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I tend to agree, but how?Weegie Addick said:There’s a big job to be done simply on awareness of when matches are on especially around the local community where travel midweek should be less of an issue. At present the club seem to be accepting that midweek crowds will be significantly lower. Yet we got over 20K for QPR on a Friday evening on the telly. I’d like to see us seize the opportunity to bring in new fans from the local area for midweek nights under the lights.0 -
Rothko said:Portsmouth will be a bigger gate, purely with kids on half term, makes a difference for a lot of parents of younger kids with no worries about school the next dayReckon Wrexham will sell- out?0
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You won’t get them in any real numbers unless you are ploughing them with free tickets (which can then turn out counterproductive to paying fans around them).Weegie Addick said:There’s a big job to be done simply on awareness of when matches are on especially around the local community where travel midweek should be less of an issue. At present the club seem to be accepting that midweek crowds will be significantly lower. Yet we got over 20K for QPR on a Friday evening on the telly. I’d like to see us seize the opportunity to bring in new fans from the local area for midweek nights under the lights.Hardly anyone local is paying £32 or £38 for a Tuesday / Wednesday game that is available on Sky. You even struggle to get the freebies to turn up. We had a block of about 100 freebies allocated in the rows in front of us and I reckon only about 20 were used (most left early).Weekends are different because of the London football tourist boost, the QPR game probably benefited from that being a Friday night. Was noticeable for QPR i think it followed the change practice this season of not making it database sales only once QPR had sold out 2-3 weeks before the game.We are slowly building our core fans and ST base again, but we’ll still get a poor turnout from them for midweek games for multiple reasons unless we are flying, and our boosted weekend visitor numbers also notably shrink our midweek crowds.3 -
Build up the database so club can email is one of the most effective. Local online and social media ads don’t need to cost much. Get a presence on notice boards or WhatsApp groups for blocks of flats - just need one or two current fans who live there to make it happen but give them a mechanism to do it eg QR code linking to the fixtures and incentive for people to register on the club database eg a prize draw. Old fashioned leafleting at local stations and shopping areas. Stronger partnership with RBG and local event promoters. Wraparound ads on the 177 bus route - added bonus that it can bring some of the Kenyan ex pats in from Peckham where there’s a bit of a concentration.Covered End said:
I tend to agree, but how?Weegie Addick said:There’s a big job to be done simply on awareness of when matches are on especially around the local community where travel midweek should be less of an issue. At present the club seem to be accepting that midweek crowds will be significantly lower. Yet we got over 20K for QPR on a Friday evening on the telly. I’d like to see us seize the opportunity to bring in new fans from the local area for midweek nights under the lights.
CAST have put most of these ideas to the club over the last year or so in general - not specifically linked to our midweek fixtures but that’s starting to be the obvious opportunity alongside similar awareness building for the women’s team and their fixtures.Club have done a lot of good work on building the crowds - helped of course by Championship football - but it does take perseverance to bring in first timers then turn occasional match goers into regulars.1 -
I've been a ST holder for 40+ years and would call myself a die hard....BUT if I didn't have a ST no way am I paying £30+ on a wet Wednesday night to watch us play Stoke when it's live on TV (and easily streamable for those that don't have Sky)
Especially with 3 home games in such a short space of time....QPR and Pompey are both far more attractive fixtures.4 -
The rearranged Stoke attendance would have been hit hard by the weather. Yet another rainy day in a long sequence of continuous rainy days. Transport issues were popping up on phones throughout the day, particularly for those of us south and southwest of the river and it wouldn’t surprise me if those in other regions were seeing similar alerts. Getting to the game and getting home was starting to look like it might have its problems for a lot of our fanbase. The game was also in the middle of a sequence of 3 home games, all night games, in less than 2 weeks and that traditionally tough on the finances month of January anecdotally seems to have extended into February for many. Let’s not forget also that for many the Stoke game was another match on our battle to avoid relegation and one they thought we would struggle to get a point from. Not everyone went to the Leicester game to see the start of our march to the playoffs and the transition in our team 😉. Overall, TBH, I’m surprised there were 14k there, I was expecting there to be a lot less.
The Pompey game will have a bigger crowd but how much bigger might depend on the same factors as above with weather playing a major part because it is contagiously depressing for most people and staying dry and watching the game at home is all too easy to do.
on the bright side, only 14k on the ground meant that at half time in the lower north I was able to walk straight up to the counter and get served; and after the game I was able to walk straight onto the platform at Charlton station and get a train a couple of minutes later. Every (rain) cloud has a silver lining as they say.
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A max ticket price of say £20 for midweek would maybe get a few more going.Weegie Addick said:There’s a big job to be done simply on awareness of when matches are on especially around the local community where travel midweek should be less of an issue. At present the club seem to be accepting that midweek crowds will be significantly lower. Yet we got over 20K for QPR on a Friday evening on the telly. I’d like to see us seize the opportunity to bring in new fans from the local area for midweek nights under the lights.5 -
We are big enough. I don't really care if Spurs, Arsenal etc have more fans - it's quality not quantity.
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there was never 14k there , the tooth fairy told meletthegoodtimesroll said:Overall, TBH, I’m surprised there were 14k there, I was expecting there to be a lot less.3 -
We were on the same level on the pitch for a few seasons, but the gulf in scale was and always will be enormous, irrespective of "poor decisions and bad ownership" in the short term. We could have made the best decisions and had amazing ownership and we would still have had a "ceiling" that pales into insignificance against them and the others in their world. When we get relegated, their is no guarantee that we rebound - Spurs would (as they and Man Utd. did in the 70's).Kap10 said:
It's not that long ago Spurs and Charlton were on the same level with us consistently taking points off them and finishing above them. Sadly poor decisions and bad ownership took us in different directions.Raith_C_Chattonell said:I recall that someone on here was recently told to ignore it when other clubs say, "We should be beating teams like Charlton'.
I must admit I feel affronted too. Maybe establishment sides like Tottenham Hotspur and Manchester United can get away with it, but not new money teams like Brighton and Bournemouth.
As to whether we can say it about other teams? Absolutely we can! In fact, I've hardly recovered from Paul Went going to Fulham in 1972. Why would he leave Charlton for a team like that?
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JustFloydRoad said:Rothko said:Portsmouth will be a bigger gate, purely with kids on half term, makes a difference for a lot of parents of younger kids with no worries about school the next dayReckon Wrexham will sell- out?
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Midweeks are usually rated at that - bronze level - though not true for Portsmouth due to the rearrangement and afraid I didn’t check what they did for Stoke which was also originally scheduled for a weekend. Price plays a part of course but more basically it’s awareness that the match is even happening for those beyond the committed fans.Baldybonce said:
A max ticket price of say £20 for midweek would maybe get a few more going.Weegie Addick said:There’s a big job to be done simply on awareness of when matches are on especially around the local community where travel midweek should be less of an issue. At present the club seem to be accepting that midweek crowds will be significantly lower. Yet we got over 20K for QPR on a Friday evening on the telly. I’d like to see us seize the opportunity to bring in new fans from the local area for midweek nights under the lights.0 -
I have always thought of us as a tier two side.0
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The local issue is that we have to win over those local residents who where not born in this country and have their already established football interests, often the team from there country of origin, second the team they watch on streams normally one of the so called big teams in the UK and Europe. Third many will be on low and medium incomes. To put this in context, in 2021 40.6% of Greenwich residents not born in the UK. Since then two point six million more people have come to this country an increase of 3% of the population.Weegie Addick said:There’s a big job to be done simply on awareness of when matches are on especially around the local community where travel midweek should be less of an issue. At present the club seem to be accepting that midweek crowds will be significantly lower. Yet we got over 20K for QPR on a Friday evening on the telly. I’d like to see us seize the opportunity to bring in new fans from the local area for midweek nights under the lights.
So we need to make better contact with the new groups and secondly price the tickets to be affordable for the these groups
and there by all of us. Which is probably the biggest problem for the owners to solve.0 -
There's a lot in this - I remember a couple of decades back there was talk of putting Charlton stuff in the welcome pack for new developments, but did this ever happen, and did it continue during the boom years in the Arsenal and on the Peninsula?Weegie Addick said:
Build up the database so club can email is one of the most effective. Local online and social media ads don’t need to cost much. Get a presence on notice boards or WhatsApp groups for blocks of flats - just need one or two current fans who live there to make it happen but give them a mechanism to do it eg QR code linking to the fixtures and incentive for people to register on the club database eg a prize draw. Old fashioned leafleting at local stations and shopping areas. Stronger partnership with RBG and local event promoters. Wraparound ads on the 177 bus route - added bonus that it can bring some of the Kenyan ex pats in from Peckham where there’s a bit of a concentration.Covered End said:
I tend to agree, but how?Weegie Addick said:There’s a big job to be done simply on awareness of when matches are on especially around the local community where travel midweek should be less of an issue. At present the club seem to be accepting that midweek crowds will be significantly lower. Yet we got over 20K for QPR on a Friday evening on the telly. I’d like to see us seize the opportunity to bring in new fans from the local area for midweek nights under the lights.
CAST have put most of these ideas to the club over the last year or so in general - not specifically linked to our midweek fixtures but that’s starting to be the obvious opportunity alongside similar awareness building for the women’s team and their fixtures.Club have done a lot of good work on building the crowds - helped of course by Championship football - but it does take perseverance to bring in first timers then turn occasional match goers into regulars.
I think we all underestimate the commitment involved in following a team, both in time and money. Huge growth won't come overnight. The people I sit with weren't born locally, but moved within walking distance and put down roots - arguably in the years when it was easier to put down roots before property prices went crazy, but they came out of curiosity in our leaner years and got the bug, so it can happen. But the aim should be to try to maintain awareness and to remind people that yes, this is a thing they can enjoy too. The women's team is a key part of that for families too.
As others have said, unless it's a massive match or the team are flying, midweeks will always be a much harder sell. I wouldn't sweat about people having other things to do than schlep to an unusual Wednesday night kick-off in atrocious weather against dull opposition, in the middle of winter, particularly if the journey is more difficult than a 20-minute walk: that's the ultimate marketing expert's challenge!3 -
CaptainRobbo said:JustFloydRoad said:Rothko said:Portsmouth will be a bigger gate, purely with kids on half term, makes a difference for a lot of parents of younger kids with no worries about school the next dayReckon Wrexham will sell- out?Also he has to come back:
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Midweek games have always been down compared to weekend ones (except for big ones like Play off Semis or promotion clinchers). Work next day, kids going to school !, cold !. I use the Valley Express coach now and I'm retired so no work to get up for, but living in Ramsgate I still don't get home till midnight. When I was using the train it was about 1 am.
When we were in the old 1st division (and playing at palace) we had about 4500 for a midweek home game against Oxford !0 -
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I have a season ticket but have not done midweek games for a few seasons, after working a full day, getting older and more tired, and even living very close to the valley in Bexley I just don’t have the energy to get home late (and I generally drive to home games) and be up and fresh for work the next day.2
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My other half is a spurs season ticket holder, I have been to one of their home games a few years ago and recently to Frankfurt and Milan (just for the trips with her when she had tickets for champions league games, I stayed in the hotel/local bars to watch) they have a much larger fanbase than us.SporadicAddick said:
We were on the same level on the pitch for a few seasons, but the gulf in scale was and always will be enormous, irrespective of "poor decisions and bad ownership" in the short term. We could have made the best decisions and had amazing ownership and we would still have had a "ceiling" that pales into insignificance against them and the others in their world. When we get relegated, there is no guarantee that we rebound - Spurs would (as they and Man Utd. did in the 70's).Kap10 said:
It's not that long ago Spurs and Charlton were on the same level with us consistently taking points off them and finishing above them. Sadly poor decisions and bad ownership took us in different directions.Raith_C_Chattonell said:I recall that someone on here was recently told to ignore it when other clubs say, "We should be beating teams like Charlton'.
I must admit I feel affronted too. Maybe establishment sides like Tottenham Hotspur and Manchester United can get away with it, but not new money teams like Brighton and Bournemouth.
As to whether we can say it about other teams? Absolutely we can! In fact, I've hardly recovered from Paul Went going to Fulham in 1972. Why would he leave Charlton for a team like that?0 -
DA9 said:
My other half is a spurs season ticket holder, I have been to one of their home games a few years ago and recently to Frankfurt and Milan (just for the trips with her when she had tickets for champions league games, I stayed in the hotel/local bars to watch) they have a much larger fanbase than us.SporadicAddick said:
We were on the same level on the pitch for a few seasons, but the gulf in scale was and always will be enormous, irrespective of "poor decisions and bad ownership" in the short term. We could have made the best decisions and had amazing ownership and we would still have had a "ceiling" that pales into insignificance against them and the others in their world. When we get relegated, there is no guarantee that we rebound - Spurs would (as they and Man Utd. did in the 70's).Kap10 said:
It's not that long ago Spurs and Charlton were on the same level with us consistently taking points off them and finishing above them. Sadly poor decisions and bad ownership took us in different directions.Raith_C_Chattonell said:I recall that someone on here was recently told to ignore it when other clubs say, "We should be beating teams like Charlton'.
I must admit I feel affronted too. Maybe establishment sides like Tottenham Hotspur and Manchester United can get away with it, but not new money teams like Brighton and Bournemouth.
As to whether we can say it about other teams? Absolutely we can! In fact, I've hardly recovered from Paul Went going to Fulham in 1972. Why would he leave Charlton for a team like that?
I've a friend that's a Spurs supporter, he's been on the waiting list for a season ticket for a couple of years. He goes to some games at the moment, but when he can get a ticket it costs him over £100 (and that is presumably at an OAPs reduction because he's over 65), I don't know where in the ground he gets his seat for his over £100.1 -
switch the cameras off and also tell sky etc to shove it - its the only way midweek crowds will recover - not just for us, its the same everywhere - most i know have a dodgy stick but a dodgy stick is no good if there's no stream in the first place0
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I thought Sky had cracked down on dodgy sticks, or do you just have to buy a new one with the latest "get round" every now and then? Do we know roughly how much we get from the Sky deal.
Yes more would come if it wasn't on Sky, but the extra wouldn't bring the crowd up to a Saturday average because of the midweek "thing". Work next day. kids have school next day, cant or difficult to get home on the train that late, and even if you can for many its gone midnight. Failing that you drive, difficult to park nearby now, and feeling tired when driving late. When I did it I had to stop in a layby halfway for a kip ! I use the Valley Express coach now, but still get home at midnight (it was about 1am on the train). And I can kip on the coach, when I did that on the late train I missed my stop a couple of times.
A lot of us have moved "out" since the days of Charlton being our local club, so have much further to travel now.0 -
Spurs have a policy that season ticket holders can only sell their tickets if they can’t make a game back via the club, who then resell it, the ST holder then gets that money credited back and knocked off of next years season ticket price. If they are found selling their seat on unofficially they can have their ST removed. My partner has a real hate for people who buy all their allocated spurs away tickets from their points system and then pass them onto mates and family who are just casual attendees.CombeMartin said:DA9 said:
My other half is a spurs season ticket holder, I have been to one of their home games a few years ago and recently to Frankfurt and Milan (just for the trips with her when she had tickets for champions league games, I stayed in the hotel/local bars to watch) they have a much larger fanbase than us.SporadicAddick said:
We were on the same level on the pitch for a few seasons, but the gulf in scale was and always will be enormous, irrespective of "poor decisions and bad ownership" in the short term. We could have made the best decisions and had amazing ownership and we would still have had a "ceiling" that pales into insignificance against them and the others in their world. When we get relegated, there is no guarantee that we rebound - Spurs would (as they and Man Utd. did in the 70's).Kap10 said:
It's not that long ago Spurs and Charlton were on the same level with us consistently taking points off them and finishing above them. Sadly poor decisions and bad ownership took us in different directions.Raith_C_Chattonell said:I recall that someone on here was recently told to ignore it when other clubs say, "We should be beating teams like Charlton'.
I must admit I feel affronted too. Maybe establishment sides like Tottenham Hotspur and Manchester United can get away with it, but not new money teams like Brighton and Bournemouth.
As to whether we can say it about other teams? Absolutely we can! In fact, I've hardly recovered from Paul Went going to Fulham in 1972. Why would he leave Charlton for a team like that?
I've a friend that's a Spurs supporter, he's been on the waiting list for a season ticket for a couple of years. He goes to some games at the moment, but when he can get a ticket it costs him over £100 (and that is presumably at an OAPs reduction because he's over 65), I don't know where in the ground he gets his seat for his over £100.0 -
I’ve been banging on about this for years. It’s all about supply and demand whether you’ve got a 70,000 capacity ground or a 27,000 capacity ground.You start by reducing the supply and you do that by selling a critical mass of season tickets. For Spurs that’s 50k season tickets. For Charlton we know from the PL years that it’s 20k.
Selling that many tickets for Spurs is easy because they’ve been selling out for years so fans have either got to keep buying a ST every year or fear missing out and never getting a chance to buy another one.We have to almost start from scratch so in the absence of promotion to the PL at the season it’s going have to be achieved by price.We missed the boat this season when we didn’t capitalise on the Wembley win and the 40k euphoric fans we could have pitched to. Instead we increased prices and then made it a secret by not releasing sales numbers which suggested they were not very good and there was no need to buy one if most of our games seemed like they were going to be available to watch on tv anyway.
Next years STs have got to be cheaper, certainly in the East and West.
Once you sell that 20k, that just leaves 7k to sell and with 3.3k automatically going to away fans that means there would only be 3.7k left to sell on a match by match basis to home fans. Combine that availability with most of them in areas where hospitality can be offered and you are looking at premium pricing, which would mean the remainder on sale could also be at the higher levels for matches we are seeing now; and if they set the lowest match day prices for home fans then that’s also where the away fan prices can be.
Could we sell 20k ? I believe we could easily do that once sales started pushing 15k/16k. Our away support basically shows that. Fans know we are likely to take good numbers to away matches even when the football has been dire and that in turn encourages others to go.3 -
Not certain Spurs has an OAP rate.CombeMartin said:DA9 said:
My other half is a spurs season ticket holder, I have been to one of their home games a few years ago and recently to Frankfurt and Milan (just for the trips with her when she had tickets for champions league games, I stayed in the hotel/local bars to watch) they have a much larger fanbase than us.SporadicAddick said:
We were on the same level on the pitch for a few seasons, but the gulf in scale was and always will be enormous, irrespective of "poor decisions and bad ownership" in the short term. We could have made the best decisions and had amazing ownership and we would still have had a "ceiling" that pales into insignificance against them and the others in their world. When we get relegated, there is no guarantee that we rebound - Spurs would (as they and Man Utd. did in the 70's).Kap10 said:
It's not that long ago Spurs and Charlton were on the same level with us consistently taking points off them and finishing above them. Sadly poor decisions and bad ownership took us in different directions.Raith_C_Chattonell said:I recall that someone on here was recently told to ignore it when other clubs say, "We should be beating teams like Charlton'.
I must admit I feel affronted too. Maybe establishment sides like Tottenham Hotspur and Manchester United can get away with it, but not new money teams like Brighton and Bournemouth.
As to whether we can say it about other teams? Absolutely we can! In fact, I've hardly recovered from Paul Went going to Fulham in 1972. Why would he leave Charlton for a team like that?
I've a friend that's a Spurs supporter, he's been on the waiting list for a season ticket for a couple of years. He goes to some games at the moment, but when he can get a ticket it costs him over £100 (and that is presumably at an OAPs reduction because he's over 65), I don't know where in the ground he gets his seat for his over £100.0 -
We will sell twenty thousand season tickets when in the Premiership, as we will be the cheapest London Prem ground so those people who are fans of Prem football will buy them. But be gone as soon as we are back in the Championship.letthegoodtimesroll said:I’ve been banging on about this for years. It’s all about supply and demand whether you’ve got a 70,000 capacity ground or a 27,000 capacity ground.You start by reducing the supply and you do that by selling a critical mass of season tickets. For Spurs that’s 50k season tickets. For Charlton we know from the PL years that it’s 20k.
Selling that many tickets for Spurs is easy because they’ve been selling out for years so fans have either got to keep buying a ST every year or fear missing out and never getting a chance to buy another one.We have to almost start from scratch so in the absence of promotion to the PL at the season it’s going have to be achieved by price.We missed the boat this season when we didn’t capitalise on the Wembley win and the 40k euphoric fans we could have pitched to. Instead we increased prices and then made it a secret by not releasing sales numbers which suggested they were not very good and there was no need to buy one if most of our games seemed like they were going to be available to watch on tv anyway.
Next years STs have got to be cheaper, certainly in the East and West.
Once you sell that 20k, that just leaves 7k to sell and with 3.3k automatically going to away fans that means there would only be 3.7k left to sell on a match by match basis to home fans. Combine that availability with most of them in areas where hospitality can be offered and you are looking at premium pricing, which would mean the remainder on sale could also be at the higher levels for matches we are seeing now; and if they set the lowest match day prices for home fans then that’s also where the away fan prices can be.
Could we sell 20k ? I believe we could easily do that once sales started pushing 15k/16k. Our away support basically shows that. Fans know we are likely to take good numbers to away matches even when the football has been dire and that in turn encourages others to go.1
