Attention: Please take a moment to consider our terms and conditions before posting.
England vs Italy - Euro 2024 Qualifier - KO @ 7:45pm - C4
Comments
-
Decent test tonight for England. Lot of the big concerns for the euros being shown tonight. Obviously missing Saka, but LB is an issue as Shaw is only real option. Chillwell is never fit and Trippier is not sufficient cover.
Phillips/Stones/Maguire getting sufficient game time throughout the season is a worry. Plus, Henderson surely can’t be the first back up midfielder in 2024.
Roll on 2nd December so can start booking flights and accommodation for Germany.0 -
I think because he turned out to be such an arse people tend to forget just how good John Terry was. He won absolutely everything domestically while leading that Chelsea team, made 109 England appearances and was regularly talked up by opposition players as a nightmare to play against. His long passing range was outrageous and despite playing a huge number of long balls out to the flanks his passing accuracy stats were always 87-92%. He also got 68 goals for Chelsea. He's their 8th highest Premier League goalscorer and 20th overall which is nuts considering how much money they've spent and the quality of players that have appeared. That FIFPRO 2004/05 team had Cafu, Nesta and Maldini in it alongside him and he kept out Campbell, Cannavaro, Lucio, Stam, Puyol and Samuel. He was less graceful than Rio Ferdinand and lacked pace, so he'd probably not fit in so well with the modern high lines but he was an absolutely incredible footballer. We just tend to remember him as a clumping carthorse, because that's what he was as a personManic_mania said:
To be clear, you think Terry, Beckham, Lampard, Gerrard and Shearer would have been in ANY of our international friend's best XI?North Lower Neil said:
We've definitely had some players more recently who were the best in the world in their position. Ashley Cole for example.Manic_mania said:
I think you are right, to an extent - I think our Brazilian, German, French, Argentinian friends when picking a world XI would name Bellingham, and maybe Kane too. I don't think those people would have been picking out any other English players like that since Gazza, or going even furthr back Moore and Charton (B)Exiled_Addick said:What's perhaps more impressive is, right now, if you're picking a world XI, which is obviously hugely subjective, I think 3 or 4 English players are legitimate considerations for that team - not saying you'd pick them all - but I don't think anyone would say you are mad to have them as potential inclusions.
I think we have a habit of seeing English players as better and more indispensible than they really were. We are a bit biased after all.
I dont think Bellingham and Kane is about bias this time.
John Terry made the World XI at FIFA awards several times. Beckham was 2nd in World Player of the Year twice, nearly won it one of those, Lampard came second another year in that and the Ballon d'Or, Gerrard 3rd, Shearer 2nd or 3rd around Euro 96.
But I feel like Bellingham could be better than all of them.
At any stage of their respective careers?
Not on your nelly
Thats England bias mate. sorry.
6 -
Rice made the mistake for the first goal when he failed to cut out the cross ball. In fact he helped it on its way to the right wing where a Right footed Left back will always struggle if a forward goes on the outside.
Stones then appeared to lose the striker and it's 0-1. Even Man city concede goals !
Against top teams for England, playing a right back at Left back is risky and with Rashford not great defensively it was clear where Italy were going to try to exploit England.
If Shaw or Chilwell are fit they play LB and are natural attacking LB's.
TBF to both Rice who is an excellent player and Trippier who is very tenacious plus Stones is just coming back to full fitness.
Some embarrassing comments on Social media and CL during the game in the 1st half. Knocking England and Southgate seems mandatory by some.
Italy don't have the same experience and nous at the back since the retirement of the old guard but they are still talented on the ball and did open England up especially in the 1st half. Can you imagine Chiellini not putting Kane on the deck before the 3rd goal !
We have two world class players in Kane and Bellingham and a squad full of talented players. If you can't enjoy this England side I recommend just watching Charlton where you can moan ad nauseam.
7 -
Why have bottled milk when you can have it on Draught 😲1
-
Ferdinand was so good too. I rate him above Terry personally, at least for the 3 or 4 years when United got to 4 CL finals.Garrymanilow said:
I think because he turned out to be such an arse people tend to forget just how good John Terry was. He won absolutely everything domestically while leading that Chelsea team, made 109 England appearances and was regularly talked up by opposition players as a nightmare to play against. His long passing range was outrageous and despite playing a huge number of long balls out to the flanks his passing accuracy stats were always 87-92%. He also got 68 goals for Chelsea. He's their 8th highest Premier League goalscorer and 20th overall which is nuts considering how much money they've spent and the quality of players that have appeared. That FIFPRO 2004/05 team had Cafu, Nesta and Maldini in it alongside him and he kept out Campbell, Cannavaro, Lucio, Stam, Puyol and Samuel. He was less graceful than Rio Ferdinand and lacked pace, so he'd probably not fit in so well with the modern high lines but he was an absolutely incredible footballer. We just tend to remember him as a clumping carthorse, because that's what he was as a personManic_mania said:
To be clear, you think Terry, Beckham, Lampard, Gerrard and Shearer would have been in ANY of our international friend's best XI?North Lower Neil said:
We've definitely had some players more recently who were the best in the world in their position. Ashley Cole for example.Manic_mania said:
I think you are right, to an extent - I think our Brazilian, German, French, Argentinian friends when picking a world XI would name Bellingham, and maybe Kane too. I don't think those people would have been picking out any other English players like that since Gazza, or going even furthr back Moore and Charton (B)Exiled_Addick said:What's perhaps more impressive is, right now, if you're picking a world XI, which is obviously hugely subjective, I think 3 or 4 English players are legitimate considerations for that team - not saying you'd pick them all - but I don't think anyone would say you are mad to have them as potential inclusions.
I think we have a habit of seeing English players as better and more indispensible than they really were. We are a bit biased after all.
I dont think Bellingham and Kane is about bias this time.
John Terry made the World XI at FIFA awards several times. Beckham was 2nd in World Player of the Year twice, nearly won it one of those, Lampard came second another year in that and the Ballon d'Or, Gerrard 3rd, Shearer 2nd or 3rd around Euro 96.
But I feel like Bellingham could be better than all of them.
At any stage of their respective careers?
Not on your nelly
Thats England bias mate. sorry.2 -
Garrymanilow said:
I think because he turned out to be such an arse people tend to forget just how good John Terry was.Manic_mania said:
To be clear, you think Terry, Beckham, Lampard, Gerrard and Shearer would have been in ANY of our international friend's best XI?North Lower Neil said:
We've definitely had some players more recently who were the best in the world in their position. Ashley Cole for example.Manic_mania said:
I think you are right, to an extent - I think our Brazilian, German, French, Argentinian friends when picking a world XI would name Bellingham, and maybe Kane too. I don't think those people would have been picking out any other English players like that since Gazza, or going even furthr back Moore and Charton (B)Exiled_Addick said:What's perhaps more impressive is, right now, if you're picking a world XI, which is obviously hugely subjective, I think 3 or 4 English players are legitimate considerations for that team - not saying you'd pick them all - but I don't think anyone would say you are mad to have them as potential inclusions.
I think we have a habit of seeing English players as better and more indispensible than they really were. We are a bit biased after all.
I dont think Bellingham and Kane is about bias this time.
John Terry made the World XI at FIFA awards several times. Beckham was 2nd in World Player of the Year twice, nearly won it one of those, Lampard came second another year in that and the Ballon d'Or, Gerrard 3rd, Shearer 2nd or 3rd around Euro 96.
But I feel like Bellingham could be better than all of them.
At any stage of their respective careers?
Not on your nelly
Thats England bias mate. sorry.
5 -
Stones will get plenty of game time when he's fit. He was a huge player for City in centre mid at the end of last season. He would be a better option for England there than Phillips too.SouthWest_Addicks said:Decent test tonight for England. Lot of the big concerns for the euros being shown tonight. Obviously missing Saka, but LB is an issue as Shaw is only real option. Chillwell is never fit and Trippier is not sufficient cover.
Phillips/Stones/Maguire getting sufficient game time throughout the season is a worry. Plus, Henderson surely can’t be the first back up midfielder in 2024.
Roll on 2nd December so can start booking flights and accommodation for Germany.2 -
I think most people do these days, though if there's any gap at all it's much smaller than a lot make out. Ferdinand was better at stepping out with the ball and much faster. He was a more verstaile defender and I think he'd do better in the modern game than Terry. What Terry had over Ferdinand though was his sheer force of character; Ferdinand joined an all-consuming giant of a team and declined in step with them. He only played half the season in their last title campaign and was mostly a bystander as City overtook them. That wasn't his fault but he was always part of an established success at Utd. Terry was the leader of an upstart team that had cup history but no previous title credentials and alongside Lampard, Cech, Drogba and others dragged that Chelsea team into title relevance. Ferdinand won the same number of Champions League titles as Terry (hilariously specifically because Terry missed his winning penalty) and at the very top level he tended not to be able to galvanise his team like Terry could. Terry drove his team and I think that's why so many pros recognised him as such a good player compared to Ferdinand, who only made it into one FIFPro 11. There was no shortage of elegant centre backs in Europe but there were (thankfully in many ways) very few players who possessed the character to drag a team through knockout matches like Terry could with Chelsea.North Lower Neil said:
Ferdinand was so good too. I rate him above Terry personally, at least for the 3 or 4 years when United got to 4 CL finals.Garrymanilow said:
I think because he turned out to be such an arse people tend to forget just how good John Terry was. He won absolutely everything domestically while leading that Chelsea team, made 109 England appearances and was regularly talked up by opposition players as a nightmare to play against. His long passing range was outrageous and despite playing a huge number of long balls out to the flanks his passing accuracy stats were always 87-92%. He also got 68 goals for Chelsea. He's their 8th highest Premier League goalscorer and 20th overall which is nuts considering how much money they've spent and the quality of players that have appeared. That FIFPRO 2004/05 team had Cafu, Nesta and Maldini in it alongside him and he kept out Campbell, Cannavaro, Lucio, Stam, Puyol and Samuel. He was less graceful than Rio Ferdinand and lacked pace, so he'd probably not fit in so well with the modern high lines but he was an absolutely incredible footballer. We just tend to remember him as a clumping carthorse, because that's what he was as a personManic_mania said:
To be clear, you think Terry, Beckham, Lampard, Gerrard and Shearer would have been in ANY of our international friend's best XI?North Lower Neil said:
We've definitely had some players more recently who were the best in the world in their position. Ashley Cole for example.Manic_mania said:
I think you are right, to an extent - I think our Brazilian, German, French, Argentinian friends when picking a world XI would name Bellingham, and maybe Kane too. I don't think those people would have been picking out any other English players like that since Gazza, or going even furthr back Moore and Charton (B)Exiled_Addick said:What's perhaps more impressive is, right now, if you're picking a world XI, which is obviously hugely subjective, I think 3 or 4 English players are legitimate considerations for that team - not saying you'd pick them all - but I don't think anyone would say you are mad to have them as potential inclusions.
I think we have a habit of seeing English players as better and more indispensible than they really were. We are a bit biased after all.
I dont think Bellingham and Kane is about bias this time.
John Terry made the World XI at FIFA awards several times. Beckham was 2nd in World Player of the Year twice, nearly won it one of those, Lampard came second another year in that and the Ballon d'Or, Gerrard 3rd, Shearer 2nd or 3rd around Euro 96.
But I feel like Bellingham could be better than all of them.
At any stage of their respective careers?
Not on your nelly
Thats England bias mate. sorry.
2 -
Tough to recall a previous occasion time when an England team scored three against Italy in a competitive fixture and made them look quite ordinary.3
- Sponsored links:
-
I seem to remember reading that as he hadn’t played for the Italian team, he qualified for England as he’d spent enough time living here.thickandthin63 said:
Dont think,I could be wrong,DiCanio got any caps.Manic_mania said:how the fuck did Zola only get 35 games for Italy.0 -
They are quite ordinary.grumpyaddick said:Tough to recall a previous occasion time when an England team scored three against Italy in a competitive fixture and made them look quite ordinary.1
