Attention: Please take a moment to consider our terms and conditions before posting.
George Dobson - Gone to Wrexham p136, farewell message p142
Comments
-
Have you seen the pre-contract that he signed?Vjacheslav said:
In this case the contract not only valid by hungarian law, but valid by uefa law too.Covered_End_Lad said:Pre-contracts are generally not binding under English law as they are usually marked 'Subject to Contract'This is not a verbal agreement. Id the 'Subject to Contract' contains all of the element of the final contract, also valid by the English law too.11 -
Scott would have let him go by now had he had his way. Would have caused a major issue with the other injuries we have.
Wish we would get rid of Scott, he is just a drain on resources now.5 -
Does that not refer solely to his application on the pitch while still under contract with us?PopIcon said:
The full article mentions the pre-agreement and the failed transfer. I have no idea if there are any clauses within the contract, but it's possible. Bear in mind, all this happened BEFORE Nathan Jones was appointed.Vjacheslav said:
That is a bullshit, he has a signed pre-contract.PopIcon said:
I'm unsure if this has been posted elsewhere. Nathan Jones quote "Is there an option for him to stay longer? Probably, if he chooses not to that’s fine…no problem."Vjacheslav said:
Why is it ridiculous?Bedsaddick said:
Source ? That's the first iv'e heard that they want over a million to sign him back. Sounds Ridiculous to me.fenaddick said:
He can try all he likes but there's no way it happens. Fehevar would have our pants down, I think they'd want 7 figures. Sounds mad I know but he's just signed a multi year contract with them and we would have to be desperate to sign him backBedsaddick said:Jones would be mad not to try and keep Dobson . The sooner the better for the club and his family's sake.
Dobbo sign for Fehervar as I know for three year long contract, so Fehervar can ask any price for it.
https://londonnewsonline.co.uk/sport/not-in-the-interests-of-charlton-athletic-fc-nathan-jones-on-george-dobsons-february-switch-to-fehervar-collapsing/
From Nathan Jones.
"It (the pre-contract) doesn’t affect anything – as long as George is at it. As long as George is George then he will be fine.
“It will be entirely down to George and his motivation for the next two-and-a-half months."
He signed the pre contract with the Hungarian club which means if we want him to stay, we’re going to have to pay whatever kind of fee they demand. It’s as simple as that in my mind.
I don’t think it’s completely settled that he’s gone and not coming back next year but I think it’s about as close as you can get. If Fehervar turn around and ask for £1m for us to get him back then I suspect that we will look elsewhere for that kind of money.2 -
I know that thing, that why I said this is a bullshit. He told a lot of out of mind thing. That not how the things works.PopIcon said:
The full article mentions the pre-agreement and the failed transfer. I have no idea if there are any clauses within the contract, but it's possible. Bear in mind, all this happened BEFORE Nathan Jones was appointed.Vjacheslav said:
That is a bullshit, he has a signed pre-contract.PopIcon said:
I'm unsure if this has been posted elsewhere. Nathan Jones quote "Is there an option for him to stay longer? Probably, if he chooses not to that’s fine…no problem."Vjacheslav said:
Why is it ridiculous?Bedsaddick said:
Source ? That's the first iv'e heard that they want over a million to sign him back. Sounds Ridiculous to me.fenaddick said:
He can try all he likes but there's no way it happens. Fehevar would have our pants down, I think they'd want 7 figures. Sounds mad I know but he's just signed a multi year contract with them and we would have to be desperate to sign him backBedsaddick said:Jones would be mad not to try and keep Dobson . The sooner the better for the club and his family's sake.
Dobbo sign for Fehervar as I know for three year long contract, so Fehervar can ask any price for it.
https://londonnewsonline.co.uk/sport/not-in-the-interests-of-charlton-athletic-fc-nathan-jones-on-george-dobsons-february-switch-to-fehervar-collapsing/
From Nathan Jones.
"It (the pre-contract) doesn’t affect anything – as long as George is at it. As long as George is George then he will be fine.
“It will be entirely down to George and his motivation for the next two-and-a-half months."
The contract valid. If he want to stay, Charlton must bought him out of his contract.
I cannot see why is he stay after this summer.3 -
Have you seen the picture of him holding up a Hungarian club shirt? I don’t think he does that if he’s not signed something binding.Covered_End_Lad said:
Have you seen the pre-contract that he signed?Vjacheslav said:
In this case the contract not only valid by hungarian law, but valid by uefa law too.Covered_End_Lad said:Pre-contracts are generally not binding under English law as they are usually marked 'Subject to Contract'This is not a verbal agreement. Id the 'Subject to Contract' contains all of the element of the final contract, also valid by the English law too.3 -
As much as it pains me to say it (because i want to keep Dobbo) the above is correct if he has signed a pre-contract theres very few options available, short of -Vjacheslav said:
In this case the contract not only valid by hungarian law, but valid by uefa law too.Covered_End_Lad said:Pre-contracts are generally not binding under English law as they are usually marked 'Subject to Contract'This is not a verbal agreement. Id the 'Subject to Contract' contains all of the element of the final contract, also valid by the English law too.
A) Charlton paying a fee to keep him which would be just like any other transfer, so the Hungarians can name their price as he just signed a 3 year contract
Somehow the Hungarians void their side of the agreement by incompetence or other means (I.E they cant meet their financial obligations)
He will be going. It's no different to signing a contract with any employer to start in the future. If you said im not going to work for them now, feasibly they can take you to court to enforce the contract but 99% of the time they dont bother because its not in their interest to have someone resign on day1.3 -
No, but I know the hungarian law, and also the uefa law about the pre contract.Covered_End_Lad said:
Have you seen the pre-contract that he signed?Vjacheslav said:
In this case the contract not only valid by hungarian law, but valid by uefa law too.Covered_End_Lad said:Pre-contracts are generally not binding under English law as they are usually marked 'Subject to Contract'This is not a verbal agreement. Id the 'Subject to Contract' contains all of the element of the final contract, also valid by the English law too.I already asked that question yesterday, and the guy who made the contract told me, 100% sure is valid.If Dobbo broke his leg, and he will be out for7 month, we must pay for his salary after 1th of July.
1 -
soapy_jones said:
I saw him and his family in a Hungry Horse the other week, is that a clue?ElfsborgAddick said:
Dobson will not be moving to Hungary in the summer.Vjacheslav said:
I got a different feelings yesterday.North Lower Neil said:
Yes. Daft thing is I get the feeling he wants to stay, we should want him to stay (and Jones probably does), but it's all too little too late as Scott tried to push him out and the pre-contract is signed.se9addick said:Surely he’s not really going to join this Hungarian team, is he?!Yesterday that was the yearly public conversation between our manager Gzrelak, and supporters of Videoton (Fehervar).So now I know more details about the Dobbo transfer.Our manager meet with him several times, he also saw a match at London, meet with him at London, and also at Budapest. And also they disscussed at phone several times.Our manager spoke about Dobbo, he highligthed his work moral, and also a leadership at the pitch. He expland that Dobbo is like a elongated hand of coach at the pitch.I also asked him a question, that he afraid of that Dobbo will not join us at the summer, beacuse of Nathan Jones can persuade to stay at Charlton. But he told me, after a several converastion with Dobbo, he 100 % sure that he will join us at the summer.As I know, the way of the blow up a transfer, and stop Dobbo to left a club, was way to far to keep him at the same motivation to stay after summer at Charlton. The key also Nathan Jones for this.
Lying BTW.
There is a lot of legs in that joke.
0 -
It's a guess but I don't think it's ridiculous. He is their asset from the start date of the contract, why would they sell him back to us on the cheap?Bedsaddick said:
Source ? That's the first iv'e heard that they want over a million to sign him back. Sounds Ridiculous to me.fenaddick said:
He can try all he likes but there's no way it happens. Fehevar would have our pants down, I think they'd want 7 figures. Sounds mad I know but he's just signed a multi year contract with them and we would have to be desperate to sign him backBedsaddick said:Jones would be mad not to try and keep Dobson . The sooner the better for the club and his family's sake.0 -
People need to stop treating footballers contracts like normal employment contracts. That is not how it works otherwise I would have had to be bought out of my last contract to move between employers1
- Sponsored links:
-
Vjacheslav said:Todds_right_hook said:
By force? He is under contract here until the summer. Jones kept him here until the expiry of his contract because he is entitled to do soVjacheslav said:
Basically Jones kept Dobbo there by force, yet he still does his best for Charlton.Bedsaddick said:Jones would be mad not to try and keep Dobson . The sooner the better for the club and his family's sake.
Yes. I know he is under contract until this summer. That was legal from Chralton to keep him. But from Dobson side of view. He made a dicision to sign for Fehervar that time from February, he packed everthing including his family, booked the flight waiting for a paperwork, medical, searching for new home, prepare for new life. At that time Charlton agreed to sold him. And the very last minute Jones told him that he won't let him to leave the club.Todds_right_hook said:
By force? He is under contract here until the summer. Jones kept him here until the expiry of his contract because he is entitled to do soVjacheslav said:
Basically Jones kept Dobbo there by force, yet he still does his best for Charlton.Bedsaddick said:Jones would be mad not to try and keep Dobson . The sooner the better for the club and his family's sake.
So are you saying that Dobson and family were going out to Hungary in February and not returning for the rest of the season?
1 -
Yes.ElfsborgAddick said:Vjacheslav said:Todds_right_hook said:
By force? He is under contract here until the summer. Jones kept him here until the expiry of his contract because he is entitled to do soVjacheslav said:
Basically Jones kept Dobbo there by force, yet he still does his best for Charlton.Bedsaddick said:Jones would be mad not to try and keep Dobson . The sooner the better for the club and his family's sake.
Yes. I know he is under contract until this summer. That was legal from Chralton to keep him. But from Dobson side of view. He made a dicision to sign for Fehervar that time from February, he packed everthing including his family, booked the flight waiting for a paperwork, medical, searching for new home, prepare for new life. At that time Charlton agreed to sold him. And the very last minute Jones told him that he won't let him to leave the club.Todds_right_hook said:
By force? He is under contract here until the summer. Jones kept him here until the expiry of his contract because he is entitled to do soVjacheslav said:
Basically Jones kept Dobbo there by force, yet he still does his best for Charlton.Bedsaddick said:Jones would be mad not to try and keep Dobson . The sooner the better for the club and his family's sake.
So are you saying that Dobson and family were going out to Hungary in February and not returning for the rest of the season?
He was about to move to them early so we made a few quid rather than nothing and we/Jones (rightly) pulled the plug.0 -
Hartleypete said:Scott would have let him go by now had he had his way. Would have caused a major issue with the other injuries we have.
Wish we would get rid of Scott, he is just a drain on resources now.
Be patient, you'll hopefully get your wish soon.
0 -
How about if we send you Andy Scott instead?Vjacheslav said:
Yes he is gone. The only way to Charlton to keep him, if they bought out from his next contract.ElliotCAFC said:He's gone now, isn't he? Signed a pre-contract so I don't think Jones could keep if even if he wants to.6 -
If he has signed a pre-contract, then I'm assuming that unless something drastic changes in the summer, then he'll be off. If we have to pay a fee to break this, then it's debatable
whether it's worth it unless it's tiny, as while he's good, he's not that good.
0 -
They are largely the same with some niche differences, its very similar to contracting work.fenaddick said:People need to stop treating footballers contracts like normal employment contracts. That is not how it works otherwise I would have had to be bought out of my last contract to move between employers
If i signed a year contract to work for company A as a contractor and i decide after 4 months company B will pay me more so im leaving, Company A have the legal ability to make me reimburse them, take me to court etc. This happens enough to be a problem in the IT world when we discuss niche specialisms.
In most cases a company wont bother as its cheaper to just let someone go and replace them.0 -
Only Dobbo, but after the deal is collapsed he flies back to London.ElfsborgAddick said:Vjacheslav said:Todds_right_hook said:
By force? He is under contract here until the summer. Jones kept him here until the expiry of his contract because he is entitled to do soVjacheslav said:
Basically Jones kept Dobbo there by force, yet he still does his best for Charlton.Bedsaddick said:Jones would be mad not to try and keep Dobson . The sooner the better for the club and his family's sake.
Yes. I know he is under contract until this summer. That was legal from Chralton to keep him. But from Dobson side of view. He made a dicision to sign for Fehervar that time from February, he packed everthing including his family, booked the flight waiting for a paperwork, medical, searching for new home, prepare for new life. At that time Charlton agreed to sold him. And the very last minute Jones told him that he won't let him to leave the club.Todds_right_hook said:
By force? He is under contract here until the summer. Jones kept him here until the expiry of his contract because he is entitled to do soVjacheslav said:
Basically Jones kept Dobbo there by force, yet he still does his best for Charlton.Bedsaddick said:Jones would be mad not to try and keep Dobson . The sooner the better for the club and his family's sake.
So are you saying that Dobson and family were going out to Hungary in February and not returning for the rest of the season?0 -
Thats football and that's jones prerogativeVjacheslav said:Todds_right_hook said:
By force? He is under contract here until the summer. Jones kept him here until the expiry of his contract because he is entitled to do soVjacheslav said:
Basically Jones kept Dobbo there by force, yet he still does his best for Charlton.Bedsaddick said:Jones would be mad not to try and keep Dobson . The sooner the better for the club and his family's sake.
Yes. I know he is under contract until this summer. That was legal from Chralton to keep him. But from Dobson side of view. He made a dicision to sign for Fehervar that time from February, he packed everthing including his family, booked the flight waiting for a paperwork, medical, searching for new home, prepare for new life. At that time Charlton agreed to sold him. And the very last minute Jones told him that he won't let him to leave the club.Todds_right_hook said:
By force? He is under contract here until the summer. Jones kept him here until the expiry of his contract because he is entitled to do soVjacheslav said:
Basically Jones kept Dobbo there by force, yet he still does his best for Charlton.Bedsaddick said:Jones would be mad not to try and keep Dobson . The sooner the better for the club and his family's sake.0 -
@Vjacheslav you are a very interesting poster regarding this situation.My take is that Dobson will not go to Hungary and he will stay in England, just a hunch and not doubting your input.Over and out.3
-
But what if you sign a Letter of Intent (the closest I know of in the normal world to a pre-contract) to join company B in four months time, but when you tell Company A this, they offer you a juicy new deal to stay? In the normal world Company B is pissed off but cannot do anything about it because it doesn't have any legal contract with you signed. With a pre-contract in football it seems that it is somehow legally enforceable. I would love to see an example of one, but, having been initially Sceptic no.1 about this whole deal, I'm now convinced that basically @Vjacheslav is on the money with this. I still don't understand why exactly Fehervar and Dobbo think this is a good idea, and remain very ready to blame his agent, but I think NJ is just determined to get Dobbo to help them stay up and then he will leave it up to Dobbo. After all in a different scenario Dobbo would have been yet again our POYT in an otherwise indifferent season and attracting interest from the division above, and we'd let him go, as we always have done.Radostanradical said:
They are largely the same with some niche differences, its very similar to contracting work.fenaddick said:People need to stop treating footballers contracts like normal employment contracts. That is not how it works otherwise I would have had to be bought out of my last contract to move between employers
If i signed a year contract to work for company A as a contractor and i decide after 4 months company B will pay me more so im leaving, Company A have the legal ability to make me reimburse them, take me to court etc. This happens enough to be a problem in the IT world when we discuss niche specialisms.
In most cases a company wont bother as its cheaper to just let someone go and replace them.3 - Sponsored links:
-
This is what I don't understand. How binding is a pre contract? He is still under contract with us and can't sign a legally binding contract elsewhere.Callumcafc said:
Have you seen the picture of him holding up a Hungarian club shirt? I don’t think he does that if he’s not signed something binding.Covered_End_Lad said:
Have you seen the pre-contract that he signed?Vjacheslav said:
In this case the contract not only valid by hungarian law, but valid by uefa law too.Covered_End_Lad said:Pre-contracts are generally not binding under English law as they are usually marked 'Subject to Contract'This is not a verbal agreement. Id the 'Subject to Contract' contains all of the element of the final contract, also valid by the English law too.
do pre contract have break clauses?
In basic terms, I'm guessing a pre contract suggests that on expiration of a contract xxxx will sign a contract at and that during this time, he is unable to negotiate terms with other clubs? This is purely intent to speak again when out of contract?
A quick google search suggests that the "binding" factor depends on essential items such as duration and renumeration, without these, it's just a gentleman's agreement.
Google says "pre contracts can be as slippery as a wet pitch. Whether they score a goal or get intercepted depends on the fine print"
i doubt a top flight professional al football club would offer a pre contract without essential terms, unless Dobson requested a break clause.Time will tell!!2 -
Is that lad still on CL that was posting a lot an hour before a kick off about all this?
Be interesting to know what the latest is from him and Dobbo's Dad, as if ever there was a time for info.....1 -
Cawley's podcast last week indicated that it's a legally binding contract and Charlton won't be paying a fee to buy him back.6
-
-
https://www.blakemorgan.co.uk/the-enforceability-of-pre-contracts-in-football/
Key part for me:
FIFA’s Dispute Resolution Chamber (‘DRC’) has had to determine on a number of occasions whether a pre-contract has binding effect when a dispute between a club and a player has arisen. The DRC has generally held that a pre-contract is binding if it contains essential terms such as the duration of the contract, remuneration and additional benefits
I think frankly it's likely that wages etc were agreed, and so it's binding. However:
The dispute involving Richard Brittain was ultimately resolved after Ross County agreed to pay St Johnstone compensation.
Which I think is probably how we could keep him if both ourselves and George Dobson were so inclined. Fehervar probably wouldn't want to force a player to move if he's not happy to go there any more, and I'm sure would take compensation as basically free money for a player they never had. Like a low budget version of John Obi Mikel.
As to the level of compensation they might accept, who knows? Can't see it being anywhere near seven figures as stated above.
However, I think it's all too far gone, we won't want to essentially pay a fee for an existing player we already had, Dobson won't want the fuss of trying to break a contract, he'll end up going to Ferhervar, and then come back on loan in a year to Oxford or somewhere.
And Charlton will have no one to blame but themselves. And Andy Scott.
2 -
I would wager, if Dobbo does go to Hungary and I expect he probably will, he will be back at a club in England within 18 months.10
-
Not sure I should share this, but I have a mate who is an employment lawyer.
He is not a football fan, but told me a young chap called "Dobbo" entered his legal practice with an interesting predicament.
Apparently Dobbo had signed a pre-contract with an obscure Hungarian football team - but now wants to renege on it.
Dobbo is keen to stay with his current employer - as he believes "they are really going places" and also because "SE London is nicer than Hungary".
When my friend looked at the pre-contract, he noted that it was "not worth the paper it was written on" - and is absolutely not binding according to English Law. Apparently English Law is FAR superior to Hungarian Law in every conceivable way.
As said, my friend does not know much about football - but is a very able (and real) expert in employment law.
Make of that what you will.15 -
If Dobson decides he wants to stay, I'm guessing it will be a case of who has the better lawyer!luke1 said:Cawley's podcast last week indicated that it's a legally binding contract and Charlton won't be paying a fee to buy him back.
After thinking about this, I think both sides would have inserted a penalty clause. Dobson can buy himself out for an agreed fee and the club can cancel for an agreed fee. Dobson could get injured during the last game of the season, ruling him out for a year and the Hungarian club then pay him off!
based on Dobson signing something, I expect him to go to Hungary in the summer2 -
Back on loan to a L1 side next January would be my guess...Covered_End_Lad said:I would wager, if Dobbo does go to Hungary and I expect he probably will, he will be back at a club in England within 18 months.0 -
This is futball pre contract under uefa rules, that allowed to the player talk with other clubs, and also allowed to sign for the summer with other clubs too.Todds_right_hook said:
This is what I don't understand. How binding is a pre contract? He is still under contract with us and can't sign a legally binding contract elsewhere.Callumcafc said:
Have you seen the picture of him holding up a Hungarian club shirt? I don’t think he does that if he’s not signed something binding.Covered_End_Lad said:
Have you seen the pre-contract that he signed?Vjacheslav said:
In this case the contract not only valid by hungarian law, but valid by uefa law too.Covered_End_Lad said:Pre-contracts are generally not binding under English law as they are usually marked 'Subject to Contract'This is not a verbal agreement. Id the 'Subject to Contract' contains all of the element of the final contract, also valid by the English law too.
do pre contract have break clauses?
In basic terms, I'm guessing a pre contract suggests that on expiration of a contract xxxx will sign a contract at and that during this time, he is unable to negotiate terms with other clubs? This is purely intent to speak again when out of contract?
A quick google search suggests that the "binding" factor depends on essential items such as duration and renumeration, without these, it's just a gentleman's agreement.
Google says "pre contracts can be as slippery as a wet pitch. Whether they score a goal or get intercepted depends on the fine print"
i doubt a top flight professional al football club would offer a pre contract without essential terms, unless Dobson requested a break clause.Time will tell!!
This is not a google thing, this is uefa regulation.0
