate), and 38.1% (additional rate).
There's also the opportunity to invest in an ISA, an individual savings account. This is a wrapper that allows you to shelter savings from both income tax and CGT. Currently the annual maximum you can invest in an ISA is £15,240. If you cease to be a UK resident and tax payer the tax protection ends.

stevexreeve

cafcfan said:

What? Really, what? There's no sense in that statement, I hesitate to call it a constructed argument.

You're quite right of course - it's not a constructed argument - sorry!

I just have an awful feeling that we are being blindly led into a future where an elite of people can move freely around the world while everyone else is forced to stay in their home country. It doesn't seem fair to have one law for the elite and another for the non-elite.

I'm actually pro Europe and generally in favour of migration where feasible and am happy for anyone to come to the UK to work (even footballers and bankers!).

But I cannot really accept that an American financier earning £500,000 is "worth" more than 20 Polish plumbers earning £25,000 and deserves special laws and different treatment.

Sorry if that still doesn't make much sense!