CHARLTON SIGN NEW CEO - DANE MURPHY (p13. Oh no they don’t)

The point being missed re poty is that it’s always been (or at least for the last 32 years) an event organised by supporters for supporters.

originally by Casc, then by supporters on the Fans Forum

why are the club now trying to take over the organising of the event ?

If the club wish to reduce the cost then they can pay for the players/staff meals which would reduce the cost for supporters.

the event used to have a disco after the awards and used to go on to midnite, so has evolved over the years. 

Algarveaddick said:

Chatting with Chris Parkes, he said he met Dane in his early days at Barnsley, and was very impressed with him back then. He said he thought then he was a breath of fresh air and had a great future in football.  

Chris backed Duchatelet as well and tried to convince me that we wouldn't get relegated and we were in safe hands (just saying/I know Chris is a great fan & servant to CAFC.)

sammy391 said:

Henry Irving said:

sammy391 said:

JohnnyH2 said:

sammy391 said:

Henry Irving said:

TellyTubby said:

Henry Irving said:

valleynick66 said:

Airman Brown said:

daveydanger said:

As far as I understood, there was previously a division of labour where Methven was strictly commercial and “off-field growth”, Rodwell was “football operations”/training ground and Scott was recruitment and technical (players, basically). 

If Dane Murphy is a credited with a lot of player deals, it will be interesting to see if they bother replacing Scott with a technical director… and what it means for Rodwell longer term. I guess Murphy will handle more of the transfer activity than Methven but less of the recruiting than Scott… basically letting Chapple and the manager focus on which players to get.

That was the public line but I’m not convinced Methven was actually doing the job or that Rodwell was fully focused on the football side. I suspect it was just a cover story to explain Methven being put in a position where he could be held to account. Mind you, they were at loggerheads, as Charlie was with Warrick, so who knows how that could ever have worked?

Do we know why they were at loggerheads?

What were the disagreements- was Rodwell arguing for greater player spend for example?

You appear to be desperate to discover that the club aren't spending enough money.

From the little I know it was that Charlie made a lot of promises about commercial income he didn't deliver on, leaked worse than a cracked sieve and run up huge bar bills after games and those are just the snippets that I heard, there is almost certainly a lot more of which I have no knowledge.

Carter came in towards the end of 2024 at the request of the main owners as they, IMHO, wanted to get a much better handle on who did what and the value for money that the owners were getting from various staff.

Directly or indirectly as a result, IMHO, we've seen Methven, Scott and Commercial Manager Barry Higson all leave.

Warrick is far more front and centre and Murphy has just come in which I think is both a major upgrade on Methven and significant financial investment as I don't think he would come cheap or be willing to give up his holding in Vitesse Arnham if he thought Charlton were trying to do things "on the cheap".   

Looking at the comparison table of Championship clubs, our commercial income is embarrassingly low. By far the smallest of all clubs, even less than Oxford.

It's clear the club is being poorly managed on that side, and suggests other things could be improved. Hopefully the Reebok deal is the start of an upward direction for income generally. 

Part of the problem is the outsourcing of retail, until this year, and hospitality.

But our commercial income is poor compared to other clubs who sponsor the hell out of everythingm

Charlton couldn't even sell one of three Nathan Jones shirt sponsorships. They also buggered up the player of the year dinner through incompetence.

There is a lot of scope for improvement. Appointing a commercial manager would be a start.

Presuming you mean last years POTY Dinner? 
There's been a clear and determined effort to produce an similar event that enables more fans to attend (hopefully coming in the summer) and one that less restrictive/out dated 

I thought that it got cancelled due to the 1st Team to prepare for the end of the season, not due to that the format was wrong in some people's opinion?

Bit of both I think - certainly feels like an effort being made to bring these types of thing into the 21st century - especially as it meant that a large swathe of the Addicks Population couldn't/wouldn't attend POTY Dinners 

You mean the dinners that sold out year on year when we were crap but didn't happen at all this year.

Yeah, no dinner at all is really 21st century.

Unfortunately, the dinners are often seen as old fashioned and outdated - and I’d argue very much aimed at certain fans - the price point alone does that! 

Whilst they are good events, and a great opportunity to meet players etc - id imagine most fans would prefer an event that reflects a wider sections of the fanbase as well as being more accessible to general fans and local communities...

The POTY Dinner doesn't raise money for anything as far as i'm aware - if it makes any profit at all - so surely a free/low entry fee event at The Valley that enables many more fans to attend can only be a better option

Are family Fun Days not "very much aimed at certain fans"? If an event takes place that I am not interested in, I don't partake. I don't moan about it's existence and try to change it into something I want it to be. I go to an alternative event that does appeal to me - for example something like POTY. 

I would love to sit in an executive box every game, but I don't because I can't afford it, I don't suggest they should be closed down or re-priced so I can afford it.

You suggested that a large swathe of supporters couldn't/wouldn't attend the POTY dinner. Surely those that wouldn't are irrelevant? I refer you to my first paragraph.   

As Henners points out, the dinners were popular and successful, it might be seen as old fashioned and outdated by some people, but if they are selling out, why would you want to stop them?

sammy391 said:

Henry Irving said:

Covered End said:

sammy391 said:

Henry Irving said:

@sammy391 are you part of CAST?

Are CAST and the club planning a player of the year event for this summer?

I am, yes.

are CAST planning anything for summer: No
are the club planning something for summer: to be confirmed via Advisory Board and the specific ’task & complete’ group - of which there were unfortunately limited applications for

It reads as if the existing competent organisers have been sidelined in favour of an inadequate "task & complete" group, thus explaining why no player of the year/season event took place and the inference is it is doubtful due to lack of numbers, experience etc.

It reads like letting Curbs go and replacing him with Iain Dowie.

It is odd that a family open day is seen as alternative to the POTY dinner.

Why are the two being connected?

Both took place last year without any conflict.

I haven't attended a POTY dinner for years, not my thing, but many fans enjoy it. I was at the fun day with the museum and it was a good event.  I hope it is repeated although the costs v Income are unknown to me. But I expect such events are seen as lost leaders.

@sammy391 has suggested that somehow a dinner is not inclusive to all fans and the community and so not appropriate for the 21st century.

Is that CAST's view? The Club's view? 

And has this task group spoken to the POTY organisors?

A poster above suggested that a more ‘accessible and open event, that would be low cost/free to fans’ would just be the Family Fun Day…

The POTY dinner have their admiration, and of course are a good event- but Its east to see a large amount of the fanbase dont/won’t engage with it- whether due to pricing, the event itself or both.

These are of course my views, so no need to CAST bash as you seemingly are trying to do, nor are they club views. 

However, the club is Clearly wanting to have an event that can encapsulate more Charlton narratives, more Charlton attractions and more Charlton fans. 

Shouldn’t be any issue with that, surely? 

POTY Organisers could have and still can, apply to be part of the Task & Complete Group 
https://www.charltonafc.com/news/early-stages-charlton-advisory-board

No need to be so sensitive, where did I "bash" CAST?   Fans are allowed to ask Trust board members questions, are they not?  

You say that the POTY dinner is a good event and then say a large amount of fans don't/won't engage with it.  So what.  Those that choose to attend enjoy it, it's not for me but that doesn't mean I think it shouldn't happen.  Do a majority of fans have to attend an event for it to be justified.  As long as fans are not excluded on the grounds of race or gender or another not relevant factor then surely there should be a wide range of events to cater for a diverse range of interests and budgets.

If cost is excluding fans as you have suggested then should the club close the lounges as they are not available to all fans due to budget.  Or stop the shirt sponsors lunches with players as they are only open to fans able to spend £400 plus.

As it happens the costs of the POTY were kept as low as possible to keep it affordable to as many as possible.

It was the club who wanted to raise it to £120 per head.

Again I'm not clear why "However, the club is Clearly wanting to have an event that can encapsulate more Charlton narratives, more Charlton attractions and more Charlton fans. 

Henry Irving said:

sammy391 said:

Henry Irving said:

Covered End said:

sammy391 said:

Henry Irving said:

@sammy391 are you part of CAST?

Are CAST and the club planning a player of the year event for this summer?

I am, yes.

are CAST planning anything for summer: No
are the club planning something for summer: to be confirmed via Advisory Board and the specific ’task & complete’ group - of which there were unfortunately limited applications for

It reads as if the existing competent organisers have been sidelined in favour of an inadequate "task & complete" group, thus explaining why no player of the year/season event took place and the inference is it is doubtful due to lack of numbers, experience etc.

It reads like letting Curbs go and replacing him with Iain Dowie.

It is odd that a family open day is seen as alternative to the POTY dinner.

Why are the two being connected?

Both took place last year without any conflict.

I haven't attended a POTY dinner for years, not my thing, but many fans enjoy it. I was at the fun day with the museum and it was a good event.  I hope it is repeated although the costs v Income are unknown to me. But I expect such events are seen as lost leaders.

@sammy391 has suggested that somehow a dinner is not inclusive to all fans and the community and so not appropriate for the 21st century.

Is that CAST's view? The Club's view? 

And has this task group spoken to the POTY organisors?

A poster above suggested that a more ‘accessible and open event, that would be low cost/free to fans’ would just be the Family Fun Day…

The POTY dinner have their admiration, and of course are a good event- but Its east to see a large amount of the fanbase dont/won’t engage with it- whether due to pricing, the event itself or both.

These are of course my views, so no need to CAST bash as you seemingly are trying to do, nor are they club views. 

However, the club is Clearly wanting to have an event that can encapsulate more Charlton narratives, more Charlton attractions and more Charlton fans. 

Shouldn’t be any issue with that, surely? 

POTY Organisers could have and still can, apply to be part of the Task & Complete Group 
https://www.charltonafc.com/news/early-stages-charlton-advisory-board

No need to be so sensitive, where did I "bash" CAST?   Fans are allowed to ask Trust board members questions, are they not?  

You say that the POTY dinner is a good event and then say a large amount of fans don't/won't engage with it.  So what.  Those that choose to attend enjoy it, it's not for me but that doesn't mean I think it shouldn't happen.  Do a majority of fans have to attend an event for it to be justified.  As long as fans are not excluded on the grounds of race or gender or another not relevant factor then surely there should be a wide range of events to cater for a diverse range of interests and budgets.

If cost is excluding fans as you have suggested then should the club close the lounges as they are not available to all fans due to budget.  Or stop the shirt sponsors lunches with players as they are only open to fans able to spend £400 plus.

As it happens the costs of the POTY were kept as low as possible to keep it affordable to as many as possible.

It was the club who wanted to raise it to £120 per head.

Again I'm not clear why "However, the club is Clearly wanting to have an event that can encapsulate more Charlton narratives, more Charlton attractions and more Charlton fans. 

Shouldn’t be any issue with that, surely?"  means that the POTY dinner shouldn't take place.  Why does it have to be either/or. 

Plurality should mean many events not one event trying and encompass everyone because that just isn't possible.

Nice of you to say that the POTY organisers can apply to joint the task group but 1. did you invite them? There experience and organisation skills might have come in handy. and 2. Why would they think to join without knowing that the event was seen as a replacement for the dinner?

No sensitivity here - just disappointing that you went straight onto the offensive about 'cast views' etc.
Of course people can ask question - in fact they're welcomed.

No one has suggested that this event is a replacement for a POTY Dinner, nor is there any indication that POTY Dinner will cease to exist - despite comments on here.

All that has happened is that the even was delayed/shelved this season, with a wider event mooted - and a Task & Complete Group set up to advise/organise/develop club events in the future, which could by all means include POTY Dinners.

Splitting hairs about money making ventures by the club, in comparison to a POTY Dinner that you have clearly said isnt a profit making event - there is no Cheaper Alternative to the POTY Dinner, where as multiple price point entry to lounges/The Valley is clear to see. 


I have no idea whether fans were invited to join the T&C Group - i haven't been part of that issue on the AB- i'd hope they wouldnt feel it necessary to be invited in order to partake. They should join as they would hopefully want to be part of the conversation/organisation of such events like POTY and further

Covered End said:

Algarveaddick said:

Chatting with Chris Parkes, he said he met Dane in his early days at Barnsley, and was very impressed with him back then. He said he thought then he was a breath of fresh air and had a great future in football.  

Chris backed Duchatelet as well and tried to convince me that we wouldn't get relegated and we were in safe hands (just saying/I know Chris is a great fan & servant to CAFC.)

As for his wife........

Woodwork said:

ShootersHillGuru said:

All sorts of events are organised all of the time by all sorts of people at all sorts of places. Quite why one of our fans groups or the club or in collaboration can’t organise POTY without this seeming drama is something I don’t understand. 

Come on. Charlton must have the most officious, busy body fanbase in English football. Charlton Life sometime feels like moving to a nice little village where the parish council is dominated by early retirement barristers, bored Head teachers and ‘in my experience’ retired corporate executives. So, god knows what the organisation that attracts alpha busy bodies is like!    

You’d prefer everyone to be a bit more Danny Dyer I suppose?
😂

blackpool72 said:

Woodwork said:

ShootersHillGuru said:

All sorts of events are organised all of the time by all sorts of people at all sorts of places. Quite why one of our fans groups or the club or in collaboration can’t organise POTY without this seeming drama is something I don’t understand. 

Come on. Charlton must have the most officious, busy body fanbase in English football. Charlton Life sometime feels like moving to a nice little village where the parish council is dominated by early retirement barristers, bored Head teachers and ‘in my experience’ retired corporate executives. So, god knows what the organisation that attracts alpha busy bodies is like!    

You obviously wasn't a member when the political threads were allowed. 
Just about the complete opposite of what you describe. 

Yes, but all champagne socialists given a leg up by their rich parents.

Airman Brown said:

swordfish said:

Airman Brown said:

The 2030 break clause in the lease is only in the club’s favour. It is not an option available to RD.

One of the consistent themes from successive ownerships is overestimation of the club’s commercial potential, often from bullshitters but also from people who just do not understand the supporter base.

It would be wrong to discourage ambition, but it’s an easy way to disappoint the owners.

Apologies for seeking more clarity on the lease, but if he was minded to evict us now, what's the earliest RD could? And has he had any opportunity to evict us since he sold the club? *

* I ask that only because I'd assumed TS wouldn't have bought the Club without assurances over the lease, RD having agreed to continue it with amended terms post ESI  rather than watch us go into Admin and so have to repay the directors loans. 

TS renegotiated the lease. It’s between CAFC Ltd and Baton, which is still owned by Staprix, IIRC. The interesting question is who the current guarantor is, but is suspect it is still Sandgaard with a side note from GFP that indemnifies him. Otherwise GFP or SE7 would have needed to renegotiate the lease with RD, which they clearly didn’t as any change would hsve been lodged with the land registry.

Thanks. Would that 'side note' not be subject to disclosure in the indemnifier's books?

Getting back to my original questions though, 2035 is the lease end date isn't it?  And RD did allow TS to renegotiate its terms, a sensible decision of the head if not the heart. He could have made life very difficult for TS and us back then by refusing to.

Trying to keep this thread on track. Does anyone know when Dane starts employment with us please?

So, there's a gap of a few days or weeks between when the offer is received and accepted and the moment at which the paperwork has been through the legal process and the person can get through the door and put his feet under the desk.  

In many ways, it could be considered similar to buying a house...