It is not only banks where the executives are taking their fill out of the trough. I have savings with Nationwide Building Society and a couple of weeks ago got the annual report. On going through the details of the directors renumeration, it appears they awarded themselves average increases of almost 14% last year. It was not clearly obvious because the total went down on account of there being one director less than the previous year. They are asking us members to vote and approve this! I wonder if the staff in the head office and behind the counters in the high street got any sort of pay increase at all. At the end of the day this is a mutual society owned by the members - savers and mortgage holders - and this is being paid for through poor returns for savers and high mortgage rates. Needless to say I have used my vote and so have my family members. If any Lifers are members check it out for yourself and make sure you use your vote. After all, maybe you think these poor, hard pressed directors are worth every penny!
I'm still pissed off with them after they closed all but one of their branches in the SE postcodes. I closed all my savings accounts with them as a result, but I've still got my mortgage with them, so I still get a vote. That's another dissenting voice for you.
Grapevine, may I ask just how much of your current opinion, if any, do you feel has been influenced by hindsight? I can see that Brown and his craven pandering to the City caused mayhem, but if adequate controls had been in place, would they have picked up on the chaos caused by the US sub prime mortgage market? Everyone seemed to have based their financial decisions on previous years figures neglecting to recognise/include the phenomenal growth in the much riskier sub prime. The banks themselves don't appear to have understood what exactly was in the packaged financial products they were buying and selling. Would we have fared any better with the BofE at the helm?
Lets face it Politicians (of all persuasions) and bankers, mix in the same circles and look after each others best interests, at the general public's expense. It's time for governments around the world to take full responsibility for the state of their country's finances. That means closing down insolvent banks and setting up retail units of their national banks. The Bank of England could offer home loans to the general public at a much better rate than a bank like Barclays, and better savings rates to depositors. Greater oversight would prevent all the gambling, better still the public wouldn't have to fund anymore bailouts.
I don't think that many people actually realise that it's not politicians who run the world, nor dictators, popes, rabbis, mullahs or generals .. it's BANKERS
Our financial system in general and our banks in particular have spectacularly failed society. I have worked in the financial sector in each of the last five decades - for much of that time in fairly senior positions - and as result have had a ring-side seat to observe what has evolved. The story of how we got here is a complex tale to tell and, arguably, nobody’s fault; a simplistic, unquestioning faith in markets is the biggest single culprit.
However, what is now very clear is that the system is in need of radical reform. Unfortunately, I can’t say I’m holding my breath waiting for that to happen. What I expect instead is a death by a thousand cuts as our once proud financial institutions gradually become emasculated and eventually broken up; the weight of regulation already bearing down on the banks is of the wrong kind and won’t solve the problem, but the burden it is creating will suffocate them. Bob Diamond probably ought to under house arrest right now. He’s not, of course, but the irony is that he’s doing a great job at keeping this process moving.
We'll see this blow up further tomorrow. Aware that Sky have a piece going to air with the FSA announcing their findings on the investigation in the mis-selling of interest rate derivatives to small businesses.
Like the Libor rates, this will affect not just Barclays, but all the main banks.
How can this Diamond geezer stay in his post? Either he knew what was going on or he didn't. I'm not sure which is worse, but either way he should go, preferably to a police station.
ridiculous comment - what if I posted something inflammatory/illegal on here,should my employers be held responsible. You cannot have him held to account for the actions of a few idiots.
We used in this country to turn our noses up at "johnnie foreigner" and his corrupt politicians and business methods. Our banks, politicians and institutions were beyond reproach. We had bank managers like Captain Manwaring and politicians who even though you might disagree with their policies at least you felt they were trustworthy like perhaps John Major. Where the hell has that gone ? Our banks are run by Del Boy and our politicians couldn't act honourably if their life depended on it.
Spot on Shooters, our country is starting to make Nigeria look honest!
How can this Diamond geezer stay in his post? Either he knew what was going on or he didn't. I'm not sure which is worse, but either way he should go, preferably to a police station.
ridiculous comment - what if I posted something inflammatory/illegal on here,should my employers be held responsible. You cannot have him held to account for the actions of a few idiots.
With reward comes responsibility otherwise what possible reason is there for the MD to earn more than the cleaner?
Diamond is the top man at Barclays. Now whether they have acted illegally, immorally or both in allegedly being complicit in rigging the LIBOR rate it is too early to say for certain.
However what can be said is that Diamond, whom is almost certainly a director as well as a shareholder, will have shaped Barclays company policy.
I am not sure it was 'company policy' to rig the LIBOR rate, rather than the ridiculous act of a couple of rogue members of staff. These staff should be dealt with, the fine paid, procedures put in place to prevent happening again. Not sure he needs to fall on his sword on this one.
''RBS is cutting 2,300 jobs across its back office staff in the UK'' - Computer Weekly 11 Feb 2009
''RBS is axing 1,000 technology jobs in the UK and plans to offshore 500 more'' Computer Weekly 2 Sep 2010
''I am very sorry for the difficulties people are experiencing. This should not have happened'' Stephen Hester, group Chief Executive apologising for the week of chaos for RBS customers, 23 Jun 2012 (earning £1.2 million a year, bonus £955,000, as part of £7.7million package awarded to him by RBS and the government 4 years ago)
''Let Stephen Hester have his bonus'', as The Guardian said.
I am not sure it was 'company policy' to rig the LIBOR rate, rather than the ridiculous act of a couple of rogue members of staff. These staff should be dealt with, the fine paid, procedures put in place to prevent happening again. Not sure he needs to fall on his sword on this one.
A high salary means you take responsibility to have systems in place to prevent "rogue" members of staff wreaking havoc. If you fail to do your job properly you pay the price just as, on a smaller scale, you or I would.
Harry S Truman had a notice on his desk which said "the buck stops here."
Very few amongst our supposed betters adopt that attitude these days.
The reason for all of this is the culture of bonus and greed. When everyone in corporate or financial markets banking believes their salary is loose change and their bonus is what they work for the driving forces will always lead to the blind eye turning to enhance remuneration. Whether you agree with it or not this is the culture we all live in now. This is rife from top to bottom in banking and I know from personal experience that those who question it and try to do the righty thing no longer work there. The whole situation is apolitical as they are either all as guilty as each other or not at all. The real poeple to blame for not calling a halt earlier are the shareholders but perhaps they turned the same blind eye?
It saddens me how money and greed rules everything in modern society. My father in law has been with AA insurance for over 50 years - he has severe dementia and is in a nursing home and renting his house to help pay the fees. The property was unoccupied as it was renovated for rental - we notified AA that it was about to be occupied by 3 brothers so they could re-quote and they said they couldn't insure them. Fair enough, but as they have deemed we have cancelled the policy they have decided they don't owe any money when the insurance was paid for a year when it was them that said they couldn't insure. Not a bank but illustrates you the world we live in.
You can't ring any comapny now with having to push a million buttons and end up with somebody telling you that you are through to the wrong Department. The culture needs to change and bashing the greedy so and sos who have created this mess is a start.
The Government talks about changes to the welfare state to make things fairer for those who work hard for a living and live in smaller houses, struggle to get by. I'm not against that but it is telling that making things fairer is about bringing people down, not lifting the workers up. They are a commodity to be exploited after all!
Everybody thinks it is their job to relieve you of your money as best they can. The concept of a fair days pay for a fair days work is lost and we need tyo get it back.
I am not sure it was 'company policy' to rig the LIBOR rate, rather than the ridiculous act of a couple of rogue members of staff. These staff should be dealt with, the fine paid, procedures put in place to prevent happening again. Not sure he needs to fall on his sword on this one.
A high salary means you take responsibility to have systems in place to prevent "rogue" members of staff wreaking havoc. If you fail to do your job properly you pay the price just as, on a smaller scale, you or I would.
Harry S Truman had a notice on his desk which said "the buck stops here."
Very few amongst our supposed betters adopt that attitude these days.
They very ratrely have otherwise we'd be changing the cabinet every day.
Truman may have had that notice but he didn't follow it and a good job too. He was a very good president and his failures (though sometimes very large e.g. the failure of intelligence on the Chinese counter-attack) don't change that.
I don't know if Diamond should resign or not, though I think he probably should. But we are emasculating our politicians and leaders if we demand that they resign every time anything goes wrong.
I am not sure it was 'company policy' to rig the LIBOR rate, rather than the ridiculous act of a couple of rogue members of staff. These staff should be dealt with, the fine paid, procedures put in place to prevent happening again. Not sure he needs to fall on his sword on this one.
A high salary means you take responsibility to have systems in place to prevent "rogue" members of staff wreaking havoc. If you fail to do your job properly you pay the price just as, on a smaller scale, you or I would.
Harry S Truman had a notice on his desk which said "the buck stops here."
Very few amongst our supposed betters adopt that attitude these days.
They very ratrely have otherwise we'd be changing the cabinet every day.
Truman may have had that notice but he didn't follow it and a good job too. He was a very good president and his failures (though sometimes very large e.g. the failure of intelligence on the Chinese counter-attack) don't change that.
I don't know if Diamond should resign or not, though I think he probably should. But we are emasculating our politicians and leaders if we demand that they resign every time anything goes wrong.
Nowhere have I said Diamond should resign, I've said he should take responsibility which is different although I accept the end result could be the same.
I find it incredible that no lessons have been learned (I hate that phrase!) from the Barings fiasco when, you will recall, a whole bank was brought down because of the actions of a rogue trader and the ostriches and incompetents whom masqueraded as his superiors.
Diamond should have known what was happening in his company otherwise why have a boss at all?
Maybe I am wrong here but I think this latest scandal is really just another example of the world going a little bit rotton and to be honest Barclays are just one of many large corporations that act entirely out of self interest with no apparent concern for consequences. This is not limited to the banking industry by the way we saw similar and serious accountancy fraud at Enron which led to the downfall of that company. They are too obsessed with the opinions of "The City" and "The Street" and what the share value is instead of running their businesses on an honest and sensible footing. Makes me want to be sick.
Maybe I am wrong here but I think this latest scandal is really just another example of the world going a little bit rotton and to be honest Barclays are just one of many large corporations that act entirely out of self interest with no apparent concern for consequences. This is not limited to the banking industry by the way we saw similar and serious accountancy fraud at Enron which led to the downfall of that company. They are too obsessed with the opinions of "The City" and "The Street" and what the share value is instead of running their businesses on an honest and sensible footing. Makes me want to be sick.
The problem is that this is a problem the world has to want to fix- difficult to do it in a unilateral way. Wouldn't it be great if we lived in a world where honest hard working people are not seen as a coomodity to exploit or rip off?
what was it that the pundit on newsnight quipped last night. I lived by the motto when I worked at Barclays my word was my bond, ( "dictum meum pactum") It seems to mean a junk bond these days........ joking aside, the banks seem to be in free-fall, another day another revelation, and the chairman and md of banks sidestepping there duties. How Diamond can possibly stay seems to be beyond the logic of most people's rational thinking. All very well for the MD of banks to offer to not have a bonus for this year, a bonus for what. The Governor of the B of E has called it deceitful manipulation, and something very wrong with the british banking system, and let down by there leaders, both the structure and culture. Whatever happened to honest, unbiased truthful banking.
what was it that the pundit on newsnight quipped last night. I lived by the motto when I worked at Barclays my word was my bond, ( "dictum meum pactum") It seems to mean a junk bond these days........ joking aside, the banks seem to be in free-fall, another day another revelation, and the chairman and md of banks sidestepping there duties. How Diamond can possibly stay seems to be beyond the logic of most people's rational thinking. All very well for the MD of banks to offer to not have a bonus for this year, a bonus for what. The Governor of the B of E has called it deceitful manipulation, and something very wrong with the british banking system, and let down by there leaders, both the structure and culture. Whatever happened to honest, unbiased truthful banking.
As this LIBOR manipulation appears to go back to 2005 from what I've read I'd have more respect for Diamond if he offered to repay all bonuses back to then or whenever he became top dog if later.
Although there is a global problem, the specific issue with UK banks was created by UK politicians who decided to de-regulate the banking system to encourage global banking organisations to do their business in the UK as opposed to elsewhere in the world. This was done under a Labour administration, but in the circumstances would the Tories have done anything different?
Someone mentioned Thatcher - she made the decision that this country should move away from heavy industry and into the service sector. Part of the motivation for that is the unions aren't so strong in that sector... But that's a debate for another time!
Had labour not done it they would have been criticised by the Tories for not doing it. Mind you - Blair's new labour was Conservative Light and their tongues were as brown as this lot's are.
what was it that the pundit on newsnight quipped last night. I lived by the motto when I worked at Barclays my word was my bond, ( "dictum meum pactum") It seems to mean a junk bond these days........ joking aside, the banks seem to be in free-fall, another day another revelation, and the chairman and md of banks sidestepping there duties. How Diamond can possibly stay seems to be beyond the logic of most people's rational thinking. All very well for the MD of banks to offer to not have a bonus for this year, a bonus for what. The Governor of the B of E has called it deceitful manipulation, and something very wrong with the british banking system, and let down by there leaders, both the structure and culture. Whatever happened to honest, unbiased truthful banking.
As this LIBOR manipulation appears to go back to 2005 from what I've read I'd have more respect for Diamond if he offered to repay all bonuses back to then or whenever he became top dog if later.
I won't hold my breath.
A wise man Len because it is Hestor who has said that of RBS 'fame'. Diamond states he will not resign, let alone his bonus.
If Diamond was an honourable man he would resign, but he wouldn't be doing the job he does if he was honourable would he? We need an alternative to these self serving greedy leeches.
Comments
a 1 in 100,000,000 chance of being a human being!
:-)
It's time for governments around the world to take full responsibility for the state of their country's finances. That means closing down insolvent banks and setting up retail units of their national banks. The Bank of England could offer home loans to the general public at a much better rate than a bank like Barclays, and better savings rates to depositors. Greater oversight would prevent all the gambling, better still the public wouldn't have to fund anymore bailouts.
However, what is now very clear is that the system is in need of radical reform. Unfortunately, I can’t say I’m holding my breath waiting for that to happen. What I expect instead is a death by a thousand cuts as our once proud financial institutions gradually become emasculated and eventually broken up; the weight of regulation already bearing down on the banks is of the wrong kind and won’t solve the problem, but the burden it is creating will suffocate them. Bob Diamond probably ought to under house arrest right now. He’s not, of course, but the irony is that he’s doing a great job at keeping this process moving.
Like the Libor rates, this will affect not just Barclays, but all the main banks.
Diamond is the top man at Barclays. Now whether they have acted illegally, immorally or both in allegedly being complicit in rigging the LIBOR rate it is too early to say for certain.
However what can be said is that Diamond, whom is almost certainly a director as well as a shareholder, will have shaped Barclays company policy.
SA has therefore made a legitimate observation.
''RBS is axing 1,000 technology jobs in the UK and plans to offshore 500 more'' Computer Weekly 2 Sep 2010
''I am very sorry for the difficulties people are experiencing. This should not have happened'' Stephen Hester, group Chief Executive apologising for the week of chaos for RBS customers, 23 Jun 2012 (earning £1.2 million a year, bonus £955,000, as part of £7.7million package awarded to him by RBS and the government 4 years ago)
''Let Stephen Hester have his bonus'', as The Guardian said.
Harry S Truman had a notice on his desk which said "the buck stops here."
Very few amongst our supposed betters adopt that attitude these days.
You can't ring any comapny now with having to push a million buttons and end up with somebody telling you that you are through to the wrong Department. The culture needs to change and bashing the greedy so and sos who have created this mess is a start.
The Government talks about changes to the welfare state to make things fairer for those who work hard for a living and live in smaller houses, struggle to get by. I'm not against that but it is telling that making things fairer is about bringing people down, not lifting the workers up. They are a commodity to be exploited after all!
Everybody thinks it is their job to relieve you of your money as best they can. The concept of a fair days pay for a fair days work is lost and we need tyo get it back.
Truman may have had that notice but he didn't follow it and a good job too. He was a very good president and his failures (though sometimes very large e.g. the failure of intelligence on the Chinese counter-attack) don't change that.
I don't know if Diamond should resign or not, though I think he probably should. But we are emasculating our politicians and leaders if we demand that they resign every time anything goes wrong.
I find it incredible that no lessons have been learned (I hate that phrase!) from the Barings fiasco when, you will recall, a whole bank was brought down because of the actions of a rogue trader and the ostriches and incompetents whom masqueraded as his superiors.
Diamond should have known what was happening in his company otherwise why have a boss at all?
"Sign on you crazy diamond"
I lived by the motto when I worked at Barclays my word was my bond, ( "dictum meum pactum")
It seems to mean a junk bond these days........
joking aside, the banks seem to be in free-fall, another day another revelation, and the chairman and md of banks sidestepping there duties.
How Diamond can possibly stay seems to be beyond the logic of most people's rational thinking. All very well for the MD of banks to offer to not have a bonus for this year, a bonus for what. The Governor of the B of E has called it deceitful manipulation, and something very wrong with the british banking system, and let down by there leaders, both the structure and culture.
Whatever happened to honest, unbiased truthful banking.
I won't hold my breath.