I thought Worner was playing very well and was a little surprised to see him dropped, I thought Elliot would get his chance again when/if Worner lost form.
Never been impressed by Robbie tbh. When he broke into the team he was a stone overweight which worried me and he just doesn`t look enough of an athlete to me. We should have bent over backwards to retain Randolph but I don`t think we did. Worner needs to be given a run of games now. Was it Weegie on another thread who called Robbie "Lily the Pink" ?
I'm not sure I'd have much more confidence in Worner, though - he's very young and inexperienced, and also not very tall. Think both him and Robbie have the same issue of not really commanding the area, and not coming off the line often enough - puts the defenders under a lot of pressure. Surely Robbie could do more on this in training?? His heart's in the right place, and he has the physical presence - just needs the confidence to use it more.
I wasn't there today so cannot comment but Weegie is reliable and she says he had a stinker.
However all keepers do every so often even Deano.
I like Robbie and think he is good enough for this level or better. In my view he has performed well in most of the 70 odd games he has played and I'm not convinced Randolph is better than him although he did play well in the dozen or so games he played at the end of last season.
As for Worner I'm pleasantly surprised with how well he has done but personally I rate Robbie higher.
He lost form alarmingly towards the end of last season culminating with the absolute shocker he had at Southend.
He came back this season looking leaner and started quite well.
He has steadily gone backwards. Each time he has come back from injury he has looked leaden footed and less fit than he was in the preceeding game.
I personally don't think he is a natural athlete and has to work hard at that side of things. Athletisism is key for goalkeepers and he seems a little bit short in that department.
As oohaah regularly points out he is beaten from distance far too frequently for my liking. Personally begining to think that he is partially to blame for the lack of cohesion at the back. He doesn't appear to be much of a talker and sometimes the defence rely on guidance from the man behind them.
Not sure that Worner is the answer right now. Think he will turn into a good keeper though.
If Daniels is available on loan I'd be tempted to bring him in.
Said in pre-season we were mad to let Marshall go. He would have helped Elliot develop. Ultimately, I think he would have been our number one and I'm sure we would have been much more solid with him.
Elliott is prone to mistakes i admit, but he has kept us in some games with some of the best saves i have seen down The Valley since Deano. He is not great at gathering crosses, but his shot stopping is very good. I do like Worner and think he will be very good keeper, I'd like to see him given another chance this season, not just when Elliott is injured. But the goals we are conceding are not down to Elliott alone. We are not defending properly, leaving Elliott exposed more often. If our defenders did their jobs he wouldn't be getting the criticism.
I personally don't think he is a natural athlete and has to work hard at that side of things. Athletisism is key for goalkeepers and he seems a little bit short in that department.
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This is a key point along with his lack of communication skills. The keeper is really your defensive organiser and if you look at many good keepers they tend to be proactive in marshalling the defenders.
He's overweight. Not communicative. Beaten from long range too often.
Worner may be inexperienced but he is VERY agile, good distribution and VERY quick off his line. Reckon he deserves a chance if Robbie has had a shocker again
Interestingly we play Weaver next week......what's the betting he has an absolute barnstormer
Rob Elliott is far more overweight than any keeper in this league and in the two leagues above. If he was to lose weight his agility will improve, though Worner is in very good shape he is about 3inches shorter than Elliott... decisions decisions.
[cite]Posted By: Swisdom[/cite]He's overweight. Not communicative. Beaten from long range too often.
Worner may be inexperienced but he is VERY agile, good distribution and VERY quick off his line. Reckon he deserves a chance if Robbie has had a shocker again
Interestingly we play Weaver next week......what's the betting he has an absolute barnstormer
Never usually a middle ground when he plays against us. Either brilliant or hopeless - his attempted save from John Robinson in the 4-0 springs to mind!.
Think we will be seeing a very different Weaver when he turns up next week. What I have seen this season he looks to have lost a couple of stone.
ditto Len and Madz. As previously remarked in another post, the defenders don't make it any easier for Elliott ( particalularly last weeks display ). Robbies made some clangers, yes, but he has also pulled off some great saves this season. Worner has also done well but worries me when dealing with crosses.
As soon as I saw this thread I knew exactly who it would be started by!
Comparisons between Elliot and Randolph this year are irrelevant. They playing for different teams in different leagues. The defence should take the majority of the blame for the amount of goals conceded this year. That said, he does not look fully fit and has been beaten from long distance too much so far this season.
I think that the real issue is that we should never have gone into the season with one keeper,Worner was bought for the future, there is no pressure on Elliot. I would like to see another keeper brought in on loan till christmas and then purchased,not necessarily to start initially,but to put real pressure on.
[cite]Posted By: Kap10[/cite]I think that the real issue is that we should never have gone into the season with one keeper,Worner was bought for the future, there is no pressure on Elliot. I would like to see another keeper brought in on loan till christmas and then purchased,not necessarily to start initially,but to put real pressure on.
We had Andy Marshall ready to fill that role but we chose to send him on his way.
Be tempted to send Worner out on loan, get his wages covered and bring in someone with more experience.
[cite]Posted By: Kap10[/cite]I think that the real issue is that we should never have gone into the season with one keeper,Worner was bought for the future, there is no pressure on Elliot. I would like to see another keeper brought in on loan till christmas and then purchased,not necessarily to start initially,but to put real pressure on.
We had Andy Marshall ready to fill that role but we chose to send him on his way.
Be tempted to send Worner out on loan, get his wages covered and bring in someone with more experience.
Don't understand all the calls for Robbie to be replaced, yes he is not perfect but this is league 1, no keepers are unflappable. Imho Worner will not do any better, he may have made some good saves but does not dominate, flaps more than Robbie and is perhaps too inexperienced to compensate for his lack of height especially when playing against the big sides ie Carlisle with the lampost Gary Madine.
However, Robbie does need to lose weight, if he does, I am sure this would help with some of the long range goals- for example against Brighton when he seemed sllow to get towards the Lua Lua goal. There are worse keepers in League 1 than Robbie, who is still relatively inexperienced (only 60 odd league games). He will get better with games and age.
I think Elliot is just a decent keeper at this level, nothing more. We have outfield players like that. Can be very good on his day, but does have some poor games. Never seen him as a brilliant shot stopper myself, makes some good saves of course, but perhaps concedes some that other keepers could get to. Or at least that's what it feels like at times.
Doesn't compare to say Kiely who was one of our best players for a few seasons.
Agree with BFR that he's not a natural athlete. Sure it was said before that Elliot had to work very hard at his game, while Randolph was more naturally talented.
On keeping either or both Elliot/Randolph in the summer, it came down to who was out of contract. Would imagine spending less of the wage budget on Elliot and Worner had left room for us to get another player, such as Fortune or Anyinsah.
Cheaper to put him on a diet than buy a new keeper surely? I mean. This isn't f*cking rocket science is it? Don't we have sports psychologists and nutrityionists and stuff? I mean, just find out who's buying him the chips and keep them away...I saw Rob Elliot when he came on at Plymouth after Weaver got sent off for intentional handling outsidethe area in the 3rd minute. They thought they were gonna storm it and he played a blinder. But that was what 2, 3 years ago? Less pasta, more running.
Comments
I agree fella!
Mind you our defenders need to take stock!
Elliott 2 clean sheets in those 10
Worner 2 clean sheets in those 6
However all keepers do every so often even Deano.
I like Robbie and think he is good enough for this level or better. In my view he has performed well in most of the 70 odd games he has played and I'm not convinced Randolph is better than him although he did play well in the dozen or so games he played at the end of last season.
As for Worner I'm pleasantly surprised with how well he has done but personally I rate Robbie higher.
People have short memories sometimes.
He came back this season looking leaner and started quite well.
He has steadily gone backwards. Each time he has come back from injury he has looked leaden footed and less fit than he was in the preceeding game.
I personally don't think he is a natural athlete and has to work hard at that side of things. Athletisism is key for goalkeepers and he seems a little bit short in that department.
As oohaah regularly points out he is beaten from distance far too frequently for my liking. Personally begining to think that he is partially to blame for the lack of cohesion at the back. He doesn't appear to be much of a talker and sometimes the defence rely on guidance from the man behind them.
Not sure that Worner is the answer right now. Think he will turn into a good keeper though.
If Daniels is available on loan I'd be tempted to bring him in.
Said in pre-season we were mad to let Marshall go. He would have helped Elliot develop. Ultimately, I think he would have been our number one and I'm sure we would have been much more solid with him.
...........
This is a key point along with his lack of communication skills. The keeper is really your defensive organiser and if you look at many good keepers they tend to be proactive in marshalling the defenders.
Worner may be inexperienced but he is VERY agile, good distribution and VERY quick off his line. Reckon he deserves a chance if Robbie has had a shocker again
Interestingly we play Weaver next week......what's the betting he has an absolute barnstormer
Never usually a middle ground when he plays against us. Either brilliant or hopeless - his attempted save from John Robinson in the 4-0 springs to mind!.
Think we will be seeing a very different Weaver when he turns up next week. What I have seen this season he looks to have lost a couple of stone.
Comparisons between Elliot and Randolph this year are irrelevant. They playing for different teams in different leagues. The defence should take the majority of the blame for the amount of goals conceded this year. That said, he does not look fully fit and has been beaten from long distance too much so far this season.
We had Andy Marshall ready to fill that role but we chose to send him on his way.
Be tempted to send Worner out on loan, get his wages covered and bring in someone with more experience.
Yeah, I remember
Worner impressed me in his little run, though he doesn't claim crosses.
However, Robbie does need to lose weight, if he does, I am sure this would help with some of the long range goals- for example against Brighton when he seemed sllow to get towards the Lua Lua goal. There are worse keepers in League 1 than Robbie, who is still relatively inexperienced (only 60 odd league games). He will get better with games and age.
Doesn't compare to say Kiely who was one of our best players for a few seasons.
Agree with BFR that he's not a natural athlete. Sure it was said before that Elliot had to work very hard at his game, while Randolph was more naturally talented.
On keeping either or both Elliot/Randolph in the summer, it came down to who was out of contract. Would imagine spending less of the wage budget on Elliot and Worner had left room for us to get another player, such as Fortune or Anyinsah.