The most influential groundbreaking album ever. Against, imho, Dylan's best. If I was on Desert Island Discs I'd take both. If they allowed albums. A tough decision for me but based on which I still listen to regularly it has to be Blood on the Tracks.
Oh my word, this is tough. Both are completely different. Both have their flaws. Yet, both are absolutely colossal.
I genuinely don't think I can separate them as albums - I've listened to them both now a few times through, and they have their different merits:
- Blood on the Tracks is a painful, honest, angry, sincere, and coherent album of heartbreak and loss. It's lyrically excellent and musically sound. Dylan's medium completely fits what he was writing about. Yet, I've never completely settled with Dylan's voice, and I don't find it overly adventurous musically (not that that's a bad thing whatsoever).
- Sgt Pepper's is one of the most brilliantly innovative albums/works of music in the last century or so, certainly within the realm of popular music. It is wonderfully cosmopolitan in its influences; composition; and form overall. However, there is an inevitable drawback in that by trying to incorporate so much, it doesn't *quite* get everything right/coherent - again, not necessarily a bad thing.
It's down to personal taste. And maybe one thing that swings it for me is that I've never had a heartbreak or break-up like Dylan seems to be conveying. Maybe when I do, I'll have a different answer.
- agree with all of six-a-bag's comments re my post, but my calling SPLHCB unadultured pop was not meant as a criticism. I grew up with the Beatles, and from your moniker so did you, altho my choice of music was more towards the other bands you mentioned. I appreciate the roles the Beatles played in shaping pop music but the vote was which album we preferred, i have both, and i preferred BOTT - anyway it is pointless comparing such diverse albums.
BOTT Pepper is pure unadulterated pop. BOTT - is a laster, withstands constant playing unlike Pepper in fact i might dig our BOTT and give it some plays today.
And arguably perhaps therein lies the futility of comparing one album against another made nearly 10 years later. What could Pepper possibly be other than Pop? That was pretty much all there was in 1967. To use the term unadulterated is to lazily ignore just how much the Beatles had developed the possibilities of the 3 minute Pop song. Compare it to any other pop album of the time. Even the fledgeling pop/rock pioneers like Hendrix, Cream or Traffic were aware of the importance of a commercial 3 minute Pop hit at that time.
I realise I am taking this all a bit too seriously, but I hate to see Pepper dismissed so casually.
In fact I'd argue that Pepper itself by it's very success, and the experimental nature of songs like A day in the life and Within you Without you, opened up the possibilities. Pop became rock, psychedelia morphed into Prog. By 1971 albums began to outsell singles and became the de facto artistic statement. By then the Beatles were no more. They had burst onto a music scene that was strictly a teen market, where the artist had a short shelf life and the audience "grew out of it" when they became an adult. Instead they carried their audience through and mirrored their changes and the music became more sophisticated as the audience grew up. In a sense they missed out on the enduring legacy of mature lyrical sophistication and musical experimentation that they themselves had kick-started. Our generation, the Beatles generation, never did " grow up", we just got older and the music grew and developed with us. Thus Bob Dylan could make an album like Blood on the Tracks, without it being an acoustic folk album with an amusing harmonica trill at the end of each verse. Who knows what sort of album the Beatles would have made in 1975 or 1985 or 1995? Maybe they were a spent force anyway - the solo albums couldn't get near them. It was left for others to take up the mantle. The Beatles had led the revolution, a "revolution in the head" as writer Ian MacDonald put it. Sadly in time that will be forgotten and the songs left to stand or fall on their merits. And if some sound naive and dated it is because the Beatles themselves rendered them so.
- anyway it is pointless comparing such diverse albums.
This. Especially as they were made many years apart.
I love BOTT in that it is heartfelt and timeless. But it never changed the musical direction of a generation.
Pepper was not even a milestone as much as it was a gateway into unknown territory, experimental and the beginning of new concepts. It has to be judged in the context of it's time and social impact.
Afterwards, even Dylan himself must have at times been influenced by the musical scene which followed as a result of Pepper. And BOTT is a product of that.
- agree with all of six-a-bag's comments re my post, but my calling SPLHCB unadultured pop was not meant as a criticism. I grew up with the Beatles, and from your moniker so did you, altho my choice of music was more towards the other bands you mentioned. I appreciate the roles the Beatles played in shaping pop music but the vote was which album we preferred, i have both, and i preferred BOTT - anyway it is pointless comparing such diverse albums.
No worries BR, I wasn't trying to dig you out personally. Just attempting to add some context to the categorisation of Pepper as a pop album (which of course it is).
I voted for Pepper earlier in the thread, I've been listening to both today. BOTT for me,is a better album to listen to, buckets of rain is a brilliant track coming at the end of the b side. However so many of the lyrics, turns of phrase and tunes on Sergeant Pepper seem indellibly written in my head, and so its still Sergeant Pepper. And of course Harry the horse dances the waltz.
I really don't want to vote on this one. Ironically the personal influence of Dylan on the Beatles propelled the Beatles away from moon and juneism, and (very questionable) trifles such as 'I saw her standing there'. The Beatles encountered Dylan and his interest in lyrics being essential and groundbreaking was part of the road to Pepper for the Beatles. The influence was almost circular it seems to me, and each album is in a diverse and different space to the other and really hard to compare and differentiate in an objective sense, it is down to personal taste such as if you like a voice or a tune. I will only cast a vote if there are one or two votes in this at the weekend, and then I will vote for the album lagging behind.
As much as I try and get into Dylan because so many seem to cream their pants when talking about him, there’s just something that stops me. I’ll acknowledge his written and recorded some mighty fine tracks but I find it difficult to listen to an album all the way through.
I gave BOTT a listen the other day and, well, maybe it’s the harmonica, perhaps too much of it, dunno can’t put my finger on it.
Pepper, without the salt for me.
Blood on the Tracks is an album I've listened to lots and lots as I want to like it. I've never really been interested in lyrics, for me they are a vehicle for a melody. I certainly don't hate the album, I just don't like it very much. Maybe I'll change my mind one day.
Ironically the personal influence of Dylan on the Beatles propelled the Beatles away from moon and juneism, and (very questionable) trifles such as 'I saw her standing there'. The Beatles encountered Dylan and his interest in lyrics being essential and groundbreaking was part of the road to Pepper for the Beatles. .
Did you PWR again Seth?
Anyway, just as pertinently, Dylan went electric directly in response to the influence of the Beatles.
Ironically the personal influence of Dylan on the Beatles propelled the Beatles away from moon and juneism, and (very questionable) trifles such as 'I saw her standing there'. The Beatles encountered Dylan and his interest in lyrics being essential and groundbreaking was part of the road to Pepper for the Beatles. .
Did you PWR again Seth?
Anyway, just as pertinently, Dylan went electric directly in response to the influence of the Beatles.
Sorry if I am repeating your point, I have PWR'd it is true, and what you write shows the value of announcing PWRing
I voted for Pepper earlier in the thread, I've been listening to both today. BOTT for me,is a better album to listen to, buckets of rain is a brilliant track coming at the end of the b side. However so many of the lyrics, turns of phrase and tunes on Sergeant Pepper seem indellibly written in my head, and so its still Sergeant Pepper. And of course Harry the horse dances the waltz.
I really don't want to vote on this one. Ironically the personal influence of Dylan on the Beatles propelled the Beatles away from moon and juneism, and (very questionable) trifles such as 'I saw her standing there'. The Beatles encountered Dylan and his interest in lyrics being essential and groundbreaking was part of the road to Pepper for the Beatles. The influence was almost circular it seems to me, and each album is in a diverse and different space to the other and really hard to compare and differentiate in an objective sense, it is down to personal taste such as if you like a voice or a tune. I will only cast a vote if there are one or two votes in this at the weekend, and then I will vote for the album lagging behind.
I can confirm, seth doesn't want to vote on this one.
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Against, imho, Dylan's best.
If I was on Desert Island Discs I'd take both. If they allowed albums.
A tough decision for me but based on which I still listen to regularly it has to be Blood on the Tracks.
I genuinely don't think I can separate them as albums - I've listened to them both now a few times through, and they have their different merits:
- Blood on the Tracks is a painful, honest, angry, sincere, and coherent album of heartbreak and loss. It's lyrically excellent and musically sound. Dylan's medium completely fits what he was writing about. Yet, I've never completely settled with Dylan's voice, and I don't find it overly adventurous musically (not that that's a bad thing whatsoever).
- Sgt Pepper's is one of the most brilliantly innovative albums/works of music in the last century or so, certainly within the realm of popular music. It is wonderfully cosmopolitan in its influences; composition; and form overall. However, there is an inevitable drawback in that by trying to incorporate so much, it doesn't *quite* get everything right/coherent - again, not necessarily a bad thing.
It's down to personal taste. And maybe one thing that swings it for me is that I've never had a heartbreak or break-up like Dylan seems to be conveying. Maybe when I do, I'll have a different answer.
But for now - Sgt Pepper's.
Lastly through a hogshead of real fire!
In this way Sgt. P will challenge the world.
SPLHCB.
Sgt Pepper wins.
Sgt Peppers wins for me.
I love BOTT in that it is heartfelt and timeless.
But it never changed the musical direction of a generation.
Pepper was not even a milestone as much as it was a gateway into unknown territory, experimental and the beginning of new concepts. It has to be judged in the context of it's time and social impact.
Afterwards, even Dylan himself must have at times been influenced by the musical scene which followed as a result of Pepper.
And BOTT is a product of that.
Vote for Pepper.
But BOTT is the album I listen to much more often, and gets my vote.
Just attempting to add some context to the categorisation of Pepper as a pop album (which of course it is).
The influence was almost circular it seems to me, and each album is in a diverse and different space to the other and really hard to compare and differentiate in an objective sense, it is down to personal taste such as if you like a voice or a tune.
I will only cast a vote if there are one or two votes in this at the weekend, and then I will vote for the album lagging behind.
I certainly don't hate the album, I just don't like it very much. Maybe I'll change my mind one day.
Anyway, just as pertinently, Dylan went electric directly in response to the influence of the Beatles.
Sgt Pepper for me.