I'm comfortable with not getting drawn into bidding wars when you know you've got to make the most of the budget to strengthen across the squad. Mothersille attitude wise sounds like a dodged bullet and I would still expect another forward in the building anyway and Gailbraith sounds like he's only ever wanted Swansea.
NJ even said in his recent interview that players attitude is absolutely fundamental and it is that first and foremost we look at. We have had shite characters at Charlton either with bad attitudes (Maddison) or simply lazy characters (Fraser; Kirk). I suspect we looked at Mothersille and decided he wasn't worth the baggage if the rumours of his attitude are true.
That wally of a chairman at P'Boro spouting again.
Sounds like a weird lie to be fair. I don't think he would make that up for no reason.
That's now the 2nd player we have been quite publicly linked with that we didn't up our bid for.
I know people will say "sounds like the club aren't letting themselves be mugged off" etc but these players cost money. For the sake of 300-500k twice to lose out on a desired target, it just isn't worth it, unless you can find someone of better quality for cheaper.
It's ok to say we are on a tight budget, which if 5-10m is true, that makes it the very lower end of champ. It might be that our budget heavily leaned towards Goalkeeper and a forward as those are two positions we definitely needed a player.
Just don't get why it seems we have this view now of "looks like we didn't want to pay then rather than we couldn't" when most signs point towards us just having a low but competitive championship budget. We are going to miss out on players if that's the case, and that is part of football.
Think it’s more the point we think a certain player is worth x amount and won’t pay over the odds. If you take what DMac says as being true where are all the other Championship sides queuing up for Mothersille if you believe he’s that good and available at a fair price? The lack of other interest suggests Championship clubs thinks he’s either not that good or they can do better elsewhere. You do seem fixated in seeing the negative in everything.
We simply cannot be compared to about 18-20 Championship sides as they have better squads, and proven championship players with bigger budgets. They aren't in a rebuild state like we are. Their targets will be completely different.
Malik did have Championship offers, QPR heavily linked (assume Poku signing changed their plans), if you bother to look at most other championship sides, you will realise they already have better quality. That's not to say Malik can't make the step up, it's just how good a lot of the players in this league are.
How am I fixated in being negative on everything? Was I negative about Tanto or Kaminski? I wanted us to sign Bell, we have, I'll post about that in a positive manner.
Offering 200-300k more or whatever it is is not paying over the odds, these are really low end championship transfer fees. I am highlighting the concern that when we appear to be in a transfer shootout, we are losing.
If Bell can also provide cover for Edwards then it makes sense if it means we can spend more budget elsewhere in the team instead of bringing in Famewo at CB and then also someone else to cover Edwards.
That wally of a chairman at P'Boro spouting again.
Sounds like a weird lie to be fair. I don't think he would make that up for no reason.
That's now the 2nd player we have been quite publicly linked with that we didn't up our bid for.
I know people will say "sounds like the club aren't letting themselves be mugged off" etc but these players cost money. For the sake of 300-500k twice to lose out on a desired target, it just isn't worth it, unless you can find someone of better quality for cheaper.
It's ok to say we are on a tight budget, which if 5-10m is true, that makes it the very lower end of champ. It might be that our budget heavily leaned towards Goalkeeper and a forward as those are two positions we definitely needed a player.
Just don't get why it seems we have this view now of "looks like we didn't want to pay then rather than we couldn't" when most signs point towards us just having a low but competitive championship budget. We are going to miss out on players if that's the case, and that is part of football.
Think it’s more the point we think a certain player is worth x amount and won’t pay over the odds. If you take what DMac says as being true where are all the other Championship sides queuing up for Mothersille if you believe he’s that good and available at a fair price? The lack of other interest suggests Championship clubs thinks he’s either not that good or they can do better elsewhere. You do seem fixated in seeing the negative in everything.
We simply cannot be compared to about 18-20 Championship sides as they have better squads, and proven championship players with bigger budgets. They aren't in a rebuild state like we are. Their targets will be completely different.
Malik did have Championship offers, QPR heavily linked (assume Poku signing changed their plans), if you bother to look at most other championship sides, you will realise they already have better quality. That's not to say Malik can't make the step up, it's just how good a lot of the players in this league are.
How am I fixated in being negative on everything? Was I negative about Tanto or Kaminski? I wanted us to sign Bell, we have, I'll post about that in a positive manner.
Offering 200-300k more or whatever it is is not paying over the odds, these are really low end championship transfer fees. I am highlighting the concern that when we appear to be in a transfer shootout, we are losing.
The answer might be in your post here, I think we were probably in for both Tanto and MM and then decided Tanto was the better choice. Just as QPR did with Poku (yes Poku is better than both of them but the theory is the same)
I’m ready for the peters but the £5 - 10 million pound budget is a concern for me. Sounds like that’ll be bottom five in The Championship and we’re also playing catch up with our squad in terms of Championship quality. I think we’ve all been excited by actually spending some money for once and got carried away with this and not focused on the fact that we’re newly promoted and need a massive squad upgrade. Good the owners are finding some cash for Jones, of course it is, but ambition other than survival is something I can’t see I’m afraid. Squad building not over yet but at this point I still feel like it’s going to be a long hard season.
The £5-10m being talked about is in fees, so that’ll be on top of £10-15m or so on wages (as a guess).
That wally of a chairman at P'Boro spouting again.
Sounds like a weird lie to be fair. I don't think he would make that up for no reason.
That's now the 2nd player we have been quite publicly linked with that we didn't up our bid for.
I know people will say "sounds like the club aren't letting themselves be mugged off" etc but these players cost money. For the sake of 300-500k twice to lose out on a desired target, it just isn't worth it, unless you can find someone of better quality for cheaper.
It's ok to say we are on a tight budget, which if 5-10m is true, that makes it the very lower end of champ. It might be that our budget heavily leaned towards Goalkeeper and a forward as those are two positions we definitely needed a player.
Just don't get why it seems we have this view now of "looks like we didn't want to pay then rather than we couldn't" when most signs point towards us just having a low but competitive championship budget. We are going to miss out on players if that's the case, and that is part of football.
That's the point though - if they're asking too much the money is better spent on someone else we think is as good but who isn't overpriced.
Or if we're going to spend that much, we'd expect to do better.
Setting a limit for what a player is worth and not going above it is sensible, otherwise you end up paying £4m for Will Grigg.
1.5-2 million for Galbraith though isn't too much money and neither is Mothersille for roughly 1 million. The only scenario in which you can say they are overpriced is if you aren't splashing the cash. Cause then you have to factor budget and where you are willing to invest that budget.
The Will Grigg transfer for 4 million is becoming a bit of a false dilemma. Of course not every player does well you pay cash for, there are loads of other examples where clubs 'overpay' and it works out successfully.
We are talking on missing out on desired targets for hundreds of thousands here, if the reports are true, not millions.
I genuinely don't really mind we are missing out on targets cause that is football, and it isn't my money to spend. I just don't see why we can't just look at it for what it is. It's a shame we are missing out, but clubs aren't trying to mug us off, they're trying to make themselves sustainable and the fees being quoted for these players are very reasonable transfer fees.
In your opinion.
Depends if Jones and Chappell think they can do better with that money.
Every club bar a few oil clubs have a budget and spend within it, walking away and not overpaying is sensible not a sign that you're not spending anything.
We're not in the realms of previous years of waiting for everyone else to do their business before picking up any old chaff on frees and loans (Church/Sordell, Terrell Thomas, Matt Penney, resigning Adam Matthews etc).
Is this the same “Dmac” that was besties with Matt Southall and didn’t have any inkling about what he was really like? Couldn’t care less what he has to say
That wally of a chairman at P'Boro spouting again.
Sounds like a weird lie to be fair. I don't think he would make that up for no reason.
That's now the 2nd player we have been quite publicly linked with that we didn't up our bid for.
I know people will say "sounds like the club aren't letting themselves be mugged off" etc but these players cost money. For the sake of 300-500k twice to lose out on a desired target, it just isn't worth it, unless you can find someone of better quality for cheaper.
It's ok to say we are on a tight budget, which if 5-10m is true, that makes it the very lower end of champ. It might be that our budget heavily leaned towards Goalkeeper and a forward as those are two positions we definitely needed a player.
Just don't get why it seems we have this view now of "looks like we didn't want to pay then rather than we couldn't" when most signs point towards us just having a low but competitive championship budget. We are going to miss out on players if that's the case, and that is part of football.
Think it’s more the point we think a certain player is worth x amount and won’t pay over the odds. If you take what DMac says as being true where are all the other Championship sides queuing up for Mothersille if you believe he’s that good and available at a fair price? The lack of other interest suggests Championship clubs thinks he’s either not that good or they can do better elsewhere. You do seem fixated in seeing the negative in everything.
We simply cannot be compared to about 18-20 Championship sides as they have better squads, and proven championship players with bigger budgets. They aren't in a rebuild state like we are. Their targets will be completely different.
Malik did have Championship offers, QPR heavily linked (assume Poku signing changed their plans), if you bother to look at most other championship sides, you will realise they already have better quality. That's not to say Malik can't make the step up, it's just how good a lot of the players in this league are.
How am I fixated in being negative on everything? Was I negative about Tanto or Kaminski? I wanted us to sign Bell, we have, I'll post about that in a positive manner.
Offering 200-300k more or whatever it is is not paying over the odds, these are really low end championship transfer fees. I am highlighting the concern that when we appear to be in a transfer shootout, we are losing.
What about us beating Derby to Sonny Carey, who are already a championship side? If we were still stuck on 0 signings I'd understand your concern a little more but we appear to be recruiting well, quite early into the window. Let's hope we keep seeing quality incomings through the door over the next couple of weeks, really hoping we bring in some quality in that RWB position
That wally of a chairman at P'Boro spouting again.
we managed to get to the number required for tanto which i believe was higher than mothersille so suggests we didn't rate him as highly
Which might be because no one was actually in for Tanto at that price other than one other mystery club someone said?
Two signings for fees, Kaminski where our competition was a club offering half of the wages and Tanto who we had a clear shot at (based on the rumour mills)
The two targets we missed (3 if you include Small) Galbraith & Mothersille. Both times we had genuine competition.
Fair play we have spent fees, but the consistent pattern is, when we are in a bidding war of sorts, we withdraw. Hopefully that theme changes as all your signings can't be hidden gems, good players are on multiple clubs radars and you have to meet clubs demands if you want them. It's not about 'not getting mugged off', players have prices.
Going off what we know I agree, but we don’t know what we don’t know, e.g. when this hasn’t been the case, the actual reasons for us withdrawing were etc.
We appear to have beaten other clubs to Kaminski, and there was talk of late interest in Tanto. Mothersille might have been 2nd choice to Tanto.
With Galbraith it’s going to happen sometimes, but the same will happen to Swansea. Most clubs don’t get every first choice target and beat all competition to signings.
After 5 years in L1 I get why some players would prefer a more established Championship team, but at least we’re giving it a good go on fees and wages. I think you’d agree it looks like our budget for fees could realistically be £5-10m, which is far bigger than most were expecting a few months ago assuming we got promoted. I got the impression the feeling was we’d continue looking for frees and paying small fees, whatever division we were in.
Agree with most of what you said here.
In regards to budget, I think 10 million combined is fine (wages, transfer fees, sign on fees etc) anything less and you are asking for trouble. I am happy we have spent some cash, but we just need to upgrade in more areas is all and it won't be cheap.
I just think the narrative being set is irking me a bit because clubs aren't trying to pull a fast one on us, they're asking for the market prices on young talented players.
We either pay and that's great, or we don't because it doesn't align with our budget and that's fine, other targets. Saying we mustn't have felt he was worth it etc makes us sound like that delusional Orient fan saying he would rather stay there than join here. Most of these players we are being linked with are better than what we have or would generally be squad upgrades.
That wally of a chairman at P'Boro spouting again.
Sounds like a weird lie to be fair. I don't think he would make that up for no reason.
That's now the 2nd player we have been quite publicly linked with that we didn't up our bid for.
I know people will say "sounds like the club aren't letting themselves be mugged off" etc but these players cost money. For the sake of 300-500k twice to lose out on a desired target, it just isn't worth it, unless you can find someone of better quality for cheaper.
It's ok to say we are on a tight budget, which if 5-10m is true, that makes it the very lower end of champ. It might be that our budget heavily leaned towards Goalkeeper and a forward as those are two positions we definitely needed a player.
Just don't get why it seems we have this view now of "looks like we didn't want to pay then rather than we couldn't" when most signs point towards us just having a low but competitive championship budget. We are going to miss out on players if that's the case, and that is part of football.
Think it’s more the point we think a certain player is worth x amount and won’t pay over the odds. If you take what DMac says as being true where are all the other Championship sides queuing up for Mothersille if you believe he’s that good and available at a fair price? The lack of other interest suggests Championship clubs thinks he’s either not that good or they can do better elsewhere. You do seem fixated in seeing the negative in everything.
We simply cannot be compared to about 18-20 Championship sides as they have better squads, and proven championship players with bigger budgets. They aren't in a rebuild state like we are. Their targets will be completely different.
Malik did have Championship offers, QPR heavily linked (assume Poku signing changed their plans), if you bother to look at most other championship sides, you will realise they already have better quality. That's not to say Malik can't make the step up, it's just how good a lot of the players in this league are.
How am I fixated in being negative on everything? Was I negative about Tanto or Kaminski? I wanted us to sign Bell, we have, I'll post about that in a positive manner.
Offering 200-300k more or whatever it is is not paying over the odds, these are really low end championship transfer fees. I am highlighting the concern that when we appear to be in a transfer shootout, we are losing.
What about us beating Derby to Sonny Carey, who are already a championship side? If we were still stuck on 0 signings I'd understand your concern a little more but we appear to be recruiting well, quite early into the window. Let's hope we keep seeing quality incomings through the door over the next couple of weeks, really hoping we bring in some quality in that RWB position
Ramsey will be playing that role and a new right sided centre back will come
That wally of a chairman at P'Boro spouting again.
Sounds like a weird lie to be fair. I don't think he would make that up for no reason.
That's now the 2nd player we have been quite publicly linked with that we didn't up our bid for.
I know people will say "sounds like the club aren't letting themselves be mugged off" etc but these players cost money. For the sake of 300-500k twice to lose out on a desired target, it just isn't worth it, unless you can find someone of better quality for cheaper.
It's ok to say we are on a tight budget, which if 5-10m is true, that makes it the very lower end of champ. It might be that our budget heavily leaned towards Goalkeeper and a forward as those are two positions we definitely needed a player.
Just don't get why it seems we have this view now of "looks like we didn't want to pay then rather than we couldn't" when most signs point towards us just having a low but competitive championship budget. We are going to miss out on players if that's the case, and that is part of football.
Think it’s more the point we think a certain player is worth x amount and won’t pay over the odds. If you take what DMac says as being true where are all the other Championship sides queuing up for Mothersille if you believe he’s that good and available at a fair price? The lack of other interest suggests Championship clubs thinks he’s either not that good or they can do better elsewhere. You do seem fixated in seeing the negative in everything.
We simply cannot be compared to about 18-20 Championship sides as they have better squads, and proven championship players with bigger budgets. They aren't in a rebuild state like we are. Their targets will be completely different.
Malik did have Championship offers, QPR heavily linked (assume Poku signing changed their plans), if you bother to look at most other championship sides, you will realise they already have better quality. That's not to say Malik can't make the step up, it's just how good a lot of the players in this league are.
How am I fixated in being negative on everything? Was I negative about Tanto or Kaminski? I wanted us to sign Bell, we have, I'll post about that in a positive manner.
Offering 200-300k more or whatever it is is not paying over the odds, these are really low end championship transfer fees. I am highlighting the concern that when we appear to be in a transfer shootout, we are losing.
What about us beating Derby to Sonny Carey, who are already a championship side? If we were still stuck on 0 signings I'd understand your concern a little more but we appear to be recruiting well, quite early into the window. Let's hope we keep seeing quality incomings through the door over the next couple of weeks, really hoping we bring in some quality in that RWB position
Ramsey will be playing that role and a new right sided centre back will come
Maybe, but you also said Gillesphey and Mannion would keep their places, which now looks a lot less certain.
That wally of a chairman at P'Boro spouting again.
Sounds like a weird lie to be fair. I don't think he would make that up for no reason.
That's now the 2nd player we have been quite publicly linked with that we didn't up our bid for.
I know people will say "sounds like the club aren't letting themselves be mugged off" etc but these players cost money. For the sake of 300-500k twice to lose out on a desired target, it just isn't worth it, unless you can find someone of better quality for cheaper.
It's ok to say we are on a tight budget, which if 5-10m is true, that makes it the very lower end of champ. It might be that our budget heavily leaned towards Goalkeeper and a forward as those are two positions we definitely needed a player.
Just don't get why it seems we have this view now of "looks like we didn't want to pay then rather than we couldn't" when most signs point towards us just having a low but competitive championship budget. We are going to miss out on players if that's the case, and that is part of football.
Think it’s more the point we think a certain player is worth x amount and won’t pay over the odds. If you take what DMac says as being true where are all the other Championship sides queuing up for Mothersille if you believe he’s that good and available at a fair price? The lack of other interest suggests Championship clubs thinks he’s either not that good or they can do better elsewhere. You do seem fixated in seeing the negative in everything.
We simply cannot be compared to about 18-20 Championship sides as they have better squads, and proven championship players with bigger budgets. They aren't in a rebuild state like we are. Their targets will be completely different.
Malik did have Championship offers, QPR heavily linked (assume Poku signing changed their plans), if you bother to look at most other championship sides, you will realise they already have better quality. That's not to say Malik can't make the step up, it's just how good a lot of the players in this league are.
How am I fixated in being negative on everything? Was I negative about Tanto or Kaminski? I wanted us to sign Bell, we have, I'll post about that in a positive manner.
Offering 200-300k more or whatever it is is not paying over the odds, these are really low end championship transfer fees. I am highlighting the concern that when we appear to be in a transfer shootout, we are losing.
The answer might be in your post here, I think we were probably in for both Tanto and MM and then decided Tanto was the better choice. Just as QPR did with Poku (yes Poku is better than both of them but the theory is the same)
I understand the logic, but Malik and Tanto are two very different players, whereas Malik and Poku aren't, very similar styles. I think we would have liked both as Rich said he wouldn't be surprised to see us wanting to sign another striker/winger which fits his profile. Tanto is a pure centre forward.
That wally of a chairman at P'Boro spouting again.
Sounds like a weird lie to be fair. I don't think he would make that up for no reason.
That's now the 2nd player we have been quite publicly linked with that we didn't up our bid for.
I know people will say "sounds like the club aren't letting themselves be mugged off" etc but these players cost money. For the sake of 300-500k twice to lose out on a desired target, it just isn't worth it, unless you can find someone of better quality for cheaper.
It's ok to say we are on a tight budget, which if 5-10m is true, that makes it the very lower end of champ. It might be that our budget heavily leaned towards Goalkeeper and a forward as those are two positions we definitely needed a player.
Just don't get why it seems we have this view now of "looks like we didn't want to pay then rather than we couldn't" when most signs point towards us just having a low but competitive championship budget. We are going to miss out on players if that's the case, and that is part of football.
That's the point though - if they're asking too much the money is better spent on someone else we think is as good but who isn't overpriced.
Or if we're going to spend that much, we'd expect to do better.
Setting a limit for what a player is worth and not going above it is sensible, otherwise you end up paying £4m for Will Grigg.
1.5-2 million for Galbraith though isn't too much money and neither is Mothersille for roughly 1 million. The only scenario in which you can say they are overpriced is if you aren't splashing the cash. Cause then you have to factor budget and where you are willing to invest that budget.
The Will Grigg transfer for 4 million is becoming a bit of a false dilemma. Of course not every player does well you pay cash for, there are loads of other examples where clubs 'overpay' and it works out successfully.
We are talking on missing out on desired targets for hundreds of thousands here, if the reports are true, not millions.
I genuinely don't really mind we are missing out on targets cause that is football, and it isn't my money to spend. I just don't see why we can't just look at it for what it is. It's a shame we are missing out, but clubs aren't trying to mug us off, they're trying to make themselves sustainable and the fees being quoted for these players are very reasonable transfer fees.
In your opinion.
Depends if Jones and Chappell think they can do better with that money.
Every club bar a few oil clubs have a budget and spend within it, walking away and not overpaying is sensible not a sign that you're not spending anything.
We're not in the realms of previous years of waiting for everyone else to do their business before picking up any old chaff on frees and loans (Church/Sordell, Terrell Thomas, Matt Penney, resigning Adam Matthews etc).
Jones and Chapple will undoubtedly know more targets and identify a better player than me.
I am talking about transfer value though, and markets. In this current market, that is a very fair fee for a player of Galbraiths quality, potential and future potential value.
That wally of a chairman at P'Boro spouting again.
Sounds like a weird lie to be fair. I don't think he would make that up for no reason.
That's now the 2nd player we have been quite publicly linked with that we didn't up our bid for.
I know people will say "sounds like the club aren't letting themselves be mugged off" etc but these players cost money. For the sake of 300-500k twice to lose out on a desired target, it just isn't worth it, unless you can find someone of better quality for cheaper.
It's ok to say we are on a tight budget, which if 5-10m is true, that makes it the very lower end of champ. It might be that our budget heavily leaned towards Goalkeeper and a forward as those are two positions we definitely needed a player.
Just don't get why it seems we have this view now of "looks like we didn't want to pay then rather than we couldn't" when most signs point towards us just having a low but competitive championship budget. We are going to miss out on players if that's the case, and that is part of football.
Think it’s more the point we think a certain player is worth x amount and won’t pay over the odds. If you take what DMac says as being true where are all the other Championship sides queuing up for Mothersille if you believe he’s that good and available at a fair price? The lack of other interest suggests Championship clubs thinks he’s either not that good or they can do better elsewhere. You do seem fixated in seeing the negative in everything.
We simply cannot be compared to about 18-20 Championship sides as they have better squads, and proven championship players with bigger budgets. They aren't in a rebuild state like we are. Their targets will be completely different.
Malik did have Championship offers, QPR heavily linked (assume Poku signing changed their plans), if you bother to look at most other championship sides, you will realise they already have better quality. That's not to say Malik can't make the step up, it's just how good a lot of the players in this league are.
How am I fixated in being negative on everything? Was I negative about Tanto or Kaminski? I wanted us to sign Bell, we have, I'll post about that in a positive manner.
Offering 200-300k more or whatever it is is not paying over the odds, these are really low end championship transfer fees. I am highlighting the concern that when we appear to be in a transfer shootout, we are losing.
That's not true though or at least not consistently. Kaminski had interest from other clubs, we did the out-bidding there. Its been reported that someone tried to hijack the Olaofe deal too but again we (seemingly) were the winners in that one.
So we've "lost" 2 (that we know of) and won 2. We don't know who if anyone was also interested in Carey or Bell but id be astonished if no-one else showed any interest in either.
This is literally just how transfers go - win some, lose some.
That wally of a chairman at P'Boro spouting again.
Sounds like a weird lie to be fair. I don't think he would make that up for no reason.
That's now the 2nd player we have been quite publicly linked with that we didn't up our bid for.
I know people will say "sounds like the club aren't letting themselves be mugged off" etc but these players cost money. For the sake of 300-500k twice to lose out on a desired target, it just isn't worth it, unless you can find someone of better quality for cheaper.
It's ok to say we are on a tight budget, which if 5-10m is true, that makes it the very lower end of champ. It might be that our budget heavily leaned towards Goalkeeper and a forward as those are two positions we definitely needed a player.
Just don't get why it seems we have this view now of "looks like we didn't want to pay then rather than we couldn't" when most signs point towards us just having a low but competitive championship budget. We are going to miss out on players if that's the case, and that is part of football.
Think it’s more the point we think a certain player is worth x amount and won’t pay over the odds. If you take what DMac says as being true where are all the other Championship sides queuing up for Mothersille if you believe he’s that good and available at a fair price? The lack of other interest suggests Championship clubs thinks he’s either not that good or they can do better elsewhere. You do seem fixated in seeing the negative in everything.
We simply cannot be compared to about 18-20 Championship sides as they have better squads, and proven championship players with bigger budgets. They aren't in a rebuild state like we are. Their targets will be completely different.
Malik did have Championship offers, QPR heavily linked (assume Poku signing changed their plans), if you bother to look at most other championship sides, you will realise they already have better quality. That's not to say Malik can't make the step up, it's just how good a lot of the players in this league are.
How am I fixated in being negative on everything? Was I negative about Tanto or Kaminski? I wanted us to sign Bell, we have, I'll post about that in a positive manner.
Offering 200-300k more or whatever it is is not paying over the odds, these are really low end championship transfer fees. I am highlighting the concern that when we appear to be in a transfer shootout, we are losing.
What about us beating Derby to Sonny Carey, who are already a championship side? If we were still stuck on 0 signings I'd understand your concern a little more but we appear to be recruiting well, quite early into the window. Let's hope we keep seeing quality incomings through the door over the next couple of weeks, really hoping we bring in some quality in that RWB position
Well, I am not sold on Carey. I think he could be a bit of a sleeper signing, but he has only really ever had one good stint. If we did beat Derby to him then fair enough, I just don't know how much they wanted him/needed him.
To be fair I am not all that concerned, I am expecting an extremely difficult season, and I sympathise that it isn't cheap to be a competitve championship side. Happy with what we have done so far.
Apologies for the rambles all. More just discussing, not having a moan.
That wally of a chairman at P'Boro spouting again.
Sounds like a weird lie to be fair. I don't think he would make that up for no reason.
That's now the 2nd player we have been quite publicly linked with that we didn't up our bid for.
I know people will say "sounds like the club aren't letting themselves be mugged off" etc but these players cost money. For the sake of 300-500k twice to lose out on a desired target, it just isn't worth it, unless you can find someone of better quality for cheaper.
It's ok to say we are on a tight budget, which if 5-10m is true, that makes it the very lower end of champ. It might be that our budget heavily leaned towards Goalkeeper and a forward as those are two positions we definitely needed a player.
Just don't get why it seems we have this view now of "looks like we didn't want to pay then rather than we couldn't" when most signs point towards us just having a low but competitive championship budget. We are going to miss out on players if that's the case, and that is part of football.
Think it’s more the point we think a certain player is worth x amount and won’t pay over the odds. If you take what DMac says as being true where are all the other Championship sides queuing up for Mothersille if you believe he’s that good and available at a fair price? The lack of other interest suggests Championship clubs thinks he’s either not that good or they can do better elsewhere. You do seem fixated in seeing the negative in everything.
We simply cannot be compared to about 18-20 Championship sides as they have better squads, and proven championship players with bigger budgets. They aren't in a rebuild state like we are. Their targets will be completely different.
Malik did have Championship offers, QPR heavily linked (assume Poku signing changed their plans), if you bother to look at most other championship sides, you will realise they already have better quality. That's not to say Malik can't make the step up, it's just how good a lot of the players in this league are.
How am I fixated in being negative on everything? Was I negative about Tanto or Kaminski? I wanted us to sign Bell, we have, I'll post about that in a positive manner.
Offering 200-300k more or whatever it is is not paying over the odds, these are really low end championship transfer fees. I am highlighting the concern that when we appear to be in a transfer shootout, we are losing.
The answer might be in your post here, I think we were probably in for both Tanto and MM and then decided Tanto was the better choice. Just as QPR did with Poku (yes Poku is better than both of them but the theory is the same)
I understand the logic, but Malik and Tanto are two very different players, whereas Malik and Poku aren't, very similar styles. I think we would have liked both as Rich said he wouldn't be surprised to see us wanting to sign another striker/winger which fits his profile. Tanto is a pure centre forward.
That wally of a chairman at P'Boro spouting again.
Sounds like a weird lie to be fair. I don't think he would make that up for no reason.
That's now the 2nd player we have been quite publicly linked with that we didn't up our bid for.
I know people will say "sounds like the club aren't letting themselves be mugged off" etc but these players cost money. For the sake of 300-500k twice to lose out on a desired target, it just isn't worth it, unless you can find someone of better quality for cheaper.
It's ok to say we are on a tight budget, which if 5-10m is true, that makes it the very lower end of champ. It might be that our budget heavily leaned towards Goalkeeper and a forward as those are two positions we definitely needed a player.
Just don't get why it seems we have this view now of "looks like we didn't want to pay then rather than we couldn't" when most signs point towards us just having a low but competitive championship budget. We are going to miss out on players if that's the case, and that is part of football.
That's the point though - if they're asking too much the money is better spent on someone else we think is as good but who isn't overpriced.
Or if we're going to spend that much, we'd expect to do better.
Setting a limit for what a player is worth and not going above it is sensible, otherwise you end up paying £4m for Will Grigg.
1.5-2 million for Galbraith though isn't too much money and neither is Mothersille for roughly 1 million. The only scenario in which you can say they are overpriced is if you aren't splashing the cash. Cause then you have to factor budget and where you are willing to invest that budget.
The Will Grigg transfer for 4 million is becoming a bit of a false dilemma. Of course not every player does well you pay cash for, there are loads of other examples where clubs 'overpay' and it works out successfully.
We are talking on missing out on desired targets for hundreds of thousands here, if the reports are true, not millions.
I genuinely don't really mind we are missing out on targets cause that is football, and it isn't my money to spend. I just don't see why we can't just look at it for what it is. It's a shame we are missing out, but clubs aren't trying to mug us off, they're trying to make themselves sustainable and the fees being quoted for these players are very reasonable transfer fees.
In your opinion.
Depends if Jones and Chappell think they can do better with that money.
Every club bar a few oil clubs have a budget and spend within it, walking away and not overpaying is sensible not a sign that you're not spending anything.
We're not in the realms of previous years of waiting for everyone else to do their business before picking up any old chaff on frees and loans (Church/Sordell, Terrell Thomas, Matt Penney, resigning Adam Matthews etc).
Jones and Chapple will undoubtedly know more targets and identify a better player than me.
I am talking about transfer value though, and markets. In this current market, that is a very fair fee for a player of Galbraiths quality, potential and future potential value.
Who said we weren't willing to pay for Galbraith? He just chose Swansea didn't he? We don't really know one way or the other (we do with Mothersille).
I won't clog the thread so will end it here - I can see your point but I also think if Jones and Chappell think a fee is too high for a player and walk away, I'll trust that.
I see not paying MacAnthony what he wants as a good thing to be honest. He always asks too much on transfers and missing out on a fee for RJJ - and very nearly for Poku - will have meant he’s no doubt pushed the asking price up. We’ve also likely done it to ourselves to a certain extent; if we were only willing to pay say £700k for him but they want £900k then we were likely waiting for him to drop the price as he always does but then in came Stockport with the £1.5m we just gave them burning a hole in their pockets. Mothersille always felt like a risk given what’s been said about his attitude so I wouldn’t have wanted us to overpay for him
That wally of a chairman at P'Boro spouting again.
Sounds like a weird lie to be fair. I don't think he would make that up for no reason.
That's now the 2nd player we have been quite publicly linked with that we didn't up our bid for.
I know people will say "sounds like the club aren't letting themselves be mugged off" etc but these players cost money. For the sake of 300-500k twice to lose out on a desired target, it just isn't worth it, unless you can find someone of better quality for cheaper.
It's ok to say we are on a tight budget, which if 5-10m is true, that makes it the very lower end of champ. It might be that our budget heavily leaned towards Goalkeeper and a forward as those are two positions we definitely needed a player.
Just don't get why it seems we have this view now of "looks like we didn't want to pay then rather than we couldn't" when most signs point towards us just having a low but competitive championship budget. We are going to miss out on players if that's the case, and that is part of football.
Think it’s more the point we think a certain player is worth x amount and won’t pay over the odds. If you take what DMac says as being true where are all the other Championship sides queuing up for Mothersille if you believe he’s that good and available at a fair price? The lack of other interest suggests Championship clubs thinks he’s either not that good or they can do better elsewhere. You do seem fixated in seeing the negative in everything.
We simply cannot be compared to about 18-20 Championship sides as they have better squads, and proven championship players with bigger budgets. They aren't in a rebuild state like we are. Their targets will be completely different.
Malik did have Championship offers, QPR heavily linked (assume Poku signing changed their plans), if you bother to look at most other championship sides, you will realise they already have better quality. That's not to say Malik can't make the step up, it's just how good a lot of the players in this league are.
How am I fixated in being negative on everything? Was I negative about Tanto or Kaminski? I wanted us to sign Bell, we have, I'll post about that in a positive manner.
Offering 200-300k more or whatever it is is not paying over the odds, these are really low end championship transfer fees. I am highlighting the concern that when we appear to be in a transfer shootout, we are losing.
That's not true though or at least not consistently. Kaminski had interest from other clubs, we did the out-bidding there. Its been reported that someone tried to hijack the Olaofe deal too but again we (seemingly) were the winners in that one.
So we've "lost" 2 (that we know of) and won 2. We don't know who if anyone was also interested in Carey or Bell but id be astonished if no-one else showed any interest in either.
This is literally just how transfers go - win some, lose some.
Kaminski we outmuscled the other club by double, they were offering a league 1 wage, we offered a championship wage.
I would be curious to know who were in for Tanto, as that didn't come from a journalist but a poster on here, correct me if I am wrong?
The last line is what I am trying to get at, so I agree with you mostly.
Think we can read too much into signings we’ve made and allegedly the teams we’ve beaten off to sign them and equally we’ve lost out too.
It’s not the olympics with clubs standing on the 1st 2nd 3rd places on the podium when a signing is announced.
Until then, so long as Jones is signing players he wants then that’s good enough for me. If we weren’t signing anyone then yes I’d be concerned what we were doing.
Has Jones ever played a flat back four with a double pivot?
TransferMarkt, suggests we did that a lot this season (lol!) - and that he did it a few times with Luton... He certainly wasn't afraid to try different things last season, unfortunately a lot of that was in November
We also have no idea who else we're in for. Burke and Kaminski rumours mainly came from a loose lipped Luton person at Glasto and a Turkish journo, Bell was only picked up on forums and not by any journos, Carey came out of nowhere. The club are doing well at limiting leaks from their end from the looks of it, we could have pulled out of deals for all manner of people because a better option became available. Remember, Tanto said his move was a month in the making, these things are complex
So far I'm seeing Doucher as a no nonsense CB (direct and to the point), Pavoren007 as a cultured winger (been to Glastonbury) and RedRobbo between the sticks (just because).
Alternatively, I need to go out more. Hard to say.
There's also the chance what MacAnthony said is untrue. He's got form for coming out with stretches of the truth.
Not many owners sell a player, then immediately make an interview where they focus on a club that didn't even buy the player.
Also, he and the journalist focus on the word 'couldn't' for matching the fee wanted. Whereas it could easily be that we 'wouldn't' match it, which is very different.
Just find something incredibly dislikeable about DMac. We'll have had a value on Mothersille that we were happy to pay and if that's not acceptable to Posh we just move on. Feels like because he's had a few gems he thinks he's some football oracle.
He lost all credibility & respect when he talked about meeting Southall to discuss transfers when he knew all along that we were under a transfer embargo. Needs calling out for that alone.
That wally of a chairman at P'Boro spouting again.
we managed to get to the number required for tanto which i believe was higher than mothersille so suggests we didn't rate him as highly
Which might be because no one was actually in for Tanto at that price other than one other mystery club someone said?
Two signings for fees, Kaminski where our competition was a club offering half of the wages and Tanto who we had a clear shot at (based on the rumour mills)
The two targets we missed (3 if you include Small) Galbraith & Mothersille. Both times we had genuine competition.
Fair play we have spent fees, but the consistent pattern is, when we are in a bidding war of sorts, we withdraw. Hopefully that theme changes as all your signings can't be hidden gems, good players are on multiple clubs radars and you have to meet clubs demands if you want them. It's not about 'not getting mugged off', players have prices.
Going off what we know I agree, but we don’t know what we don’t know, e.g. when this hasn’t been the case, the actual reasons for us withdrawing were etc.
We appear to have beaten other clubs to Kaminski, and there was talk of late interest in Tanto. Mothersille might have been 2nd choice to Tanto.
With Galbraith it’s going to happen sometimes, but the same will happen to Swansea. Most clubs don’t get every first choice target and beat all competition to signings.
After 5 years in L1 I get why some players would prefer a more established Championship team, but at least we’re giving it a good go on fees and wages. I think you’d agree it looks like our budget for fees could realistically be £5-10m, which is far bigger than most were expecting a few months ago assuming we got promoted. I got the impression the feeling was we’d continue looking for frees and paying small fees, whatever division we were in.
Agree with most of what you said here.
In regards to budget, I think 10 million combined is fine (wages, transfer fees, sign on fees etc) anything less and you are asking for trouble. I am happy we have spent some cash, but we just need to upgrade in more areas is all and it won't be cheap.
I just think the narrative being set is irking me a bit because clubs aren't trying to pull a fast one on us, they're asking for the market prices on young talented players.
We either pay and that's great, or we don't because it doesn't align with our budget and that's fine, other targets. Saying we mustn't have felt he was worth it etc makes us sound like that delusional Orient fan saying he would rather stay there than join here. Most of these players we are being linked with are better than what we have or would generally be squad upgrades.
You must've had a bang on the head if you think a 10m budget for transfer fees AND wages is fine for the championship. Some teams will probably do that budget on just 2-3 players.
Let's say we spend 4m on transfer fees, that leaves 6m for wages.
6m for wages is 115k a week. Divide that by a squad of 23 players is roughly 5k a week per player.
It would be nowhere near enough at this level.
You probably need a 10m budget for wages on top of the budget for transfer fees.
So far I'm seeing Doucher as a no nonsense CB (direct and to the point), Pavoren007 as a cultured winger (been to Glastonbury) and RedRobbo between the sticks (just because).
Alternatively, I need to go out more. Hard to say.
RonnieMoore playing up top. Low conversion rate, divides the fan base, but a long term servant of the club.
Not particularly excited about this one. It adds depth to the squad, which is useful, but I worry Bell might be on a downward trajectory based on last season’s performances. That said, a change of environment and reuniting with the manager who previously got the best out of him could help spark a revival.
Let’s just hope the Luton recruitment phase is behind us now.
Kudos RedRobo, bang on the money!
He only cover …. It’s a squad game we need back up players as well as first team ones
Yes, I acknowledged he was brought in as cover, what’s your point? Classic Mr Idiot.
Comments
Malik did have Championship offers, QPR heavily linked (assume Poku signing changed their plans), if you bother to look at most other championship sides, you will realise they already have better quality. That's not to say Malik can't make the step up, it's just how good a lot of the players in this league are.
How am I fixated in being negative on everything? Was I negative about Tanto or Kaminski? I wanted us to sign Bell, we have, I'll post about that in a positive manner.
Offering 200-300k more or whatever it is is not paying over the odds, these are really low end championship transfer fees. I am highlighting the concern that when we appear to be in a transfer shootout, we are losing.
Depends if Jones and Chappell think they can do better with that money.
Every club bar a few oil clubs have a budget and spend within it, walking away and not overpaying is sensible not a sign that you're not spending anything.
We're not in the realms of previous years of waiting for everyone else to do their business before picking up any old chaff on frees and loans (Church/Sordell, Terrell Thomas, Matt Penney, resigning Adam Matthews etc).
In regards to budget, I think 10 million combined is fine (wages, transfer fees, sign on fees etc) anything less and you are asking for trouble. I am happy we have spent some cash, but we just need to upgrade in more areas is all and it won't be cheap.
I just think the narrative being set is irking me a bit because clubs aren't trying to pull a fast one on us, they're asking for the market prices on young talented players.
We either pay and that's great, or we don't because it doesn't align with our budget and that's fine, other targets. Saying we mustn't have felt he was worth it etc makes us sound like that delusional Orient fan saying he would rather stay there than join here. Most of these players we are being linked with are better than what we have or would generally be squad upgrades.
Added to the ITK list.
Jones and Chapple will undoubtedly know more targets and identify a better player than me.
I am talking about transfer value though, and markets. In this current market, that is a very fair fee for a player of Galbraiths quality, potential and future potential value.
So we've "lost" 2 (that we know of) and won 2. We don't know who if anyone was also interested in Carey or Bell but id be astonished if no-one else showed any interest in either.
This is literally just how transfers go - win some, lose some.
To be fair I am not all that concerned, I am expecting an extremely difficult season, and I sympathise that it isn't cheap to be a competitve championship side. Happy with what we have done so far.
Apologies for the rambles all. More just discussing, not having a moan.
I won't clog the thread so will end it here - I can see your point but I also think if Jones and Chappell think a fee is too high for a player and walk away, I'll trust that.
I would be curious to know who were in for Tanto, as that didn't come from a journalist but a poster on here, correct me if I am wrong?
The last line is what I am trying to get at, so I agree with you mostly.
It’s not the olympics with clubs standing on the 1st 2nd 3rd places on the podium when a signing is announced.
Until then, so long as Jones is signing players he wants then that’s good enough for me. If we weren’t signing anyone then yes I’d be concerned what we were doing.
So far I'm seeing Doucher as a no nonsense CB (direct and to the point), Pavoren007 as a cultured winger (been to Glastonbury) and RedRobbo between the sticks (just because).
Alternatively, I need to go out more. Hard to say.
Let's say we spend 4m on transfer fees, that leaves 6m for wages.
6m for wages is 115k a week. Divide that by a squad of 23 players is roughly 5k a week per player.
It would be nowhere near enough at this level.
You probably need a 10m budget for wages on top of the budget for transfer fees.