AITA - extension and neighbour situation.

HastingsRed

swords_alive said:

No accounting for some people. Is it possible he's got a bit of dementia creeping in? Is there a family member,  e.g. son or daughter you can talk to or another neighbour you might be able to mediate through?

Was thinking the same re dementia.

cantersaddick

Todds_right_hook said:

Planning consent/permitted development = lawful
party wall agreement = lawful

Fuck him!!!!

I have read your post in detail but only skimmed the responses so apologies if already covered.

At the application stage, he was entitled to raise concerned to the planners but if it’s lawful, a committee would likely have been favourable towards you. One neighbour complaining would unlikely even result in the application going to committee. 

Out of interest, a standard 3m extension?

party wall agreement - not cutting into his wall but served a foundation notice?

Yes to both. standard 3m, foundations slightly going under his property.

Redskin

I wouldn't concern yourself with this any more.
In a couple of months he will have unconsciously come to terms with the new build, and a month later forgotten - nothing to do with dementia - what the original extension even looked like.
Despite his fighting it, it will slowly dawn on him that he has been wholly unreasonable and made a fool of himself into the bargain. A proud and obdurate man, he still cannot bring himself to apologise to you as he peeks through a gap in the 12 foot high wattle fence as the gay young things and the neighbours who once were his friends quaff fruit laden Pimms  and nibble on canapés.
He dies a month later in trouser soiled exile...

* I know, too much, but the first paragraph is meant. He will - eventually - come to terms with the change and hopefully you can rekindle the cordial relationship you all once enjoyed.
Good luck with it.

Chris_from_Sidcup

"I'm pretty close to saying "I understand you dont like it but we havent done anything wrong, you had many opportunities to raise it and didn't".

I think that's exactly what you should say in addition to telling him you don't appreciate him bad mouthing you to other neighbours.

I wouldn't bother giving him wine and a hamper at Christmas either, this kind of implies you're trying to apologise for something when you've done nothing wrong. 

Arsenetatters

I expect he’ll regret going off in a big huff once he gets used to it and he might be too proud to say so. It also sounds like you enjoyed looking out for him and had a good relationship. 

You’re ‘keeping the door open’ for him to change his mind which I think he will. 

It sounds like getting on with the neighbours and looking out for each other is important to you so I’d carry on as if nothing’s happened for a little longer. 

If you get on with any of the other neighbours that have been there as long as he has you could have a word with them too and say how you feel. He might have done this before. 

I’d go with the Christmas hamper idea and invite him  round for a cuppa and a mince pie. If he doesn’t accept the hamper and doesn’t come round then it’s sad but it’s his choice. At least you’ve done your best. 

Kindest is always the best way IMHO. If it’s not returned don’t let it make you bitter. Stay kind. 

cantersaddick

Enjoyed the last two posts being the polar opposite advice but both very convincing! Thanks guys! Incredibly helpful! 

Leroy Ambrose

ForeverAddickted said:

Shame this has happened, especially if you've previously been on such good terms with him.

Reminds me of our old neighbours next door - Was always a pleasure speaking to them, never had an issues, spoke to them about the decking that we were planning to put up in the Garden, got their approval to try and ensure that everything went smoothly.. the moment the decking starting going up they started to become a nuisance over it all claiming it was too high etc. and sadly got to the point where we just ignored each other.

Thankfully they ended up moving so don't have to deal with it any more, but its almost like a lot of neighbours can be easy to work with, when you don't need to work with them... the moment anything changes its like a lightbulb, maybe its a bit of jealousy at the work you're having done to improve your home... I dont know... Hope you get it all resolved easily Canters!!

Sounds very much like my neighbour. Elderly woman - she was lovely when I first moved in, invited me round for a cuppa, lent me a bag of sugar etc. Honestly - you take one drunken shit on someone's front garden though and you see a totally different side to them.

DaveMehmet

Leroy Ambrose said:

ForeverAddickted said:

Shame this has happened, especially if you've previously been on such good terms with him.

Reminds me of our old neighbours next door - Was always a pleasure speaking to them, never had an issues, spoke to them about the decking that we were planning to put up in the Garden, got their approval to try and ensure that everything went smoothly.. the moment the decking starting going up they started to become a nuisance over it all claiming it was too high etc. and sadly got to the point where we just ignored each other.

Thankfully they ended up moving so don't have to deal with it any more, but its almost like a lot of neighbours can be easy to work with, when you don't need to work with them... the moment anything changes its like a lightbulb, maybe its a bit of jealousy at the work you're having done to improve your home... I dont know... Hope you get it all resolved easily Canters!!

Sounds very much like my neighbour. Elderly woman - she was lovely when I first moved in, invited me round for a cuppa, lent me a bag of sugar etc. Honestly - you take one drunken shit on someone's front garden though and you see a totally different side to them.

Serves her right for shitting on your lawn 

Pelling1993

cantersaddick said:

Enjoyed the last two posts being the polar opposite advice but both very convincing! Thanks guys! Incredibly helpful! 

Punch him, then kiss him seems to be play here imo 

cafcfan

This is all a bit mumsnet isn't it?

DaveMehmet

cafcfan said:

This is all a bit mumsnet isn't it?

You ok hun? Xx

letthegoodtimesroll

gringo said:

Is it too late to bury him under the extension?🤔

Old guy

lived in the neighbouring house since before you moved in

lives alone

has concerns about you digging up your patio and garden and putting in deep foundations for an extension that goes out further than he first thought before he saw the plans when he originally was OK with it 

Hmmm…for what possible reason would he change his mind…

😁

Elthamaddick

letthegoodtimesroll said:

gringo said:

Is it too late to bury him under the extension?🤔

Old guy

lived in the neighbouring house since before you moved in

lives alone

has concerns about you digging up your patio and garden and putting in deep foundations for an extension that goes out further than he first thought before he saw the plans when he originally was OK with it 

Hmmm…for what possible reason would he change his mind…

it might go out further than he 'realised' but doesn't go out further than the plans though....plus he was clearly given multiple chances to review/discuss

DaveMehmet

Like a lot of people, my first reaction would be fuck him, you’ve done nothing wrong or illegal.

However, you’ve got to live next door to him and I’d hate to be at loggerheads with a neighbour.

Maybe don’t go out of your way to help him but obviously do so in emergencies or if he’s clearly struggling.

Hopefully he’ll begin to realise he needs you more than you need him. 

cantersaddick

letthegoodtimesroll said:

gringo said:

Is it too late to bury him under the extension?🤔

Old guy

lived in the neighbouring house since before you moved in

lives alone

has concerns about you digging up your patio and garden and putting in deep foundations for an extension that goes out further than he first thought before he saw the plans when he originally was OK with it 

Hmmm…for what possible reason would he change his mind…

😁

Well the point is rather that he didn't have any concerns and repeatedly said he didn't have any concerns. Until after the structure was built. Then he suddenly had issues. As soon as nothing could be done to address them.

LoOkOuT

You’ve been wooshed canters mate 💀🪏

Fanny Fanackapan

letthegoodtimesroll said:

gringo said:

Is it too late to bury him under the extension?🤔

Old guy

lived in the neighbouring house since before you moved in

lives alone

has concerns about you digging up your patio and garden and putting in deep foundations for an extension that goes out further than he first thought before he saw the plans when he originally was OK with it 

Hmmm…for what possible reason would he change his mind…

😁

Perhaps he was a big " Brookside" fan....

CaptainRobbo

iainment said:

Neighbours! I often think the best are the quiet ones who keep themselves to themselves.
Hopefully he’ll transition to that.

cantersaddick

Had some more rather unpleasant messages over the weekend. At least I've worked out a little more on what his issues are:

- his garden level is about 20cm lower than ours which does make it look taller from his side. This is absolutely valid and I completely understand this. But I don't see how we were expected to know this without it being raised at any point in the planning process. If he had raised it we would absolutely have found a way to compromise on it. 
- he is convinced in his head it is 60cm taller than it actually is. Its complete rubbish and if it was that tall we would be outside of our planning consent. 
- he is also convinced that a pitched roof would be a metre lower than the flat roof at the far point. This is also complete rubbish we have had the calculations done after he raised this and it would be 20cm lower at the furthest point. This is exactly the difference between ours and our neighbours the other side who have done a pitched roof. If it was a metre lower then tall people would be banging their heads on the ceiling inside.
- he believes it was our responsibility to explain it to him and that we didn't do a good enough job explaining it which is why it's all our fault. Which is also rubbish. Us offering to go through it with him was us going over and above. We could have just let him recieve the notification in the post and say nothing. We tried to make sure he understood everything but it was absolutely not our responsibility. 

He didn't want to hear responses and just wanted to call us bad people. It's a shame but it is what it is at this point. He doesn't want anything to do with us. I left it with "happy to respect your wishes going forwards but if ever you need anything we are here and happy to help". 

DaveMehmet

I retract my earlier post…. Fuck him 

valleynick66

It’s as before. The reality is different to seeing a plan. 

Only time / familiarity will resolve. 

Just need to be patient and not over react. 

I’d say still send a Christmas Card etc and be the ‘bigger’ person. 

At least you can now appreciate why the structure appears bigger to him. It doesn’t matter that you are within your rights / he has no grounds it’s simply his perception for now is you’ve built something he didn’t fully envisage. 

CaptainRobbo

cantersaddick said:

Had some more rather unpleasant messages over the weekend. At least I've worked out a little more on what his issues are:

- his garden level is about 20cm lower than ours which does make it look taller from his side. This is absolutely valid and I completely understand this. But I don't see how we were expected to know this without it being raised at any point in the planning process. If he had raised it we would absolutely have found a way to compromise on it. 
- he is convinced in his head it is 60cm taller than it actually is. Its complete rubbish and if it was that tall we would be outside of our planning consent. 
- he is also convinced that a pitched roof would be a metre lower than the flat roof at the far point. This is also complete rubbish we have had the calculations done after he raised this and it would be 20cm lower at the furthest point. This is exactly the difference between ours and our neighbours the other side who have done a pitched roof. If it was a metre lower then tall people would be banging their heads on the ceiling inside.
- he believes it was our responsibility to explain it to him and that we didn't do a good enough job explaining it which is why it's all our fault. Which is also rubbish. Us offering to go through it with him was us going over and above. We could have just let him recieve the notification in the post and say nothing. We tried to make sure he understood everything but it was absolutely not our responsibility. 

He didn't want to hear responses and just wanted to call us bad people. It's a shame but it is what it is at this point. He doesn't want anything to do with us. I left it with "happy to respect your wishes going forwards but if ever you need anything we are here and happy to help". 

Looking on the bright side, doesn't look like you have to go to Fortnum & Mason now for his hamper. 👍

Beckboy

Tell him to fucking move then ,o and bill him for the use of the Skip

aliwibble

cafcfan said:

This is all a bit mumsnet isn't it?

Nah, AITA is Reddit, Mumsnet is AIBU

Todds_right_hook

It’s lawful and as the planning drawings. Fuck him, you haven’t been sneaky, he hasn’t interpreted the drawings correctly. 

At the planning stage, did the architect show a pitched roof as an option? If so, show the neighbour this as it will show that the flat roof is lower.

Leroy Ambrose

cantersaddick said:

Had some more rather unpleasant messages over the weekend. At least I've worked out a little more on what his issues are:

- his garden level is about 20cm lower than ours which does make it look taller from his side. This is absolutely valid and I completely understand this. But I don't see how we were expected to know this without it being raised at any point in the planning process. If he had raised it we would absolutely have found a way to compromise on it. 
- he is convinced in his head it is 60cm taller than it actually is. Its complete rubbish and if it was that tall we would be outside of our planning consent. 
- he is also convinced that a pitched roof would be a metre lower than the flat roof at the far point. This is also complete rubbish we have had the calculations done after he raised this and it would be 20cm lower at the furthest point. This is exactly the difference between ours and our neighbours the other side who have done a pitched roof. If it was a metre lower then tall people would be banging their heads on the ceiling inside.
- he believes it was our responsibility to explain it to him and that we didn't do a good enough job explaining it which is why it's all our fault. Which is also rubbish. Us offering to go through it with him was us going over and above. We could have just let him recieve the notification in the post and say nothing. We tried to make sure he understood everything but it was absolutely not our responsibility. 

He didn't want to hear responses and just wanted to call us bad people. It's a shame but it is what it is at this point. He doesn't want anything to do with us. I left it with "happy to respect your wishes going forwards but if ever you need anything we are here and happy to help". 

You're missing a trick here. Just shit on his lawn. 

Arsenetatters

Hmmmm

If he's not listening to explanations then you could write them all out for him to show him you've been more than reasonable. Even if he never reads them he's had them anyway. 

I was all for the hamper before this latest outburst but I wouldn't bother now as he will probably see is as a bribe as he's so convinced he's in the right. I'd go for the xmas card and leave it up to him, you've gone over and above. Stick to being kind as you have been doing but if he gets abusive I think I might 'set a boundary' and say you're not accepting any more and will block him if he persists.

IdleHans

Treat yourself to a pair of enormously powerful speakers

iainment

I think the Xmas card, hamper etc would be seen as condescending. Leave them out.

fenlandaddick

Unfortunately most neighbours are not friends. 

Expect them to be w⚓️s when anything affects their life, or they perceive it to.

If you dont want the hassle, never buy a semi or terrace with any party walls, and live as far away from people as possible.

Even if the current neighbour is nice, the next one is likely to be a complete tosser.

I've had a handful that have been worth bothering with ,  and even then a hello and Xmas card, keep an eye out when they go awsy is as far as I go.

As for the current tosspot living next to you, don't bother with any more presents or favours.

Strictly professional, treat as the enemy, and don't do anything formal or start a legal process.

I'd suggest getting some cameras for the back and front to monitor your residence making sure you only cover your own land and make them discreet.

If it gets worse, don't do anything formal just sell up if it annoys you that much.