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Ye Shiwen

Can she really be that good ?
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    No
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    thought she was clean?
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    yes - just got out of a swimming pool
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    colthe3rd said:

    No

    despite the evidence currently before us?
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    The analysis last night was annoying to say the least. There were constant references to 'Chinese' swimmer Ye Shiwen, but Michael Phelps wasn't once described as the 'American' swimmer.
    If she has done wrong they keep the samples for eight years, so she is unlikely to get away with anything, but for now she has/will be tested and she is clean. They compared her time when she was just 14 to now when she is nearly 16, and girls change a lot in those particular years.
    The Americans have never been bested by the Chinese in the Olympic medals table, and it may happen for the first time and they don't like it, the snide digs at Ye Shiwen started with the Americans. They should concentrate on celebrating Michael Phelps rather than digging out a competitor.
    There is an underlying racism in always mentioning the swimmers nationality when they are Chinese but not when they are American. The fear of a growing yet different culture may fuel the arms length way the Chinese are often portrayed in many ways, but at heart they are simply people getting on with it, not aliens from another universe.
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    seth plum said:


    There is an underlying racism in always mentioning the swimmers nationality when they are Chinese but not when they are American. The fear of a growing yet different culture may fuel the arms length way the Chinese are often portrayed in many ways, but at heart they are simply people getting on with it, not aliens from another universe.

    Take your point, but might it just be because everyone knows who 19-times medal-winner Michael Phelps is but Ye Shiwen is a hitherto unknown, certainly in relative terms?
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    if they didnt say chinese Ye Shiwen i wouldnt have a clue where she was from!!

    I certainly know where Phelps is from though.
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    seth plum said:

    The analysis last night was annoying to say the least. There were constant references to 'Chinese' swimmer Ye Shiwen, but Michael Phelps wasn't once described as the 'American' swimmer.
    If she has done wrong they keep the samples for eight years, so she is unlikely to get away with anything, but for now she has/will be tested and she is clean. They compared her time when she was just 14 to now when she is nearly 16, and girls change a lot in those particular years.
    The Americans have never been bested by the Chinese in the Olympic medals table, and it may happen for the first time and they don't like it, the snide digs at Ye Shiwen started with the Americans. They should concentrate on celebrating Michael Phelps rather than digging out a competitor.
    There is an underlying racism in always mentioning the swimmers nationality when they are Chinese but not when they are American. The fear of a growing yet different culture may fuel the arms length way the Chinese are often portrayed in many ways, but at heart they are simply people getting on with it, not aliens from another universe.

    I hear all of this but I heard that the final 50m of her 400m medley was faster than Michael Phelps over the last 50m of his 100m!

    A 16 years old girl just shouldn't be faster than one of the best male swimmers ever - thats just not right

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    Swis I bleieve it was faster than Lochte over that same distance. That for me is the main thing here. I couldn't care less where she is from but can someone tell me if it has ever happened in any other sport where a woman/girl has been faster than a man? I know swimming is not all about power but also a huge part is technique but really?
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    edited August 2012
    The Chinese have a very, very bad record in terms of doping up their swimmers.

    I would love to think she is legit but history suggests it is likely she is not.

    The Chinese even got caught trying to smuggle Human Growth Hormone through Sydney Airport before the Sydney Olympics!
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    Until they prove otherwise then she is clean, give her a break I say.
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    Oh ok then, we have not tested her, but lets say that our objective proof is that 'it's just not right', that should be enough huh?
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    some bloke on the radio last night said it is because she has huge feet.
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    Those two rowers who won gold were miles ahead of the rest of the pairs. And one only started rowing a few years ago. Must be on drugs, only explanation.

    Oh, what's that?, they're British, you say. Ok, scrub that, great win, fully deserved.

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    Those two rowers who won gold were miles ahead of the rest of the pairs. And one only started rowing a few years ago. Must be on drugs, only explanation.

    Oh, what's that?, they're British, you say. Ok, scrub that, great win, fully deserved.

    Drugs no. Hidden outboard yes.

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    Can she really be that good ?

    YE S

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    If you're not a particular swimming fan you don't automatically know who Michael Phelps is, tho I agree he is so famous his nationality need hardly be mentioned.
    I wonder if that is the only example tho...in the commentary the often say 'the Chinese swimmer', maybe because of those pesky difficult names, but swimmers like Missy Franklin, or Alison Schmitt are far more likely to be mentioned by name rather than 'the American swimmer'.
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    colthe3rd said:

    Swis I bleieve it was faster than Lochte over that same distance. That for me is the main thing here. I couldn't care less where she is from but can someone tell me if it has ever happened in any other sport where a woman/girl has been faster than a man? I know swimming is not all about power but also a huge part is technique but really?

    It was just the last 50m of the event she had a quicker split than him.
    However she was 23 seconds slower overall, and she was racing to the line in a battle for gold whereas he cruised to the end as comfortably winning.

    Ian Thorpe said as a 15 year old he won the worlds and he improved his time by 5 seconds by time he was 16 and that such improvements at that age are fairly common.

    Rebecca Addlington improved the 800m world record time by 2 seconds and beat the rest of the field by 6 seconds in Beijing.

    It is not like she has come from nowhere as she was already the world champion at this event.

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    An article in the Guardian was undecided. It's right to ask questions and whenever there have been outstanding performances by athletes (think Ben Johnson, Michelle de Bruin etc) there is usually some substance to the accusation. The article makes the point that not that long ago a raft of Chinese mid-distance athletes all seemed to arrive at the same time, set fantastic records and raised questions about doping...and then disappeared without trace.

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2012/jul/31/london-2012-ye-shiwen-doping?newsfeed=true

    Innocent until proven guilty though...
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    Now China has become a massive global economic powerhouse they are able to fund more training programs into sports they traditionally lagged behind the West such as track and field, swimming and sailing to name a few. They are able to send their athletes overseas or employ the best coaches and their diet has also changed accordingly. And another factor why they are starting to turn out exciting new superstars is that there are so many kids in the talent pool there will be more elite athletes coming through. Ye is what will be the first of many in future Olympics to come.

    And until it can be proved beyond doubt that she has been doping then let her be celebrated for her achievements. I for one hope she is clean.
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    Now China has become a massive global economic powerhouse they are able to fund more training programs into sports they traditionally lagged behind the West such as track and field, swimming and sailing to name a few. They are able to send their athletes overseas or employ the best coaches and their diet has also changed accordingly. And another factor why they are starting to turn out exciting new superstars is that there are so many kids in the talent pool there will be more elite athletes coming through. Ye is what will be the first of many in future Olympics to come.

    And until it can be proved beyond doubt that she has been doping then let her be celebrated for her achievements. I for one hope she is clean.

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    Now China has become a massive global economic powerhouse they are able to fund more training programs into sports they traditionally lagged behind the West such as track and field, swimming and sailing to name a few. They are able to send their athletes overseas or employ the best coaches and their diet has also changed accordingly. And another factor why they are starting to turn out exciting new superstars is that there are so many kids in the talent pool there will be more elite athletes coming through. Ye is what will be the first of many in future Olympics to come.

    And until it can be proved beyond doubt that she has been doping then let her be celebrated for her achievements. I for one hope she is clean.

    And until it can be proved beyond doubt that she has been doping then let her be celebrated for her achievements. I for one hope she is clean...........Totally agree.
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    MrOneLung said:

    colthe3rd said:

    Swis I bleieve it was faster than Lochte over that same distance. That for me is the main thing here. I couldn't care less where she is from but can someone tell me if it has ever happened in any other sport where a woman/girl has been faster than a man? I know swimming is not all about power but also a huge part is technique but really?

    It was just the last 50m of the event she had a quicker split than him.
    However she was 23 seconds slower overall, and she was racing to the line in a battle for gold whereas he cruised to the end as comfortably winning.

    Ian Thorpe said as a 15 year old he won the worlds and he improved his time by 5 seconds by time he was 16 and that such improvements at that age are fairly common.

    Rebecca Addlington improved the 800m world record time by 2 seconds and beat the rest of the field by 6 seconds in Beijing.

    It is not like she has come from nowhere as she was already the world champion at this event.

    Did he definitely slow down on purpose? Looked like he was still chasing a WR
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    Now China has become a massive global economic powerhouse they are able to fund more training programs into sports they traditionally lagged behind the West such as track and field, swimming and sailing to name a few. They are able to send their athletes overseas or employ the best coaches and their diet has also changed accordingly. And another factor why they are starting to turn out exciting new superstars is that there are so many kids in the talent pool there will be more elite athletes coming through. Ye is what will be the first of many in future Olympics to come.

    And until it can be proved beyond doubt that she has been doping then let her be celebrated for her achievements. I for one hope she is clean.

    More articulate than my posts.
    China is a Country of about 1.3 billion people, it is likely that they would find good sportspeople.
    The wonderful Usain Bolt was stunningly brilliant, but was the first reaction 'he must be on something'...I don't remember it that way.
    I'm not sure of the population numbers of Jamaica either.
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    Around 3 million I'd guess.
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    The problem in China is that the people backing Shiwen (local authorities, administrators, etc) have a lot to gain by having their swimmers do well at the Olympics - and if that means a bit of doping then they don't care.

    If she wins then they win, the swimming folks get a much bigger budget and the local politicians that gave her patronage get marks off the regime in Beijing for bringing her through the ranks.

    Being in Oz there is a lot more swimming coverage year round than you get in the UK and over the years the Chinese have produced "batches" of top class swimmers who win races, set records and then disappear as fast as they arrived.

    The whole system is full of politics and corruption and the athletes don't get much choice over their treatment.
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    But the thing with sprinters from Jamaica and the US is that it is in their genes that they are naturally good athletes
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    Dont know if shes doping or not, but I wouldnt start a fight with her
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    Those two rowers who won gold were miles ahead of the rest of the pairs. And one only started rowing a few years ago. Must be on drugs, only explanation.

    Oh, what's that?, they're British, you say. Ok, scrub that, great win, fully deserved.

    But the two rowers have stood out most of this year, they have been there or thereabouts. The swimmer has been pelt and all of a sudden she swims as quick as a man, I smell a (water) rat!
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    Greenie said:

    Those two rowers who won gold were miles ahead of the rest of the pairs. And one only started rowing a few years ago. Must be on drugs, only explanation.

    Oh, what's that?, they're British, you say. Ok, scrub that, great win, fully deserved.

    But the two rowers have stood out most of this year, they have been there or thereabouts. The swimmer has been pelt and all of a sudden she swims as quick as a man, I smell a (water) rat!
    She is the current world champion

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