Albie Morgan - diagnosed with type 1 diabetes (p63)

NabySarr said:

Exiled_Addick said:

NabySarr said:

Exiled_Addick said:

Chunes said:

He looks great at the moment but he's had so many false dawns. How do we know this isn't just another one?

I think this is a bit of a myth. He burst onto the scene in 18/19 when he was allowed to play with a bit of freedom in a good side brimming with confidence. His next season was in the championship where he played too many matches and was asked to change his game to be more defensive at a young age in a team that was really struggling and for a manager who was too quick to criticize publicly. He never really rediscovered himself under Bowyer other than glimpses of his passing range but he was clearly trying to do the things Bowyer was asking and his work rate and fitness did improve. Then there was the No. 10 experiment which was just a mistake and seemed to shatter any remaining confidence he had and he generally struggled for a year or so after that. However, he has been slowly working his way back since Adkins left and particularly seems to have gained some traction this season. 

I don’t think it’s really a case of false dawns so much as a bright start was followed by a trough, not entirely of his own making, which he has taken a long time to climb out of. Closest we’ve seen to a “false dawn” was the way he started this season well then dipped a bit, but it’s hardly as if his form went off a cliff and it wasn’t just him that this happened to either. 

Personally, I see the early signs it’s all finally starting to click. Not guaranteed he’ll kick on from here but he’s in the best place he’s been since he first started appearing for the first team. I think it’d be a shame to have persevered this long and ditch him now just as he’s improving again. I think he should get another year with an extension clause in the club’s favour. If he hasn’t really kicked on by this time next year then that’ll be the time to part ways.

Is he really worse than someone like Ben Reeves who played plenty of matches for us in teams that made the playoffs? I don’t think so and believe he has a role to play and can make a worthwhile contribution, as part of a balanced squad, to a top 6 challenging team. 

Bowyer was very tough on him, but I think it was needed. One of Morgan’s best assets now is his work rate and pressing which is probably a big part of why Holden might want to keep him. Before that he was just a good passer of the ball, he needed more to his game. Just needs to keep scoring more goals and then he will be really good player 

I agree Bowyer was definitely trying to help Morgan and was well intentioned, it just crossed a line publicly a few times but Bowyer didn’t do that with just Morgan. And Morgan’s drop off isn’t all on Bowyer either. Injuries, players leaving, lack of budget, the ESI fiasco all meant Morgan got overused at a tender stage in his development and got shunted around the midfield and was in and out the side a lot. It is what it is, but I think it’s something that needs to be kept in mind when people say he should be further along in his development at this age. I think that argument would hold more water if his development had been better managed at that key time when he was, what, 19 to 21? He was a little bit robbed of the most important years. 

Yeah I agree we didn’t handle his development well at all. He probably needed a loan but we always kept him around the squad as backup because of our ownership issues meaning we never had a deep enough squad. It is interesting that he is playing well now, which is one of the few occasions he’s actually been given a run of games without being dropped/rotated 

I seem to remember Bowyer saying we tried to send him out on loan but there were no takers

AndyG said:

NabySarr said:

Exiled_Addick said:

NabySarr said:

Exiled_Addick said:

Chunes said:

He looks great at the moment but he's had so many false dawns. How do we know this isn't just another one?

I think this is a bit of a myth. He burst onto the scene in 18/19 when he was allowed to play with a bit of freedom in a good side brimming with confidence. His next season was in the championship where he played too many matches and was asked to change his game to be more defensive at a young age in a team that was really struggling and for a manager who was too quick to criticize publicly. He never really rediscovered himself under Bowyer other than glimpses of his passing range but he was clearly trying to do the things Bowyer was asking and his work rate and fitness did improve. Then there was the No. 10 experiment which was just a mistake and seemed to shatter any remaining confidence he had and he generally struggled for a year or so after that. However, he has been slowly working his way back since Adkins left and particularly seems to have gained some traction this season. 

I don’t think it’s really a case of false dawns so much as a bright start was followed by a trough, not entirely of his own making, which he has taken a long time to climb out of. Closest we’ve seen to a “false dawn” was the way he started this season well then dipped a bit, but it’s hardly as if his form went off a cliff and it wasn’t just him that this happened to either. 

Personally, I see the early signs it’s all finally starting to click. Not guaranteed he’ll kick on from here but he’s in the best place he’s been since he first started appearing for the first team. I think it’d be a shame to have persevered this long and ditch him now just as he’s improving again. I think he should get another year with an extension clause in the club’s favour. If he hasn’t really kicked on by this time next year then that’ll be the time to part ways.

Is he really worse than someone like Ben Reeves who played plenty of matches for us in teams that made the playoffs? I don’t think so and believe he has a role to play and can make a worthwhile contribution, as part of a balanced squad, to a top 6 challenging team. 

Bowyer was very tough on him, but I think it was needed. One of Morgan’s best assets now is his work rate and pressing which is probably a big part of why Holden might want to keep him. Before that he was just a good passer of the ball, he needed more to his game. Just needs to keep scoring more goals and then he will be really good player 

I agree Bowyer was definitely trying to help Morgan and was well intentioned, it just crossed a line publicly a few times but Bowyer didn’t do that with just Morgan. And Morgan’s drop off isn’t all on Bowyer either. Injuries, players leaving, lack of budget, the ESI fiasco all meant Morgan got overused at a tender stage in his development and got shunted around the midfield and was in and out the side a lot. It is what it is, but I think it’s something that needs to be kept in mind when people say he should be further along in his development at this age. I think that argument would hold more water if his development had been better managed at that key time when he was, what, 19 to 21? He was a little bit robbed of the most important years. 

Yeah I agree we didn’t handle his development well at all. He probably needed a loan but we always kept him around the squad as backup because of our ownership issues meaning we never had a deep enough squad. It is interesting that he is playing well now, which is one of the few occasions he’s actually been given a run of games without being dropped/rotated 

I seem to remember Bowyer saying we tried to send him out on loan but there were no takers

Yeah that happened once, but how many years has he been here? He needed to play regularly to learn his game. Instead it’s taken him years as he’s been in and out of the team every season 

queensland_addick said:

I hope we keep him. Holden has told him that he's going to get a run of games, and that has allowed him to express himself and play without fear.
He needs to be one of the most influential players in the team, and he has the ability to be that, with some confidence and backing.
I have a feeling that it will suddenly just click for him, as it did for Scott Parker, and going way back Mike Flanagan.

It won't. 
He ain't in their class. 

Dont forget the likes of George Lapslie played 27-games in the 18/19 season - Albie Morgan is probably better, or at worse on a level with Lapslie

We're not going to have a squad of 20 (?) First Team players, all vying for eleven spots each week - There are going to be squad players at Morgan's level if not worse, depending on how we replace him, if we let him go

Exiled_Addick said:

NabySarr said:

Exiled_Addick said:

Chunes said:

He looks great at the moment but he's had so many false dawns. How do we know this isn't just another one?

I think this is a bit of a myth. He burst onto the scene in 18/19 when he was allowed to play with a bit of freedom in a good side brimming with confidence. His next season was in the championship where he played too many matches and was asked to change his game to be more defensive at a young age in a team that was really struggling and for a manager who was too quick to criticize publicly. He never really rediscovered himself under Bowyer other than glimpses of his passing range but he was clearly trying to do the things Bowyer was asking and his work rate and fitness did improve. Then there was the No. 10 experiment which was just a mistake and seemed to shatter any remaining confidence he had and he generally struggled for a year or so after that. However, he has been slowly working his way back since Adkins left and particularly seems to have gained some traction this season. 

I don’t think it’s really a case of false dawns so much as a bright start was followed by a trough, not entirely of his own making, which he has taken a long time to climb out of. Closest we’ve seen to a “false dawn” was the way he started this season well then dipped a bit, but it’s hardly as if his form went off a cliff and it wasn’t just him that this happened to either. 

Personally, I see the early signs it’s all finally starting to click. Not guaranteed he’ll kick on from here but he’s in the best place he’s been since he first started appearing for the first team. I think it’d be a shame to have persevered this long and ditch him now just as he’s improving again. I think he should get another year with an extension clause in the club’s favour. If he hasn’t really kicked on by this time next year then that’ll be the time to part ways.

Is he really worse than someone like Ben Reeves who played plenty of matches for us in teams that made the playoffs? I don’t think so and believe he has a role to play and can make a worthwhile contribution, as part of a balanced squad, to a top 6 challenging team. 

Bowyer was very tough on him, but I think it was needed. One of Morgan’s best assets now is his work rate and pressing which is probably a big part of why Holden might want to keep him. Before that he was just a good passer of the ball, he needed more to his game. Just needs to keep scoring more goals and then he will be really good player 

I agree Bowyer was definitely trying to help Morgan and was well intentioned, it just crossed a line publicly a few times but Bowyer didn’t do that with just Morgan. And Morgan’s drop off isn’t all on Bowyer either. Injuries, players leaving, lack of budget, the ESI fiasco all meant Morgan got overused at a tender stage in his development and got shunted around the midfield and was in and out the side a lot. It is what it is, but I think it’s something that needs to be kept in mind when people say he should be further along in his development at this age. I think that argument would hold more water if his development had been better managed at that key time when he was, what, 19 to 21? He was a little bit robbed of the most important years. 

I think that's a good summary of the issue Bowyer has as manager in general. Albie was overweight, unfit and apparently didn't have the best attitude. Bowyer got into him about it and I remember the version of Albie that came back after football restarted during Covid. He was brilliant as a wide midfielder against Hull and QPR and we actually looked like we might stay up for a minute. He'd clearly got through to him, but then after he'd built him up with some tough love he then needed to develop him as a player, but he just stayed on the same course of aggression. I don't think Bowyer is capable of stopping now, he can get into the players who need a rocket but then he doesn't seem to be able to pull back on the rage. I remember how chilled he was when he first took over, and how well he developed the players in the 18/19 season. He gave Bielik a bit of a public showing out early on and then went back to nice mode but I think the ESI debacle, the injury crisis and Covid broke all that and brought out the angry version and he hasn't got out of it since.

ForeverAddickted said:

Dont forget the likes of George Lapslie played 27-games in the 18/19 season - Albie Morgan is probably better, or at worse on a level with Lapslie

We're not going to have a squad of 20 (?) First Team players, all vying for eleven spots each week - There are going to be squad players at Morgan's level if not worse, depending on how we replace him, if we let him go

With Jack Payne and Mcgrandles returning we're probably over stocked on squad players in the middle. 

Dobson, Fraser, Payne, Mcgrandles currently under contract for next season, with hopefully, Henry signed up.  We need that Cullen signing to finish off the middle. 

We apparently beat off champ clubs to get Mcgrandles in so it might not be that easy to shift him, I would and keep Morgan as the back up, but, I'm not buying and selling players sadly. Well, not in real life, FM I'm all over it.

I've been critical of Albie in the past but in fairness to him he is playing wel at the moment.

My biggest frustration with him is his delivery of pass can sometimes be superb - like really really good, but then other simple passes go astray.  And don't get me started on his coirners.  For someone who strikes the ball so cleanly his dead ball delivery can be very weak.

I'd say he's worth getting signed up to a new contract as he is unlikely to be too expensive but, if he continues to improve, could become really important to us.  He is very energetic and seems to be popular but, most importantly, he appears to be liked by Holden and it's getting the best out of him.

I worry though that he hasn't been offered a new deal and is effectively putting himself in the shop window a the moment - if he only has 3 months to run on his contract he is free to talk to other teams

Under Dean Holden, Morgan is improving.
(Agree about time !)

Albie Morgan had been lucky not to  have been released before but why release him now when Holden is getting a decent song out of him and does the closing down (better than Fraser does) and has 7 assists and 5 goals. 

If we are counting players on their ability to be a top six or top 2 players in League 1 then you will struggle to find many in our present squad but sometimes a good team can be better that its individual parts.

Rak Sakyi is playing in the Championship next season( not certain it's as easy to skip past Premier defenders ?)  so it's going to need some quality to come to the club to replace him. Amazing out of all of the midfielders over the last couple of seasons, buys or loan in midfield, Dobson, Fraser and Morgan would still be the first picks. 

Just my opinion but Albie Morgan's career could kick on now at 23. He may need a move to get him out of his comfort zone but IF he could replicate Saturday's performance then a modest new contract may seal the deal. 

jonseventyfive said:

Must admit on this from he is changing my mind, when he is playing well if not starting every game surely good back up.

Me as well

I would keep the Albie from page 1 of this thread . Page 46 he’s got to go.

Crusty54 said:

There are lies, damn lies and statistics.

His pass completion rate was very high on Saturday. However, many of those were back passes or wall passes where the receiving player had no choice but to return it to him. He often ignores the obvious pass and needs to be more positive in his play. On Saturday he was not running back to cover as fast as the rest of the team and needs to improve his tackling.

A lot of the players in the game at The Valley this afternoon showed how to tackle and go forwards in style. To beat a much more experienced Wigan side and showed how to do it.

Were you watching the same game as everyone else? I saw a player doing plenty of good defensive work and making good tackles.

You see glimpses of what he could be as a player , I question if he's ever going to be consistent enough? Could be one that we let go that goes on to have a solid EFL career elsewhere. 

I would expect we could flog McGrandles if he was so sought after?