I think I have made it clear that this is not an ideal situation but yes. If she wants to compete with women that is. If she wants to compete with men, she doesn't have to do anything. She has tesosterone levels that mean she should be able to compete with men after all.
So, let me get this clear. You'd have two types of events. One for women, some of whom you'd insist take drugs. And one for men and women.
You are trying to make out what I am saying is ridiculous, but it is only the legal process that is allowing her to compete. I think we have to react to the times. What you have to acknowledge firstly is that in Athletics, as in many sports, women cannot compete at the highest levels with men. Why is this? It is because men are stronger and this is due to tesosterone. Now my view is that this athlete is a woman. In these enlightened times, some people who were born as men will want to be women and if that is what they want and feel they are, they should be classed as women. That is good, but there will have to be an adjustment to sport to ensure fairness. Now drugs can lower tesosterone. People who undergo a sex change to become a woman, generally take drugs to reduce their tesosterone levels through choice. The modern day has to adapt and whilst men and women's sport should always be that, having details in the rules that differentiates one from the other beyond what is between their legs is needed. I can't say for certain, but if this athlete was not a gold medal athlete, she would possibly be more likely to be taking hormones to increase her femininity.
Caster Semenya showing "her" muscles to the other competitors after winning just rubbed salt in the wounds. Before the legal argument was won by an India Woman Athlete, CS came last in one race i watched when medication to lower her Testosterone level was being taken.
There can't be any winners in this argument, Sharp and the other girls in the race won't bother to go through all that training if an answer isn't found.
I found it a sham to watch plus i could see what the others thought at the end of the race. Does Phil Williams who i like, get a bonus if he can make athletes Cry ? He must of already realized it would set Lynsey Sharp off in talking about Semenya.
What with the State cheating Russians, this is yet another obstacle to overcome for the Female clean Athlete.
It's an unfair advantage and shouldn't be allowed, sport should be an equal playing field she has an advantage that no level of coaching or training can over come
It's an unfair advantage and shouldn't be allowed, sport should be an equal playing field she has an advantage that no level of coaching or training can over come
What then becomes the cut off point?? Her advantage is physical. Just like the fast twitch muscles of a sprinter, the height of a basketball player or the lung capacity of a swimmer. Her body just allows her to be better over 800m than her rivals.
Not all her rivals. She is not better than athletes with tesosterone levels similar to hers! It is only an argument you can make in relation to women's sport.
It's an unfair advantage and shouldn't be allowed, sport should be an equal playing field she has an advantage that no level of coaching or training can over come
What then becomes the cut off point?? Her advantage is physical. Just like the fast twitch muscles of a sprinter, the height of a basketball player or the lung capacity of a swimmer. Her body just allows her to be better over 800m than her rivals.
Someone that can generate levels of testosterone that the vast majority % of female population can not achieve is definitely a cut off,
How the rest is worked out is for greater minds but it's not right it's not Imo anywhere near acceptable, if you can make the level reduce then they should be forced to reduce the level of testosterone via medication until it reaches the level the vast majority of competitors are at, and that should be tested before and after the event for those athletes immediately and if they show a higher level than accepted they are DQ
It's an unfair advantage and shouldn't be allowed, sport should be an equal playing field she has an advantage that no level of coaching or training can over come
What then becomes the cut off point?? Her advantage is physical. Just like the fast twitch muscles of a sprinter, the height of a basketball player or the lung capacity of a swimmer. Her body just allows her to be better over 800m than her rivals.
We are talking the difference between the sexes. Not the fact that some people have a slow heart rate or if my dad had sent me to Eton i would have been a Prime Minister instead of selling the big issue.
Look at the bigger picture and stop all this PC Chat.
If you could watch that and felt that was fine you are different to me.
Not all her rivals. She is not better than athletes with tesosterone levels similar to hers! It is only an argument you can make in relation to women's sport.
In your suggestion, a woman with a high, natural level of testosterone should be banned from competing with other women unless she undergoes medical intervention.
Let's extend this in order to make the point.
Tall men have an advantage over short men in rowing.
How would you deal with this? Should the tall men be banned? Or surgically shortened?
Someone that can generate levels of testosterone that the vast majority % of female population can not achieve is definitely a cut off,
How the rest is worked out is for greater minds but it's not right it's not Imo anywhere near acceptable, if you can make the level reduce then they should be forced to reduce the level of testosterone via medication until it reaches the level the vast majority of competitors are at, and that should be tested before and after the event for those athletes immediately and if they show a higher level than accepted they are DQ
I agree, I cant see how this infringes any of her rights. She doesn't have to do this - only if she wants to compete at a level where athletes are less strong because they lack tesosterone. She could compete against athletes with similar levels. And I'd argue her right to do so.
Someone that can generate levels of testosterone that the vast majority % of female population can not achieve is definitely a cut off,
How the rest is worked out is for greater minds but it's not right it's not Imo anywhere near acceptable, if you can make the level reduce then they should be forced to reduce the level of testosterone via medication until it reaches the level the vast majority of competitors are at, and that should be tested before and after the event for those athletes immediately and if they show a higher level than accepted they are DQ
I agree, I cant see how this infringes any of her rights. She doesn't have to do this - only if she wants to compete at a level where athletes are less strong because they lack tesosterone. She could compete against athletes with similar levels. And I'd argue her right to do so.
I'd argue her right, as a woman, to compete with other women.
And I'd strongly argue against anyone preventing her from earning a living in her profession on such arbitrary, unfair grounds.
If her higher testosterone levels are naturally occurring I see no difference to any other naturally occurring attribute that benefits an athlete, just like Phelps' "abnormal" lung capacity.
In the context of sport - the difference between men and women is tesosterone levels. Not if one has a dick or not. I'm just saying, use this definition to determine who competes with who. Yes there are sports that don't suit short people but there are sports they can compete in. In rowing, all the tall people competing don't have the advantage over their direct competitors that this woman has! They would if all the other crews were full of short people, but they are not.
If you are not a tall man, you would probably pick a sport that doesn't disadvantage you too much. The women who have normal tesosterone levels who have worked all their lives to get to the top didn't know they would have to face somebody who had a massive medical advantage over them.
In the context of sport - the difference between men and women is tesosterone levels. Not if one has a dick or not. I'm just saying, use this definition to determine who competes with who. Yes there are sports that don't suit short people but there are sports they can compete in. In rowing, all the tall people competing don't have the advantage over their direct competitors that this woman has! They would if all the other crews were full of short people, but they are not.
If you are not a tall man, you would probably pick a sport that doesn't disadvantage you too much. The women who have normal tesosterone levels who have worked all their lives to get to the top didn't know they would have to face somebody who had a massive medical advantage over them.
Why does it upset you so much that she gets to compete with other women?
I think one thing has been clear when you see the gutted faces of athletes who have dedicated their lives to the Olympics and missed out on medals is how much work and dedication they put in. The winning athletes like mighty Mo allude to this too. There is an unfairness here and I take a view out of respect for those athletes in that event who basically haven't got a chance. It isn't Semenya's fault how she was born, but I am suggesting what I think is the fairest solution. Not the ideal one, that doesn't exist!
I think one thing has been clear when you see the gutted faces of athletes who have dedicated their lives to the Olympics and missed out on medals is how much work and dedication they put in. The winning athletes like mighty Mo allude to this too. There is an unfairness here and I take a view out of respect for those athletes in that event who basically haven't got a chance. It isn't Semenya's fault how she was born, but I am suggesting what I think is the fairest solution. Not the ideal one, that doesn't exist!
So she should be banned because everyone else she beats gets upset?
Comments
It isn't an easy thing to find a solution too.
Before the legal argument was won by an India Woman Athlete,
CS came last in one race i watched when medication to lower her Testosterone level was being taken.
There can't be any winners in this argument, Sharp and the other girls in the race won't bother to go through all that training if an answer isn't found.
I found it a sham to watch plus i could see what the others thought at the end of the race. Does Phil Williams who i like, get a bonus if he can make athletes Cry ? He must of already realized it would set Lynsey Sharp off in talking about Semenya.
What with the State cheating Russians, this is yet another obstacle to overcome for the Female clean Athlete.
How the rest is worked out is for greater minds but it's not right it's not Imo anywhere near acceptable, if you can make the level reduce then they should be forced to reduce the level of testosterone via medication until it reaches the level the vast majority of competitors are at, and that should be tested before and after the event for those athletes immediately and if they show a higher level than accepted they are DQ
Not the fact that some people have a slow heart rate or if my dad had sent me to Eton i would have been a Prime Minister instead of selling the big issue.
Look at the bigger picture and stop all this PC Chat.
If you could watch that and felt that was fine you are different to me.
Let's extend this in order to make the point.
Tall men have an advantage over short men in rowing.
How would you deal with this? Should the tall men be banned? Or surgically shortened?
It must be because if his old thread
And I'd strongly argue against anyone preventing her from earning a living in her profession on such arbitrary, unfair grounds.
If you are not a tall man, you would probably pick a sport that doesn't disadvantage you too much. The women who have normal tesosterone levels who have worked all their lives to get to the top didn't know they would have to face somebody who had a massive medical advantage over them.