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Adkins Out? - Match Thread
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He looked stressed to buggery on the touchline during added time, harranging the 4th official and standing on the pitchAirman Brown said:Yesterday’s game could easily have ended in a draw, in which case I suspect the narrative would be very different here and elsewhere. There were several close shaves. That fine margin is itself reason to be wary of drawing conclusions.
I watched Adkins quite closely yesterday both at the game and at the station. Understandably, I don’t think he is in a great place. He has a huge task to turn the ship in time to save his job. Everyone should hope he can do it because that means the club will move forward, but the odds are still stacked against him.
I wonder if he thought himself that he needed a win to save his job?0 -
Well put. I wasn't so much an Adkins Outer as an Arter Outer myself and I'm only too happy to have egg on my face in that situation too. It's weird how players and teams can vacillate so much in how effective they look mindBR7_addick said:Just to put a bit of perspective on the Adkins Outers like myself.
If there is charlton fans who want us to lose so he’s gone even after that win, they’re prats, you’re just gonna have to deal my opinion there. And I’m an Adkins outer (although slightly less now).
We want Charlton and Adkins to do the business, so your “told you so’s” are fine with me, I want to be wrong about Adkins, I want egg on my face and him to win the next 5 games etc. It’s not brexit it’s doesn’t have to be a divisive subject, we all want the same thing at the end of the day, Charlton wins. It’s just we (Adkins outers) cannot see it getting better, but yesterday gives him some hope and he has my blessing the guy.1 -
Adkins seemed tetchy with Minto in the post-match, the bounce has gone from his step and he could probably do with a couple of days off.0
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I think the fitness situation is worse than we think. I don’t know who is responsible for that. I do think that Nigel has been dealt a bad hand. He cannot be in a good place even though it’s part of the territory but he is a human being underneath it all and a decent one at that. He hasn’t helped himself with the relentless “everything is peachy” bollocks and his rigid lump it to Stockley tactics. Having said that there is a school of thought that the players are not doing what he asks (credibility issue maybe?). Nothing ITK, just repeating what I’ve read on here. His tinkering is simply trying to find a best 11 when he has too many players and a lot of crocks.
I’m now in the “give him an international break and another 5 games with no excuses” camp. Do I think he’ll crack it? I doubt it. But we were all clammering for Paul Cook a few months ago and just look at the state of Ipswich. Oh and I see Bowyer’s bubble has burst at Brum. It’s a funny old game.
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I will be delighted if Adkins proves us all wrong and turns things around.10
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The win is nice, but I still dont see any evidence that we will come good under Adkins.Croydon said:
Adkins' Charlton will come good, but I fear that some will never be happy.AFKABartram said:Charlton Athletic won a game in a spirited, battling display in testing, Northern conditions.
For tonight, the world is a beautiful place.
Park the anti-manager stuff for a while, he’s not going to get replaced in the next couple of weeks. Just enjoy the victory and hope this is the springboard we needed.1 -
The one thing I haven't heard Adkins do is call out players individually. There is a difference between saying "we might have taken that chance" and “You can say that’s cost us but Macauley [Bonne] has to score. You can’t keep missing chances like that. Three yards out. Connects with the ball properly and you score. Can’t miss chances like that. It ain’t good enough."Rothko said:Adkins seemed tetchy with Minto in the post-match, the bounce has gone from his step and he could probably do with a couple of days off.
Being a Manager is as much about getting the most out of a player as it is coaching them. It's also about taking the pressure off the players when things aren't working out. In the last four games, we've twice we've come from behind in one to secure a draw and we sealed a win in one having been pegged back after taking the lead. That isn't the tell tale sign of a squad that downs tools when things aren't going right.2 -
So would I but I suppose its depends on on what the expectations a turn around is. My expectations are or were pretty high but I thought reasonable, promotion. That's going to require some turn around now and is not really any more than a pipe dream now. Playoffs are still a possibility but again not likely to happen. Games come thick and fast and we have already lost too many to have a serious punt at this league.hoof_it_up_to_benty said:I will be delighted if Adkins proves us all wrong and turns things around.
We need to stop silly goals against us first and build confidence up in a losing team. That will probably mean quite a few drawn games.
I'd still get shot of and start the season again with a change of culture. I'd would like to go a bit further and change the entire coaching staff but obviously that's not going to happen.0 -
To be fair I imagine a bit of tetchiness is understandable. Yes he's a positive guy but he's not an idiot and won't have missed the signs of unrest in the stands and Sandgaard's increasingly foreboding tone - he'll have known his job was not safe (and probably still isn't in the medium-long term.)Rothko said:Adkins seemed tetchy with Minto in the post-match, the bounce has gone from his step and he could probably do with a couple of days off.4 -
Have said on a pre match thread that have thought Adkins needs to either pick the team to play his way or swallow a bit of pride and be more "effective" and embrace a bit of Stockley's head ball. Granted fitness and injuries have meant we havent seen the Arter, gilbey, Lee combo.
Saturday it was definitely a case of seeing the former, would not have been surprised to see two DM's in the side and Washington wide for example, was genuinely a surprising line up that, to me, is our most technical we can put out. We still looked a bit ropey at the back but with Arter, Gilbey, Lee, Kirk, Leko you're not expecting a massive amount of defensive work and turgid performances so can forgive it...
Hopefully we build on the win and push on, still pretty neutral in regards to Adkins though and if we're back to looking utterly pathetic then toodles Nige.0 - Sponsored links:
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Perhaps Jacko will be 'manager' again for tomorrow night's Pap game?Rothko said:Adkins seemed tetchy with Minto in the post-match, the bounce has gone from his step and he could probably do with a couple of days off.
Adkins can sit high up in the stands like the rest of us. Then he'll see what we see.
He can then see clearly how the game unfolds tactically.
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Seems sensible, I don't understand why more managers don't sit in the stands. Curbs used to do it of course but I can't think of many others that do these days. I'm sure they would see the game so differently. Steve Evans for one would benefit, financially if nothing else...2
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I hope that unless anyone injured we play the same side.0
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No chance of that happening.Redrobo said:I hope that unless anyone injured we play the same side.0 -
Yes, but within reason. If we keep playing the way we did against Fleetwood we’ll be fine, and that’s doable as we seem to be improving as players are getting match fit. But it’s unrealistic to expect us to go on five game winning runs, and I don’t think he needs to do that to save his job.Scoham said:Agree that although Fleetwood could have got a result we also missed good chances ourselves. Even if we had won 5-0 it wouldn’t have proven Adkins had turned it around, he needs to consistently win games.
I wanted him out though I can't deny we've improved our attacking play in recent games. It was looking like the squad weren't playing for him but you don’t win away at Fleetwood without working hard.
The bigger concern is now our defending, we need to improve if we’re going to go on a winning run. Also key for me is keeping Gilbey and Arter fit.3 -
Depends on what Sandgaard's expectations are really. Winning five on the spin is probably way too high a target to be realistic or fair but I think there will be expectations of targets being met to some degree.JamesSeed said:
Yes, but within reason. If we keep playing the way we did against Fleetwood we’ll be fine, and that’s doable as we seem to be improving as players are getting match fit. But it’s unrealistic to expect us to go on five game winning runs, and I don’t think he needs to do that to save his job.Scoham said:Agree that although Fleetwood could have got a result we also missed good chances ourselves. Even if we had won 5-0 it wouldn’t have proven Adkins had turned it around, he needs to consistently win games.
I wanted him out though I can't deny we've improved our attacking play in recent games. It was looking like the squad weren't playing for him but you don’t win away at Fleetwood without working hard.
The bigger concern is now our defending, we need to improve if we’re going to go on a winning run. Also key for me is keeping Gilbey and Arter fit.0 -
If we continue to play as we did against Fleetwood we will finish mid table which is an improvement on where we are and obviously avoid relegation.JamesSeed said:
Yes, but within reason. If we keep playing the way we did against Fleetwood we’ll be fine, and that’s doable as we seem to be improving as players are getting match fit. But it’s unrealistic to expect us to go on five game winning runs, and I don’t think he needs to do that to save his job.Scoham said:Agree that although Fleetwood could have got a result we also missed good chances ourselves. Even if we had won 5-0 it wouldn’t have proven Adkins had turned it around, he needs to consistently win games.
I wanted him out though I can't deny we've improved our attacking play in recent games. It was looking like the squad weren't playing for him but you don’t win away at Fleetwood without working hard.
The bigger concern is now our defending, we need to improve if we’re going to go on a winning run. Also key for me is keeping Gilbey and Arter fit.1 -
And I don’t get people who say they didn’t want him in the first place. He had an excellent CV overall, has let teams to three promotions and has experience in the Premier League. Under the circumstances , bearing in mind how few names were available I think he was a decent appointment.Obviously he’s still under pressure, but he won’t be sacked in ten games time if we’re averaging a decent number of points over those ten games. The poor start won’t be taken into account because I suspect TS knows the blame for that poor start rests partly with him and his management structure.8
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Not sure I agree entirely. I think we have to expect that now due to the start we’ve had. Then when we’re in a respectful state again then we can be reasonable. Let’s not lower our standards due to the poor start, my expectations is still challenging for promotion no matter how daft that sounds right now.JamesSeed said:
Yes, but within reason. If we keep playing the way we did against Fleetwood we’ll be fine, and that’s doable as we seem to be improving as players are getting match fit. But it’s unrealistic to expect us to go on five game winning runs, and I don’t think he needs to do that to save his job.Scoham said:Agree that although Fleetwood could have got a result we also missed good chances ourselves. Even if we had won 5-0 it wouldn’t have proven Adkins had turned it around, he needs to consistently win games.
I wanted him out though I can't deny we've improved our attacking play in recent games. It was looking like the squad weren't playing for him but you don’t win away at Fleetwood without working hard.
The bigger concern is now our defending, we need to improve if we’re going to go on a winning run. Also key for me is keeping Gilbey and Arter fit.1 -
Curbs used to have Keith Peacock sit up in the stand to get an overview and assess pattern of play.Kips said:Seems sensible, I don't understand why more managers don't sit in the stands. Curbs used to do it of course but I can't think of many others that do these days. I'm sure they would see the game so differently. Steve Evans for one would benefit, financially if nothing else...
Peacock then used to phone Curbs in the dugout to convey his observations.
My opinion: Curbs was right. I believe managers' need the benefit of a different perspective of play that you can't always see from the dugout.
I can't understand why we never do it now.
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Fair enough, but I’m just saying he won’t be sacked if we play well and get decent results from now on. Can’t see Sandgaard doing that.BR7_addick said:
Not sure I agree entirely. I think we have to expect that now due to the start we’ve had. Then when we’re in a respectful state again then we can be reasonable. Let’s not lower our standards due to the poor start, my expectations is still challenging for promotion no matter how daft that sounds right now.JamesSeed said:
Yes, but within reason. If we keep playing the way we did against Fleetwood we’ll be fine, and that’s doable as we seem to be improving as players are getting match fit. But it’s unrealistic to expect us to go on five game winning runs, and I don’t think he needs to do that to save his job.Scoham said:Agree that although Fleetwood could have got a result we also missed good chances ourselves. Even if we had won 5-0 it wouldn’t have proven Adkins had turned it around, he needs to consistently win games.
I wanted him out though I can't deny we've improved our attacking play in recent games. It was looking like the squad weren't playing for him but you don’t win away at Fleetwood without working hard.
The bigger concern is now our defending, we need to improve if we’re going to go on a winning run. Also key for me is keeping Gilbey and Arter fit.I’m not lowering standards, as overall we should be at least fighting for the playoffs bearing mind size of club etc, but if we’re playing well and collecting a decent number of points I wouldn’t want him sacked, as that could make things worse.
Especially as I’m not sure the bad start is/was entirely down to him.0 -
I agree, I didn't mean we need to win every game or even go on a long unbeaten run. Regularly is probably a better choice of word.JamesSeed said:
Yes, but within reason. If we keep playing the way we did against Fleetwood we’ll be fine, and that’s doable as we seem to be improving as players are getting match fit. But it’s unrealistic to expect us to go on five game winning runs, and I don’t think he needs to do that to save his job.Scoham said:Agree that although Fleetwood could have got a result we also missed good chances ourselves. Even if we had won 5-0 it wouldn’t have proven Adkins had turned it around, he needs to consistently win games.
I wanted him out though I can't deny we've improved our attacking play in recent games. It was looking like the squad weren't playing for him but you don’t win away at Fleetwood without working hard.
The bigger concern is now our defending, we need to improve if we’re going to go on a winning run. Also key for me is keeping Gilbey and Arter fit.3 -
I can’t help but feel a bit sorry for Adkins - even if the football approach has left a lot to be desired.
He did the business at the back end of last year which he would probably have assumed would be followed up by an aggressive attack at the start of the transfer window. Getting the players in early, and players who to be frank probably amounted to more than Oxford and Sunderland rejects.
Usually with a manager I am pretty clear in my mind one way or the other - but this time there are too many other variables at play that I think have affected our results.
I really don’t know what I would do - and it probably comes down to who (if anyone else) would be available.6 -
I want all the points we can get under Adkins, but if it’s not enough then I for one won’t be fussed if he goes.
Certainly not wishing for bad results to get rid.2 -
I think the spine should remain the same but rotation in attacking areas can be a healthy thing. Teams not knowing if they're going to be going up against the guile of Kirk or the raw pace of CBT down the left, not knowing if they've got Leko or DJ to deal with down the right and not knowing if they're going to be run into the ground by Davison or battered by Stockley is a great option for us. The backline and the central midfield should hopefully be the same as much as possible though, just need to keep Gilbey and Arter fit and ensure that Clare and JFC are ready to come in for them when they need to. Dobson can spend some time learning his role and, if reports are true, sorting his attitude out and Watson can be there to help the younger players develop. This Fleetwood win might be another false dawn but the right things are in place for a big, talented squad to do well.Redrobo said:I hope that unless anyone injured we play the same side.
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Think the amount of times a game is watched by the management team he will see a lot more then supporters who only see what they want to see !!Oggy Red said:
Perhaps Jacko will be 'manager' again for tomorrow night's Pap game?Rothko said:Adkins seemed tetchy with Minto in the post-match, the bounce has gone from his step and he could probably do with a couple of days off.
Adkins can sit high up in the stands like the rest of us. Then he'll see what we see.
He can then see clearly how the game unfolds tactically.1 -
Going on who played for the under 23s yesterday, who played 90 Saturday, and who needs match fitness this is how I think we will line up:
Henderson
Barker, Elewere, Pearce, Purrington
Dobson, Arter
CBT, Morgan, Clayden
Davison
Assuming DJ is frozen out, if he’s not then I’d expect him to be in for CBT or Clayden.
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Barker is on loan at Wealdstone.BR7_addick said:Going on who played for the under 23s yesterday, who played 90 Saturday, and who needs match fitness this is how I think we will line up:
Henderson
Barker, Elewere, Pearce, Purrington
Dobson, Arter
CBT, Morgan, Clayden
Davison
Assuming DJ is frozen out, if he’s not then I’d expect him to be in for CBT or Clayden.1 -
I think when a club goes on a bad run those who are a ‘bit suspect’ will start dissing the manager behind his back, and that attitude can spread, ultimately ending in the manager ‘losing the dressing room’. (If the manager is a nightmare then perhaps that’s fair enough.)Garrymanilow said:
I think the spine should remain the same but rotation in attacking areas can be a healthy thing. Teams not knowing if they're going to be going up against the guile of Kirk or the raw pace of CBT down the left, not knowing if they've got Leko or DJ to deal with down the right and not knowing if they're going to be run into the ground by Davison or battered by Stockley is a great option for us. The backline and the central midfield should hopefully be the same as much as possible though, just need to keep Gilbey and Arter fit and ensure that Clare and JFC are ready to come in for them when they need to. Dobson can spend some time learning his role and, if reports are true, sorting his attitude out and Watson can be there to help the younger players develop. This Fleetwood win might be another false dawn but the right things are in place for a big, talented squad to do well.Redrobo said:I hope that unless anyone injured we play the same side.Nothing like a few wins to change the narrative though, and it was good to see that photo of the bench, including Arter, properly celebrating the win. It’s easy to think that players don’t care or are ‘stealing a living’ when on a losing run, but I think, with very rare exceptions, that’s way OOTT. Their careers are dependent, ultimately, on results.0
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