[cite]Posted By: Oggy Red[/cite]Incidentally the BBC website shows Charlton having 21 attempts at goal, 12 on target.
Tranmere had 9 efforts, only 5 on target ...... and in fact were leading 1-0 , without having a single shot on target until the 60th minute, according to the BBC stats.
the stats might, for example, show that Mooney covered more grass than any other Charlton player but he was still shit.
still dont thinkwe should throw the baby out with the bathwater..... However if its the poisonois vally with "fans" actually making the players nervous, ruining our chances and as TOTALLY COUNTER PRODUCTIVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Last year it go to the point that when we conceded a corner we would boooo, when we lose the ball wed boo.....
Does anyone realise how damaging that is to the team...
Ashamed of our "fans" total disgrace if you ask me..... it does apear that the buzzing team spirit that parkinson created has disappeared... and ufortunately their doesnt seem to be much behind the team.... its all pshychological and the moaning , booing , whinging aresholes are NOT WELCOME!!
the stats might, for example, show that Mooney covered more grass than any other Charlton player but he was still shit.
So he may have been today.
No doubt it gives you great pleasure to glorify in the player's ineffectiveness today - so you can puff your chest out and tell people you were right?
But Large, you've never even given the player the credit he's due when he has played well, when he has provided assists and scored goals.
Oggy, I believe you missed my point entirely. I was trying to say that you can use statistics to make any point you want and I was just using Mooney as an example.
However, you are right in my opinion of Mooney. I have though been consistant in my assessment of his attributes and even in the games he has scored, all too infrequently, I still have not seen anything that he brings to the team. All he does is run around a lot, but does it brilliantly. He has no pace, no strength, can't head a ball and has a weak shot. In my opinion he is a poor footballer. In my opinion he'll never consistantly score goals. I'm sorry you don't like it but that's my opinion and I'm sticking to it.
Mooney was absolutely awful as usual. I'd be very happy to never see him again. He just runs aimlessly in hope the defender will miss the ball these days. Very, very poor.
I think we should revert to 4-5-1 and bring in either Racon or Shelvey for Mooney.
The plus point was Reid. He did very well. Good pace and looks to get down the line.
It will be the play offs now, which is about right for our quality of squad.
this isnt a critisms just a observation,that people saying we should get behind the boys and that they are ashamed of the fans,are the ones that dont go week in week out.Sorry chaps but you dont have to watch the tripe that has been served up over the past few weeks.
[cite]Posted By: Screamer[/cite]It will be the play offs now, which is about right for our quality of squad.
I disagree. I don't think our squad has less quality than Norwich's, except glaringly up-front, but does at the moment seem to lack direction and motivation.
Mooney was woeful today. Hardly won a header. His movement and anticipation off the ball were terrible. He was second best to everything. When the substitutions were about to be made, he went to run off the field of play thinking he would be substituted only for PP to take Sam and Reid off to his surprise and everyone of the 16,000 fans at The Valley. I think it's time that McKenzie had his first start up front with Burton.
Reid looked lively. Some nice close touches and was willing to take on the defender and hug the line. Got stuck in as well.
Sodje although he doesn't always instil me with confidence, he looked composed at the back, and his ability in the air was vital. He made a couple of forages forward which reminded me of Bougherra.
Bailey had his worst game in a red shirt in all the games I've seen him. Some of his passing was atrociuos, launching pointless 40 yard passes cross field out of play. However, he was in the right place at the righ time for the goal and his effort can't be faulted.
[cite]Posted By: northstandsteve[/cite]this isnt a critisms just a observation,that people saying we should get behind the boys and that they are ashamed of the fans,are the ones that dont go week in week out.Sorry chaps but you dont have to watch the tripe that has been served up over the past few weeks.
I don't believe any of our fans turn up to each home game specifically to boo from the start and as mentioned on here earlier have had to put up with watching a team in freefall over the last 3 years and justifiably expect better. Tranmere have won away just once this season, scoring just 6 goals into the bargain, but we made them look like a top 6 side and we were lucky to scrape a point.
Pah - can't be arsed to say anymore. The top 2 automatic places have gone, but we should ge one of the 4 play-off places and I stil contend we'll end up 3rd or 4th.
If you've watched your team long enough, sooner or later the penny drops about a squad of players & the management behind them, then you can start looking at things objectively.
Let's not delude ourselves, we're simply not good enough.
still dont thinkwe should throw the baby out with the bathwater..... However if its the poisonois vally with "fans" actually making the players nervous, ruining our chances and as TOTALLY COUNTER PRODUCTIVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Last year it go to the point that when we conceded a corner we would boooo, when we lose the ball wed boo.....
Does anyone realise how damaging that is to the team...
Ashamed of our "fans" total disgrace if you ask me..... it does apear that the buzzing team spirit that parkinson created has disappeared... and ufortunately their doesnt seem to be much behind the team.... its all pshychological and the moaning , booing , whinging aresholes are NOT WELCOME!!
Bad Times[/quote]
I don't agree with boo-ing and do not do it myself, but to suggest that the fans are in anyway at fault for that lousy performance is like sticking your head in the sand. We were shit from start to finish. Too many players thought they could just turn up and win. Players like Mooney lack guts to dig in and fight for a win (or even a header) and our manager seems completely tactically inept. The first boo i heard was at half time - so how to explain the woeful first half performance.
TBH people that come on to the web and say it is the fans fault and all the moaners can bugger off clearly do not realise that the club is in the financial abys we are in & needs every fan it can get to turn up.
yep agreed we are not good enough,however today as i walked out i said for the first time supporting charlton,i dont
know if i want to do this anymore.Anybody who knows me knows how much i love the club but today was awful and i cant have players who dont give a shit and lloyd sam is one of the culprits he really dont give a toss.
Booing your own team lads whats that all about, looks like our slight blip in form maybe over and we looked a lot better today and never looked in trouble Mcshefferey also looked a class signing and should get goals at this level, looking foreward to beating Spurs on Wednesday who believe it or not havn't sold their allocation.
[cite]Posted By: Oaky white[/cite]Booing your own team lads whats that all about, looks like our slight blip in form maybe over and we looked a lot better today and never looked in trouble Mcshefferey also looked a class signing and should get goals at this level, looking foreward to beating Spurs on Wednesday who believe it or not havn't sold their allocation.
[quote][cite]Posted By: LargeAddick[/cite][quote][cite]Posted By: Oaky white[/cite]Booing your own team lads whats that all about, looks like our slight blip in form maybe over and we looked a lot better today and never looked in trouble Mcshefferey also looked a class signing and should get goals at this level, looking foreward to beating Spurs on Wednesday who believe it or not havn't sold their allocation.[/quote]
like Leeds fans have NEVER booed their team. LOL.[/quote] Yes they have after a run of bad results but you havn't exactly been in a poor run of form to warrant it.
Parkinson is not the man to get the club out of the shit.
No Racon? When you have done something other than get us relegated Phil then you can leave our best player out of the team cos you dont see eye to eye.
Promotion? Well be in a League 1 relegation battle next year with this set up.
The facts are clear, we have not had a really good performance for quite a while, lucky wins against Wycombe and Hartlepool only cover up the reality that since the start of December, the team has flattered to deceive and it is time for a change in team selection and maybe formation.
Would like to see Mooney dropped, Sam dropped for a game or two as he needs to realise he is not irreplacable and Waggy deserves a start in his favoured RM role (He was average on the left imho). Also time to see the creative influence and quality that is Racon.
Well, I've had a night out with a few beers and meal and I still feel the same about that performance. Utter crap.
Sorry, but we just aren't doing anything right at the moment.
We have gone from a fluid side that passed its way through the midfield and openned teams up with swift passing counter attacks, to one trick ponies that hoof a straight left to right pass 60 yards to no-one over and over again.
I don't care how we do it, but we need to get Racon back in the side. Semedo and Bailey just aren't working at the moment.
I don't go to games to slag the team off but I can understand the frustration that comes from the stands after showings like today. I've mentioned this before, but I really want to know who is coaching our forwards as the lack of movement off the ball is shameful. Time and time again we see a full back or midfielder pick the ball up, look forward and pass backwards as they don't have an option infront of them. Before anyone says anything, running 10 yards in a straight line does not consititute movement off the ball.
Our performance today was in many ways a mirror image of Monday. We were stuck in a lethargic one paced hole. We don't seem to have anyone one to take the game by the scruff of the neck and inject some pace into proceedings. If a team comes to spoil, we immediately settle for playing at their pace and if we don't score early we start knocking the ball long.
We have reached a crossroads this season. Parky needs to show some cojones and change it round. Mooney & Burton isn't working. Not sure what has happened to Mooney but am starting to wonder if the injury is still effecting him as he seems to have lost a yard of pace.
For me Sam needs to come out of the side. His body language is appalling. He just doesn't look interested. His defensive work is non existant and he clearly din't think he could beat the full back so just appeared to stop trying.
Said it on the way out, but I actually think getting away from home might help. We can legitmately go back to 4-5-1 and hopefully the pressure will drop slightly.
I've tried to avoid thinking negatively, but my fear is that the season is heading the same way as the first Championship season. We are tailing off and running out of ideas.
[cite]Posted By: Oaky white[/cite]Booing your own team lads whats that all about, .
Hmmm, what indeed Oaky.
Seems like we are reactive rather than proactive.
We never lift the team when they are struggling, we wait for the team to lift us and that is a disappointment.
Talking of disappointments....
Why did we wait until the 70th minute before we started to show the passion, desire and "want to win" attitude required?
I'm not going to slag off individual players; IMO that was our best team out there today.
To me it was all about attitude and desire (or rather the lack of it) and the lacklustre start has become a pattern which is down to Parky to address.
If we'd have started like we ended I swear we would have annihilated them, but instead if was the same old same old.
So another p1sspoor team comes to the Valley with nothing to lose, unused to playing in a proper stadium; wonder after half an hour what all the fuss is about; confidence grows;and the next thing is they are passing the ball around like Brazil,which they never have before and never will again.
Crowd gets frustrated; doesn't lift the team; gets on their back,boo's them - how is that going to help?
Somehow Parky needs to get the tam playing from the start how they were at the end.
I'm glad the next three are away though, because our fans suck.
Great debut from Reidy.
[cite]Posted by: Almost Everyone[/cite].... boring .... predicatable .... reactionism ....
;-)
Observations of reality unfortunatley. But lets all just keep our heads in the sand. Playing shit for 3 months, 1-0 loss to orient and draw with tranmere whilst playing abysmally is just a blip and anyone who disagrees is just reactionary.
Will be the same lines when we dont make the play offs.
Fuck me has parkinson got to get his cock out and start banging one out in the centre circle before some people will see that he isnt going to improve the club in the way thats required.
Comments
the stats might, for example, show that Mooney covered more grass than any other Charlton player but he was still shit.
So he may have been today.
No doubt it gives you great pleasure to glorify in the player's ineffectiveness today - so you can puff your chest out and tell people you were right?
But Large, you've never even given the player the credit he's due when he has played well, when he has provided assists and scored goals.
still dont thinkwe should throw the baby out with the bathwater..... However if its the poisonois vally with "fans" actually making the players nervous, ruining our chances and as TOTALLY COUNTER PRODUCTIVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Last year it go to the point that when we conceded a corner we would boooo, when we lose the ball wed boo.....
Does anyone realise how damaging that is to the team...
Ashamed of our "fans" total disgrace if you ask me..... it does apear that the buzzing team spirit that parkinson created has disappeared... and ufortunately their doesnt seem to be much behind the team.... its all pshychological and the moaning , booing , whinging aresholes are NOT WELCOME!!
Bad Times
Oggy, I believe you missed my point entirely. I was trying to say that you can use statistics to make any point you want and I was just using Mooney as an example.
However, you are right in my opinion of Mooney. I have though been consistant in my assessment of his attributes and even in the games he has scored, all too infrequently, I still have not seen anything that he brings to the team. All he does is run around a lot, but does it brilliantly. He has no pace, no strength, can't head a ball and has a weak shot. In my opinion he is a poor footballer. In my opinion he'll never consistantly score goals. I'm sorry you don't like it but that's my opinion and I'm sticking to it.
He just runs aimlessly in hope the defender will miss the ball these days. Very, very poor.
I think we should revert to 4-5-1 and bring in either Racon or Shelvey for Mooney.
The plus point was Reid. He did very well. Good pace and looks to get down the line.
It will be the play offs now, which is about right for our quality of squad.
I disagree. I don't think our squad has less quality than Norwich's, except glaringly up-front, but does at the moment seem to lack direction and motivation.
Reid looked lively. Some nice close touches and was willing to take on the defender and hug the line. Got stuck in as well.
Sodje although he doesn't always instil me with confidence, he looked composed at the back, and his ability in the air was vital. He made a couple of forages forward which reminded me of Bougherra.
Bailey had his worst game in a red shirt in all the games I've seen him. Some of his passing was atrociuos, launching pointless 40 yard passes cross field out of play. However, he was in the right place at the righ time for the goal and his effort can't be faulted.
Hows booing gonna help??
Pah - can't be arsed to say anymore. The top 2 automatic places have gone, but we should ge one of the 4 play-off places and I stil contend we'll end up 3rd or 4th.
Let's not delude ourselves, we're simply not good enough.
still dont thinkwe should throw the baby out with the bathwater..... However if its the poisonois vally with "fans" actually making the players nervous, ruining our chances and as TOTALLY COUNTER PRODUCTIVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Last year it go to the point that when we conceded a corner we would boooo, when we lose the ball wed boo.....
Does anyone realise how damaging that is to the team...
Ashamed of our "fans" total disgrace if you ask me..... it does apear that the buzzing team spirit that parkinson created has disappeared... and ufortunately their doesnt seem to be much behind the team.... its all pshychological and the moaning , booing , whinging aresholes are NOT WELCOME!!
Bad Times[/quote]
I don't agree with boo-ing and do not do it myself, but to suggest that the fans are in anyway at fault for that lousy performance is like sticking your head in the sand. We were shit from start to finish. Too many players thought they could just turn up and win. Players like Mooney lack guts to dig in and fight for a win (or even a header) and our manager seems completely tactically inept. The first boo i heard was at half time - so how to explain the woeful first half performance.
TBH people that come on to the web and say it is the fans fault and all the moaners can bugger off clearly do not realise that the club is in the financial abys we are in & needs every fan it can get to turn up.
know if i want to do this anymore.Anybody who knows me knows how much i love the club but today was awful and i cant have players who dont give a shit and lloyd sam is one of the culprits he really dont give a toss.
like Leeds fans have NEVER booed their team. LOL.
like Leeds fans have NEVER booed their team. LOL.[/quote]
Yes they have after a run of bad results but you havn't exactly been in a poor run of form to warrant it.
but we've only lost once at home this season.....
Would like to hear some answers to Steves question there
Parkinson is not the man to get the club out of the shit.
No Racon? When you have done something other than get us relegated Phil then you can leave our best player out of the team cos you dont see eye to eye.
Promotion? Well be in a League 1 relegation battle next year with this set up.
Brentford at home...september
Would like to see Mooney dropped, Sam dropped for a game or two as he needs to realise he is not irreplacable and Waggy deserves a start in his favoured RM role (He was average on the left imho). Also time to see the creative influence and quality that is Racon.
yep and don't get me started about the ones that weren't happy either
Sorry, but we just aren't doing anything right at the moment.
We have gone from a fluid side that passed its way through the midfield and openned teams up with swift passing counter attacks, to one trick ponies that hoof a straight left to right pass 60 yards to no-one over and over again.
I don't care how we do it, but we need to get Racon back in the side. Semedo and Bailey just aren't working at the moment.
I don't go to games to slag the team off but I can understand the frustration that comes from the stands after showings like today. I've mentioned this before, but I really want to know who is coaching our forwards as the lack of movement off the ball is shameful. Time and time again we see a full back or midfielder pick the ball up, look forward and pass backwards as they don't have an option infront of them. Before anyone says anything, running 10 yards in a straight line does not consititute movement off the ball.
Our performance today was in many ways a mirror image of Monday. We were stuck in a lethargic one paced hole. We don't seem to have anyone one to take the game by the scruff of the neck and inject some pace into proceedings. If a team comes to spoil, we immediately settle for playing at their pace and if we don't score early we start knocking the ball long.
We have reached a crossroads this season. Parky needs to show some cojones and change it round. Mooney & Burton isn't working. Not sure what has happened to Mooney but am starting to wonder if the injury is still effecting him as he seems to have lost a yard of pace.
For me Sam needs to come out of the side. His body language is appalling. He just doesn't look interested. His defensive work is non existant and he clearly din't think he could beat the full back so just appeared to stop trying.
Said it on the way out, but I actually think getting away from home might help. We can legitmately go back to 4-5-1 and hopefully the pressure will drop slightly.
I've tried to avoid thinking negatively, but my fear is that the season is heading the same way as the first Championship season. We are tailing off and running out of ideas.
I hope to god I'm proved wrong on Tuesday night.
Hmmm, what indeed Oaky.
Seems like we are reactive rather than proactive.
We never lift the team when they are struggling, we wait for the team to lift us and that is a disappointment.
Talking of disappointments....
Why did we wait until the 70th minute before we started to show the passion, desire and "want to win" attitude required?
I'm not going to slag off individual players; IMO that was our best team out there today.
To me it was all about attitude and desire (or rather the lack of it) and the lacklustre start has become a pattern which is down to Parky to address.
If we'd have started like we ended I swear we would have annihilated them, but instead if was the same old same old.
So another p1sspoor team comes to the Valley with nothing to lose, unused to playing in a proper stadium; wonder after half an hour what all the fuss is about; confidence grows;and the next thing is they are passing the ball around like Brazil,which they never have before and never will again.
Crowd gets frustrated; doesn't lift the team; gets on their back,boo's them - how is that going to help?
Somehow Parky needs to get the tam playing from the start how they were at the end.
I'm glad the next three are away though, because our fans suck.
Great debut from Reidy.
Observations of reality unfortunatley. But lets all just keep our heads in the sand. Playing shit for 3 months, 1-0 loss to orient and draw with tranmere whilst playing abysmally is just a blip and anyone who disagrees is just reactionary.
Will be the same lines when we dont make the play offs.
Fuck me has parkinson got to get his cock out and start banging one out in the centre circle before some people will see that he isnt going to improve the club in the way thats required.