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POST-MATCH THREAD: Wycombe Wanderers vs Charlton Athletic: Saturday 27th April 2024 | KO 12.30
Comments
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I didn't much notice him tbh. But Jones did say he subbed the players at half time because he felt they weren't contributingJamesSeed said:Surprised to see Ness scoring fours. He looked solid enough playing right in front of us. Misplaced a pass that went out of play. He also played a forward pass to Kanu that got intercepted, but that was more because Kanu was on his heels - he’s not a natural target man. Otherwise I thought he was fine against a pretty physical Wycombe attack. Getting subbed at half time didn’t reflect a bad performance if that’s what people are assuming?0 -
Probably the least enjoyable season I can remember as a Charlton fan - dire football throughout, hardly any wins to celebrate, struggling to think of any memorable matches or moments of excitement.Jones still has a lot to do to convince me. Over the 15 games his record is not massively better than Appleton's. You can say the squad is dross (and it looks like it), but I find it hard to believe that what he's got to work can be worse than most clubs at this level. On paper (in terms of wages, experience, past performance etc) our squad just shouldn't be scrapping at the bottom of League One. When you have the top scorer in the league, you shouldn't be finishing 16th will eleven wins for the season. There's clearly something rotten in the culture of the club, and I'm not optimistic about it being sorted out over a summer, or with the current ownership - I hope I'm wrong!7
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Taking a defender off at half time other than for an injury and then manager saying afterwards he took those off as they were not contributing is a much better reflection of his performance yesterdayJamesSeed said:Surprised to see Ness scoring fours. He looked solid enough playing right in front of us. Misplaced a pass that went out of play. He also played a forward pass to Kanu that got intercepted, but that was more because Kanu was on his heels - he’s not a natural target man. Otherwise I thought he was fine against a pretty physical Wycombe attack. Getting subbed at half time didn’t reflect a bad performance if that’s what people are assuming?3 -
It's worse. Jones 16 games have yielded 22 points. Appleton's after the same number of games, 23, but that's not the full story, the latter having had a run of 4 points from a possible 30 after the Cheltenham game, which led to his dismissal.ateamofcorygibbs said:Probably the least enjoyable season I can remember as a Charlton fan - dire football throughout, hardly any wins to celebrate, struggling to think of any memorable matches or moments of excitement.Jones still has a lot to do to convince me. Over the 15 games his record is not massively better than Appleton's. You can say the squad is dross (and it looks like it), but I find it hard to believe that what he's got to work can be worse than most clubs at this level. On paper (in terms of wages, experience, past performance etc) our squad just shouldn't be scrapping at the bottom of League One. When you have the top scorer in the league, you shouldn't be finishing 16th will eleven wins for the season. There's clearly something rotten in the culture of the club, and I'm not optimistic about it being sorted out over a summer, or with the current ownership - I hope I'm wrong!
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Worst season statistically since 1925/1926.
Nathan there's work to do. Hope and think you're up to it.2 -
Jones is not insane.northstandsteve said:All this wholesale changes, is fine if you can move players on, I understand that out of contract players not offered new contracts, but you can’t move on contracted players unless they want to go. The board are going to have to invest massively . More than they realise, if they don’t nothing changes and Jones will walk. But saying that, his team selection and changes were bordering on madness. Sorry but no sane Manager can pick Lua Lua in the squad put Forini on and leave Coventry on the bench.
He obviously had his reasons for the selections.
It's just that we don't know the reasons.9 -
I like Jones and think he has done wonders, I think his personality is such that he will not let Charlie and Scott sod him around.oohaahmortimer said:Jones garnered a good work ethic to get us out of the Appleton carnage
I’m not convinced
a) he’s good enough to get us promoted and
b ) he’ll be given enough decent players to give himself a chance
3% Automatic promotion
30% Play offs
65% 7th-12th
2% bottom half7 -
I don't really get why Nathan keeps talking about personnel being behind the defensive issues ...then consistently selecting the same personnel
Thomas has always been a 4th choice CB, more often deployed as an emergency LB, who's contract is up anyway ...why has be been playing every week?4 -
Simply the other options are seen as worse?JonT_Abs said:I don't really get why Nathan keeps talking about personnel being behind the defensive issues ...then consistently selecting the same personnel
Thomas has always been a 4th choice CB, more often deployed as an emergency LB, who's contact is up anyway ...why has be been playing every week?1 - Sponsored links:
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That's an interesting stat, it probably bears out Nathan Jones declaring that three managers can't all be wrong. I think we all know that the squad the three managers were expected to work with was bloody poor, I think we all took the Millwall friendly as a sign of progress, till we got the wake up call of a side conceding goals as a matter of course, Hector, Asiimwe and dodgy keeping by AMB being the lowlights in the early season. Bye bye Holden, in comes Appleton, almost immediately he gets Leaburn and Chuks available, results improve till he loses both of them. In steps Jones, some players improved, Watson and Kanu being the most noticeable, but we also get a proper wing back in Small, results improve and some very good results too, but match that with draws and daft goals conceded. Since we were virtually safe, performances have been poor and it feels like some players know they are going and others who are staying or believe they are, are struggling to maintain their level of performance. Criticism of Jones is a bit harsh, basically because whatever we think of certain players, overall the squad is poor, it's been poor since early August and it's only slightly improved since January, if its the same come July then Jones will follow Appleton and Holden out of the door.swordfish said:
It's worse. Jones 16 games have yielded 22 points. Appleton's after the same number of games, 23, but that's not the full story, the latter having had a run of 4 points from a possible 30 after the Cheltenham game, which led to his dismissal.ateamofcorygibbs said:Probably the least enjoyable season I can remember as a Charlton fan - dire football throughout, hardly any wins to celebrate, struggling to think of any memorable matches or moments of excitement.Jones still has a lot to do to convince me. Over the 15 games his record is not massively better than Appleton's. You can say the squad is dross (and it looks like it), but I find it hard to believe that what he's got to work can be worse than most clubs at this level. On paper (in terms of wages, experience, past performance etc) our squad just shouldn't be scrapping at the bottom of League One. When you have the top scorer in the league, you shouldn't be finishing 16th will eleven wins for the season. There's clearly something rotten in the culture of the club, and I'm not optimistic about it being sorted out over a summer, or with the current ownership - I hope I'm wrong!2 -
Be very expensive to get rid of jones. Better to buy some decent players. The issue there being our track record of identifying and then signing decent players. Small and Ramsey look good though.1
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Jones has vanished without trace, Ness, Gillesphey and REG seem to be in the team sometimes, sometimes the bench, sometimes out. It's weird that the 2 CBs that have played most are the 2 out of contract. If L Jones is injured, it's weird to have had no confirmation from N Jones, the customary moan a manager has when a key player is absent.Dazzler21 said:
Simply the other options are seen as worse?JonT_Abs said:I don't really get why Nathan keeps talking about personnel being behind the defensive issues ...then consistently selecting the same personnel
Thomas has always been a 4th choice CB, more often deployed as an emergency LB, who's contact is up anyway ...why has be been playing every week?
And worth noting that we bought almost a whole new defence in January/February. Appleton never had Small and Ramsay, and had little time with Gillesphey and REG before he was sacked, so it's not as if the same set of defenders has been struggling all season.1 -
Definitely need a new keeper4
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I watched the game on tv, which was probably for the best. That performance nearly had me dropping off. It was a typical end of season game played by professional footballers who looked to me they knew their fate. A bit of a kick about to complete the fixtures. The players out there Saturday know there will be a fair number of them being let go and some new ones coming in. It was good not to win and finish with our worse position for a century, it leaves no one in any doubt or give false hope to us supporters. I cant remember a squad so large and with so many players used throughout the season, that was so well short of talent and made little attempt to make up the shortfall with may be a bit more effort.
I've heard, straight from the horses mouth, that they want 6 players in this summer. Quite often what you want and what you get and what you hear and what you get is not remotely what you actually end up with.
I'm glad its all over and I can now have a few weeks off not shouting at the telly before I look forward to another year in the 3rd division.0 -
I don't believe the wing backs are part of the problem. It's the CB's. Hector has been decent in the past couple of months, but the rest have either been poor, disinterested or not picked for other reasons.killerandflash said:
Jones has vanished without trace, Ness, Gillesphey and REG seem to be in the team sometimes, sometimes the bench, sometimes out. It's weird that the 2 CBs that have played most are the 2 out of contract. If L Jones is injured, it's weird to have had no confirmation from N Jones, the customary moan a manager has when a key player is absent.Dazzler21 said:
Simply the other options are seen as worse?JonT_Abs said:I don't really get why Nathan keeps talking about personnel being behind the defensive issues ...then consistently selecting the same personnel
Thomas has always been a 4th choice CB, more often deployed as an emergency LB, who's contact is up anyway ...why has be been playing every week?
And worth noting that we bought almost a whole new defence in January/February. Appleton never had Small and Ramsay, and had little time with Gillesphey and REG before he was sacked, so it's not as if the same set of defenders has been struggling all season.
Maybe Jones picked the ones willing to work.1 -
I'm with Silly Billy. As I have said before with NJ "expect the unexpected". That includes these bizzare decisions, team selections and substitutions. However I do support him ,as he s the manager of my team, and I want him to do well.Sillybilly said:I tuned in today mainly because it was raining and I was very tired so nowt better to do today than put my foot up and wish a farewell to this bunch of chancers that have besmirched the shirt this season. A hearty fuck you very much to the vast majority of them. Typically, the day I put money on a certain draw we conspire to lose to bring an end to the most ignominious long unbeaten run on record. Gits!!!!!
i know I’m in the minority but I’m not in the Jones the Messiah camp. I doff my cap to him and thank him for somehow getting this shower of shit over the line when we were headed for certain oblivion a few short months ago, but there are signs that he’ll do things in his own slightly bonkers way moving forward. I’m not getting the treatment of Alfie and today’s selection was just nuts. His brand of hoofball has saved us (genuine thanks again) but if I have to watch that next season I’m out cos it’s as boring as a long weekend in Blackpool. I’m hoping that with “his” squad things will be different but I’m reserving judgement for now.So we pause for reflection and recharge the batteries. Those of us who’ve been in it for the long haul have taken a pasting this season. It has added a lot of stones to my bucket. Admittedly, absence and watching via stream isn’t great, but it’s going to take a real overhaul and an early sign that the owners and Jones are serious about revolution to keep me captive. Don’t get me wrong, a few weeks sunshine will undoubtedly recharge my batteries but thank God or whatever your chosen Deity that this season is over.
He has all the cards in his hands, with power over recruitment and so far a generous ownership. Let's see what happens.
I'm going to renew my ST, with fingers crossed. There so much to do I think it may 2 seasons of good recruitment maybe 3 to get promotion. (Thinking- that's what Ipswich needed)3 -
Jones likes hard work. He loves Karoy, because he works hard. Daniel Kanu ticks his box. He suspects May of being a goal-hanger. He can't have Jones because there's only room for one Jones in this club and its him. We're definitely off to the wacky races next season - it may go well, it may go not so well - but it won't be as dull as this one.3
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lol, is this something that was actually said in seriousnessBlockhead said:Jones likes hard work. He loves Karoy, because he works hard. Daniel Kanu ticks his box. He suspects May of being a goal-hanger. He can't have Jones because there's only room for one Jones in this club and its him. We're definitely off to the wacky races next season - it may go well, it may go not so well - but it won't be as dull as this one.0 -
You’re probably right, but he did have a good spell shortly after the free kick where he got his foot in and broke up play a few times, which led to the (clearly ironic, yet nonetheless highly amusing) chants of ‘sign him up!’.robinofottershaw said:
I agree. Yes, the free kick was good but every cameo he has played, including yesterday, he has looked pretty ineffective to me. I am sure his counter would be that he hasn't had enough minutes to show what he can do. However, I am not convinced the juice is worth the squeeze.Davo55 said:
Strange how fans see things so differently. I think Fiorini was poor. Barely contributed anything apart from the free kick that hit the bar.JamesSeed said:Well, Fiorini was good.
its very hard not to watch a performance without taking previous appearances into account. Overall he’s been utterly useless, but he wasn’t ineffective on Saturday imho.1 - Sponsored links:
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Yeah, but I don’t take every word he says on face value. Ness wasn’t involved in their goal, unlike TT, and to some extent Hector. He probably played better than both in the first half, well much better than TT at least. Had he played as badly as Terrell you could understand him being switched out, but he didn’t.Chunes said:
I didn't much notice him tbh. But Jones did say he subbed the players at half time because he felt they weren't contributingJamesSeed said:Surprised to see Ness scoring fours. He looked solid enough playing right in front of us. Misplaced a pass that went out of play. He also played a forward pass to Kanu that got intercepted, but that was more because Kanu was on his heels - he’s not a natural target man. Otherwise I thought he was fine against a pretty physical Wycombe attack. Getting subbed at half time didn’t reflect a bad performance if that’s what people are assuming?
And we still don’t know why he hasn’t been selecting Jones do we? Is he still injured? Was his two or three games poor spell so bad that he no longer trusts him?Does he like him so much he’s taking the opportunity to look at other CBs to see if they’re worth keeping?
Not sure NJ has dropped any hints has he, or did I miss something?1 -
Agreed Fiorini did well when he came on. A lot more combative than in his previous appearances, suggesting that if he had been fit enough to play like that when he arrived, he would have figured a lot more.JamesSeed said:
You’re probably right, but he did have a good spell shortly after the free kick where he got his foot in and broke up play a few times, which led to the (clearly ironic, yet nonetheless highly amusing) chants of ‘sign him up!’.robinofottershaw said:
I agree. Yes, the free kick was good but every cameo he has played, including yesterday, he has looked pretty ineffective to me. I am sure his counter would be that he hasn't had enough minutes to show what he can do. However, I am not convinced the juice is worth the squeeze.Davo55 said:
Strange how fans see things so differently. I think Fiorini was poor. Barely contributed anything apart from the free kick that hit the bar.JamesSeed said:Well, Fiorini was good.
its very hard not to watch a performance without taking previous appearances into account. Overall he’s been utterly useless, but he wasn’t ineffective on Saturday imho.
I thought Isted was fine as well. He may have been poor in previous games, but on Saturday was one of our better players.1 -
If there is any truth that May is out of favour with NJ ?
then it flies in face of fans who voted by recording breaking 82% for May as POTY.
surely not as May works his socks off and is a proven 20+ goal machine
CAFC website.....The striker, who received a record-breaking 82% of fans’ votes, has impressed throughout his debut campaign with the Addicks, scoring 27 goals across all competitions. His 23 league goals earned him the Sky Bet League One Golden Boot award and he was also named in the EFL Team of the Season for League One.
Captain George Dobson finished as the runner-up, with Terell Thomas coming third.
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A player told me that Bakinson was picked because it saves the club from paying an extra fee for his loan and that Fiorini was brought on as a reward for how he has been in training.
So there may have been some method in the selection madness.7 -
Only 6? Hmmm.charltonkeston said:I watched the game on tv, which was probably for the best. That performance nearly had me dropping off. It was a typical end of season game played by professional footballers who looked to me they knew their fate. A bit of a kick about to complete the fixtures. The players out there Saturday know there will be a fair number of them being let go and some new ones coming in. It was good not to win and finish with our worse position for a century, it leaves no one in any doubt or give false hope to us supporters. I cant remember a squad so large and with so many players used throughout the season, that was so well short of talent and made little attempt to make up the shortfall with may be a bit more effort.
I've heard, straight from the horses mouth, that they want 6 players in this summer. Quite often what you want and what you get and what you hear and what you get is not remotely what you actually end up with.
I'm glad its all over and I can now have a few weeks off not shouting at the telly before I look forward to another year in the 3rd division.0 -
Looking on the bright side, at least none of our owners copied TS's walk around the pitch before the game...
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‘Few weeks’ ? Try few months to the next seasoncharltonkeston said:I watched the game on tv, which was probably for the best. That performance nearly had me dropping off. It was a typical end of season game played by professional footballers who looked to me they knew their fate. A bit of a kick about to complete the fixtures. The players out there Saturday know there will be a fair number of them being let go and some new ones coming in. It was good not to win and finish with our worse position for a century, it leaves no one in any doubt or give false hope to us supporters. I cant remember a squad so large and with so many players used throughout the season, that was so well short of talent and made little attempt to make up the shortfall with may be a bit more effort.
I've heard, straight from the horses mouth, that they want 6 players in this summer. Quite often what you want and what you get and what you hear and what you get is not remotely what you actually end up with.
I'm glad it’s all over and I can now have a few weeks off not shouting at the telly before I look forward to another year in the 3rd division.0 -
Sorry to offend (honest) but he does look like a "challenged" person being led around by his carer in that picture.killerandflash said:Looking on the bright side, at least none of our owners copied TS's walk around the pitch before the game...3 -
haha I'd completely forgotten about this!killerandflash said:Looking on the bright side, at least none of our owners copied TS's walk around the pitch before the game...0 -
A lot of cognitive dissonance on this thread. “I didn’t like Appleton so when he couldn’t get a tune out of the squad it was his fault”. “ I like Jones so now he can’t get much of a tune out of the squad it’s the players.”
Truth, as usual, probably lies somewhere on between. There is, however a lot of blind faith being placed in Jones. I really hope he delivers but it’s not a racing certainty based on his 16 games here.7
