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How many of the current squad are Championship quality?

edited September 2010 in General Charlton
I know it's a crazy question, but just wondering out of the current playing staff how many are already good enough for the step up or have the potential to be!?

I never see us play so I have no idea really.
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Comments

  • none of them to be honest
  • I would say Semedo, Martin, Reidy, Jackson, and maybe Racon
  • So even if Parky turns it round it's going to take a pile of money to build a squad that could survive. How much is protion to the Championship worth?
  • edited September 2010
    Honestly imho it comes down to "on their day", the reason many of our players are in League 1 is not because they are not talented but that they do not show it often enough. For example Semedo and Racon have the potential to be amongst the best in the league and could play at a higher level. However Racon is nowhere near consistent enough and too often goes missing whilst Semedo has been slightly disappointing this season. Semedo last season would have walked into most Championship sides.

    Lee Martin also falls into the Racon category but is young and has time to work his way back up.

    Jackson and Reid, surely both would get Championship offers if they left the club tomorrow. Both are Championship quality imho and would get into most squads.

    Christian Dailly has done and perhaps could have last season/this season but may be a little old now, although I thought this about him in league 1 when he signed and he let no one down.

    I also think Rob Elliot could with a little improvement play in the Championship, he did not disgrace himself in 2009 and since then has got leaner and improved greatly. Despite being a little injury prone as a keeper he should not peak for a long time and I think he will be disappointed if League 1 is as high as he goes.
  • edited September 2010
    Youga
    Dailly
    Fortune (if fit)
    Semedo
    Racon
    Martin
    Reid
    Jackson (in midfield)
  • It doesn't matter really, does it.
  • I'm not sure how Semedo or Racon can be classed as anything other than average league one players simply because in league one they look very average.

    In my opinion the only player who is Championship class , for some reason was sat on the bench Saturday and that's Jon Fortune.
  • Agree with Clem_snide apart from Racon and maybe semedo but semedo could get in as a squad player. I would like to think Waggy would be by the time we got there even if we got there in the shortest time possible.
  • edited September 2010
    [cite]Posted By: Bedsaddick[/cite]I'm not sure how Semedo or Racon can be classed as anything other than average league one players simply because in league one they look very average.

    In my opinion the only player who is Championship class , for some reason was sat on the bench Saturday and that's Jon Fortune.

    He's not fit.
  • How about applying this question to the Manager?

    Lots of other threads about whether he should go or not, but how about ... if he sneaked us up this season ... is he the man to keep us in and lead us through the Championship? After all, he's hardly going to be sacked if he does get us out of League 1.
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  • Dear god, no wonder you lot are miserable if you're watching games expecting the players and management to show signs of not only being good enough to get us promoted to the Championship, but to be challenging for promotion to the Prem. We are a League One side, have had to rebuild the team over the summer, and have already lost all but one of the defenders who finished last season with us through injury. You're not just wanting to see if they can run before they can walk, you wondering whether they can high jump too. One challenge at a time FFS!
  • edited September 2010
    Could do a job tomorrow:

    Semedo
    Racon (if someone holds his hand, at a push)
    Jackson
    Dailly

    With time:

    Martin
    Fortune (for obvious reasons)
    Reid

    Youga I really don't know about, went from solid, to a calamity, to one of our best players and hasn't kicked a ball since Gillingham away was it? Nearly a year then... could take that long to get him 100% fit and through a pre-season etc.
  • [cite]Posted By: aliwibble[/cite]Dear god, no wonder you lot are miserable if you're watching games expecting the players and management to show signs of not only being good enough to get us promoted to the Championship, but to be challenging for promotion to the Prem. We are a League One side, have had to rebuild the team over the summer, and have already lost all but one of the defenders who finished last season with us through injury. You're not just wanting to see if they can run before they can walk, you wondering whether they can high jump too. One challenge at a time FFS!

    I think in the light of recent discussions about Parky's future it is actually probably the most relevant question that could be asked. Especially for those, me included, that are hoping for a swift exit upwards out of this league.

    If nothing but promotion is good enough for a large proportion of fans, the question has to be - what would such a promotion lead to?

    Is it even in our interests to get promoted this season?

    Does Parky have a long term vision regarding the youngsters at the club? How many of them coming through will make the grade in a few years time in Tier 2.

    Does the lack of reserve team football hinder their progress?

    How much would it cost to build a side that would survive in the Championship - where does that money come from?

    It's the short term vision you are espousing ali - that has got us where we are I would argue.
  • I'll hold Racon's hand, ISLS.....
  • [cite]Posted By: Oakster[/cite]
    [cite]Posted By: aliwibble[/cite]Dear god, no wonder you lot are miserable if you're watching games expecting the players and management to show signs of not only being good enough to get us promoted to the Championship, but to be challenging for promotion to the Prem. We are a League One side, have had to rebuild the team over the summer, and have already lost all but one of the defenders who finished last season with us through injury. You're not just wanting to see if they can run before they can walk, you wondering whether they can high jump too. One challenge at a time FFS!

    I think in the light of recent discussions about Parky's future it is actually probably the most relevant question that could be asked. Especially for those, me included, that are hoping for a swift exit upwards out of this league.

    If nothing but promotion is good enough for a large proportion of fans, the question has to be - what would such a promotion lead to?

    Is it even in our interests to get promoted this season?

    Does Parky have a long term vision regarding the youngsters at the club? How many of them coming through will make the grade in a few years time in Tier 2.

    Does the lack of reserve team football hinder their progress?

    How much would it cost to build a side that would survive in the Championship - where does that money come from?

    It's the short term vision you are espousing ali - that has got us where we are I would argue.

    *breathes a refreshing sigh of relief*

    At last!
  • [cite]Posted By: Oakster[/cite]Is it even in our interests to get promoted this season?
    You really haven't been paying attention, have you? We are not financially viable in League One, but we would be in the Championship, so of course it is in our interest to get promoted.
    Does Parky have a long term vision regarding the youngsters at the club? How many of them coming through will make the grade in a few years time in Tier 2.
    Dunno - did anyone ask him at the Q&A? And how many of them come through is a question of natural talent and mental strength as well as experience. Are those hoping for a swift exit out of this league going to give them time to learn from their mistakes in league games, or get on their backs for every misplaced pass or missed tackle?
    Does the lack of reserve team football hinder their progress?
    Probably, but the decision to scrap it was a financial one, not a footballing one.
    How much would it cost to build a side that would survive in the Championship - where does that money come from?
    Who knows? It depends on whether the existing players are happy to stay on their current deals, whether richer clubs make us an offer we can't refuse for our most valuable players, what players are available at the time, what competition there is for their signatures, and so on. And as ever the money will come from sponsorship, season tickets and player sales.
    It's the short term vision you are espousing ali - that has got us where we are I would argue.
    No, what got us where we are was spending money we didn't have trying to maintain our league position. I'm not espousing short term vision, I'm asking for some realism about where we are now. At this level, players are on short term contracts as it's too much of a risk to sign them up for more than a couple of years, so at every transfer window it's a question of weighing up the disruption of selling players against maximising the transfer revenue in order to stay afloat. It's impossible to know NOW which players will have be in demand from other clubs next summer, which will have sustained long term or even career ending injuries, which youngsters will be ready to step up, or need to go on loan to get more experience, and which players we'd want to build next season's team around.

    It's nine months away. Anything could happen in the intervening period, and none of us has a crystal ball. It's ridiculous to try to judge the players or the manager on what you assume their response will be to something that hasn't even happened yet, and may never do.
  • edited September 2010
    [cite]Posted By: aliwibble[/cite]It's ridiculous to try to judge the players or the manager on what you assume their response will be to something that hasn't even happened yet, and may never do.

    But perfectly OK to 'cross that bridge when we come to it' ... and find that there is no bridge?

    I think it's a reasonable question to ask, as I did when Parkinson was appointed, ... not "Is he the man to take us out of League 1?", but "Is he the man that you could see leading this Club forward in three or four years time?".
  • edited September 2010
    [cite]Posted By: aliwibble[/cite]
    [cite]Posted By: Oakster[/cite]Is it even in our interests to get promoted this season?
    You really haven't been paying attention, have you? We arenot financially viable in League One, but we would be in the Championship, so of course it is in our interest to get promoted.

    OK explain to me in simple financial terms how we would be viable and survive immediate relegation in the Championship based on the current squad? I'm asking this as a friendly question, I'm not looking for a cyber-rumble with you :-)
  • [cite]Posted By: Dave Rudd[/cite]
    [cite]Posted By: aliwibble[/cite]It's ridiculous to try to judge the players or the manager on what you assume their response will be to something that hasn't even happened yet, and may never do.

    But perfectly OK to 'cross that bridge when we come to it' ... and find that there is no bridge?
    At which point you look for an alternative way of getting across. Better that than never making it as far as the river, because you sold your shoes to buy an inflatable dinghy on the offchance that the bridge might be out.
  • I think many of our players could cope, especially off the back of a very good finish/promotion to the season. Whilst I like Racon's touches at times, his frequent anonymity would see him soon out of most champ sides..... unless like virtually all Pardew players someone or many always did the hard part for him. Here's my assesment:

    Elliot
    Docherty
    Fortune
    Dailly (only ? is age but if we went up I'd rather have him than say the Holland we had in the champ, Dailly isn't past his sell by like Holland was)
    Not sure on Semedo, as he doesn't force issues.
    J Jackson
    Wagstaff, after a solid L1 season and hopefully someone somewhere has bothered to drum into one of our winger to cross early.
    Martin, prob get on better in champ in a well structured team.
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  • All of them could play in the Championship and not look too out of place....but not altogether in the same team! The best ones would be Dailly, Semedo and possibly Elliott (if he stayed fit). They're the ones that you could transfer list and get reasonable money for.
  • none. If they were they'd be in the Championship.
  • Wagstaff,
    Reid
    Martin

    Semedo: if he was cheap, so probably not
    Fortune: If he is still the player we think he is/was. A match by match contract, so again another no.....

    We should be okay for the 5 a side league then..........
  • I was talking to a Millwall mate after the Watford pasting and he said it's been such a long time since they were in that division he was shocked at the difference in standard between Division 3 (league one) and Division 2 (championship). As a fan of 30 odd years he's had lots of experience of yo-yoing between the two and doesn't think the diference has ever been so great.
  • Let's face it, we're looking distinctly mid-table L1 at the moment, so talk of the Championship is a bit previous, isn't it?

    If we did gain promotion I would expect us to struggle, unless some investment comes in from somewhere.
  • Luke Varney wasn't good enough for the championship but has been deemed good enough for the premiership.
  • We are where we are for a reason. We have league 1 players and anybody who was seen as having Championship quality was taken in the summer. Depressing but true - lucky it's only a game
  • Elliott, Dailly, Fortune, Reid, at present.

    Wagstaffe, Solly, & Tuna, will get there with more experience.
  • I would like to think that if we get promoted it will be like past promotions. The individuals in the team may not individually be championship class, but they will be a team, with a great spirit and the buzz of having achieved promotion together.

    Its a cliché but the whole will be greater than the sum of its parts.
  • [cite]Posted By: LargeAddick[/cite]none. If they were they'd be in the Championship.

    Rubbish. Football does not work like this.

    Both Martin and Reid are championship players, but have dropped down due to various problems
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