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Gillingham v Charlton | Saturday 21st November 2020 | Post-match thread

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  • I doubt that made a difference. Washington is a Frank Lampard taker rather than a Yoni Buyens taker. A Johnnie Jackson taker rather than a Darren Bent taker. It wasn't a terrible penalty, but by definition, it was saveable. But it did require a good save.
    The fact he put it in the exact same place as the one he took only 2 weeks ago probably helped their keeper. If we get another one I'll be lumping all my savings on him putting it low to the keepers right.
  • Cafc43v3r said:
    Our strikers aren't missing chance after chance though, are they?

    Whether it's the movement of the front 2, the areas they are playing in or the midfields fault I don't know. But Morgan, Maddison and Shinnie isn't a negative midfield by any stretch.  Plus 2 attacking full backs.

    There have been a few times this season we could have scored and didn't but I can't think of many when a striker should have scored and didn't (penalty obviously                               but even the best miss sometimes).
    Not missing chance after chance but that is even more reason why we needed a striker who actually knows where the goal is so he can take advantage of any half chances we create.
    Smyth from 2 yards springs to mind but of course even the best miss sometimes unless you're Macauley Bonne & then it's a hanging offence.
  • edited November 2020
    Theory is a wonderful thing, it's a loophole that is a shame could be exploited,
    just a possibility that's all, and could rebound?

    In theory, I would imagine the numbers would be small. It would be embarrassing for the club if it happened though. On reflection, maybe 2 purchases equalling one entry to the draw would have been the best idea, but this issue didn't occur to me until it was raised on here.   
  • Oggy Red said:
    The last line doesn't rhyme?


    I think this famous poem by The Poet Laureate of 1895 read:

    Win at home and draw away
    The Reds go up in May
    Any points on the road
    For the future doth well bode

    Lose at home and win away
    The Reds miss out come May
    Only points on the road
    Won’t please the home fans a right load 
  • If we do as expected on Tuesday night, we will have averaged 2 points from our post break games. It is an understandable mistake to look at other sides but it is pointless as it is something you have no control over. Whilst averaging 2 points a game is a realistic target, make it your target. 
  • Partly GD. It might come down to that in the end.......like it did in 18/19.

    And you can't keep expecting to win 1-0. The opposition ARE allowed to score you know & as I posted earlier, most other teams score more goals than us, and some score for fun. Fleetwood have already scored 4 or more twice this season. The reason why we didnt beat Gillingham wasn't because we let one in, but because we didnt score enough. 

    And to @Todds_right_hook - if we only score 1 in each of our next 2 games I'll wager we wont win both.
    Does it matter how many Fleetwood score week in week out, how many did they score against us compared to goals conceded?
  • edited November 2020
    Ultimately, no it doesn't. Of course if you don't have goals in the team, you have a greater chance of drawing too many. A team that draws every game has a decent chance of being relegated. 

    I wouldn't say we don't have goals in the team. An analysis of our chances yesterday and you could make a case that on another day we would have got 2 or 3 and as we are decent defensively, that will get you 3 points more often than not. Even 1 will quite often be enough for us but the chances of a draw massively increases of course.

    We do have to factor in the ever changing side. Our midfield was pretty new yesterday in terms of experience of playing with each other. I think it showed a bit. But that is to be expected. We play that game 10 times we win at least 7 of them.
  • LenGlover said:
    Terry alias @KillersBeard is a year or two older than thirty.....
    Decade or two you mean 🤣
  • Agree. I'm always hearing this contact argument; in fact it's the only thing I don't like about our commentary duo. I guess that they are both under 30 and have a different idea of what football is compared to those of us who watched football in 70s, 80s or earlier.
    I'm beginning to find myself laughing at the players in most matches I watch. I find it sad.
    Gallagher for West Brom, big debate on match of the day last night! He should have been booked for diving!

    I work with a guy who plays 9th tier, even at that level they are coached to go down after contact!

    I spoke to him via text about the 4th official giving the pen, he didn’t know they could do that. He thought their job was to stop the benched from fighting and to shout at!
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  • What was Gunter thinking of ,surely an experienced player like him should have avoided contact,the guy was going away from the goal.
    I do think are play is a little ponderous,we had so much of the ball but always gave Gillingham the chance to recover their shape before we got into the danger area.With big men up front,sometimes the long ball works.
    Thought the ref was quite acceptable by League 1 standards,until he stopped the play for an injury when the player was 5 feet off the pitch,mystifying.
    Still unbeaten in 8,Maddison will get better and will show what he can do soon,defence is now a worry,but would assume Barker  may come in either tuseday or saturday.
    Would like tp think on the car front,proof of allegiance to CAFC would be a requirement .
  • The fact he put it in the exact same place as the one he took only 2 weeks ago probably helped their keeper. If we get another one I'll be lumping all my savings on him putting it low to the keepers right.
    He took a very good penalty for Northern Ireland recently. Hit high. Keepers never save the high ones!
  • edited November 2020
    All levels are coached to go down on contact. It is not viewed as cheating as a lot of refs don't give a foul if you stay on your feet. You are helping the ref to see the foul. It is totally different to diving IMO.

    As for the Gallagher incident. Some refs may have called a foul and others may not. I think if you get a bit of the ball and the man at the same time, it is a foul. But there is a grey area where different people will see it differently.

    Where there was a problem last night, and with the VAR system, is we have seen VAR apply a referee's call system on a number of occasions. Where a decision is a some refs may have given it, others may have not situation. The ref initially gave a penalty last night and the incident clearly fell into this category. 

    Given that, when a ref gets VAR in his ear saying, 'hey mate, you might want to look at that again', it actually adds a pressure to the ref. He will probably think, maybe I have got that wrong as if it was a close one, they would have let it go. So his mindset is going to be wrong as he goes up to the screen and he is going to be more likely to change his decision. 

    On a similar note, I think it was wrong for the ref to speak to the fourth official yesterday given where the fourth official was. Assuming that is what he did do and it wasn't his assistant he was talking to, who would have been better placed. But then he would have surely waved his flag!
  • Partly GD. It might come down to that in the end.......like it did in 18/19.

    And you can't keep expecting to win 1-0. The opposition ARE allowed to score you know & as I posted earlier, most other teams score more goals than us, and some score for fun. Fleetwood have already scored 4 or more twice this season. The reason why we didnt beat Gillingham wasn't because we let one in, but because we didnt score enough. 

    And to @Todds_right_hook - if we only score 1 in each of our next 2 games I'll wager we wont win both.
    agreed - i think there is little doubt that the improvements to the squad in January will be at least 1 striker and if it were my decision another pacy wide man / striker - i can see what bogle does but that starting front 2 aren't offering enough threat - the finishing 2 arguably are but for some reason, can't do it for 90 mins  game after game- we need a 90 minute goal threat every game, its as simple as that as you have to score goals, and lots of them, to get promoted. Softening an opponent up for 60 mins and hoping to win it in the last 30 isn't going to do it.  
  • To be honest, I think Bogle offers more threat than Washington in an overall offensive sense. Washington scores goals though.
  • had some during match comments from an arsenal fan watching the game who never normally watches us and he said both  sets of strikers - us and gills - were not good enough and were the weak links and i make him right - gills even more so given they were up against a team with no centre halfs but then they don't expect to get promoted 
  • Yesterday was a good example of 'if you can't win, don't lose'.
    Missing a penalty is rarely rewarded with three points.
    We move on.
  • DOUCHER said:
    had some during match comments from an arsenal fan watching the game who never normally watches us and he said both  sets of strikers - us and gills - were not good enough and were the weak links and i make him right - gills even more so given they were up against a team with no centre halfs but then they don't expect to get promoted 
    Totally agree with this until both sides made changes. Aneke and Smyth turned it favourably towards us and John Akinde did the same for them. 
  • Totally agree. He may not have meant it but he clearly clipped the blokes heels. 

    A clear penalty for me. 
    The laws don't mention intent but a foul has to be careless, reckless or using excessive force.  

    Personally I don't see Gunter's play to meet any of those tests and if the referee received advice to the contrary he should have ignored it.
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  • 3 months ago we were on the brink of not having a club, now we are crying over getting a point at gills - at least it wasn’t a loss COYA
    I think brink of not having a club is an exaggeration, and with your logic we should just be content with plodding along in league 1 for a while because at least we have a club? People are a little disappointed with a point wouldn’t say we are crying - rant over
  • Of course its easy to only remember the good things someone does

    But I only remember Gillingham coming close to scoring twice in the first half

    There was that point blank save (Yes the Gillingham player should have done better but thats not really Ben's fault is it?) - Then there was the double save as well wasnt there when the Gillingham player was allowed to run on to ball which Amos blocked away

    He then got a hand to the penalty, FYI he cant come out quicker as one foot has to stay on the line...

    Certainly doesnt scare me with his catching - End of the day, Football is about opinions, we'll all have different views on things
    Pretty sure the OP meant come out to get the ball Akinde ran on to. I’m going to watch the reply because live I couldn’t believe he didn’t. 
  • I must have been watching a different game to you as I don't see how you think we could have scored 2 or 3. Apart from the penalty we didn't have a clear cut chance & I don't remember their keeper making a save (apart from Watson's long range effort that was hitting the bar at best). Amos was probably the busier keeper & kept us in it before half time.

    Although the strikers get a lot of grief on here (from me mainly...😃) it can't be easy if no-one is making any chances for them. No dangerous crosses or through balls. Working off scraps most of the time.
    I take you point but what I meant was on another day the ball would have dropped more kindly for us in the area. There were loads of times we didnt get the rub of the green and I still think we could have got a few goals if it had been kinder.

    A win on Tuesday and then a decent draw next Saturday and my charity bet with you is looking good @g@golfaddick 😁
  • The FA definition of careless:

    Careless is when a player shows a lack of attention or consideration when making a challenge or acts without precaution. No disciplinary sanction is needed.

    ======
    The rest of the spiel:

    Direct free kick

    A direct free kick is awarded if a player commits any of the following offences against an opponent in a manner considered by the referee to be careless, reckless or using excessive force:

    • charges
    • jumps at
    • kicks or attempts to kick
    • pushes
    • strikes or attempts to strike (including head-butt)
    • tackles or challenges
    • trips or attempts to trip

    If an offence involves contact it is penalised by a direct free kick or penalty kick.

    • Careless is when a player shows a lack of attention or consideration when making a challenge or acts without precaution. No disciplinary sanction is needed
    ======

    My interpretation is that it should NOT have been awarded. It's clear for me that the person who awarded it was heavily influenced by their manager, and from a distance that his assistance was not required. 


  • edited November 2020
    DOUCHER said:
    agreed - i think there is little doubt that the improvements to the squad in January will be at least 1 striker and if it were my decision another pacy wide man / striker - i can see what bogle does but that starting front 2 aren't offering enough threat - the finishing 2 arguably are but for some reason, can't do it for 90 mins  game after game- we need a 90 minute goal threat every game, its as simple as that as you have to score goals, and lots of them, to get promoted. Softening an opponent up for 60 mins and hoping to win it in the last 30 isn't going to do it.  
    So many clubs are struggling with this injuries the right now. I watched a few games yesterday. Millwall have a few out but one of their midfielder players has played 133 consecutive games for the full 90. Unbelievable fitness and fortune. 

    I also so watched the Bournemouth v Reading match. Reading were top of the championship (few recent defeats) and cruising 2-0 at half time. Lost 4-2. Despite Reading being such a form team this season their first corner was not until about 75 minutes.

    With the squad we have we are doing well. Whether we hit a rut and drop of the pace, will be directly affected by injuries to key players and a constant need the change the lineup. That said, this issue appears that be the same for so many teams so it will be interesting to see which early runners can keep up through the season. I wouldn't bet decent money on anyone in the current top six making the play-offs, let alone promotion just yet. 




  • We scored the least goals in the top 6 in 18/19 and still finished above Pompey on GD. No reason why we can’t do similar this season. 
    We scored 73 that season. At the rate we are currently scoring at we will reach 63 and that won't be good enough for a top 6 place simply because the clean sheets have stopped.

    I believe that the Famewo/Innis partnership has yet to concede a single goal. Now we have neither and are having to play players out of position and in partnerships they are not used to, we are going to have to score more goals to compensate for the inevitable ones we are going to leak. Only Washington of yesterday's starting XI has actually scored more than a single goal this season.

    The good news is that we have a run of 7 games now during which time we play 5 of the bottom 8 - it's a chance to cement our place at the top as the expectation, if we really are a promotion candidate, should be to pick up at least 15 points from those matches. That will define if we are still on track. 
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