The thread was about a man, with stubble in a dress using the womens toilets. I don’t give a shiny shit why they feel entitled to do so and most women I have had any type of discussion with do not like this behaviour. We've had two blokes sacked for using the women's toilets at our various sites as, rightly, those toilets are a safe space for a single sex. The women's toilets at my yard I've been told are a lot nicer than the blokes and fair play, I've seen the state some of the creatures I work with seem to relish leaving the blokes shitters in.
The thread was not about floor to ceiling, specifically constructed unisex/gender fluid/whatever toilets it was about our thoughts on men using the women's toilets and thats a absolute hard no for me. Next time I'm in the pub I'll ask all the girls in there what they think as well. I have a suspicion but I'll share the answers when I hear them.
Which loo should a transwoman use?
Some on here won't like my answer but here goes.
If you have a penis you use the mens.
If you have a vagina you use the ladies.
Who polices that?
Make it the law and police it like we do every other law.
So, when a policeman stops you when you're driving, you have to show your driving licence. Does that mean you have to show your reproductive parts when you want to use a loo? This is a preposterous exaggeration to illustrate the point.
How does anyone "in charge" ever going to know whether people using the loos are doing so within the law or outside it, if the measure is as simple and straightforward as you suggest?
I'm not saying it's simple or straightforward but as someone who has three granddaughters between the ages of 5 and 13 I would not be happy with a man going into the same toilets as them.
I wouldn't be happy either but I would broaden it to not being happy about any person using a public toilet for sexual gratification purposes. So the example about a man dressed as a woman taking secret photos is terrible and he deserves severe punsihment. I might add, so does a woman doing the same in a woman's toilet. It is the act itself which is the problem.
I would imagine there are some places where a trans person, would be very uncomfortable going into a men's toilet and genuinely at risk of violence. Are we not allowed to imagine such an obvious scenario or do we have a permission not to care when it comes to them?
I think the vast majority posting on this thread are men. The opinions I take most notice of are women's. If the majority of women feel uncomfortable about biological men using female toilets then I think that they should be heard. Roughly 50 % of the population are female and less than 1% are trans .
So the wishes of the50% should be the one that counts.
The thread was about a man, with stubble in a dress using the womens toilets. I don’t give a shiny shit why they feel entitled to do so and most women I have had any type of discussion with do not like this behaviour. We've had two blokes sacked for using the women's toilets at our various sites as, rightly, those toilets are a safe space for a single sex. The women's toilets at my yard I've been told are a lot nicer than the blokes and fair play, I've seen the state some of the creatures I work with seem to relish leaving the blokes shitters in.
The thread was not about floor to ceiling, specifically constructed unisex/gender fluid/whatever toilets it was about our thoughts on men using the women's toilets and thats a absolute hard no for me. Next time I'm in the pub I'll ask all the girls in there what they think as well. I have a suspicion but I'll share the answers when I hear them.
Which loo should a transwoman use?
Transwoman, as in a biological male can use the mens toilets or the unisex disabled toilets. @Jessie and a few other female posters, the ones who are affected by this, has said similar.
Its nonsense that those of us who aren't affected are piping up saying its fine for a transwoman/biological male to use the women's toilets because they have cubicles.
And for what its worth, the western world has never been a safer place for people to be themselves. And I'm all for that, why wouldn't I be. I cant pretend to be a feminist or some bullshit like that as I'm not a female but I 100% respect the rights of women to have a safe and private place like they have for years that is exclusively for women
Can you see any issues at all in this? Set aside who - and how - this is policed, and consider whether the three people pictured below would feel safe if they're in a nightclub that has no "unisex disabled toilets" and they were prevented from using the women's loos. Does limiting these people to using men's loos in a crowded, busy nightclub late at night present any risk issues at all?
I take it they are all biological males who have made the not inconsequential life choice to live as females? I'd expect them to respect women's, biological females space and not use their toilets.
Am I in the minority here in thinking this is insane?
I agree. Got a Willy, use the mens, not got a Willy, use the ladies. Simples.
Oh, thank goodness it's simple! Which loo do the three people pictured use? Who checks?
It's self policing really. You have to rely on people to abide by the rules and do the right thing.
Once people have fully transitioned they can of course then use the appropriate toilet.
If you are a woman and you feel frightened by the idea of the normalisation of people who present in varied ways using the same public toilets as you without the associated improvements in society to protect you from the monsters in it then that's ok,
Monsters... condescending waffle.
Cherry-pick a large, tremendously thoughtful post for one word that isn't even wrong (there are a lot of monsters out there who prey on women. This is inarguable) eh
If you are a woman and you feel frightened by the idea of the normalisation of people who present in varied ways using the same public toilets as you without the associated improvements in society to protect you from the monsters in it then that's ok,
Monsters... condescending waffle.
Not really sure why that's got that response. I don't think calling rapists monsters is that controversial is it? I'm aware that women don't need to be told it's ok to feel what they feel - I'm guessing that's what you're referring to - and that's not what I'm saying, I was just trying to point out that that it functions alongside the fears trans people have. The two things can be parallel instead of opposing but that often gets forgotten for one or the other
The thread was about a man, with stubble in a dress using the womens toilets. I don’t give a shiny shit why they feel entitled to do so and most women I have had any type of discussion with do not like this behaviour. We've had two blokes sacked for using the women's toilets at our various sites as, rightly, those toilets are a safe space for a single sex. The women's toilets at my yard I've been told are a lot nicer than the blokes and fair play, I've seen the state some of the creatures I work with seem to relish leaving the blokes shitters in.
The thread was not about floor to ceiling, specifically constructed unisex/gender fluid/whatever toilets it was about our thoughts on men using the women's toilets and thats a absolute hard no for me. Next time I'm in the pub I'll ask all the girls in there what they think as well. I have a suspicion but I'll share the answers when I hear them.
Which loo should a transwoman use?
Some on here won't like my answer but here goes.
If you have a penis you use the mens.
If you have a vagina you use the ladies.
Who polices that?
Make it the law and police it like we do every other law.
So, when a policeman stops you when you're driving, you have to show your driving licence. Does that mean you have to show your reproductive parts when you want to use a loo? This is a preposterous exaggeration to illustrate the point.
How does anyone "in charge" ever going to know whether people using the loos are doing so within the law or outside it, if the measure is as simple and straightforward as you suggest?
I'm not saying it's simple or straightforward but as someone who has three granddaughters between the ages of 5 and 13 I would not be happy with a man going into the same toilets as them.
I wouldn't be happy either but I would broaden it to not being happy about any person using a public toilet for sexual gratification purposes. So the example about a man dressed as a woman taking secret photos is terrible and he deserves severe punsihment. I might add, so does a woman doing the same in a woman's toilet. It is the act itself which is the problem.
I would imagine there are some places where a trans person, would be very uncomfortable going into a men's toilet and genuinely at risk of violence. Are we not allowed to imagine such an obvious scenario or do we have a permission not to care when it comes to them?
I think the vast majority posting on this thread are men. The opinions I take most notice of are women's. If the majority of women feel uncomfortable about biological men using female toilets then I think that they should be heard. Roughly 50 % of the population are female and less than 1% are trans .
So the wishes of the50% should be the one that counts.
Do we apply that logic to all marginalised groups though? The majority of the people are able bodied should we ignore concerns of the disabled? The majority of people in the UK are white British do we ignore concerns of racial minorities?
Not saying I have the solution. But we can't write them off as a small number of people. As I said they are some of the most vulnerable people in society. We should work together to find a solution that works for all.
That's why I'm advocating for "proper" gender neutral toilets - individual rooms - wherever they can be implemented.
The thread was about a man, with stubble in a dress using the womens toilets. I don’t give a shiny shit why they feel entitled to do so and most women I have had any type of discussion with do not like this behaviour. We've had two blokes sacked for using the women's toilets at our various sites as, rightly, those toilets are a safe space for a single sex. The women's toilets at my yard I've been told are a lot nicer than the blokes and fair play, I've seen the state some of the creatures I work with seem to relish leaving the blokes shitters in.
The thread was not about floor to ceiling, specifically constructed unisex/gender fluid/whatever toilets it was about our thoughts on men using the women's toilets and thats a absolute hard no for me. Next time I'm in the pub I'll ask all the girls in there what they think as well. I have a suspicion but I'll share the answers when I hear them.
Which loo should a transwoman use?
Transwoman, as in a biological male can use the mens toilets or the unisex disabled toilets. @Jessie and a few other female posters, the ones who are affected by this, has said similar.
Its nonsense that those of us who aren't affected are piping up saying its fine for a transwoman/biological male to use the women's toilets because they have cubicles.
And for what its worth, the western world has never been a safer place for people to be themselves. And I'm all for that, why wouldn't I be. I cant pretend to be a feminist or some bullshit like that as I'm not a female but I 100% respect the rights of women to have a safe and private place like they have for years that is exclusively for women
Can you see any issues at all in this? Set aside who - and how - this is policed, and consider whether the three people pictured below would feel safe if they're in a nightclub that has no "unisex disabled toilets" and they were prevented from using the women's loos. Does limiting these people to using men's loos in a crowded, busy nightclub late at night present any risk issues at all?
I take it they are all biological males who have made the not inconsequential life choice to live as females? I'd expect them to respect women's, biological females space and not use their toilets.
Am I in the minority here in thinking this is insane?
I agree. Got a Willy, use the mens, not got a Willy, use the ladies. Simples.
Oh, thank goodness it's simple! Which loo do the three people pictured use? Who checks?
It's self policing really. You have to rely on people to abide by the rules and do the right thing.
Once people have fully transitioned they can of course then use the appropriate toilet.
I can't believe how far we have come that we now have to ignore the evidence of our eyes, ears and common sense because of what the usual suspects want us to think.
The thread was about a man, with stubble in a dress using the womens toilets. I don’t give a shiny shit why they feel entitled to do so and most women I have had any type of discussion with do not like this behaviour. We've had two blokes sacked for using the women's toilets at our various sites as, rightly, those toilets are a safe space for a single sex. The women's toilets at my yard I've been told are a lot nicer than the blokes and fair play, I've seen the state some of the creatures I work with seem to relish leaving the blokes shitters in.
The thread was not about floor to ceiling, specifically constructed unisex/gender fluid/whatever toilets it was about our thoughts on men using the women's toilets and thats a absolute hard no for me. Next time I'm in the pub I'll ask all the girls in there what they think as well. I have a suspicion but I'll share the answers when I hear them.
Which loo should a transwoman use?
Some on here won't like my answer but here goes.
If you have a penis you use the mens.
If you have a vagina you use the ladies.
Who polices that?
Make it the law and police it like we do every other law.
So, when a policeman stops you when you're driving, you have to show your driving licence. Does that mean you have to show your reproductive parts when you want to use a loo? This is a preposterous exaggeration to illustrate the point.
How does anyone "in charge" ever going to know whether people using the loos are doing so within the law or outside it, if the measure is as simple and straightforward as you suggest?
I'm not saying it's simple or straightforward but as someone who has three granddaughters between the ages of 5 and 13 I would not be happy with a man going into the same toilets as them.
I wouldn't be happy either but I would broaden it to not being happy about any person using a public toilet for sexual gratification purposes. So the example about a man dressed as a woman taking secret photos is terrible and he deserves severe punsihment. I might add, so does a woman doing the same in a woman's toilet. It is the act itself which is the problem.
I would imagine there are some places where a trans person, would be very uncomfortable going into a men's toilet and genuinely at risk of violence. Are we not allowed to imagine such an obvious scenario or do we have a permission not to care when it comes to them?
I think the vast majority posting on this thread are men. The opinions I take most notice of are women's. If the majority of women feel uncomfortable about biological men using female toilets then I think that they should be heard. Roughly 50 % of the population are female and less than 1% are trans .
So the wishes of the50% should be the one that counts.
Do we apply that logic to all marginalised groups though? The majority of the people are able bodied should we ignore concerns of the disabled? The majority of people in the UK are white British do we ignore concerns of racial minorities?
Not saying I have the solution. But we can't write them off as a small number of people. As I said they are some of the most vulnerable people in society. We should work together to find a solution that works for all.
That's why I'm advocating for "proper" gender neutral toilets - individual rooms - wherever they can be implemented.
Regarding your last sentence if implemented properly I agree. Airplanes being a perfect example. But what about area's where they can't be implemented properly. Take Charlton as an example, half the blokes waiting to go into trap one for instance are going in for a cigarette or a toot.
The thread was about a man, with stubble in a dress using the womens toilets. I don’t give a shiny shit why they feel entitled to do so and most women I have had any type of discussion with do not like this behaviour. We've had two blokes sacked for using the women's toilets at our various sites as, rightly, those toilets are a safe space for a single sex. The women's toilets at my yard I've been told are a lot nicer than the blokes and fair play, I've seen the state some of the creatures I work with seem to relish leaving the blokes shitters in.
The thread was not about floor to ceiling, specifically constructed unisex/gender fluid/whatever toilets it was about our thoughts on men using the women's toilets and thats a absolute hard no for me. Next time I'm in the pub I'll ask all the girls in there what they think as well. I have a suspicion but I'll share the answers when I hear them.
Which loo should a transwoman use?
Some on here won't like my answer but here goes.
If you have a penis you use the mens.
If you have a vagina you use the ladies.
Who polices that?
You're very keen on telling people on what they should or shouldn't be doing. Sounds like you were made for the position.
I can't believe how far we have come that we now have to ignore the evidence of our eyes, ears and common sense because of what the usual suspects want us to think.
So true! People who look like, sound like and are women being forced to use male facilities. Ridiculous isn't it
My wife doesn't care, it's a cubicle not a urinal so no problem as far as she's concerned. But I appreciate not every woman would feel the same.
One of the major weekenders we attend ends up with huge queues for the ladies, so many of them use the gents ( not the urinals, before someone pipes up ). The blokes have no problem.
I’m not sure I agree with this. I reckon for a heap of different reasons there are some blokes that are distinctly uncomfortable when in public or venue toilets and pairs of pissed up females come in, or a female cleaner emerges and is walking around them.
There seems to be a focus on this thread on the predatory angle but to a lesser degree uncomfortableness in these scenarios shouldn’t just be seen as a one way thing that is only a concern for females.
I don’t think the word comfortable should be even thought of. Is there any straight guy comfortable with a gay guy in the same communal shower. Is there any straight woman comfortable with s gay woman in a similar situation. It’s whether it’s placing a risk of danger or harm that’s our issue here.
The thread was about a man, with stubble in a dress using the womens toilets. I don’t give a shiny shit why they feel entitled to do so and most women I have had any type of discussion with do not like this behaviour. We've had two blokes sacked for using the women's toilets at our various sites as, rightly, those toilets are a safe space for a single sex. The women's toilets at my yard I've been told are a lot nicer than the blokes and fair play, I've seen the state some of the creatures I work with seem to relish leaving the blokes shitters in.
The thread was not about floor to ceiling, specifically constructed unisex/gender fluid/whatever toilets it was about our thoughts on men using the women's toilets and thats a absolute hard no for me. Next time I'm in the pub I'll ask all the girls in there what they think as well. I have a suspicion but I'll share the answers when I hear them.
Which loo should a transwoman use?
Some on here won't like my answer but here goes.
If you have a penis you use the mens.
If you have a vagina you use the ladies.
Who polices that?
You're very keen on telling people on what they should or shouldn't be doing. Sounds like you were made for the position.
I am absolutely not. I am very interested in knowing what other people's views are. What do you think the solution should be?
If you are a woman and you feel frightened by the idea of the normalisation of people who present in varied ways using the same public toilets as you without the associated improvements in society to protect you from the monsters in it then that's ok,
Monsters... condescending waffle.
Not really sure why that's got that response. I don't think calling rapists monsters is that controversial is it? I'm aware that women don't need to be told it's ok to feel what they feel - I'm guessing that's what you're referring to - and that's not what I'm saying, I was just trying to point out that that it functions alongside the fears trans people have. The two things can be parallel instead of opposing but that often gets forgotten for one or the other
Because it was a sentence that I found condescending and it really grated on me.
The thread was about a man, with stubble in a dress using the womens toilets. I don’t give a shiny shit why they feel entitled to do so and most women I have had any type of discussion with do not like this behaviour. We've had two blokes sacked for using the women's toilets at our various sites as, rightly, those toilets are a safe space for a single sex. The women's toilets at my yard I've been told are a lot nicer than the blokes and fair play, I've seen the state some of the creatures I work with seem to relish leaving the blokes shitters in.
The thread was not about floor to ceiling, specifically constructed unisex/gender fluid/whatever toilets it was about our thoughts on men using the women's toilets and thats a absolute hard no for me. Next time I'm in the pub I'll ask all the girls in there what they think as well. I have a suspicion but I'll share the answers when I hear them.
Which loo should a transwoman use?
Some on here won't like my answer but here goes.
If you have a penis you use the mens.
If you have a vagina you use the ladies.
Who polices that?
You're very keen on telling people on what they should or shouldn't be doing. Sounds like you were made for the position.
I am absolutely not. I am very interested in knowing what other people's views are. What do you think the solution should be?
Sign an attacking midfielder that's better than Berry 😜
Wasn't sure how to word the title and if there's already a thread on this as no doubt there's probably several then admin please delete.
Bloke with a very butch voice and stubble in a pub dressed as a woman, very glamorous like, (put some real effort into it unlike some of the girls who can't even be arsed to change out of their dressing gowns and pyjamas to go down to the shops) who has just used the ladies loos. Now is this socially acceptable for those on here, particularly the ladies to think as you're using the loo that in the cubicle next to you is a rather large man standing up lifting up his skirt to have a piss.
Thoughts?
You do know how you could of worded the title better, lets not be obtuse clearly saying "blokes using the ladies toilet" and referring to trans woman as blokes is being deliberately provocative so lets drop the faux ignorance of "I WaSNT SuRE hOW tO WorD ThE TitLE" nonsense as said lets not be obtuse it demeans us all and embarrasses yourself.
All that said, how about you actually ask women how they feel about it ? I personally as a 35 year old man dont care at all who uses the bathroom next to me in public as long as they arent being a creep (rules apply to all genders) that said I've never felt the danger that women face so i can understand why they wouldnt want it to happen. However I think we are thinking illogically if you think that this a ploy for men to attack women, i doubt any potential attacker would be thinking i wish i could get in the bathroom and attack someone, unfortunately im not allowed in there.
In many places in France you will find unisex public toilets. The principle that some people don't get is it is beyond a left or right thing. It is a reality thing. Yes you can invent a scenario where a transvestite gets their todger out and swings it about for all to see, or you can live in the real world where they would use a cubicle and people in the toilet would be none the wiser. There are not sex checks to enter a toilet and never will be.
My wife has been to a few places with unisex toilets and has not entered and gone elsewhere as she is not comfortable with men in the same toilet area as women. Bearing in mind the amount of women who are victims of sexual abuse I fully understand.
So that right there is clearly the answer no ? lets businesses decide how they want to organise their bathrooms and if people feel uncomfortable with it they can decide if its a big enough problem or not to use that business.
I'm appalled at the apparent acceptance that men are messier pissers than women. I've known some right wayward aimers in my time (the current Mrs Davo is of course impeccable).
My wife doesn't care, it's a cubicle not a urinal so no problem as far as she's concerned. But I appreciate not every woman would feel the same.
One of the major weekenders we attend ends up with huge queues for the ladies, so many of them use the gents ( not the urinals, before someone pipes up ). The blokes have no problem.
I’m not sure I agree with this. I reckon for a heap of different reasons there are some blokes that are distinctly uncomfortable when in public or venue toilets and pairs of pissed up females come in, or a female cleaner emerges and is walking around them.
There seems to be a focus on this thread on the predatory angle but to a lesser degree uncomfortableness in these scenarios shouldn’t just be seen as a one way thing that is only a concern for females.
So you've stood next to the bloke who unfolds six inches of flaccid dick and then starts a conversation as well?
My wife doesn't care, it's a cubicle not a urinal so no problem as far as she's concerned. But I appreciate not every woman would feel the same.
One of the major weekenders we attend ends up with huge queues for the ladies, so many of them use the gents ( not the urinals, before someone pipes up ). The blokes have no problem.
I’m not sure I agree with this. I reckon for a heap of different reasons there are some blokes that are distinctly uncomfortable when in public or venue toilets and pairs of pissed up females come in, or a female cleaner emerges and is walking around them.
There seems to be a focus on this thread on the predatory angle but to a lesser degree uncomfortableness in these scenarios shouldn’t just be seen as a one way thing that is only a concern for females.
So you've stood next to the bloke who unfolds six inches of flaccid dick and then starts a conversation as well?
My wife doesn't care, it's a cubicle not a urinal so no problem as far as she's concerned. But I appreciate not every woman would feel the same.
One of the major weekenders we attend ends up with huge queues for the ladies, so many of them use the gents ( not the urinals, before someone pipes up ). The blokes have no problem.
I’m not sure I agree with this. I reckon for a heap of different reasons there are some blokes that are distinctly uncomfortable when in public or venue toilets and pairs of pissed up females come in, or a female cleaner emerges and is walking around them.
There seems to be a focus on this thread on the predatory angle but to a lesser degree uncomfortableness in these scenarios shouldn’t just be seen as a one way thing that is only a concern for females.
So you've stood next to the bloke who unfolds six inches of flaccid dick and then starts a conversation as well?
I reckon 200+ comments in all key points on this have now been shared so I think it’s probably best to flush the chain on this one and put the Out Of Order sign on its front door
Comments
The opinions I take most notice of are women's.
If the majority of women feel uncomfortable about biological men using female toilets then I think that they should be heard.
Roughly 50 % of the population are female and less than 1% are trans .
So the wishes of the50% should be the one that counts.
Once people have fully transitioned they can of course then use the appropriate toilet.
Not saying I have the solution. But we can't write them off as a small number of people. As I said they are some of the most vulnerable people in society. We should work together to find a solution that works for all.
That's why I'm advocating for "proper" gender neutral toilets - individual rooms - wherever they can be implemented.
Airplanes being a perfect example.
But what about area's where they can't be implemented properly.
Take Charlton as an example, half the blokes waiting to go into trap one for instance are going in for a cigarette or a toot.
”I am a woman”
What happens next?
All that said, how about you actually ask women how they feel about it ? I personally as a 35 year old man dont care at all who uses the bathroom next to me in public as long as they arent being a creep (rules apply to all genders) that said I've never felt the danger that women face so i can understand why they wouldnt want it to happen. However I think we are thinking illogically if you think that this a ploy for men to attack women, i doubt any potential attacker would be thinking i wish i could get in the bathroom and attack someone, unfortunately im not allowed in there.