I have been mulling things over in the last few days. What worries me is that for entirely understandable reasons there seems to a great deal of disharmony within this forum. Some of this has resulted in posts accusing people within the club of not caring about where we are or how we feel.
In recent days we have had acrimonious posts about the O/S, insults are flying around, mainly directed at finding somebody to blame for our collective misery.
Before we reach out and hurl more insults at whoever we blame for this, lets ask ourselves the question: did any person responsible for the running of the club, director or manager deliberately decide to get us bottom of the second tier of football?
Then lets ask ourselves another question: Is our league position in any way the fault of the clubs administrative staff?
When we are about to have a pop at a fellow lifer who has a different take on what has gone wrong, lets ask ourselves the question: is this person in any way responsible for the plight the club is now in, or do they just hold a different opinion? If they do hold a different opinion, lets ask ourselves the question: is holding that opinion going to make things better, worse or have no effect on what happens this season?
I am just a bit concerned that we are turning against one another in our frustration and anger. There may be time in the future where we have to fight again for the club we love, like some did in the 1980's and 90's. I am not sure that time is now, but if it comes, the more united we are the better.
The Directors of the club have on a number of occasions stood at a cross roads, without the detailed map of hindsight and made some good faith decisions regarding the future of the club. Sadly they made some mistakes. Who is not to say that any of us, sitting where they sat, with the brief they received, would not have made the same decisions? I have sat on Boards where really tough decisions have been made. Did we always make the right ones? No, but I can say that we took the decisions in good faith, based on advice and without the benefit of hindsight. I think that is also the case here.
Personally I feel that they made a number of mistakes starting with Dowie and have made another mistake in Parky’s appointment especially given his temporary period. It is the bizarre decisions of our last two managers that I especially take issue with and the failure to play two strikers when none of those who have played regularly have made any impact. However I do not believe that any of our managers have deliberately tried to wreck the clubs chances; they've just made poor decisions at the end of the day.
Everybody is hurting, directors, managers, players, staff and fans so lets not turn against one another. If we have criticisms, try to make them measured and not laced with personal abuse or scatter-gun insults.
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ONLY JOKING !!!!!!
I hope everyone digests it and considers. Hopefully we can all move forward more harmoniously
after the Sheff Utd game when Pardew had to go, most posters on here were saying he same thing; bring in someone new NOW. A new broom and all that. No faffing around with caretakers as we had done that previously wih Les Reed and it didn't work.We all said that Parky woud be tarred with the same brush as Pardew and seeing as he had been his no 2 he should go too.
This wasn't hindsight. We were saying this the same evening as Pardew was getting the boot. We could all ee it, sowhycoudn't the board. I don't believe that we are all cleverer than them, I believe that he answer is all down to money - not wantin to pay off Parky and as Murray said he other week, use that money for transfers instead. Ashort sighted approach that is going to cost us more, much more, in the long run.
We hate saying it, but (to the board or directors)....................WE TOLD YOU SO
I'm not being an apologist for the Board, I believe they have made a mistake with Parky. However they are not fools either and there would no doubt have been a robust discussion about whether to go for him or look elsewhere, they all sat round a table and made a decision for better or for worse. My guess is, and it's only a guess, is that Parky was always going to be given the job and they never seriously looked elsewhere. I think this is a throw back to the Curbs leaving days, when things went tits up because they had to go out and recruit an "unknown". So they had a No 2 lined up to take over. Parky was on the original list of preferred candidates when Dowie got the job.
My problem is they are trying to solve the last problem instead of the current one. Whereas in the Curbs days, it would have been great for him to have handed over to a no 2 because of the relative success we had at the time. Now after a disaster, I would have thought the worst thing you could do was appoint one of the failed team.
That said, there may have been other reasons like the club really is potless and Parky truely is all we could afford.
What has disappointed me most about our slide over the past few years is not that we are losing or that we look like we are going to be in League one (although both hurt a lot) but how the situation has revelled a really nasty, negative, vitriolic and unforgiving face of our fan base.
I'm never embarrassed to say that I'm a Charlton supporter regardless of how the team is doing but I cringe sometimes when I hear and read our own fans.
Up the Addicks
A sad but perfect example of what I meant.
A statement deliberately twisted for no positive purpose, which adds nothing and which totally misrepresents or maybe just totally missed what was being said.
Well done and thank you for proving my point quite so quickly and completely.
and their money.
I think I'm missing something here because I don't understand the agenda.When you were the fans director, is that what you told the rest of the board - that many of the people you represented made you cringe?
Or have I misunderstood or misrepresented the word 'cringe' ?
Good post, Steve21.
Despite all the doom and gloom, the bottom line is there's always another day, another game.
That's the reality, whatever the self-styled 'Realists' might say.
Personally, I can't see Parky changing things round - but just supposing the Board or even he decides that the best thing for everybody, including himself, is to go ....... then a new man, new energy might change everything. Or not.
We don't know.
And we have seen it all before - failed relegation fights and also successful ones. ....... where we've done Houdini escapes when all had already seemed impossible.
And if we have failed, it's only been a matter of time before things changed again.
Change is the only certainty in life,
I certainly don't want to pillorise and hound people who have over the years put good money into our club, largely for the right reasons, and in my heart have been forgiving them for certain mistakes that have been proved mistakes in hindsight.
However, The problem in my conscience is that i believe that mistakes are STILL being made, with alarming regularity, and at present i can't honestly see decisions becoming 'good decisions' again because my faith in those in charge is fading rapidly. I honestly don't want it to though, because i feel if there was any form of sustained campaign to force out those at the top, we'll be in a far worse situation because i can't see a viable alternative at the moment.
The type of new investors i would desire to invest in the club (UK individuals) simply would not invest in our current model while we maintain our current liabilities and league status.
I simply can't see a happy ending at present, and the reason i believe we are starting to see infighting and acrimony is because there is no real obvious path to a better future.
Did anyone see the Swiss University report on why so many more British passengers died proportional to American passengers? Its all well and good being positive and polite, but it doesnt always end in the best possible solution.
Waggott out now!
But Waggott out now anyway.
;-)
'' ...on the Titanic, I should have said!''
I did wonder what you were on about there for a minute, Arthur! I'd just started to take up the brace position for a crash landing. Now I realise you were actually telling us to run for the lifeboats...
Joking apart, I think you make a very valid point : ''this kind of approach was seen in the Luton Town fanzines in years gone by... the majority wanted to remain positive and the resulting inaction led them to where they are today.''
"In May 2003, Luton was taken over by a mysterious consortium. Days afterwards, manager Kinnear and his assistant Mick Harford were both sacked. This sparked a protest by Luton fans, who demanded their instant re-appointment. The protest was fierce and led to the resignations of new chairman Roger Terrell and vice-chairman Lee Power."
So they protested and were fierce, so it could be argued the ACTION led them to where they are today.
Swap Charlton for the UK economy and you've diagnosed the sh1t we're in better than any bbc closet fabian can bring themselves to admit. Seriously i think thats a genius analysis.
If anyone could have saved them it was Kinnear, though they were a good 5 years on from a likely 'tipping point'
So, yeah
I didn't. That is you twisting someone else's words yet again.
At last something you have said that I agree with totally. Let' s leave it at that for the sake of the message board
By the time of the 2003 uprising to which you refer, they had already gone into adminsitration at least once and may be twice (they've done it three times in total over the past ten years!)
After the uprising, they at least got back up to the Championship. Only for it all to go wrong. Again.
Bing started this thread saying:
''I am just a bit concerned that we are turning against one another in our frustration and anger... if we have criticisms, try to make them measured and not laced with personal abuse or scatter-gun insults.''
You then reply: ''Well said Bing...what has disappointed me most about our slide over the past few years is ...how the situation has revelled a really nasty, negative, vitriolic and unforgiving face of our fan base...I cringe sometimes when I hear and read our own fans."
Can you not see the irony of your own words ? Well perhaps you can and that's why you then come back to claim that accusing you of insulting other Charlton fans is ''twisting'' your words...
What does saying our own fans make you cringe achieve? Why do you do it?
What is the agenda?
take a deep breath and look at your postings again.
Your final taken-out-of-context remark illustrates the point rather well
Not sure what you point is. Which point and which remark?
If you are saying that I suggest that fans should not be critical or complain or suggest improvements than that is not the case.
IMHO we fans should be doing a lot more, a lot lot more but something constructive.