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Anyone feel a bit sorry for Luzon?

Swisdom
Swisdom Posts: 14,977
in General Charlton
I was going to post this last week because I genuinely felt a bit sorry for him.

Many of the fans hated him
Some fans mocked him
Thousands of people told him he was about to get sacked and that he didn't know what he was doing (admittedly many sang his name when we got to 2-2 vs Norwich)

This all after he'd been sacked 6 months ago under a similar cloud.

I will admit it, I felt sorry for him.

Then along came Brentford and we played really well - smashed them if I am honest. Scored some lovely goals and played some good football. But when those goals went in how many players ran over and hugged the gaffer. How many high fived him? The answer was none. He was doing his pieces on the sidelines but none of the players came to him.

Again I felt a bit sorry for him.

Fast forward to last night and again he is criticised for not attending a fans meeting in favour of scouting the opposition for a 6 pointer this coming Friday. From my perspective I can think of no place other than at last nights game that I would rather he were at. Not a scout. Not one of his coaches. Guy Luzon - in the crowd - watching our next opponent as that is the most important thing this week.

Again I felt a bit sorry for him.

So in summary my message is simple. Fair play to him so far. He hasn't risen to it and hasn't moaned. He has kept his trap shut - got on with his job and appears to want to let his football (and a few well placed soundbites) do the talking. I genuinely hope he does well for us because I like to see a bit of passion. I like to see players willing to throw their body on the line and if this man can encourage more of these things he's alright in my book.

Now - go and get 3 points against Wigan and I'll consider getting your name tattooed on @Greenie Junior's arse :-)
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Comments

  • Ledge
    Ledge Posts: 7,179
    Well said
  • Henry Irving
    Henry Irving Posts: 85,269
    Seth does
  • cafcledbury
    cafcledbury Posts: 1,228
    edited February 2015
    Swisdom guys love child. I feel sorry for him he not got the fans backing at the moment. He got a tough task ahead .everyone loved Powell. Then riga. Then everyone loved bob Peters. And we will all love Guy Luzon when we beat the spanners in the toolbox. We are all charlton till we die .
  • PL54
    PL54 Posts: 10,757
    He has walked into a shit storm not of his making and been immediately written off by some - shame those people don't have the best interests of the club in mind.

    Supporting an as yet not crap manager shouldn't be hard.
  • Atletico Addick
    Atletico Addick Posts: 5,843
    Swallowing his pride by recognising and clapping the fans efforts would be a start.
  • ChicagoAddick
    ChicagoAddick Posts: 4,398
    edited February 2015
    A little bit, but he is hardly unused to what he has walked into. Standard fans behaved a lot worse. He is well paid, has a good relationship with the owner, his confidence should be high as he was chosen as the best of 20 candidates and has just got his first win. And unlike some employees, he will be judged on results by his boss. Maybe.


  • ForeverAddickted
    ForeverAddickted Posts: 94,642
    Atletico Addick said:

    Swallowing his pride by recognising and clapping the fans efforts would be a start.

    Suppose its gotta come to a stage when the fans have to swallow their pride and get behind him though... Just gotta see who swallows first
  • Garrymanilow
    Garrymanilow Posts: 13,215
    To be fair I don't think there was really anyone knocking Luzon for not showing up at the meeting. Most if not all of the comments were directed at the club only announcing he wouldn't be there 30 mins before the start, which was just bad planning on their part. We really need to get three points at Wigan so I hope he learned a lot last night
  • ForeverAddickted
    ForeverAddickted Posts: 94,642
    Garrymanilow said:

    To be fair I don't think there was really anyone knocking Luzon for not showing up at the meeting. Most if not all of the comments were directed at the club only announcing he wouldn't be there 30 mins before the start, which was just bad planning on their part. We really need to get three points at Wigan so I hope he learned a lot last night

    Really hope a Wigan win last night showed him more than a defeat would have... It means he now knows where Wigan will be a threat going forwards and where their strengths will be in Defence, now all he has to do is exploit them whilst ensuring we stay tight where Reading werent
  • PL54
    PL54 Posts: 10,757
    edited February 2015
    Atletico Addick said:

    Swallowing his pride by recognising and clapping the fans efforts would be a start.

    4 days after being told he "doesn't know what he's doing" and was "getting sacked in the morning" ?

    It's not his pride that needs swallowing.

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  • Solidgone
    Solidgone Posts: 10,220
    I thought Bowie sang "he swallowed his pride and puckered his lips...."
  • Atletico Addick
    Atletico Addick Posts: 5,843
    PL54 said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    Swallowing his pride by recognising and clapping the fans efforts would be a start.

    4 days after being told he "doesn't know what he's doing" and was "getting sacked in the morning" ?

    It's not his pride that needs swallowing.
    That's part parcel of football, there's a lot worse being sung in the stands than that, hell, ball boys get more of a blasting than that at some games! He's getting paid to do a job, do the job foremostly but acknowledge the fans you are doing that job, essentially, for.. no harm done, you won't win them over by ignoring them, even if we are winning, the fans would put the praise onto the players.
  • Fumbluff
    Fumbluff Posts: 10,138
    Um, nope
  • A-R-T-H-U-R
    A-R-T-H-U-R Posts: 7,678
    Atletico Addick said:

    PL54 said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    Swallowing his pride by recognising and clapping the fans efforts would be a start.

    4 days after being told he "doesn't know what he's doing" and was "getting sacked in the morning" ?

    It's not his pride that needs swallowing.
    That's part parcel of football
    No it isn't.
    That's part and parcel of petulant, impatient, childish fans who wouldn't be seen at just about any other football club.
    Not in my name thanks.
  • flyingkiwiDK
    flyingkiwiDK Posts: 5,725
    He's got a tough task ahead of him and he knows it therefore I don't feel sorry for him.

    I wish him well and hope he succeeds. I still refuse to judge him after only a handful of games.
  • PragueAddick
    PragueAddick Posts: 22,165
    Guy Luzon is actually an extraordinarily privileged Head Coach. Most such who lose their jobs are just slung out.

    When Luzon was "slung out " of Standard, he was actually retained by RD, apparently to "do consulting work" at Ujpest. According to our correspondent there, there is no sign that he actually did anything of note. Indeed, there was no physical sign of him. However Hungarian clubs benefit from special tax status, so presumably it was mutually advantageous to have him on that payroll. . Then, lo and behold, a new assignment came up in the conglomerate, and Guy moved seamlessly into his next role. It seems that the little local difficulty caused by a rogue Israeli website did not upset his boss too much.

    So no, I don't feel sorry for Luzon at all. I don't think that in modern European football a coach who has been "fired" has ever been treated more generously by his boss.

  • Atletico Addick
    Atletico Addick Posts: 5,843
    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    PL54 said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    Swallowing his pride by recognising and clapping the fans efforts would be a start.

    4 days after being told he "doesn't know what he's doing" and was "getting sacked in the morning" ?

    It's not his pride that needs swallowing.
    That's part parcel of football
    No it isn't.
    That's part and parcel of petulant, impatient, childish fans who wouldn't be seen at just about any other football club.
    Not in my name thanks.
    Which is part parcel of football... If you think Charlton fans are the only to do this sort of thing then you are deluded, take that from someone who sees a lot lot worse at plenty of other football clubs. A few sing songs is nothing in reality.
  • ricky_otto
    ricky_otto Posts: 22,600
    Not particularly. He's getting paid to do a job. That said,he deserves a bit more respect than he has had so far.

    His appointment and network connection will always cause debate - as with anybody within the network. I'm not a fan of his (so far). But I'm as fickle as most football supporters, so will only be too happy to be 'won over' because that will mean the team are doing well.

    The problem Luzon has is that when things go well he won't get the credit that Powell or Curbs got. But I get the impression that a couple of bad results and the knives will be out and getting sharper.

    You can't please a of the people all of the time.

  • ValleyGary
    ValleyGary Posts: 38,001
    Great post Swisdom.
  • A-R-T-H-U-R
    A-R-T-H-U-R Posts: 7,678
    edited February 2015
    Atletico Addick said:

    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    PL54 said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    Swallowing his pride by recognising and clapping the fans efforts would be a start.

    4 days after being told he "doesn't know what he's doing" and was "getting sacked in the morning" ?

    It's not his pride that needs swallowing.
    That's part parcel of football
    No it isn't.
    That's part and parcel of petulant, impatient, childish fans who wouldn't be seen at just about any other football club.
    Not in my name thanks.
    Which is part parcel of football... If you think Charlton fans are the only to do this sort of thing then you are deluded, take that from someone who sees a lot lot worse at plenty of other football clubs. A few sing songs is nothing in reality.
    Come on now.
    Name three clubs you have been to where "you don't know what you're doing" chants have rung out at their managers fist home game.
    Please don't call me deluded. Your agenda is clear without getting personal.

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  • A-R-T-H-U-R
    A-R-T-H-U-R Posts: 7,678
    edited February 2015
    PragueAddick said:

    Guy Luzon is actually an extraordinarily privileged Head Coach. Most such who lose their jobs are just slung out.

    When Luzon was "slung out " of Standard, he was actually retained by RD, apparently to "do consulting work" at Ujpest. According to our correspondent there, there is no sign that he actually did anything of note. Indeed, there was no physical sign of him. However Hungarian clubs benefit from special tax status, so presumably it was mutually advantageous to have him on that payroll. . Then, lo and behold, a new assignment came up in the conglomerate, and Guy moved seamlessly into his next role. It seems that the little local difficulty caused by a rogue Israeli website did not upset his boss too much.

    So no, I don't feel sorry for Luzon at all. I don't think that in modern European football a coach who has been "fired" has ever been treated more generously by his boss.

    Conglomerate? I thought Roland was only into football now?
    Lovely narrative though, I particularly like the 'lo and behold'
    I agree with you about his cushioning in the network, but I would add I don't think in modern football many managers have been treated so disrespectfully in their first home game.
  • PragueAddick
    PragueAddick Posts: 22,165
    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    PL54 said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    Swallowing his pride by recognising and clapping the fans efforts would be a start.

    4 days after being told he "doesn't know what he's doing" and was "getting sacked in the morning" ?

    It's not his pride that needs swallowing.
    That's part parcel of football
    No it isn't.
    That's part and parcel of petulant, impatient, childish fans who wouldn't be seen at just about any other football club.
    Not in my name thanks.
    Which is part parcel of football... If you think Charlton fans are the only to do this sort of thing then you are deluded, take that from someone who sees a lot lot worse at plenty of other football clubs. A few sing songs is nothing in reality.
    Come on now.
    Name three clubs you have been to where you don't know what you're doing chants have rung out at their managers fist home game.
    Please don't call me deluded. Your agenda is clear without getting personal.
    Well to be a fair comparison, those three clubs would need to have the same circumstances as Charlton. Part of a network where the manager was fired from one network club, sent as a "consultant" to a second, and then sent on to the third club as soon as a vacancy appears.

    That' s a tough one.
  • A-R-T-H-U-R
    A-R-T-H-U-R Posts: 7,678
    PragueAddick said:

    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    PL54 said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    Swallowing his pride by recognising and clapping the fans efforts would be a start.

    4 days after being told he "doesn't know what he's doing" and was "getting sacked in the morning" ?

    It's not his pride that needs swallowing.
    That's part parcel of football
    No it isn't.
    That's part and parcel of petulant, impatient, childish fans who wouldn't be seen at just about any other football club.
    Not in my name thanks.
    Which is part parcel of football... If you think Charlton fans are the only to do this sort of thing then you are deluded, take that from someone who sees a lot lot worse at plenty of other football clubs. A few sing songs is nothing in reality.
    Come on now.
    Name three clubs you have been to where you don't know what you're doing chants have rung out at their managers fist home game.
    Please don't call me deluded. Your agenda is clear without getting personal.
    Well to be a fair comparison, those three clubs would need to have the same circumstances as Charlton. Part of a network where the manager was fired from one network club, sent as a "consultant" to a second, and then sent on to the third club as soon as a vacancy appears.

    That' s a tough one.
    Maybe read his comments again.
    He said if Charlton fans are the only ones doing this then I am deluded, then you pipe up saying no one is in the same position as Charlton.
    Which one is it?
  • PragueAddick
    PragueAddick Posts: 22,165
    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    PragueAddick said:

    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    PL54 said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    Swallowing his pride by recognising and clapping the fans efforts would be a start.

    4 days after being told he "doesn't know what he's doing" and was "getting sacked in the morning" ?

    It's not his pride that needs swallowing.
    That's part parcel of football
    No it isn't.
    That's part and parcel of petulant, impatient, childish fans who wouldn't be seen at just about any other football club.
    Not in my name thanks.
    Which is part parcel of football... If you think Charlton fans are the only to do this sort of thing then you are deluded, take that from someone who sees a lot lot worse at plenty of other football clubs. A few sing songs is nothing in reality.
    Come on now.
    Name three clubs you have been to where you don't know what you're doing chants have rung out at their managers fist home game.
    Please don't call me deluded. Your agenda is clear without getting personal.
    Well to be a fair comparison, those three clubs would need to have the same circumstances as Charlton. Part of a network where the manager was fired from one network club, sent as a "consultant" to a second, and then sent on to the third club as soon as a vacancy appears.

    That' s a tough one.
    Maybe read his comments again.
    He said if Charlton fans are the only ones doing this then I am deluded, then you pipe up saying no one is in the same position as Charlton.
    Which one is it?
    Your point is that it is extreme to hear such chants after one game. My point is that the normally reasonable Charlton fans were presented with an extreme situation.
  • A-R-T-H-U-R
    A-R-T-H-U-R Posts: 7,678
    edited February 2015
    PragueAddick said:

    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    PragueAddick said:

    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    PL54 said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    Swallowing his pride by recognising and clapping the fans efforts would be a start.

    4 days after being told he "doesn't know what he's doing" and was "getting sacked in the morning" ?

    It's not his pride that needs swallowing.
    That's part parcel of football
    No it isn't.
    That's part and parcel of petulant, impatient, childish fans who wouldn't be seen at just about any other football club.
    Not in my name thanks.
    Which is part parcel of football... If you think Charlton fans are the only to do this sort of thing then you are deluded, take that from someone who sees a lot lot worse at plenty of other football clubs. A few sing songs is nothing in reality.
    Come on now.
    Name three clubs you have been to where you don't know what you're doing chants have rung out at their managers fist home game.
    Please don't call me deluded. Your agenda is clear without getting personal.
    Well to be a fair comparison, those three clubs would need to have the same circumstances as Charlton. Part of a network where the manager was fired from one network club, sent as a "consultant" to a second, and then sent on to the third club as soon as a vacancy appears.

    That' s a tough one.
    Maybe read his comments again.
    He said if Charlton fans are the only ones doing this then I am deluded, then you pipe up saying no one is in the same position as Charlton.
    Which one is it?
    Your point is that it is extreme to hear such chants after one game. My point is that the normally reasonable Charlton fans were presented with an extreme situation.
    No, sorry, my point was that the disgraceful chants were not 'part and parcel' of football.
    The post I was replying to stated that If I thought Charlton were the only club where this happened then I was deluded. I was told, and god knows why I am writing this out for you when you could read it yourself, that a lot worse happens at plenty of other grounds.
    Which it doesn't.
    And I think you are agreeing with this in a strange slanted way.
  • PragueAddick
    PragueAddick Posts: 22,165
    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    PragueAddick said:

    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    PragueAddick said:

    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    PL54 said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    Swallowing his pride by recognising and clapping the fans efforts would be a start.

    4 days after being told he "doesn't know what he's doing" and was "getting sacked in the morning" ?

    It's not his pride that needs swallowing.
    That's part parcel of football
    No it isn't.
    That's part and parcel of petulant, impatient, childish fans who wouldn't be seen at just about any other football club.
    Not in my name thanks.
    Which is part parcel of football... If you think Charlton fans are the only to do this sort of thing then you are deluded, take that from someone who sees a lot lot worse at plenty of other football clubs. A few sing songs is nothing in reality.
    Come on now.
    Name three clubs you have been to where you don't know what you're doing chants have rung out at their managers fist home game.
    Please don't call me deluded. Your agenda is clear without getting personal.
    Well to be a fair comparison, those three clubs would need to have the same circumstances as Charlton. Part of a network where the manager was fired from one network club, sent as a "consultant" to a second, and then sent on to the third club as soon as a vacancy appears.

    That' s a tough one.
    Maybe read his comments again.
    He said if Charlton fans are the only ones doing this then I am deluded, then you pipe up saying no one is in the same position as Charlton.
    Which one is it?
    Your point is that it is extreme to hear such chants after one game. My point is that the normally reasonable Charlton fans were presented with an extreme situation.
    No, sorry, my point was that the disgraceful chants were not 'part and parcel' of football.
    Disgraceful? That's what I heard on a video from a Paris metro.

    Guess we agree to disagree. I wouldn't have sung it, but I sure understand why they did.
  • Uboat
    Uboat Posts: 12,201
    I don't feel the least bit of sympathy for him, but draw comfort from the fact that one day he'll be gone and then we'll never hear of him again.
  • A-R-T-H-U-R
    A-R-T-H-U-R Posts: 7,678
    PragueAddick said:

    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    PragueAddick said:

    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    PragueAddick said:

    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    PL54 said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    Swallowing his pride by recognising and clapping the fans efforts would be a start.

    4 days after being told he "doesn't know what he's doing" and was "getting sacked in the morning" ?

    It's not his pride that needs swallowing.
    That's part parcel of football
    No it isn't.
    That's part and parcel of petulant, impatient, childish fans who wouldn't be seen at just about any other football club.
    Not in my name thanks.
    Which is part parcel of football... If you think Charlton fans are the only to do this sort of thing then you are deluded, take that from someone who sees a lot lot worse at plenty of other football clubs. A few sing songs is nothing in reality.
    Come on now.
    Name three clubs you have been to where you don't know what you're doing chants have rung out at their managers fist home game.
    Please don't call me deluded. Your agenda is clear without getting personal.
    Well to be a fair comparison, those three clubs would need to have the same circumstances as Charlton. Part of a network where the manager was fired from one network club, sent as a "consultant" to a second, and then sent on to the third club as soon as a vacancy appears.

    That' s a tough one.
    Maybe read his comments again.
    He said if Charlton fans are the only ones doing this then I am deluded, then you pipe up saying no one is in the same position as Charlton.
    Which one is it?
    Your point is that it is extreme to hear such chants after one game. My point is that the normally reasonable Charlton fans were presented with an extreme situation.
    No, sorry, my point was that the disgraceful chants were not 'part and parcel' of football.
    Disgraceful? That's what I heard on a video from a Paris metro.

    Guess we agree to disagree. I wouldn't have sung it, but I sure understand why they did.
    Really, don't bring that racist crap into this.

    Back to this discussion.
    You understand why fans chanted you don't know what you're doing and worse to a new Charlton manager on his home debut?

    Then I am surprised and very disappointed.

    Remind me what a 'fan' a 'supporter' is in your eyes. New manager deserves support until they reach Pardew esque chaos.
  • ValleyGary
    ValleyGary Posts: 38,001
    Uboat said:

    I don't feel the least bit of sympathy for him, but draw comfort from the fact that one day he'll be gone and then we'll never hear of him again.

    I honestly dont get it.

    Is it because he has a close relationship with RD? Will you not be happy with a manager until it's under a different owner???
  • PragueAddick
    PragueAddick Posts: 22,165
    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    PragueAddick said:

    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    PragueAddick said:

    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    PragueAddick said:

    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    A-R-T-H-U-R said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    PL54 said:

    Atletico Addick said:

    Swallowing his pride by recognising and clapping the fans efforts would be a start.

    4 days after being told he "doesn't know what he's doing" and was "getting sacked in the morning" ?

    It's not his pride that needs swallowing.
    That's part parcel of football
    No it isn't.
    That's part and parcel of petulant, impatient, childish fans who wouldn't be seen at just about any other football club.
    Not in my name thanks.
    Which is part parcel of football... If you think Charlton fans are the only to do this sort of thing then you are deluded, take that from someone who sees a lot lot worse at plenty of other football clubs. A few sing songs is nothing in reality.
    Come on now.
    Name three clubs you have been to where you don't know what you're doing chants have rung out at their managers fist home game.
    Please don't call me deluded. Your agenda is clear without getting personal.
    Well to be a fair comparison, those three clubs would need to have the same circumstances as Charlton. Part of a network where the manager was fired from one network club, sent as a "consultant" to a second, and then sent on to the third club as soon as a vacancy appears.

    That' s a tough one.
    Maybe read his comments again.
    He said if Charlton fans are the only ones doing this then I am deluded, then you pipe up saying no one is in the same position as Charlton.
    Which one is it?
    Your point is that it is extreme to hear such chants after one game. My point is that the normally reasonable Charlton fans were presented with an extreme situation.
    No, sorry, my point was that the disgraceful chants were not 'part and parcel' of football.
    Disgraceful? That's what I heard on a video from a Paris metro.

    Guess we agree to disagree. I wouldn't have sung it, but I sure understand why they did.
    Really, don't bring that racist crap into this.

    Back to this discussion.
    You understand why fans chanted you don't know what you're doing and worse to a new Charlton manager on his home debut?

    Then I am surprised and very disappointed.

    Remind me what a 'fan' a 'supporter' is in your eyes. New manager deserves support until they reach Pardew esque chaos.
    Did you sing "Super Al" ? I did, in Prague, after watching the demolition of West Ham on TV. Fans react to what is in front of them, but both on and off the pitch.

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