"I am fuming the stewards took my blanky that I have had made out of all of the scarves I have bought over the years. This really keeps me warm in winter. Bad stewards. Nigel of DORKing, DORKing"
"Among the Eagles faithful not allowed into the ground was former fan of the year Andy Carey, 41.
Mr Carey, who picked up the accolade in 2006, has only missed six Palace matches since 1983, and he said: "It was a shambles, in all my years I've never seen anything like it.
"A steward just said to me: 'I don't like you, I'm throwing you out'.
"I was lifted off my feet and taken out of the ground, it was totally overboard."
What an idiot, that's a total contradiction. He says he wasn't allowed into the ground, but goes on to say he was thrown out and taken out of the ground. Complete lies.
John Little's official (and speedy) response to Palace fans enquiries.
Thank you for your letter of 28th January in which you raise some concerns about the events of Tuesday 27th, in the lead up to, and during the course of the Charlton Athletic v Crystal Palace fixture.
As I am sure you are aware, we work very closely with the Police, and receive valuable information from them which we do act upon. The Police Intelligence leading up to the game on Tuesday evening suggested that there was a high risk of pre planned and spontaneous disorder.
One of the outstanding features of some of Crystal Palace fans behaviour both at home and on their away travels this season, has been the number of occasions that objects have been thrown onto the pitch. Flares have also been smuggled into stadiums, and the intelligence suggested that this would be attempted at The Valley. There has also been a high incidence of Crystal Palace fans turning up at turnstiles intoxicated. At the away match against Ipswich this season, six Crystal Palace youths were arrested for trying to enter the ground whilst drunk. At the away fixture in Coventry, Crystal Palace fans attacked stewards at Coventry, and they broke a number of seats when they played at Pride Park, against Derby.
With this information from the Police, we decided to search all visiting supporters entering the South Stand (excluding children). This was aimed at preventing items entering the stadium that are banned by The Ground Regulations and also to identify any intoxicated persons. By dealing with these problems at the turnstiles, it was felt that this would stop problems within the stadium and make the environment safe for the law abiding and decent Crystal Palace fans who had come to enjoy the football. This meant that at certain times, we slowed the entry to the South Stand via the turnstiles, to ensure that all persons were searched. This was done in the interests of safety for everyone. Those that turned up in good time were in the stadium before kick off.
Those ejected from The Valley as they entered the stadium were ejected for a number of reasons which included: possession of alcohol, intoxicated (both of these are offences under The Control of Alcohol Act and these fans could have been arrested), use of foul and abusive language aimed at our staff both stewards and turnstile operators, and for refusing to be searched. One of those ejected from the Ground was arrested by the Police Officers for being in possession of a Class A drug. All of those ejections were conducted in full view and with the cooperation of the police, watched by Senior Police Officers from our Safety Control Room and recorded on CCTV. The Crowd Safety Advisor for the Football Association was positioned by the South Stand turnstiles and witnessed many of these ejections. Members of the Local Authority, all members of the Greenwich SAG group, were also in attendance.
During the course of the game a number of other supporters were ejected from the South Stand, and these were for refusing to move from the aisles, even after several requests to do so, and two other fans for repeatedly standing and bouncing on their seats, again after several requests telling them not to do so. All of these were recorded on CCTV.
I find it a great shame that you should focus your attention on defending these individuals who find it acceptable to break the law and use foul and abusive language aimed at our staff. We have a duty of care to our staff, and we will not tolerate any anti-social behaviour towards them.
Over 3,100 Crystal Palace supporters watched the match from the South stand and were a credit to their club, it was only a very small minority who thought that they were above the law and could breach ground regulations.
Our staff training records are completely up to date and amongst the best in football and we are audited both by the Local Authority and The Football Licensing Authority.
I am pleased to report that the ejections from the ground were all conducted in a professional manner, with no injuries reported and that all of those ejected were handed over to The Police. There were no instances of objects thrown onto the pitch.
Both the FA Crowd Safety Advisor and The Ground Commander (Senior Police Officer) congratulated me at the end of the match. The FA Crowd Safety Advisor saying ‘It was good to see robust stewarding’.
I hope that the above information goes some way to clarifying the situation for you.
Yours sincerely
John Little
Safety Officer
cc Mick Everitt – Operations Director (CAFC)
Steve Waggott - Chief Executive (CAFC)
Andy Brett – Greenwich Football Office (Met Police)
Dominic Jordan – Vice Chair (CPFC)
Kevin Corner – Selhurst Park Stadium/Safety Manager
Malcolm Collier – Football Licensing Authority
Doug Hopkins – Football Association
Would have more sympathy for the POSSIBLE but UNPROVEN wrong doing if every complaint on their site was not preceded and followed by streams of abuse of Charlton and how we are not a family club, how it is all the clubs fault, how John Little will be put on a leave of absence, etc, etc
They keep using their own Police Liaison officer as "proof" but it seems strange that OB would come out and make any public statement that undermines other OB. Let's hear from this Mike Dorans direct first.
And no response from Palace fans on the class A drug or any of the police intelligence from other clubs about missiles or flares just "I've never seen that"
I agree there are some ridiculous complaints, however there are some on there which cannot be dismissed so easily.
I would imagine Mr Little would hope that his letter would finish the matter, but I can see this going the distance. I just hope Palace as a club do not become involved, as it may then look as SJ continuing his fued with RM.
[cite]Posted By: Henry Irving[/cite]
And no response from Palace fans on the class A drug or any of the police intelligence from other clubs about missiles or flares just "I've never seen that"
Henry, sorry but I'm sure that if flares had been used at previous Palace games, they may have been seen by Palace fans attending them, and I certainly can't remember any mention of them before. As for the missiles, again "I've never seen that" and so I can't really comment other than that, as there may have been isolated occasions.
As for the class A drug found, well I'm sorry but ok a Palace fan was found to have drugs on him, he wasn't the first football fan to use drugs, and he certainly won't be the last, I'd imagine there may even be Charlton fans who have been known to use them, I would imagine with the run you were on, before you beat us, most Charlton fans were on them.
I'm over it, I was treated without incident, so have no problem.
We've all been to games where the stewards and the police have gone ott, and we've just accepted it because thats what happens to football supporters when they go to matches. However usually if there is bad treatment, its usually aimed at the young lads who have been drinking, or the mouthy ones. On this occasion it looks as though the poor treatment was aimed at more reasonable fans.
Anyway the incidents, if there were any will have been caught on cctv, if Charlton do have anything to answer for, they will hopefully have been captured on there, if not this will simply fade away.
[cite]Posted By: T.C.E[/cite]Henry, John Little called the away end "the south stand" and not the "The Jimmy Seed Stand" is this a disciplinary matter? ;-)
I'm writing a letter of complaint now. Trouble is his boss is just as bad ; - )
I agree there are some ridiculous complaints, however there are some on there which cannot be dismissed so easily.
.
I don't think anything has been "dismissed". Individual cases will have to be dealt with on an individual basis but John is clearly setting out that there was well founded reason for the zero tolerance policy and that the Police, FLA and Local Authority were all happy with how the situation was dealt with.
[cite]Posted By: budgie[/cite]
I would imagine Mr Little would hope that his letter would finish the matter, but I can see this going the distance. I just hope Palace as a club do not become involved, as it may then look as SJ continuing his fued with RM.
You would imagine wrong. Charlton have a customer charter and John has responded within it. If further complaints are made John or others in the club will respond. Having had the pleasure of working alongside John and his team they take this part of their role very seriously. A few years back after a cup game v Brentford John and another member of staff attended a Brentford Fans meeting to explain the situation from the CAFC view in person.
Compare this with Crystal Palace. They had a complaint earlier this season from a Palace fan about him being ejected. They ignored it
The ST holder ejected from Selhurst Park ( not by Charlton Stewards) at the side's opening game against Watford without any reason being given.
When he resisted, he was also charged with assaulting a steward. He denied this and the charge was thrown out due to lack of evidence.
He then complained to Palace, having had to miss nine games.
He got short shrift from the club, who ignored his letters and one from the Football League. He then contacted the Independent Football Ombudsman (IFO).
Set up by the government and football's governing bodies (The FA, Premier League and Football League), it acts as the last resort for any complaint against a club.
Within a week Palace had offered him a full refund but only due to outside pressure. They had hoped it would go away but that is not how Charlton do their business.
So I think people in glass palaces (see what I did there) should be careful where they throw stones when it comes to how Charlton and John have responded.
[cite]Posted By: Henry Irving[/cite]So I think people in glass palaces (see what I did there) should be careful where they throw stones when it comes to how Charlton and John have responded.
John did very well in responding so quickly, and it was very poor of Palace in responding to there complaint.
However it will still be interesting to see the outcome of any investigations that are carried out.
As you say, I have no sympathy fo anyone foul mouthing the stewards, or appearing too drunk to be allowed entry.
The main problem the Palace fans will have though is proving there innocence via the cctv, as I would imagine there will be no sound. The only clear one that will be able to be proved though, is one of the more serious, and that will be the young girl, been searched by a male steward.
Oh well, thats my lot on here for the night, off to drown my sorrows, not a lot of fun this run of losing, is it?
This kind of whining hacks me off as much as fans reporting players to the police because they claim the player swore at them after having baited the same player for 90 mins! I don't give a toss who the people moaning support, games like CAFC v CPFC will always come with this kind of action...it might not be right but it is reality!
Budgie we have much bigger problems than dodgy stewarding at the Valley, thank god we already have 40 points as we are complete toilet at the moment!!
hand on heart i have never known such a bunch of nerdy whingeing fans as crystal palace fans,some of your fans are even suggesting that the secruity were belmarsh screws! if your not making threads about charlton your making up rubbish like this,get a grip,or better still get a history.
[cite]Posted By: budgie[/cite]Sorry nolly, I keep forgetting about that fa cup win, was a good day out for you?
I dunno about nolly but I wasn't born then myself. The team we played wore claret and blue. Aren't they your colours? Was it you? Oh no, your colours are red and blue stripes aren't they? Hmmm, but then what is that peru rip-off kit all about then? Must get confusing in Nigel-land. Is that why you spend so much time on here?
Comments
Brilliant!!!!
Mr Carey, who picked up the accolade in 2006, has only missed six Palace matches since 1983, and he said: "It was a shambles, in all my years I've never seen anything like it.
"A steward just said to me: 'I don't like you, I'm throwing you out'.
"I was lifted off my feet and taken out of the ground, it was totally overboard."
What an idiot, that's a total contradiction. He says he wasn't allowed into the ground, but goes on to say he was thrown out and taken out of the ground. Complete lies.
Though there's no promises that I'll actually turn up of course. CharltonDan, SE3 "
LMFAO!! Just shows how wound my little visits to BBS have made them.......Legendary status!!
If only I could still get on there. Such a shame.....
"I love it when a plan comes together"
PS Nigel. Sidcup is not SE3......
Thank you for your letter of 28th January in which you raise some concerns about the events of Tuesday 27th, in the lead up to, and during the course of the Charlton Athletic v Crystal Palace fixture.
As I am sure you are aware, we work very closely with the Police, and receive valuable information from them which we do act upon. The Police Intelligence leading up to the game on Tuesday evening suggested that there was a high risk of pre planned and spontaneous disorder.
One of the outstanding features of some of Crystal Palace fans behaviour both at home and on their away travels this season, has been the number of occasions that objects have been thrown onto the pitch. Flares have also been smuggled into stadiums, and the intelligence suggested that this would be attempted at The Valley. There has also been a high incidence of Crystal Palace fans turning up at turnstiles intoxicated. At the away match against Ipswich this season, six Crystal Palace youths were arrested for trying to enter the ground whilst drunk. At the away fixture in Coventry, Crystal Palace fans attacked stewards at Coventry, and they broke a number of seats when they played at Pride Park, against Derby.
With this information from the Police, we decided to search all visiting supporters entering the South Stand (excluding children). This was aimed at preventing items entering the stadium that are banned by The Ground Regulations and also to identify any intoxicated persons. By dealing with these problems at the turnstiles, it was felt that this would stop problems within the stadium and make the environment safe for the law abiding and decent Crystal Palace fans who had come to enjoy the football. This meant that at certain times, we slowed the entry to the South Stand via the turnstiles, to ensure that all persons were searched. This was done in the interests of safety for everyone. Those that turned up in good time were in the stadium before kick off.
Those ejected from The Valley as they entered the stadium were ejected for a number of reasons which included: possession of alcohol, intoxicated (both of these are offences under The Control of Alcohol Act and these fans could have been arrested), use of foul and abusive language aimed at our staff both stewards and turnstile operators, and for refusing to be searched. One of those ejected from the Ground was arrested by the Police Officers for being in possession of a Class A drug. All of those ejections were conducted in full view and with the cooperation of the police, watched by Senior Police Officers from our Safety Control Room and recorded on CCTV. The Crowd Safety Advisor for the Football Association was positioned by the South Stand turnstiles and witnessed many of these ejections. Members of the Local Authority, all members of the Greenwich SAG group, were also in attendance.
During the course of the game a number of other supporters were ejected from the South Stand, and these were for refusing to move from the aisles, even after several requests to do so, and two other fans for repeatedly standing and bouncing on their seats, again after several requests telling them not to do so. All of these were recorded on CCTV.
I find it a great shame that you should focus your attention on defending these individuals who find it acceptable to break the law and use foul and abusive language aimed at our staff. We have a duty of care to our staff, and we will not tolerate any anti-social behaviour towards them.
Over 3,100 Crystal Palace supporters watched the match from the South stand and were a credit to their club, it was only a very small minority who thought that they were above the law and could breach ground regulations.
Our staff training records are completely up to date and amongst the best in football and we are audited both by the Local Authority and The Football Licensing Authority.
I am pleased to report that the ejections from the ground were all conducted in a professional manner, with no injuries reported and that all of those ejected were handed over to The Police. There were no instances of objects thrown onto the pitch.
Both the FA Crowd Safety Advisor and The Ground Commander (Senior Police Officer) congratulated me at the end of the match. The FA Crowd Safety Advisor saying ‘It was good to see robust stewarding’.
I hope that the above information goes some way to clarifying the situation for you.
Yours sincerely
John Little
Safety Officer
cc Mick Everitt – Operations Director (CAFC)
Steve Waggott - Chief Executive (CAFC)
Andy Brett – Greenwich Football Office (Met Police)
Dominic Jordan – Vice Chair (CPFC)
Kevin Corner – Selhurst Park Stadium/Safety Manager
Malcolm Collier – Football Licensing Authority
Doug Hopkins – Football Association
I would just like to say that this is not my post, I think I know who did it (someone who uses Charlton Loyal to stir things), but definitely not me.
Edit: I don't think anyone thought that was your comment DA9.
Whining Nigels 0
Agree - excellent response.
Boy, them grapes sure are sour over there.
They keep using their own Police Liaison officer as "proof" but it seems strange that OB would come out and make any public statement that undermines other OB. Let's hear from this Mike Dorans direct first.
And no response from Palace fans on the class A drug or any of the police intelligence from other clubs about missiles or flares just "I've never seen that"
...but still plenty to play for.
I agree there are some ridiculous complaints, however there are some on there which cannot be dismissed so easily.
I would imagine Mr Little would hope that his letter would finish the matter, but I can see this going the distance. I just hope Palace as a club do not become involved, as it may then look as SJ continuing his fued with RM.
Henry, sorry but I'm sure that if flares had been used at previous Palace games, they may have been seen by Palace fans attending them, and I certainly can't remember any mention of them before. As for the missiles, again "I've never seen that" and so I can't really comment other than that, as there may have been isolated occasions.
As for the class A drug found, well I'm sorry but ok a Palace fan was found to have drugs on him, he wasn't the first football fan to use drugs, and he certainly won't be the last, I'd imagine there may even be Charlton fans who have been known to use them, I would imagine with the run you were on, before you beat us, most Charlton fans were on them.
Get over it.
We've all been to games where the stewards and the police have gone ott, and we've just accepted it because thats what happens to football supporters when they go to matches. However usually if there is bad treatment, its usually aimed at the young lads who have been drinking, or the mouthy ones. On this occasion it looks as though the poor treatment was aimed at more reasonable fans.
Anyway the incidents, if there were any will have been caught on cctv, if Charlton do have anything to answer for, they will hopefully have been captured on there, if not this will simply fade away.
I'm writing a letter of complaint now. Trouble is his boss is just as bad ; - )
I don't think anything has been "dismissed". Individual cases will have to be dealt with on an individual basis but John is clearly setting out that there was well founded reason for the zero tolerance policy and that the Police, FLA and Local Authority were all happy with how the situation was dealt with.
You would imagine wrong. Charlton have a customer charter and John has responded within it. If further complaints are made John or others in the club will respond. Having had the pleasure of working alongside John and his team they take this part of their role very seriously. A few years back after a cup game v Brentford John and another member of staff attended a Brentford Fans meeting to explain the situation from the CAFC view in person.
Compare this with Crystal Palace. They had a complaint earlier this season from a Palace fan about him being ejected. They ignored it
The ST holder ejected from Selhurst Park ( not by Charlton Stewards) at the side's opening game against Watford without any reason being given.
When he resisted, he was also charged with assaulting a steward. He denied this and the charge was thrown out due to lack of evidence.
He then complained to Palace, having had to miss nine games.
He got short shrift from the club, who ignored his letters and one from the Football League. He then contacted the Independent Football Ombudsman (IFO).
Set up by the government and football's governing bodies (The FA, Premier League and Football League), it acts as the last resort for any complaint against a club.
Within a week Palace had offered him a full refund but only due to outside pressure. They had hoped it would go away but that is not how Charlton do their business.
So I think people in glass palaces (see what I did there) should be careful where they throw stones when it comes to how Charlton and John have responded.
John did very well in responding so quickly, and it was very poor of Palace in responding to there complaint.
However it will still be interesting to see the outcome of any investigations that are carried out.
........
Those that are on CCTV won't have a leg to stand on.
Those who were not allowed in for swearing at stewards/being drunk etc will have to provide evidence that they were behaving themselves.
Sadly after the trouble at recent CAFC/CPFC matches I can understand why the stewards took a zero tolerance policy at this game.
The main problem the Palace fans will have though is proving there innocence via the cctv, as I would imagine there will be no sound. The only clear one that will be able to be proved though, is one of the more serious, and that will be the young girl, been searched by a male steward.
Oh well, thats my lot on here for the night, off to drown my sorrows, not a lot of fun this run of losing, is it?
This kind of whining hacks me off as much as fans reporting players to the police because they claim the player swore at them after having baited the same player for 90 mins! I don't give a toss who the people moaning support, games like CAFC v CPFC will always come with this kind of action...it might not be right but it is reality!
Budgie we have much bigger problems than dodgy stewarding at the Valley, thank god we already have 40 points as we are complete toilet at the moment!!
I dunno about nolly but I wasn't born then myself. The team we played wore claret and blue. Aren't they your colours? Was it you? Oh no, your colours are red and blue stripes aren't they? Hmmm, but then what is that peru rip-off kit all about then? Must get confusing in Nigel-land. Is that why you spend so much time on here?
If its teams in red and white with history you want, I'd go for Man U or Liverpool.
Me, I'll just stick to my local team.