The unfortunate passing of his father and his move South gave him some slack for his disappointing start. He's now been with us 18 months and nothing much has changed. Perhaps Blackpool may take him back in January.
Thing with Kirk, he does seem to make something out of nothing - he is a frustration player and do feel he can do better! Chances created per minute he will be up there in the league stats I reckon.. I have no research behind that stat so could be miles off.. haha!
Thing with Kirk, he does seem to make something out of nothing - he is a frustration player and do feel he can do better! Chances created per minute he will be up there in the league stats I reckon.. I have no research behind that stat so could be miles off.. haha!
I know it’s easy to be an armchair expert but 95% of us think this guy is a dud to varying degrees. How on earth did our soooer dooper black box gang with all their data and first hand experience come to the conclusion that he was worth our biggest fee in recent years?
Should have cut our losses in the close season when Blackpool were willing to do a deal. Only see him going out on loan or a free deal, unless we keep him because we are stuck with him.
Should have cut our losses in the close season when Blackpool were willing to do a deal. Only see him going out on loan or a free deal, unless we keep him because we are stuck with him.
They had the option to sign him at the end of the loan last January and didnt take it up
The unfortunate passing of his father and his move South gave him some slack for his disappointing start. He's now been with us 18 months and nothing much has changed. Perhaps Blackpool may take him back in January.
I have immense sympathy for his personal circumstances . But he’s not a good footballer - was a very poor buy , among many others over the last 2.5 years .
Should have cut our losses in the close season when Blackpool were willing to do a deal. Only see him going out on loan or a free deal, unless we keep him because we are stuck with him.
They had the option to sign him at the end of the loan last January and didnt take it up
The deal was already in place
I thought Blackpool tried under cutting on the deal and TS didn't go for it.
Thing with Kirk, he does seem to make something out of nothing - he is a frustration player and do feel he can do better! Chances created per minute he will be up there in the league stats I reckon.. I have no research behind that stat so could be miles off.. haha!
Kirk just needs a free role in my opinion
Not as often as he makes nothing out of something unfortunately
Honestly, it's never true that a player would look better at a higher level, but I would consider making an exception for Kirk. If you built a team of good players around him and gave him loads of the ball at number 10, I have him down as a sort of budget Riquelme. Whether he ever gets to experience this is another story. He'd be a hell of a cheap signing though
Interestingly, Kirk has played a part in goals this season, he is level with JRS, but less minutes nearly 300 minutes less He 3 goals and 4 assists this season so far from 1193 minutes on the pitch
Should have cut our losses in the close season when Blackpool were willing to do a deal. Only see him going out on loan or a free deal, unless we keep him because we are stuck with him.
They had the option to sign him at the end of the loan last January and didnt take it up
The deal was already in place
I thought Blackpool tried under cutting on the deal and TS didn't go for it.
They certainly tried it with Crewe, when they had Owen Dale on loan
It worked that time, so wouldn't be surprised if they tried it with us as well
Interestingly, Kirk has played a part in more goals than any other player this season He 3 goals and 4 assists this season so far from 1193 minutes on the pitch
Statistic as often ignore the rest of the picture. He generally plays a position where the other part of the game is non existent and out ways the good part of his game.
Kirk is still head and shoulders the best winger we have at the club , his assist rate is better than Raki and CBT .. and has started to chip in with a few goals … I would have Kirk ahead of the other two every day of the week
Interestingly, Kirk has played a part in more goals than any other player this season He 3 goals and 4 assists this season so far from 1193 minutes on the pitch
Statistic as often ignore the rest of the picture. He generally plays a position where the other part of the game is non existent and out ways the good part of his game.
I wonder what his stats are for hiding in a game.
But what is his position in the team? It is to create and score goals right?
Interestingly, Kirk has played a part in more goals than any other player this season He 3 goals and 4 assists this season so far from 1193 minutes on the pitch
Statistic as often ignore the rest of the picture. He generally plays a position where the other part of the game is non existent and out ways the good part of his game.
I wonder what his stats are for hiding in a game.
But what is his position in the team? It is to create and score goals right?
Your comment reminds me of something Jack Grealish said prior to the season starting.
He said a lot of people thought he didnt justify his price tag last season, based on the lack of stats
But in his eyes he was getting involved because there were countless times where he was setting up the bloke who got the assist for the goal. Or there would have been chances he did create but it doesnt go down as anything, because the bloke on the other end of the cross wasn't putting the effort away.
Now lets look at that, who is the bloke at the end of the cross... Oh yes... the equally loved Jayden Stockley...
Interestingly, Kirk has played a part in more goals than any other player this season He 3 goals and 4 assists this season so far from 1193 minutes on the pitch
Statistic as often ignore the rest of the picture. He generally plays a position where the other part of the game is non existent and out ways the good part of his game.
I wonder what his stats are for hiding in a game.
But what is his position in the team? It is to create and score goals right?
Your comment reminds me of something Jack Grealish said prior to the season starting.
He said a lot of people thought he didnt justify his price tag last season, based on the lack of stats
But in his eyes he was getting involved because there were countless times where he was setting up the bloke who got the assist for the goal. Or there would have been chances he did create but it doesnt go down as anything, because the bloke on the other end of the cross wasn't putting the effort away.
Now lets look at that, who is the bloke at the end of the cross... Oh yes... the equally loved Jayden Stockley...
Agreed.. I would like to find out those stats for Kirk, not easy to find in league one.. Interesting as well. Kirk has had 20 shots this season, which 4 are on target and he has 3 goals!
Kirk is still head and shoulders the best winger we have at the club , his assist rate is better than Raki and CBT .. and has started to chip in with a few goals … I would have Kirk ahead of the other two every day of the week
A counter-argument to that, is players (like Kirk) bring down the morale of the team through their lack of drive and effort.
Kirk does have ability. He's technically sound and delivers a decent ball. His problem appears to be a lack of heart. Shaun Newton and John Robinson weren't especially technically gifted but both worked incredibly hard in the wide areas and with that, won a lot of their battles. Sadly, Kirk appears to need others to win his battles for him and that's probably the definition of a luxury-player. If we were top of the league, we could possibly afford a luxury-player but positioned as we are, then I'd say we need to pick battlers.
Maybe a fellow northerner (Holden) can get a different tune out of Kirk. Let's hope so.
Kirk is still head and shoulders the best winger we have at the club , his assist rate is better than Raki and CBT .. and has started to chip in with a few goals … I would have Kirk ahead of the other two every day of the week
Wouldn't say head and shoulders.. They are all much of a likeness.. CBT if we could keep him on the pitch longer, he would be in front on stats, and that would mainly become of the pace he has, will get him in to positions.
I am a little more liberal on the definition of an assist, by my count Kirk has had 7 assists, 5 in the league and 2 in the cups.
The guy rarely plays a full game, maybe if we gave him more game time it would increase his confidence and abilities, you don't have to be a headless chicken and dash around everywhere to positively effect a match.
Interestingly, Kirk has played a part in more goals than any other player this season He 3 goals and 4 assists this season so far from 1193 minutes on the pitch
Statistic as often ignore the rest of the picture. He generally plays a position where the other part of the game is non existent and out ways the good part of his game.
I wonder what his stats are for hiding in a game.
But what is his position in the team? It is to create and score goals right?
Good question because the last 4 managers couldn't find the answer to that one.
Kirk is still head and shoulders the best winger we have at the club , his assist rate is better than Raki and CBT .. and has started to chip in with a few goals … I would have Kirk ahead of the other two every day of the week
Winger! don't make me laugh. He might stand out on the wing, but a winger he is not.
Interestingly, Kirk has played a part in more goals than any other player this season He 3 goals and 4 assists this season so far from 1193 minutes on the pitch
Statistic as often ignore the rest of the picture. He generally plays a position where the other part of the game is non existent and out ways the good part of his game.
I wonder what his stats are for hiding in a game.
But what is his position in the team? It is to create and score goals right?
Good question because the last 4 managers couldn't find the answer to that one.
I'd love to see him come good but I just don't know how you best utilise someone that gives you very little out of possession. Shame because he can pick a pass and showed he could finish with those 2 well taken goals at Burton but I don't think you can play someone in a free role at this level.
Interestingly, Kirk has played a part in more goals than any other player this season He 3 goals and 4 assists this season so far from 1193 minutes on the pitch
Statistic as often ignore the rest of the picture. He generally plays a position where the other part of the game is non existent and out ways the good part of his game.
I wonder what his stats are for hiding in a game.
But what is his position in the team? It is to create and score goals right?
That's a problem that almost all of our players have had over the last two and a half years.
They aren't bad players persay almost all of them are very specialist and lack the ability to even "do a job" doing something else. Whatever team you pick and what ever style you play you end up with 3 or 4 square pegs in round holes and that's if everyone is fit.
It's a squad put together by numbers with little thought given of how it all fits together. You can't just get the center mid that makes the most tackles and the center mid that has the most goal interactions and expect them to be Keane and Scholes.
I still think if you gave a manager 2 windows and half decent backing half this squad (any half of it really) would look 10 times better than they have done.
Interestingly, Kirk has played a part in more goals than any other player this season He 3 goals and 4 assists this season so far from 1193 minutes on the pitch
Statistic as often ignore the rest of the picture. He generally plays a position where the other part of the game is non existent and out ways the good part of his game.
I wonder what his stats are for hiding in a game.
But what is his position in the team? It is to create and score goals right?
Good question because the last 4 managers couldn't find the answer to that one.
Started more times than not for Garner.!
So the manager who left us in 18th position is the endorsement for a player who is on the wing most of the time yet not a winger. I grant you Kirk does have some good attributes but I would wager his lack of involvement during a game is to the detriment of the team.
Perhaps if we had a strong all round balanced team he might have been the cherry on top. Unfortunately CAFC don't have. Perhaps that's why your stats comparing him to the other non creative crap makes him come out on top on 1 aspect of the stats.
The problem with Kirk is he has no pace - He's probably the best winger we have at putting the ball into the box, but he's not an explosive player, so wont, and cant take on the Full-Back and beat him in a race, so he'll never be the type of player to get you out of your seat as you watch him make something happen.
What worked for him at Crewe, was the fact that Pickering had the pace from Full-Back, he'd overlap, take the Full-Back with him and leave Kirk the space to whip the ball into the box. Either that or Pickering would do it himself.
Basically their version of Wiggins and Jackson
Now since we've had Kirk, who have we had thats replicated the Pickering role? - Sessegnon has come closest, but as everyone berates, he has to cut back on to his right foot when he does go forward (Although as we saw on Boxing Day, it seems Holden preferred him hanging back, with Clare as the attacking Wing-Back) which slows down our attack.
Once again the larger issue is the fact that the Recruitment team looked at Charlie as a signing and thought... Yup he has the qualities to make us a better team - Unfortunately it feels as though they didnt look at the bigger picture, and work out why it worked so well for him at Crewe.
I get Kirk isn't perfect... But seems crazy you want to get rid of our biggest contributor to goals on loan or a free transfer, that is mad!! What other club will want to do that.. Clearly he is popular around the club and with team mates as well.. Would be a mistake to let him go
Not sure we have ever used him in the right position, not a winger or a striker. If we had a spot for CAM where they didn't have to put any effort in, would probably look class, however we can't really afford any player not giving 100% so he might aswell go.
I get Kirk isn't perfect... But seems crazy you want to get rid of our biggest contributor to goals on loan or a free transfer, that is mad!! What other club will want to do that.. Clearly he is popular around the club and with team mates as well.. Would be a mistake to let him go
The problem now is the fact that Holden has come in, and in our last couple of games, we've gone back to 3-5-2
That formation doesnt work for any of our wingers, Kirk may be able to adapt like Leuth says, with him in the No.10 role - But once again we're a mess, we've made rigid signings for a 4-4-2 | 4-3-3... and are already changing setup to something that three / four players are useless in.
Comments
He's now been with us 18 months and nothing much has changed.
Perhaps Blackpool may take him back in January.
Kirk just needs a free role in my opinion
The deal was already in place
He 3 goals and 4 assists this season so far from 1193 minutes on the pitch
It worked that time, so wouldn't be surprised if they tried it with us as well
I wonder what his stats are for hiding in a game.
He said a lot of people thought he didnt justify his price tag last season, based on the lack of stats
But in his eyes he was getting involved because there were countless times where he was setting up the bloke who got the assist for the goal. Or there would have been chances he did create but it doesnt go down as anything, because the bloke on the other end of the cross wasn't putting the effort away.
Now lets look at that, who is the bloke at the end of the cross... Oh yes... the equally loved Jayden Stockley...
Kirk does have ability. He's technically sound and delivers a decent ball. His problem appears to be a lack of heart. Shaun Newton and John Robinson weren't especially technically gifted but both worked incredibly hard in the wide areas and with that, won a lot of their battles. Sadly, Kirk appears to need others to win his battles for him and that's probably the definition of a luxury-player. If we were top of the league, we could possibly afford a luxury-player but positioned as we are, then I'd say we need to pick battlers.
Maybe a fellow northerner (Holden) can get a different tune out of Kirk. Let's hope so.
The guy rarely plays a full game, maybe if we gave him more game time it would increase his confidence and abilities, you don't have to be a headless chicken and dash around everywhere to positively effect a match.
They aren't bad players persay almost all of them are very specialist and lack the ability to even "do a job" doing something else. Whatever team you pick and what ever style you play you end up with 3 or 4 square pegs in round holes and that's if everyone is fit.
It's a squad put together by numbers with little thought given of how it all fits together. You can't just get the center mid that makes the most tackles and the center mid that has the most goal interactions and expect them to be Keane and Scholes.
I still think if you gave a manager 2 windows and half decent backing half this squad (any half of it really) would look 10 times better than they have done.
Perhaps if we had a strong all round balanced team he might have been the cherry on top. Unfortunately CAFC don't have. Perhaps that's why your stats comparing him to the other non creative crap makes him come out on top on 1 aspect of the stats.
What worked for him at Crewe, was the fact that Pickering had the pace from Full-Back, he'd overlap, take the Full-Back with him and leave Kirk the space to whip the ball into the box. Either that or Pickering would do it himself.
Basically their version of Wiggins and Jackson
Now since we've had Kirk, who have we had thats replicated the Pickering role? - Sessegnon has come closest, but as everyone berates, he has to cut back on to his right foot when he does go forward (Although as we saw on Boxing Day, it seems Holden preferred him hanging back, with Clare as the attacking Wing-Back) which slows down our attack.
Once again the larger issue is the fact that the Recruitment team looked at Charlie as a signing and thought... Yup he has the qualities to make us a better team - Unfortunately it feels as though they didnt look at the bigger picture, and work out why it worked so well for him at Crewe.
That formation doesnt work for any of our wingers, Kirk may be able to adapt like Leuth says, with him in the No.10 role - But once again we're a mess, we've made rigid signings for a 4-4-2 | 4-3-3... and are already changing setup to something that three / four players are useless in.