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Post-match thread: Charlton Athletic vs Wycombe Wanderers | Saturday 1st Jan 2022
Comments
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I doubt Norwich will employ the anti football tactics of Wycombe, simply because they are a Premier League Team (for a few months anyway) and they are playing a mid-table League One side. I think this will suit us, but in League One teams have worked out the way to beat us is to get bodies behind the ball and suffocate us. We need a Ricky Holmes type and a physical cheating bastard upfront and we won't get beaten for the rest of the season (I like Cole Stockton).Airman Brown said:
I'm not saying it's easy or that it's sensible to spend a lot of money, but I think there is a risk of the remaining positivity generated around the removal of ESI being lost if there is a period of drift. That's one reason why it's important to have a crack at Norwich. It's all about perception. Otherwise you are putting season tickets on sale in the spring against a backdrop of free tickets and unfulfilled promises. The club also needs to restructure the ST offer considerably, which I would think is likely to create winners and losers. People will be less inclined to question price increases if they can see a narrative from what is happening on the pitch. Hopefully, Jacko can provide that. I think he is the big plus at the moment. Personally, I don't think it comes from progressing in the Papa John's Trophy.cabbles said:
Can we really add the sort of quality we’re looking for in Jan though? I think DJ is okay, but I’m not sure a year on, we’ve got a player to get us out of this league.Airman Brown said:
Ipswich? Losing Stockley for three games hurt us as did the Covid absentees at Plymouth. Certainly true that after conceding at Morecambe we haven’t looked the part on the road. I think we have plenty of decent players at this level but we don’t have the depth that has been claimed because a lot of the squad - Arter, Gunter, Morgan, Watson, Kirk, Davison, for example - aren’t useful options.oohaahmortimer said:
We’ve been pony since the Plymouth game and 7 points from 6 games is miles away from where we need to be and nearer relegation form .
of course we’re better than we were ffs that was probably the worse footballing period in our history with Adkins at the start of this season so hardly something to tug ourselves off about .
So many sub standard players it’s doing my head in .
We are an established league one team , disgraceful times and I still can’t see the light at the end of this tunnel of shitnessThe risk has always been that the season fades away, which it could easily now. You could then see a fall-off in season ticket sales, which were inflated by positivity around the takeover. That’s why we need signings in January and momentum going into the summer. It’s not so much about income but credibility. Dumping more and more tickets won’t help if the product is weak.I would say unless we’re bringing in top quality in Jan (hard to do for any club), there is a risk we’ll have squad fodder exactly this time next year.I take your point about bringing players in to excite/increase season ticket sales, but unless that’s someone who genuinely takes your breath away, I can’t see it being a genuine pull for people to pay money next year.
I just looked at the top scorer in League 2 as an example. Some bloke called Dom Telford. In theory you could say that sounds like a decent buy, but given the players we’ve bought in over the last few years, if we announced we’d signed him tomorrow, it’s not someone that would blow me away.
The season is done. Yes, it could be bad tailing off and finishing where we are, but given the notoriously difficult Jan window, I think the money is better saved and used in the summer when we’ve cleared out the dead wood like the ones you mentioned above.0 -
I'd agree with the prevailing opinion on here that we probably didn't deserve to lose the game and there was plenty of huff and puff, but we never really looked like being able to win it at any point either. They took their one chance and we didn't. They sat back behind the ball and the display had an Adkins air of being somewhat clueless about doing something different to try and break them down.@LoOkOuT makes a good point in the OP that we did come across as a team that hadn't played in a good couple of weeks - we were very ponderous on and off the ball and our decision-making was often very poor. The amount of times we tried floating or lofting the ball into the box baffled me when most of our success came from driven crosses or cutbacks. I actually think our best chance was a pullback to Elliott Lee who for some reason decided to wait for the ball to come to him and the chance was gone. Players electing to cut inside rather than cross, allowing Wycombe to get bodies around the ball, was confusing as well.Leko provided an injection of energy but I don't think there's much separating him and Jaiyesemi's overall performances really - frustrating on the day and gave their respective full-back too easy of afternoon. Run at them, try and turn them or run in behind them - it's easy to defend and get players back when you hold them up and try a couple of stepovers.I sympathise with Jackson in terms of him not having the options or not trusting the fringe players to try a different system, but 3-5-2 doesn't really work against teams such as Wycombe who sit in. I think part of it is playing wing-backs who are marked high up the pitch, so they can't stretch the game by running in behind.I know we're in a different position to over ten years ago, but I would be looking to make a signing like Bradley Wright-Phillips this month. Yes we were only one point outside the play-offs at the time and Plymouth Argyle were still a financial mess, but we need that marquee signing or statement of intent to say we mean business this season and the next. Outside of that, get the wheels in motion of separating the wheat from the chaff. Who's going to have no part to play between now and May? Who needs to go out on loan? Who's got five months to stake their claim to stay at the club?1
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I felt for JJ yesterday, yes we have a big squad but far too many of them just are not good enough. Look at the bench when we were chasing the game he literally had nobody who he could bring on who you thought might make the difference. We have a decent 14 players imo but when a couple of key ones are missing there isnt anyonecto step in11
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Yes, agree with all that. I’m desperate for us to have a go at Norwich, and now the season’s dead with the league, even more so. Look at the bounce Millwall got a few years back reaching the QFs.Airman Brown said:
I'm not saying it's easy or that it's sensible to spend a lot of money, but I think there is a risk of the remaining positivity generated around the removal of ESI being lost if there is a period of drift. That's one reason why it's important to have a crack at Norwich. It's all about perception. Otherwise you are putting season tickets on sale in the spring against a backdrop of free tickets and unfulfilled promises. The club also needs to restructure the ST offer considerably, which I would think is likely to create winners and losers. People will be less inclined to question price increases if they can see a narrative from what is happening on the pitch. Hopefully, Jacko can provide that. I think he is the big plus at the moment. Personally, I don't think it comes from progressing in the Papa John's Trophy.cabbles said:
Can we really add the sort of quality we’re looking for in Jan though? I think DJ is okay, but I’m not sure a year on, we’ve got a player to get us out of this league.Airman Brown said:
Ipswich? Losing Stockley for three games hurt us as did the Covid absentees at Plymouth. Certainly true that after conceding at Morecambe we haven’t looked the part on the road. I think we have plenty of decent players at this level but we don’t have the depth that has been claimed because a lot of the squad - Arter, Gunter, Morgan, Watson, Kirk, Davison, for example - aren’t useful options.oohaahmortimer said:We’ve been pony since the Plymouth game and 7 points from 6 games is miles away from where we need to be and nearer relegation form .
of course we’re better than we were ffs that was probably the worse footballing period in our history with Adkins at the start of this season so hardly something to tug ourselves off about .
So many sub standard players it’s doing my head in .
We are an established league one team , disgraceful times and I still can’t see the light at the end of this tunnel of shitnessThe risk has always been that the season fades away, which it could easily now. You could then see a fall-off in season ticket sales, which were inflated by positivity around the takeover. That’s why we need signings in January and momentum going into the summer. It’s not so much about income but credibility. Dumping more and more tickets won’t help if the product is weak.I would say unless we’re bringing in top quality in Jan (hard to do for any club), there is a risk we’ll have squad fodder exactly this time next year.I take your point about bringing players in to excite/increase season ticket sales, but unless that’s someone who genuinely takes your breath away, I can’t see it being a genuine pull for people to pay money next year.
I just looked at the top scorer in League 2 as an example. Some bloke called Dom Telford. In theory you could say that sounds like a decent buy, but given the players we’ve bought in over the last few years, if we announced we’d signed him tomorrow, it’s not someone that would blow me away.
The season is done. Yes, it could be bad tailing off and finishing where we are, but given the notoriously difficult Jan window, I think the money is better saved and used in the summer when we’ve cleared out the dead wood like the ones you mentioned above.1 -
And it's a squad that was built to play 4-3-3. A lot of our investment has been put into wingers and now we don't play with any.AndyG said:I felt for JJ yesterday, yes we have a big squad but far too many of them just are not good enough. Look at the bench when we were chasing the game he literally had nobody who he could bring on who you thought might make the difference. We have a decent 14 players imo but when a couple of key ones are missing there isnt anyonecto step in3 -
To be fair to 433/4231 it's not a great squad either.Chunes said:
And it's a squad that was built to play 4-3-3. A lot of our investment has been put into wingers and now we don't play with any.AndyG said:I felt for JJ yesterday, yes we have a big squad but far too many of them just are not good enough. Look at the bench when we were chasing the game he literally had nobody who he could bring on who you thought might make the difference. We have a decent 14 players imo but when a couple of key ones are missing there isnt anyonecto step in0 -
Yes, Lee scored 12 in 18/19 when Luton got promoted from this division.Croydon said:
Do they? Lee seems scared to shoot half the time, and Gilbey can be so selfish around the box yet only has one goal to his name. It's not as if they're not in the right areas, they're just not scoring.Scoham said:
Agree though Lee and Gilbey have goals in them - is it more about the style of play, formation and their roles within that? They don't get in many shooting positions, Stockley, Washington and Purrington tend to be our main goal threats. I don't think it's solved just by putting JFC in the team.mendonca said:We only have 3 goals from Lee, Gilbey and Dobson this season.
That's too low from your 3 CMs. It also shows the value of JFC (despite his flaws) as he can turn games like yesterday into a 1-1.
How often is Gilbey shooting? I doubt he's averaging enough shots per game compared to the CMs in this league who are on course for double figures by the end of the season. With Lee as the most attacking CM it means Gilbey plays more box to box, he'd likely score more by taking that attacking midfielder role.1 -
We seem short of a shooter and when we can't play Stockley AND Washington, we are weak as a strike force. At this level, I don't think there is much else wrong.1
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No one wants to have a ping, dig, crack at goal ….bottle merchants with no confidence/ability or both to let it go and we could then get deflections, possible chances from rebounds, corners ..
as Golfie would say if you don’t buy a ticket you won’t win the raffle ..2 -
Depth. We have a big squad but not enough promotion quality players. As well as replacing Davison with two good strikers we need better than Matthews/Gunter (may be room for one of them as cover), Watson, Morgan, Arter and Souare. Kirk also needs to step up.MuttleyCAFC said:We seem short of a shooter and when we can't play Stockley AND Washington, we are weak as a strike force. At this level, I don't think there is much else wrong.
Promotion squads have more players who will compete at the level above. We have too many players who have no chance of that.
Another big summer rebuild coming up.1 - Sponsored links:
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Completely agree Trev but I think he will await a Summer rebuild again rather than spend money on bigger wages which aren't going to achieve anything this season. I think we will be underwhelmed once more and then face a squad rebuild. We have to hope that the lesson of last Summer has been learnt and that we are quick out of the traps if it's all to be done close season. If we don't win promotion next season we will effectively have become a League One club with yo-yo ambitions for the Championship.CAFCTrev said:The league season is over now for me, but lets use the January window to put together a strong team ahead of next season. Hopefully come August we can hit the ground running this time and avoid the shambles that was last summer.
In the mean time it would be nice to try and win the pizza trophy, its probably the only thing we can realistically go for now and another Wembley day out would be great.1 -
We have been “bested” by much smaller teams who play in smaller grounds than Wycombe since we have been in league one. You sound like a privileged Sunderland or Newcastle fan who thinks they should be doing better because they have big groundsaddick1956 said:
It is simy not true they have bounced between Championship and League 1 for a number of seasons unless I have woken up in 2025 . They went up in 2020, luckily as it happens on an unfinished season and came down ineaststandmike said:
Take a deep breath, yes we lack talent, yes we need to rebuild and yes another season in league one looks on the cards. But.................addick1956 said:
It is too late...we need 4 quality players. Teams keep rolling us over, often using players we let go in the past. Losing to pub clubs like Wycombe whose total support would not fill one stand at the Valley is another new low. If things don't improve I won't buy another season ticket . I will wait for a free one.sammy391 said:Boring turgid game.
we’re way too sloppy to get anything out of games, and way too wasteful too!Silly mistakes and silly fouls cost us the second ball often - and just nothing upfront when stockley isn’t around.
really don’t get the constant use of Leko - who drifts in and out of games- roll on CBT bring for again!January a huge time for us, but think it is way too late unfortunately
Wycombe are not mugs, they have bounced between league one and the championship for a number of seasons getting plenty of experience whilst up there. They are 4 points off automatic promotion as well.
The comment about the size of their crowds was a silly one, Sunderland have struggled to get out of this league the same as us and our crowds would not fill one of their stands, they had over 34,000 in yesterday
2021, the year I believed I just left until I read your offering of a criticism.
I don't care where they sit now. They play
in a remote ground at the back end of an industrial estate and play like a pub team.
A club of our size should not be bested by the likes of them, let alone twice in a season.
If you think that is OK your standards are very low.
I am a realist who does not wear rose tinted specs, in the 55 years I have been supporting Charlton I have seen it all and trust me, my standards are low whilst we are in this shit league.1 -
I see Cole Stockton got another brace. He is somebody we should absolutely try to get.1
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Unfortunately, we won't. He doesn't fit the profile TS is looking for. He wouldn't have sell on value at his age and would cost upward of 500k to bring in.MuttleyCAFC said:I see Cole Stockton got another brace. He is somebody we should absolutely try to get.1 -
Stockton is a year younger than Stockley, who we bought in the summer for a similar fee.....Cloudworm said:
Unfortunately, we won't. He doesn't fit the profile TS is looking for. He wouldn't have sell on value at his age and would cost upward of 500k to bring in.MuttleyCAFC said:I see Cole Stockton got another brace. He is somebody we should absolutely try to get.1 -
Exactly the same situation as me and my son. Just about got over it now...ForeverAddickted said:
I'm double vaccinated, but still caught COVID at the end of November.golfaddick said:
Are you vaccinated ?DONVANVLIET said:Not sure hangovers were the only reason for the obvious drop in attendees yesterday. I know seven people (all season ticket holders) who did not attend, including myself, and it was simply down to the current levels of Covid infections. I won't be going on Tuesday or next Saturday and won't be returning until the infection rates have dropped sharply. I know I am not alone in thinking this way.
I only ask because if you are then there is no real reason to not go. Do you stay at home all winter in case you get the flu ? MMR ?
Ironically I tested positive four days after the Plymouth game at the Valley - First "Fill the Valley" event, and I hadnt been anywhere else - So I'm pretty confident I caught it at Charlton1 -
Stockton is, in my opinion, having a purple patch at Morecombe. Case of player and club being a good fit. His previous record suggests as such. At nearly 28 and currently playing at by far the highest level he ever has I really don’t see him as the answer.Lincsaddick said:
Stockton would go straight into our team .. but I reckon IF he goes in Jan, he's Championship bound (Huddersfield, Blackpool ?) ..ForeverAddickted said:
Going to be one of four options:Lincsaddick said:all been said, no Stockley, no goals .. thing is where to find a very good and consistent striker in January who is 'happy' to play second fiddle and spend a lot of time on the bench ?
Currently in League One yet has reached their ceiling at their club (Stockton)
Currently in League Two and producing (Matt @ Forest Green has been mentioned)
Currently warming the bench in the Championship, doesn't have much to lose (Aneke)
Or a youth prospect from the Premier League.
Anyone we bring in will be a risk, as there is always the potential they could be a Ajose, Benson, McAleny.
as you say, always a danger that someone like Stockton is a one team man and/or a one season flash in the pan .. you pay your money and take the risks (not my money is it lol)2 -
He has attributes we need to take us forward IMO.0
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Cole Stockton's season is baffling me. Got a mate who is a Tranmere fan so saw him play a few times for them. He was utter shite0
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I'm sure I've said it before but there are so many examples of target men/hold up strikers coming good in their mid to late 20s - Taylor and Kermorgant with us for example. Michael Smith another former player of ours but the other way around. Stockley's on track to do the same. Further back Rickie Lambert continued to improve to the point he played for England.Pelling1993 said:Cole Stockton's season is baffling me. Got a mate who is a Tranmere fan so saw him play a few times for them. He was utter shite
I would guess it's down to them learning how to best make use of their strength and becoming more consistent and well rounded as they gain experience. Quick strikers on the other sometimes peak early and aren't as threatening after they start losing that pace.
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