This is a particular interest of mine - having watched the film when it first came out I was intrigued so read the 2 books the Oliver Stone film is (loosely) based on as well as a few others, plus countless documentaries, films etc I have come to the conclusion that Oswald was not a "lone assasin". Too much in his history show that he was not just an ordinary Joe - I don't think he fired the fatal shots but may have fired some shots from the Book Depositry.
whether is was a CIA or FBI or a Military plot I have no idea - I don't know how you can keep such things secret for so long - but as Oswald said.....he was just a patsy.
I think this is pretty much what I believe. The film was a feature film and not a documentary so yes there were some liberties taken. That is a shame in my view because the general point made in the film that Oswald was not "the lone angry nut" that was the official view, is a sound one.
Due to an economic crisis I'll probably stay in tonight, gf is out so have the place to myself - is the Oliver Stone film worth a watch ? I've got it on Sky+ and it's taking up 2% of my precious memory, so it's watch or delete time !
Nice and topical, only took place nearly 49 years ago. What next for a discussion on CL, did Princip really murder Archduke Ferdinand to set off the First World War? Where are the photos and the forensic?:-)
Evet since I saw the film on cinema release I've bern fascinated by the JFK assassination. I've read a load of books on the subject, seen numerous documentaries & still none the wiser. I'm pretty sure Oswsld didn't shoot him but as to who was really behind it (CIA?) I don't think we'll ever find out. Not sure about this new theory of the serviceman in the car behind & pretty sure he was killed by a shooter on the grassy knole. Interesting to find out what G.Bush had to do with it & also Howard Hunt. If I could have dinner with 3 people from the past then 1 would def be Oswald.
The operation on the ground that day was a group called Alpha 66, a bunch of anti-Castro Cubans, spooks, mercenaries, and all around wronguns who did paramilitary training in the bogs of Louisiana and Florida. The upper echelon of that group would have been E. Howard Hunt and Frank Sturgis, who, according to Sophia Lorentz, were seen passing out money and guns to the group the night (or two nights, can't remember), beforehand. The top of that pyramid, and almost certainly Oswald's handler, was a man named David Atlee Phillips. If I had to guess, I'd say he was the senior man on the ground in charge of logistics.
The level above them would have been CIA operatives, David Sanchez Morales and Cord Meyer, whose ex-wife Mary Pinchot Mayer JKF was having an affair with at the time of his death. Beyond that, you could look at any number of CIA operatives who hated Kennedy for many reasons. James Jesus Angleton is a good bet. Templeton, Colby, we could be here all night. I think it's a decent bet that someone like Helms, deputy Director of the CIA, probably knew. L Fletcher Prouty believes you can see a military Intel man named General Ed Lansdale in the pictures of the tramps being escorted through Dealey Plaza. I think it's thin, but Lansdale, who Graham Greene's "The Quiet American" was based on, was both a hawkish anti-Castro OP Mongoose guy, and a long time operative in the far east.
Beyond that, I'm really not sure. Clearly the mafia had some role. Johnny Rosselli was part of the plot to kill Castro, and worked closely with Phillips. There were probably logistical things, including money and guns, that they were in charge of.
I've never bought into the theory that LBJ was the mastermind. It's a theory that had gained a lot of traction amongst nut jobs like Trump's mate Roger Stone, Jim Fetzer, et al. JFK assassination researches roughly fall into two camps, one people who tend to be academics, and the other all around conspiracy theorists. Bar McLellan, father of Press Secretary Scott, wrote a book a few years ago about LBJ, Texas oil barons, and a guy named Mac Wallace who was supposedly LBJ's personal hit man. It includes George HW Bush and Richard Nixon, the former who can never seem to remember where he was that day, and the latter who was in Dallas that day. But it's all quite thin and in my opinion fanciful.
As to who the actual shooters were, I don't know. I think we may never know. There are, at best, maybe a handful of people alive who might know, or who could at least confirm some of the above. George H.W. Bush being the most famous (he did work with the CIA as far back as the Bay of Pigs). I've always been partial to the French Connection/Lucien Sarti aspect. Clearly it wasn't just them, but I do think there's a decent case to be made that Sarti was one of the gunmen on the grassy knoll as he confessed to it in prison in Mexico, and because he had a reputation for using exploding bullets. His would have been the head shot.
Beyond that, I've always had it around eight shots, 1) Kennedy in the back, 2) Kennedy in the throat, 3) Connolly, 4) Connolly, 5) Freeway sign, 6) Miss, hits bystander under overpass, 7) Kennedy back of head, 8) Kennedy front of head
I can't be certain on the exact timing of the shots beyond the first couple and last couple.
Recommended reading: Delilo's "Libra," already mentioned, it's a work of historical fiction but it outlines a very plausible theory of how things happened.
Garrison's "On The Trail of the Assassins," one of the books JFK was based on. Oh and let's recommend the other, "Crossfire" by Jim Marrs. Do no Google the other things Jim Marrs says.
Dick Russell's "The Man Who Knew Too Much" (which is currently on my nightstand unread).
Anything by Mark Lane and Joan Mellon
And then on YouTube, I recommend any one of the numerous interviews with the late L. Fletcher Prouty. He worked in Military Intelligence black ops for many years.
Doug Horne, member of the ARRB, or Cyril Wecht, famous coroner, talking about the autopsy at Bethesda which was a shitshow (and Horne has recently speculated that famous bad guy Gen. Curtis LeMay might have been there).
Lastly, any interview with John Armstrong. About 15 years ago he wrote a book that is out of print in which he, through reviewing the Warren Report and doing his own research, outlines that there were two people who are merged into one Oswald at some point when they are both in the Marines. I know that sounds crazy, but it was an intelligence trick back in the day. And more importantly, Armstrong is a very bright, articulate, sober guy who is extremely detail oriented. Obviously it sounds really far fetched, but if you're interested in the JFK assassination, and Oswald, I recommend checking it out.
Oh, and "The Men Who Killed Kennedy," which you can watch on YouTube. Keep in mind some of the stuff is outdated (it was originally made in the late 80s, and updated in 2003 with the Bar McLelan stuff). But it's still very good.
Comments
NLA !!!!!! You're asking for it....!
I would never ask for a disapointed Fanny and i would hope i never have one
Heard he had a gaff in Greenwich that needs a tidy up tho
Both were alive at the time.
The level above them would have been CIA operatives, David Sanchez Morales and Cord Meyer, whose ex-wife Mary Pinchot Mayer JKF was having an affair with at the time of his death. Beyond that, you could look at any number of CIA operatives who hated Kennedy for many reasons. James Jesus Angleton is a good bet. Templeton, Colby, we could be here all night. I think it's a decent bet that someone like Helms, deputy Director of the CIA, probably knew. L Fletcher Prouty believes you can see a military Intel man named General Ed Lansdale in the pictures of the tramps being escorted through Dealey Plaza. I think it's thin, but Lansdale, who Graham Greene's "The Quiet American" was based on, was both a hawkish anti-Castro OP Mongoose guy, and a long time operative in the far east.
Beyond that, I'm really not sure. Clearly the mafia had some role. Johnny Rosselli was part of the plot to kill Castro, and worked closely with Phillips. There were probably logistical things, including money and guns, that they were in charge of.
I've never bought into the theory that LBJ was the mastermind. It's a theory that had gained a lot of traction amongst nut jobs like Trump's mate Roger Stone, Jim Fetzer, et al. JFK assassination researches roughly fall into two camps, one people who tend to be academics, and the other all around conspiracy theorists. Bar McLellan, father of Press Secretary Scott, wrote a book a few years ago about LBJ, Texas oil barons, and a guy named Mac Wallace who was supposedly LBJ's personal hit man. It includes George HW Bush and Richard Nixon, the former who can never seem to remember where he was that day, and the latter who was in Dallas that day. But it's all quite thin and in my opinion fanciful.
As to who the actual shooters were, I don't know. I think we may never know. There are, at best, maybe a handful of people alive who might know, or who could at least confirm some of the above. George H.W. Bush being the most famous (he did work with the CIA as far back as the Bay of Pigs). I've always been partial to the French Connection/Lucien Sarti aspect. Clearly it wasn't just them, but I do think there's a decent case to be made that Sarti was one of the gunmen on the grassy knoll as he confessed to it in prison in Mexico, and because he had a reputation for using exploding bullets. His would have been the head shot.
Beyond that, I've always had it around eight shots, 1) Kennedy in the back, 2) Kennedy in the throat, 3) Connolly, 4) Connolly, 5) Freeway sign, 6) Miss, hits bystander under overpass, 7) Kennedy back of head, 8) Kennedy front of head
I can't be certain on the exact timing of the shots beyond the first couple and last couple.
Recommended reading:
Delilo's "Libra," already mentioned, it's a work of historical fiction but it outlines a very plausible theory of how things happened.
Garrison's "On The Trail of the Assassins," one of the books JFK was based on. Oh and let's recommend the other, "Crossfire" by Jim Marrs. Do no Google the other things Jim Marrs says.
Dick Russell's "The Man Who Knew Too Much" (which is currently on my nightstand unread).
Anything by Mark Lane and Joan Mellon
And then on YouTube, I recommend any one of the numerous interviews with the late L. Fletcher Prouty. He worked in Military Intelligence black ops for many years.
Doug Horne, member of the ARRB, or Cyril Wecht, famous coroner, talking about the autopsy at Bethesda which was a shitshow (and Horne has recently speculated that famous bad guy Gen. Curtis LeMay might have been there).
Lastly, any interview with John Armstrong. About 15 years ago he wrote a book that is out of print in which he, through reviewing the Warren Report and doing his own research, outlines that there were two people who are merged into one Oswald at some point when they are both in the Marines. I know that sounds crazy, but it was an intelligence trick back in the day. And more importantly, Armstrong is a very bright, articulate, sober guy who is extremely detail oriented. Obviously it sounds really far fetched, but if you're interested in the JFK assassination, and Oswald, I recommend checking it out.
Oh, and "The Men Who Killed Kennedy," which you can watch on YouTube. Keep in mind some of the stuff is outdated (it was originally made in the late 80s, and updated in 2003 with the Bar McLelan stuff). But it's still very good.