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EFL Playoffs 25/26 (Saints booted out of final and given 4 point deduction - pg34)
Comments
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I don’t believe the FA would have any jurisdiction over points penalties in the EFL, which is a distinct league. However they could impose club sanctions on an FA member.DamoNorthStand said:https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/articles/crmplprldl8o
Full investigation.
Massive points penalty surely incoming.1 -
The FA can add to the pain to the club, financially and sportingfenaddick said:
Crucially an FA investigation which means they can charge individuals. I don’t know if they can impose a sporting sanction on the club or notDamoNorthStand said:https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/articles/crmplprldl8o
Full investigation.
Massive points penalty surely incoming.1 -
If Southampton can dig up any evidence of pay a whistle blower to show that they themselves were spied on during the season, the ELF are in real trouble!1
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Anyone who mocks a disability is a grade 1 c*nt.cabbles said:Harwood Bellis 😂😂😂 deserves it the twat after mocking Ayling’s stammer7 -
So is the thinking that the players had no idea about the spying?ForeverAddickted said:Southampton could have learnt a lot from Leo Scienza on how to put out a proper statement.For those who cant access Instagram:Disappointment, anger, sadness … It’s difficult to find the right words for what we’re all feeling right now.What has happened over the last days is heartbreaking.. for the club, for every player in this dressing room, and above all for our supporters. A moment like this should never end the way it did.I feel sorry for every football fan, as well as the players and supporters of Hull and Boro, who were caught up in all of this chaos too.We gave everything for this dream. Day after day, sacrifice after sacrifice, always believing we could bring this club back to where it belongs. For me, the dream of playing in the Premier League was something I fought for with everything I had. That’s why this pain cuts so deep.The hardest part is knowing how much our fans deserved this moment. You stood behind us all season with incredible passion, loyalty and belief. Even in the toughest moments, you carried us forward.Thank you for staying with us through everything, you definitely deserved better1 -
stevexreeve said:If Southampton can dig up any evidence of pay a whistle blower to show that they themselves were spied on during the season, the ELF are in real trouble!
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I would think any spying would be confined to a minimum number of people. If the players knew it would inevitably leak out.Arsenetatters said:
So is the thinking that the players had no idea about the spying?ForeverAddickted said:Southampton could have learnt a lot from Leo Scienza on how to put out a proper statement.For those who cant access Instagram:Disappointment, anger, sadness … It’s difficult to find the right words for what we’re all feeling right now.What has happened over the last days is heartbreaking.. for the club, for every player in this dressing room, and above all for our supporters. A moment like this should never end the way it did.I feel sorry for every football fan, as well as the players and supporters of Hull and Boro, who were caught up in all of this chaos too.We gave everything for this dream. Day after day, sacrifice after sacrifice, always believing we could bring this club back to where it belongs. For me, the dream of playing in the Premier League was something I fought for with everything I had. That’s why this pain cuts so deep.The hardest part is knowing how much our fans deserved this moment. You stood behind us all season with incredible passion, loyalty and belief. Even in the toughest moments, you carried us forward.Thank you for staying with us through everything, you definitely deserved better
If more than 3 people know a secret it becomes common knowledge soon enough.3 -
Leroy Ambrose said:Bet they get reinstated
As each pixel has started to show the true picture of cheating and arrogance which Southampton undertook once Tonda Eckert went from under 21 boss to Interim manager its become comedy gold but also desperately sad for the purists.
Eckert soon got the job full time in early December after his winning start in November after the sacking of Will Still.
Schadenfreude is apt for Eckert who at 19 was an analyst with Germany at the Euro's in 2012 and in 2014 his job was to produce a dossier on opponents Argentina before the final. As Germany had thrashed Brazil 7-1 in the semi, I wonder what weaknesses he had spotted as the free spirit of Brazilian ball skills were totally crushed and negated by the powerful Germanic side in that 1st half when 5-0 up in 29 minutes.
Was Tonda Eckert at 21 emulating Will Salt or was the Security too tight at the World Cup ?
I have found it interesting to hear the words of Eckert before and after 'Spygate' as he said he didn't realize it was cheating; young Salt the intern knew it was cheating because that's why he did a runner.
Surreal Shenanigans.
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Might have misheard it on the NTTF podcast gave the impression that there may have been some awareness that certain tactical information had been obtained from the other team's training session. That this was shared in Southampton's team meetings. Probably not explicitly stated to the players the source of it though0
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I'm a bit sceptical that the players knew absolutely nothing about the spying. Imagine you go to your prep session with the coaching staff and they tell you that this team who have never played a certain way before are going to completely change shape and you're given a plan to counteract it. You're told exactly how their set piece routines will go and it's 100% right. Maybe the answer is just most footballers are quite thick and don't really think about these things but you're blasting your way up the table beating teams who you have an exact plan to counteract no matter whether they've tried that tactic before. Did they really think Eckert and his staff were that good at predicting what teams would do or was this practice that was known by enough of the coaching staff that they were joking about it over messages something that they at least had an idea of? I find it amazing to think that they knew absolutely nothing of it.8
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I think you're probably giving footballers a bit too much credit there. I very much doubt any of them are sufficiently aware of their opponents exact tactics in any given situation for it to register that the coaches are telliing them something different.Garrymanilow said:I'm a bit sceptical that the players knew absolutely nothing about the spying. Imagine you go to your prep session with the coaching staff and they tell you that this team who have never played a certain way before are going to completely change shape and you're given a plan to counteract it. You're told exactly how their set piece routines will go and it's 100% right. Maybe the answer is just most footballers are quite thick and don't really think about these things but you're blasting your way up the table beating teams who you have an exact plan to counteract no matter whether they've tried that tactic before. Did they really think Eckert and his staff were that good at predicting what teams would do or was this practice that was known by enough of the coaching staff that they were joking about it over messages something that they at least had an idea of? I find it amazing to think that they knew absolutely nothing of it.3 -
As far as i'm aware the FA investigation is going to be mainly focused on the individuals involved, as the EFL only have the power to charge/punish clubs.
It's worth noting that when Canada were caught spying at the Olympics, three of their staff were banned by FIFA for one year.
If i'm the Southampton owner i'd probably be getting ahead of what's likely to come and sacking the staff involved asap this week.0 -
If the spying was ineffective, why do it?Chris_from_Sidcup said:
I agree with this. I'm sure the spying helped with some things or they wouldn't have done it, but there's no way they only did well because of it.SDAddick said:
I don't think you can put that much down to watching the oppositions' training sessions. Especially if it only happened three times (IF it only happened three times). I believe Southampton had the best record in the league from the time he took over. I highly, highly doubt that's all down to spying on the opposition. Southampton have good footballers who were playing really poorly until he took over, and played really well after. I just can't imagine that's down to cheating. I think he got a good side playing very well, and I suspect the benefits from watching opposition training sessions were marginal.EugenesAxe said:
Does he appear promising because he’s a cheat?SDAddick said:
Yeah as I said earlier there's no way he can stay. He's almost certain to face a ban, and rightly so.bobmunro said:Gravesend_Addick said:Good.
I think the Southampton manager will go within the next few days now
I would imagine he has gone already.
He's a promising young manager, I suspect he'll pop up somewhere on the continent. But as I've said before as well, it's such a huge risk for such a finite reward.
It's why I keep saying it's such a finite reward for such a major risk.
Let's not forget that pre-season they were title favourites behind Ipswich, they do have a good squad and were only in a mess because Will Still was pretty hopeless.
They proved how good they were in the FA Cup, beating Fulham and Arsenal and only losing late on to Man City. I'm pretty sure that if any Championship side spied on Arsenal's training sessions all week and even got their team sheet days in advance, they'd probably still lose.
Eckert was in charge for 40 games and they failed to win 15 of them, so it's not as if the spying meant they won every week.2 -
Might be cheaper to sack them once they’re suspended thoughChris_from_Sidcup said:As far as i'm aware the FA investigation is going to be mainly focused on the individuals involved, as the EFL only have the power to charge/punish clubs.
It's worth noting that when Canada were caught spying at the Olympics, three of their staff were banned by FIFA for one year.
If i'm the Southampton owner i'd probably be getting ahead of what's likely to come and sacking the staff involved asap this week.1 -
He'll find his whey!eastterrace6168 said:IdleHans said:
He must be really cheesed offIsawsummersplay said:I feel sorry for James Bree.
...😉0 -
I mean the very obvious way around that is to just... not do it. Don't say "we are doing this to counter this one specific tactic" and definitely don't say "this is how their set pieces will go so we do this." If you have to say anything say that you know they like zonal marking or we've identified x or y player as their main threat or something suitably vague that you could have worked out from footage or live viewing of previous games.Garrymanilow said:I'm a bit sceptical that the players knew absolutely nothing about the spying. Imagine you go to your prep session with the coaching staff and they tell you that this team who have never played a certain way before are going to completely change shape and you're given a plan to counteract it. You're told exactly how their set piece routines will go and it's 100% right. Maybe the answer is just most footballers are quite thick and don't really think about these things but you're blasting your way up the table beating teams who you have an exact plan to counteract no matter whether they've tried that tactic before. Did they really think Eckert and his staff were that good at predicting what teams would do or was this practice that was known by enough of the coaching staff that they were joking about it over messages something that they at least had an idea of? I find it amazing to think that they knew absolutely nothing of it.
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I’d guess the issue for those involved is, if the FA considers they are guilty they will take action based upon those findings, which presumably means that if something else were to subsequently come to light after that they could then re-investigate and take further action. Making sure everything is disclosed from the start might have a better long term outcome for them. Obviously if that means there were other games for instance not already confessed to then the EFL would probably want to revisit the 4 points penalty already imposed. Pandora’s box may have well and truly been opened.1
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Think you are right. And especially so if Eckert really has denied knowing it was not allowed in the English league.jonno said:For those who question the benefit of spying... listen to the question and response from James Bree in this interview (from around 1min 20 seconds) - I wonder if this is a clue? James Bree: Southampton defender on return to Tonda Eckert's side - BBC Sport
(And not a single mention of Charlton in there throughout, as per)0 -
stevexreeve said:Given the seriousness that ELF have taken the spying, surely they should conduct a full investigation into the matter.
My guess is that within a few hours they would uncover emails showing
spying went on at at least 20 games.
So a 40 points deduction is appropriate.
That would throw throw the club into league one and administration!
Goodbye and good riddance.
About time he took something seriously!! 😉1 -
From Saints to Sinners...
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...and good riddance...0 -
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Who said it was ineffective?gringo said:
If the spying was ineffective, why do it?Chris_from_Sidcup said:
I agree with this. I'm sure the spying helped with some things or they wouldn't have done it, but there's no way they only did well because of it.SDAddick said:
I don't think you can put that much down to watching the oppositions' training sessions. Especially if it only happened three times (IF it only happened three times). I believe Southampton had the best record in the league from the time he took over. I highly, highly doubt that's all down to spying on the opposition. Southampton have good footballers who were playing really poorly until he took over, and played really well after. I just can't imagine that's down to cheating. I think he got a good side playing very well, and I suspect the benefits from watching opposition training sessions were marginal.EugenesAxe said:
Does he appear promising because he’s a cheat?SDAddick said:
Yeah as I said earlier there's no way he can stay. He's almost certain to face a ban, and rightly so.bobmunro said:Gravesend_Addick said:Good.
I think the Southampton manager will go within the next few days now
I would imagine he has gone already.
He's a promising young manager, I suspect he'll pop up somewhere on the continent. But as I've said before as well, it's such a huge risk for such a finite reward.
It's why I keep saying it's such a finite reward for such a major risk.
Let's not forget that pre-season they were title favourites behind Ipswich, they do have a good squad and were only in a mess because Will Still was pretty hopeless.
They proved how good they were in the FA Cup, beating Fulham and Arsenal and only losing late on to Man City. I'm pretty sure that if any Championship side spied on Arsenal's training sessions all week and even got their team sheet days in advance, they'd probably still lose.
Eckert was in charge for 40 games and they failed to win 15 of them, so it's not as if the spying meant they won every week.
I literally said "I'm sure the spying helped with some things or they wouldn't have done it"0 -
As much as it will benefit us , giving Southampton an increased points deduction after the punishment already received is just wrong . What have the fans done to deserve that ? Punish the individual culprits by all means .5
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I agree, but what does "internet lad" mean!?jose said:I wonder what will become of that poor internet lad who did the spying, presumably under instruction.
He will be tainted by this backstory for life. The Southampton players might consider having a whip round and giving the young man a few million quid to re start his life.0 -
Why is it wrong? If they’re proved to have attempted to gain a sporting advantage over other teams in the league why shouldn’t those teams benefit from it next season?Bedsaddick said:As much as it will benefit us , giving Southampton an increased points deduction after the punishment already received is just wrong . What have the fans done to deserve that ? Punish the individual culprits by all means .1 -
TBF, they probably wouldn’t need to spy from behind a tree at Sparrows Lane when they would have had a man actually on the training pitch. Or is that not allowed either in the 72 hour period before a game ?swords_alive said:
Think you are right. And especially so if Eckert really has denied knowing it was not allowed in the English league.jonno said:For those who question the benefit of spying... listen to the question and response from James Bree in this interview (from around 1min 20 seconds) - I wonder if this is a clue? James Bree: Southampton defender on return to Tonda Eckert's side - BBC Sport
(And not a single mention of Charlton in there throughout, as per)0 -
Individual culprits representing the club. It’s a club issue and the club should be punishedBedsaddick said:As much as it will benefit us , giving Southampton an increased points deduction after the punishment already received is just wrong . What have the fans done to deserve that ? Punish the individual culprits by all means .2 -
This has always intrigued me. Do you say to Bree that he can’t be at the training ground for three days before the game? Does his manager ring him for insider info? Are there rules against that? Where do the loan players loyalties lie? You’d like to think to the club for whom he’s playing at the time but the club loaning him may have him on a long term deal and still paying some of his wages. I’ve always wondered how this works in this situation.letthegoodtimesroll said:
TBF, they probably wouldn’t need to spy from behind a tree at Sparrows Lane when they would have had a man actually on the training pitch. Or is that not allowed either in the 72 hour period before a game ?swords_alive said:
Think you are right. And especially so if Eckert really has denied knowing it was not allowed in the English league.jonno said:For those who question the benefit of spying... listen to the question and response from James Bree in this interview (from around 1min 20 seconds) - I wonder if this is a clue? James Bree: Southampton defender on return to Tonda Eckert's side - BBC Sport
(And not a single mention of Charlton in there throughout, as per)0 -
Where would you base yourself to spy on Charlton anyway? In the UoG campus? Up on Avery Hill Park? In Footscray playing fields?0
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they should be punished for doing the "binoculars eyes" at other fans alone!Todds_right_hook said:
Individual culprits representing the club. It’s a club issue and the club should be punishedBedsaddick said:As much as it will benefit us , giving Southampton an increased points deduction after the punishment already received is just wrong . What have the fans done to deserve that ? Punish the individual culprits by all means .0
